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120 Comments
- sebr, on 10/10/2007, -2/+55Obviously, this also means that the iPod classic would also be supported for any other applications using libgpod
- inactive, on 10/10/2007, -1/+24Now people who want to use Amarok can buy a new iPod classic. Take that, Apple!
- jooaakim, on 10/10/2007, -2/+23Sweet!
Let's hope the iTouch will be supported soon as well. - eean, on 10/10/2007, -2/+21An example of the kind of stuff they had to do:
http://pastebin.wtbw.co.uk/72 - sirhomer, on 10/10/2007, -1/+18I.E. every half popular Linux media player
- tech42er, on 10/10/2007, -1/+15Nope. Apple's DRM only lets you play it on Metro-North.
- juancn, on 10/10/2007, -6/+19Why always everyone assumes the worst? The addition of a very simple SHA1 hash is not a way to break other apps. It is just needed to better tolerate an unplug in the middle of a sync. operation. The problems that appeared are just a side effect. Before now, an application that syncs with an iPod (iTunes or any other) had no easy way to check for consistency of the files in a robust manner. This is just a minor (and very reasonable) improvement from an engineering point of view.
- BZKyle, on 10/10/2007, -1/+13After reading that, I have only one thing to say.
My brain go assplode now. - sirhomer, on 10/10/2007, -1/+13For those curious, it seems that Apple's hash consisted of a private key and SHA1 of the database. The hash is based on the Firewire GUID.
- craterburnsu, on 10/10/2007, -0/+10Well.. if you're using something like Amarok, i don't think you'll be connecting to Itunes for updates very often.
- frazras, on 10/10/2007, -3/+12OK this fells like we are saying: "HA Apple, did you think you could force us not to give you our money"
- geminitojanus, on 10/10/2007, -3/+12You obviously know absolutely jack about security engineering. Read up on why we use hardware keys to authenticate messages (in this case Songs) and come back to this discussion. There are still a lot of loopholes in this system they very easily could have closed (for example, signing against a public server rather than just your home computer and the iPod device).
- fkr3, on 10/10/2007, -3/+12And that Apple doesn't lock them back up with an update and create a cycle of one-upmanship.
- jamesfisher, on 10/10/2007, -6/+14Don't be a moron. It's using a key based on the Firewire ID (unique to each iPod) to hash (most of) the contents of the database file, and storing/checking this hash. If it fails, the iPod shows no songs.
This is considered "evil" because:
Any application that doesn't know how to do this can no longer edit the DB file.
The code was deliberately obfuscated.
If this was purely an integrity check, why include a per-iPod factor? - slowsloth, on 10/10/2007, -4/+12A little bit inaccurate. Fixing libgpod means that not only Amarok, but Banshee and Rhythmbox will be able to work with new iPods too.
- HappyScrappy, on 10/10/2007, -2/+10sirhomer points out above:
'For those curious, it seems that Apple's hash consisted of a private key and SHA1 of the database. The hash is based on the Firewire GUID.'
Yeah, a SHA1 is a good system for checking file integrity. Inserting a private key into the mix isn't necessary for integrity checking. It's only needed if you're trying to keep others from writing files like yours. - turpenine, on 10/10/2007, -0/+8ass plode?
thats new. I thought the classic as 'asplode or esplode. - jaiwithani, on 10/10/2007, -2/+9There are ways to check for consistency that don't result in reporting an empty database when a checksum fails.
- HappyScrappy, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7Interesting. In order to do so, Apple would have to first come out and say they intentionally tried to lock the iPod to iTunes. If they did this, they would likely run into a lot of trouble in Europe. Doing so could very well be a losing proposition.
- fkr3, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7Because it's all about control. Apple wants you in iTunes where they can keep their branding, merchandise and music/video store in front of your eyes.
- kiwiboyus, on 10/10/2007, -5/+12Great news for those Linux users out there that already ordered a new iPod. Personally my 2 year old iPod Photo is going to be the only Apple product I'll ever own. When it dies and can't be fixed I'll be looking else where for my next mp3/media player.
- andycr512, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6So it works fine in OSX and Windows even if you don't use iTunes? I don't think so.
This isn't about OSes - this is about programs, and trying to obtain a monopoly lock on a way to transfer files to an MP3 player. - geminitojanus, on 10/10/2007, -6/+12HMAC stands for Hashed Message Authetication Code, so in other words, they added a way to verify that the file in the database is the file that it's linking against.
And this is what gets considered evil. SIGH. - skyshock1, on 10/10/2007, -3/+9Hopefully this will have the opposite reaction, and people who already bought an iPod will now have an incentive to move to Linux.
My next player will be from Cowon however. They support more formats. - halter73, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5True, but with the iPod classic there is no wifi.
- dieselmusa, on 10/10/2007, -2/+7Very nice work :)
- Kyderdog, on 10/10/2007, -3/+8Buried for lies.
"MacBooks are twice as expensive as other brand notebooks with exactly the same configuration" - kaiwai, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5Yeah they did; I thought they would have pulled out the firewire chip as well - their claim was that if they removed it the cost would be reduced and thus higher margins. As for firewire, years ago it was a great technology but when you're looking at USB2 with addressed all the problems of USB1 - namely low bandwidth, high cpu utilisation and not able to recharge the ipod. USB2 now has 480mbps; the need for firewire is gone.
- Iandefor, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5As mentioned above: you don't need to introduce a private key to a SHA1 to make sure the data's consistent. You only need to do that if you're going to prevent anyone but you from touching the DB.
- TheSpore, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4iTunes and iPods used to be so awesome.
For instance:iTunes used to let you share all you music over a LAN connection; iTunes used to be pretty stable around version 4.2-4.9; iPods used to be the best value for your money in terms of memory and audio quality and interface.
Now: iTunes severely limits LAN sharing; iTunes is really crummy at playing music (I can't web-browse and play music at the same time now with the audio going crazy), and cover-flow has only made iTunes less stable; iPods are no longer the best value in terms of memory, the newer iPods actually have worse audio quality, and as much as I love the click wheel, I'd like a dedicated volume control and folder-based music organization. - stmiller, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4iPods currently work with Linux software, and have for some time. Apple has not sued anyone. The initial support for iPods went through a similar discussion then. It's more like reverse engineering than breaking any laws.
- jshabad00, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5Nice work!
- yunus, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4Can you imagine what great products and applications we would have if large corporations would work with people like this instead of wasting their time trying to stop them.
- inactive, on 10/10/2007, -4/+7Not just linux users, but anyone who doesn't want to infect their computers with iTunes.
- CodyJP, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4Glad to hear it.
- inactive, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4Good job guys :)
- totorototoro, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3:D
- eean, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3That's from a comment to the blog moron.
- maxputer, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4Nicely done.
- Scruffydan, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4I would be more worried that apple slaps a DMCA lawsuit on Amarok for bypassing the ipod's digital lock
http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/archives/005442.php - MacParrot, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3Well, not quite. FireWire 400 is still faster than USB 2 according to most tests that I've seen. However it isn't SO much faster that it's worth maintaining as a standard for data transfer on an iPod. And considering that many more people have USB 2 as compared to FireWire, it isn't surprising that Apple went that route.
- rebuilder, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3if you want durability, get a flash-based player.
- rebuilder, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3"Take that, Apple - people have more incentives to buy your products now!"
I'm sure they're in pain. - subterfuge, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3you're too late. didn't you read the article?
- geminitojanus, on 10/10/2007, -2/+5"How much security does an iPod need?"
Enough to prevent someone running arbitrary programs on your iPod by exploiting some piece of software (iTunes) through a malicious file (its own database). Imagine the damage you could cause to open WiFi networks by carting around a virus spewing WiFi device without you even knowing it. - ChOas, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Apple 0 ?
They sold every iPod Amarok gets installed on, not ? - TheSeeker11, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2I could do that, I just don't want to.
- MacParrot, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Happy,
Other than using it in hd mode, isn't it the perception that the iPod is locked to iTunes? I thought that WAS part of the problem that Apple was having in Europe. - sirhomer, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3Yet another company decides to be hostile to freedom and gets pwned in the face. And no, I don't own a single Apple product.
- kaiwai, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2gtkpod and libgpod used to be 'one' but then a few months (possibly years) ago they seperated the two so that libgpod technology can be shared amongst several projects. Its a great way to do things, as it allows several projects to benefit from the work of one rather than each project working on their own implementation.
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