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- chrono13, on 10/12/2007, -4/+93Wine has always surprised me. Not by what it can run, which is impressive by itself, but the fact that the project was started in the first place, surprised again that it continued to be developed especially at times when it did not provide much and was not popular, and surprised again that it survived several releases of Windows, which may have caused others to give up: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wine_software#History
Does anyone have the quotes for the beginnings of Wine? Something like...
"Hey, lets make a compatibility layer between Linux and Windows that will make Windows applications run flawlessly in Linux".
What brass! To strike up such an enormous, difficult, and even potentially dangerous (catching MS's litigious ire) project.
And now when projects like ReactOS and other seemingly impossible or overly difficult projects come up, I first and foremost have the utmost respect for all of the developers who chose to work on it. To devote so much time and effort into a task that could be many years (if ever) to show any fruit. among the other dangers. If something like ReactOS succeeded tomorrow, it would not go unnoticed or unanswered by MS. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactos#Controversy_and_code_audit
And yet, these developers do it anyway. In the face of gargantuan tasks ("Hey, I know... lets perfectly rewrite Windows!"), being laughed at and made fun of ("WHY? LOL!") and having a project that has a large part of its foundation laid upon an unwilling, and indeed vicious, disruptive and destructive third party who would do anything to see it fail - well... you just have to wonder, with brass that size, how do they sit down? - Agret, on 10/12/2007, -0/+31Cedega has been surpassed by wine now, don't waste your time with it. Just stick to wine.
- Phocion55, on 10/12/2007, -2/+28Yet....ironically....look at who's whining right now.
- SniperGX1, on 10/12/2007, -1/+24If you don't like a story don't digg it or read it, and definitely don't comment on it as that makes it look active and will be promoted more quickly... moron
- NoOneButMe, on 10/12/2007, -5/+22You _do_ realize that Cedega is built off old Wine code, right?
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+17As is Windows...
- voyvf, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12Mad props to the wine developers. I don't often run wine, but when I do, it's usually because I have to run a win32 application, and need to run it *immediately* - as opposed to waiting for vmware to boot up a guest OS.
Hopefully one day it'll be so seamless, it'll run Windows applications as quick and stable as if it were native. - Xenogis, on 10/12/2007, -1/+12You still have grass!?
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -23/+33In other news, the grass in my front lawn is now a full 1 inch longer than it was 2 weeks ago.
- Felshadow, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10that would be a huuuuge task, although i could never really get much to run in Linux with wine (although its easy to replace software, god i miss Amarok) its still a decent program
if they had some more supported titles and programs than i wouldnt even use windows, but games keep me anchored :( - Tourney3p0, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9Actually it sounds _exactly_ like whine. Unless you have an extraordinarily small brain and have a difficult time distinguishing between "sounds like" and "looks like", I guess.
- luperry, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9the irony...
it doesn't happen so often when you can say so much about a person's intellectual competence just from one sentence. - KillerJ59J, on 10/12/2007, -3/+11mandeep: Because _bold_ is not an optional. I'm _sure_ I could write my emphasis in capital letters, but that is no substitute for bold and maybe I think the _ approach is more elegant.
- Theli, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10"Call me when I can install the following (or any updated versions) by clicking a few clicks..."
You forgot to post your phone number. - thomasprebble, on 10/12/2007, -3/+11@boybunny
Show some ***** respect mate. Obviously you have not the faintest idea how hard software can be to develop. - boybunny, on 10/12/2007, -3/+11I don't care about WINE any more. I lost interest a couple of years ago. Its great if you want to play Game X because all the developers ever bloody do is "DirectX Fix" after frigging DirectX Fix!
I remember when WINE was supposed to eventually make every application on Windows work on Linux. Isn't it time to branch off Direct X development from the original WINE, so WINE can finally make programs like Photoshop, Corel Draw, Corel Paint, Illustrator and tons of others work out of the box.
There has been NO advancement for any graphics apps (and I doubt any other types) for at least four years. The reality is that I and many other people I know will never switch to Linux until all the Apps we need and want can work on Linux. We don't care at all about games.
And I know someone will point out that you can get Photoshop 6 running if you dont click on the wrong buttons (that causes an immediate crash). How old is Photoshop 6 now? Go look it up. - jongarber, on 10/12/2007, -3/+11For people who are whining about the Wine update being on digg... shutup, some people don't check the Wine website everyday to check for updates... however we ALL check digg first thing in the morning and periodically (every 5-10 seconds) check the front page. Also, I'd love to see Wine on Mac OS X. I use Crossover on Mac now. I switched from Windows to Linux to Mac. When using Linux, I actually loved, and enjoyed the challenge of getting programs to work with Wine. Whoops, ranting... sorry ;)
- deadbaby, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7It's not an emulator so no. You'd need an x86 virtual machine.
- Theli, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8"Double click an icon, click 'next' a few times, then run the application. That's how life should be."
I prefer selecting the applications from a categorized list, crossing the ones I want and uncrossing the ones I don't want, and then have the operating system automatically download and install them (no extra clicks needed).
I'm running Windows XP and Kubuntu on dual boot myself and I must say that Kubuntu is much friendlier to work with. Very little restarting, a central place to run all updates from (apps and OS), no WGA to bother me and no start menu that after a few weeks of usage gets so cluttered as to make it useless. I even find the systems settings dialogs to be easier to use even though I've used Windows Control Panel for several years.
There are a few applications that require one to use the terminal, sure... and there are also a few applications that require you to edit your sources.list file, and I do hope that in time these will be added by default so you can install them as easy as you install Amarok. It is something that needs to be looked into before Linux can truly become an "average Joe" operating system.
I do keep Windows installed because it does have its advantages, though these advantages are arguably not inherit in Windows itself but rather a consequence of its popularity (application/game/driver support). - NoOneButMe, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6No harm no foul. Lay off chrono13 - he realized his error and admitted to it; props for that. Not many online would do such a thing.
- limxdul, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8i remember the joy i first felt when i finally made wine run starcraft. that was like six years ago. the memories... brings me tears...
- Lorian, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Well speed is not an issue because nothing is being emulated, the Windows API is "just" being reimplemented. Stability, still not so great.
The progress they are making though is pretty staggering though. - srg13, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6You can run CS2 as well, but it's a little more complicated:
http://blog.publicidadpixelada.com/how-to-adobe-photoshop-cs2-on-ubuntu-10-steps/ - user98887, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Oh Man that's awesome. I have been waiting for this release since version 0.9.32 made the front page of digg
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Some hate Windows and some love the apps that are coded for windows.
With Wine you can keep your cake and eat it too. - pauldonnelly, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Read the changelog ( http://source.winehq.org/source/ChangeLog ) and tell us again that the developers only work on DirectX. It may not run whatever program you're obsessed with, but quit talking bad about the developers who are working hard and doing a good job.
- GMorgan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Actually WINE runs a tiny amount on a VM. If any program makes an IVT call that will be handled via the WINE VM. Most applications do not make IVT calls though and get deeper access through libraries. All the libraries have been re-implemented using the Linux IVT so run natively. In essence it depends on the program but in all cases the direct IVT calls are so uncommon that it is usually a negligible cost even for those apps that do make IVT calls (and even those calls are still 80% efficient, so we lose 20% efficiency for every 1,000,000th line of code, the general efficiency of some core Linux functionality more than makes up for it).
You could build it on another platform using a Java style VM. Build the libraries natively but run the code on the VM. You'd get reasonable performance (i.e. Java/.Net level in some cases) for normal applications (since all the libraries are native) but it wouldn't work as nicely as WINE on x86. It would also take a lot of hacking and I'd say you aren't going to get anyone to do this any time soon if at all. Too much work for too little gain.
//edit - note you could built a x86 VM on a C64 if you wanted. Anything that is Turing complete can implement anything else.// - GMorgan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Meh, not even in the HURDs league. GNU make the best vapourware.
- Nick42, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5My favorite feature in Wine 0.9.34 is the fact that Guild Wars is now playable. The invisible cursor bug is gone, and it now works great out of the box!
- lassel, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5I'm happy to get the news when it shows up in a Ubuntu update ..
- deadbaby, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6That's a fair point. I'd rather seem them focus on applications too. If you want to play PC games just dual boot and get it over with.
- Jumangi, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5Wine has to be the longest running beta in the history of software.
- idonthack, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3"shutup, some people don't check the Wine website everyday to check for updates..."
However, their package manager does. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2will the new version run photoshop?
- romulasry, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3"BTW, when will this thing be a version 1.0?"
After DirectX 10 gets implemented somewhat, then we get to have fun with all the bug fixes. ;p - romulasry, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Medieval 2: Total War now goes into battle without crashing this version.
See http://appdb.winehq.org/appview.php?iVersionId=6222
Look at the screen shots. Not bad, now to fix the funky mouse cursor in game. ;) - chrono13, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4Sorry noonebutme, I see now what you were saying. I haven't checked the lists for each for a little while, and it seems while I was sleeping things changed.
Use Wine, try Crossover if Wine doesn't work, and forget Cedega. Again - sorry. - SimonGray, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Actually, it was _alpha_ until recently (last year I think it officially became beta software).
- srg13, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4As I said above to someone talking about photoshop:
"You can run CS2 as well, but it's a little more complicated:
http://blog.publicidadpixelada.com/how-to-adobe-photoshop-cs2-on-ubuntu-10-steps/ "
It's only three steps if you have a fully updated distribution. - pauldonnelly, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I'd rather have an application crash than the whole system. Besides, most of the programs people run won't be running in Wine. It's a big comfort to know that your operating system isn't a house of cards that will fall down at any moment, taking everything you had sitting around with it.
- dgh1973, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5Dugg because on a whim I fired up World of Warcraft with it and it appears to work better than cedega/winex... at least letting me alt tab out of it into other things.
Wine has come a very long way over the years. - GMorgan, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4Linux is more stable than Windows though by a long way. In the Linux community people talk about only being able to get a fortnights uptime as a disaster. Totally different league of stability.
Now distribution channels and the LSB are being worked on we should see more native apps. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2man, i'd report more bugs i find to wine if bugzilla weren't so damn complicated. it requires ***** logins, and what's worse, it's the type that sends you an email confirmation and all that crap. yuck. why the hell can't it just be a "insert bug description here" textbox, and then a "submit" button, and that's it?
- kerrle, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2@catmistake:
I guess you haven't actually looked at wine if you think you can't run Microsoft software in Linux without the source. Several versions of Office have very good support now, and run just fine. Outlook/Outlook Express included. - muppethouse, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Last week I decided to try to compile the latest CVS version of wine for OS X. To my surprise, it built just fine. I'm not running the two applications I need without any problems. From what I can tell though, using Apple's X11 server along with stock wine will not give you any DirectX capabilities however. Nothing I need however uses DirectX, and since the latest OpenOffice 2.2 uses X11 I have that running anyway.
- straxus, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@catmistake
You could always use Evolution as your mail client, as it has Exchange support. I use it at work. In addition, Crossover will pretty much set up Office for you. - Eddm, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2By the way, I used Ubuntu for over a year before I switched back to Windows -- I know what you mean about the checking/unchecking applications you want and don't want and I wish this was a Windows feature. Ubuntu has me beat there.
"Stability" was probably a bad word choice. "Productivity" would have been better. I waste enough time trying to customise applications, let alone getting them to run in the first place.
I think I speak for the average professional when I say we just want things to work as they come to us. While Wine is slowly getting closer to achieving that within Linux, it's definitely not the same yet. But how I wish it was. We shouldn't have to work around these cross-OS issues, and it would be great if developers would create more native linux applications but unfortunately they don't and that's the deal breaker for me.
Not to mention I have yet to find an open-source application that is anywhere near as good as it's commercial counterpart. - lindapuzhgena, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Cool! Such things make me a bit crazy! http://fishtalks.blogspot.com
- brokekneck, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1So I can run BF2 and BF2142 now right?
- Stonekeeper, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2@Freddre
ROFL! You just gave me a good start to the day! -
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