What is Digg?Sponsored by HowLifeWorks
How Private Online Shopping Clubs Work view!
howlifeworks.com - How to become a member and get discounts of up to 80% on must-have luxury goods
92 Comments
- NICU, on 10/12/2007, -8/+34Almost everything this guy is trying to do after "Install Ubuntu" can be accomplished through Automatix. Automatix installs all the media players, codecs, common applications, and proprietary drivers you could want. It also installs Wine which lets you install any Windows applications you could want. If you're looking to use Ubuntu (or similar distros) check out Automatix.
Ubuntu, and most other Gnome and KDE based distros, are very easy to use. Had you never seen Windows before you'd have just as much more trouble with Windows. Windows doesn't have repositories of over 20,000 applications that are ready to install. - n8r0n, on 10/12/2007, -4/+20That's not saying much, this year is only 18 days old...
- stalefries, on 10/12/2007, -6/+21A lot of people recommend that you _do not_ use Automatix, because it makes poor choices in, for example, your sources.list file. Really, it's not that hard to do this kind of stuff, and you learn _a lot_ while doing it.
- Ramtech, on 10/12/2007, -2/+16Ubuntu is freaking great...
it runs awesome on my Pentium 3 550MHz , 384MB of RAM
thank you linux!!! :).. - UltimaNut, on 10/12/2007, -3/+17"What it takes to make Ubuntu ready for use"
Ready for use? Thats odd cause ive been using it all year. - czimmerman, on 10/12/2007, -0/+13Linux doesn't have solid software? What the crap are you smoking? Just because we don't have native Photoshop and Microsoft Office doesn't mean we don't have solid software.
- ace77, on 10/12/2007, -3/+16I don't want to start ***** here, I always appreciate your comments Roy and I am a big Linux fan but this time I do not agree at 100%. I think that for the average Windos user even following the step-by-step set of instructions can be difficult, you konw those noobs are always scared by command line prompt. Anyway I think that wine does a great job and indeed sometimes installing a Windos game on Linux is very easy for Linux users
- Phocion55, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14Don't people realize that Linux experiences vary from person to person?????????
Saying "Ubuntu is the easiest to use" is INACCURATE. Says WHO?
I couldn't get Ubuntu to install on my laptop after 3 hours, but had a base Gentoo system up and running on it in 2.
Hell, if I was new to Linux - knew nothing about, saw "Ubuntu is the easiest", and had the experience I did with it, I would be on Digg right now flaming everyone who uses Linux in general.........like a lot of people are doing. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+13I found Ubuntu to be pretty stable, only needed a couple of restarts in 2 months time. I use putty/fedora at work so I can get around cmd line somewhat okay, but in the end.. if Linux main objective is overtaking Windows, the cmd line has to go in favor of click install. Typical computer illiterate users are not going to learn lines of commands to install simple things etc.
- GnuTzu, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11Great way to rate the activities and nicely organized.
- sishgupta, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9sudo gedit
- bobothn, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10@CrazyZ
http://www.gnucash.org/
why use quicken?
And 95% of all windows apps i have tried to install worked flawlessly. True quicken might not work but there are free alternatives that are better. also quicken is not a simple windows app. - Phocion55, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Then how about .BAT files in Windows? Damn....that must mean I have to open a Windows cmd window, CD to my Tomcat BIN directory, and execute the startup batch file.
Who does that?
Following you logic, Windows has the same usability issues, then. - Phocion55, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Sweet! I must be the only person in the world with a working Wifi card!
- UltimaNut, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9I go by the Chinese calendar. New year for us on your calendar is 2/18/2007. There are other cultures on this planet you know.
- msgyrd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6The only goal I can really pin on the open source movement is it's desire to stay open and free. Undermining other markets is simply a byproduct of producing quality software for free.
- wynd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6"if Linux main objective is overtaking Windows, the cmd line has to go in favor of click install."
That's not its main objective. Linux was not created to make money. Linux does not have the goal of being the most popular and widespread OS on the planet. Crazy, I know. - Recuso, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Exactly. The big gripe I have with the "easier" distros is that it takes too much away from the user. Going through a gentoo stage-1 install with bootstrapping for the first time took me a while, granted, however the experience itself was very intimate and I learned a great deal about my operating system and my particular install of Gentoo. Nothing I wanted was on the system, everything I required was. I got a customized experience that taught me a multitude about Linux and Gentoo, how to work the system, and how to upgrade and maintain my system.
That said, Gentoo documentation usually is above par. That is where I see the natural "next step" as. Not towards 100% "easy-to-use-omg-you-stupid-user" readiness, "click it and forget it" type things. I want an operating system that is well documented and lets ME, as an educated user, make the decisions -- not treat me like a moron and do as it wishes. With the resources available to the average semi-tech-y person (gentoo installation and support documentation, irc.gentoo.org #gentoo (freenode)) there is no reason someone shouldn't be able to get an installation of one of the more "difficult" distros like Gentoo up and running.
Okay, now that that's done >_>
$ emerge -C rant
[Or 'emerge unmerge rant', as I still type it. I don't know why that got depreciated, I liked it :(] - eqisow, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Flash 9 in installable in Synaptic with extra repositories enabled. You definitely don't have to open a CLI if you don't want to.
- schestowitz, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8From the (fairly good) item:
"10. Install a Windows game (Warcraft 3)
* Difficulty Level: Hard"
Actually, all one has to do is find the correct Web page and then follow the step-by-step set of instructions. Wine can do WoW, e.g.:
World of Warcraft on OpenSuse Linux 10.1 (with Wine)
http://www.latenightpc.com/blog/archives/2006/11/25/world-of-warcraft-on-opensuse-linux-101/ - tehbored, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5What?! Flash is easy to install. Just download it from the website, unpack it, click on the installer, the click "run in terminal." After that you pretty much just have to hit "enter" a few times and you're done! Ok, so it's SLIGHTLY harder than windows; the only thing is that adobe should put these instructions on the download page.
Great list BTW. - diggapleaze, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5yet trying to do a dist-upgrade after tainting your machine with automatix *is* difficult
stick to the official repos (including multiverse and universe if you need to), kids. - Sabarok, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5In the article, the writer explains the definition of his terms. "Hard" is anything that requires looking the information online and more than 1 command. On a scale of easy to hard, if that doesn't qualify as hard, what would it take for something to be hard for someone who knows next to nothing about computers (the average user). Having to look something online and follow steps is not as easy as clicking a button
- misterhektik, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Ace, calling people who don't like command line "noobs" is a step backward in the movement to make linux mainstream. It's exactly that kind of elitist attitude that is stopping linux from progressing.
Also, there shouldn't be "step-by-step" guides for every single application you want to install. It gets tedious. Saying that installing WoW is easy, just takes n number of steps just doesn't do it. - noahhoward, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5The only big problem I've had with Ubuntu is dealing with file permissons, I can't just go and edit my files unless I'm the specific user that created it. I understand the reasons for this but it is annoying when you upload a web page to apache then have to change the privliges.
Of course, unlike most people who use Linux then give it a scathing review, I'm willing to admit that I'm lacking knowledge of something that would probably simplify it. - jaknet, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4@ UltimaNut.. How about turn down that little knob on the speakers in stead?
Very clever comment, but if like me you actually enjoy listening to music and the pc is wired into the hi-fi (instead of the naff speakers supplied with pcs) and the controls are well out of the way. Losing a volume control to hand is annoying. - DeadPenguin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Or you could be lazy like me and install Linux Mint.
http://linuxmint.com/ - Phocion55, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8You can execute the flash installer script to run in a terminal.
Requires two clicks.
Don't blame Linux. Blame user ignorance. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7getautomatix.com
It's not really that difficult... - Humptydank, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6Well I'm not that hardcore in Linux, and I just got my first Ubuntu install to boot up the first time into X no problem. This is worth noting because it was inside a VMWare Virtual machine, which was running on a TrueCrypt encrypted container which was running on Windows x64 Professional.
And on a dual-core Athlon 3800+ w/2gig of ram the performance isn't bad at all.
Plenty of opportunities to go wrong with the setup above, but it's still just fine... - UltimaNut, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7How about turn down that little knob on the speakers in stead?
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5Ubuntu has given my old Dell inspiron a new lease of live - it was completely crippled with windows, now its useful again.
And Automatix is great too. - Makurosu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3You make a good point, and I wish some of the earlier versions of Ubuntu hadn't been so difficult to get things working on. I remember spending days and even compiling source to get mplayer to work on Hoary. My salvation was the UbuntuGuide.org website. This was before Automatix or EasyUbuntu. I didn't switch to Ubuntu on my main computer at that time, because it was just too much work to set things up on my computer that I needed. I made the switch during Dapper shortly before the Edgy release, and I have never gone back to Windows (except here at work, obviously).
I hear a lot of complaints about Ubuntu that aren't true today, but were true in earlier releases. So, it sounds like there is a certain group of people who want an alternative but have been turned off by a previous version of Ubuntu, which is unfortunate. - bradleyland, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Regarding the Automatix thing. I recently installed Ubuntu for a friend who didn't want to pay for Windows XP on a computer I gave him since Vista was right around the corner. First, thank god for Automatix. Second, why do we need Automatix. The whole thing seemed like a bit of a hack to me. It's like a tacked on layer on top of the existing OS install/configuration systems, since they're lacking in some way. There's nothing in Automatix that you shouldn't be able to do through the traditional installation methods, and have it fall under the "Very Easy" category as defined by the author.
This is the fifth Linux distribution I've installed over the years for use by friends or myself. Starting with RedHat 7, then years later with SuSE 9, Mandrake 9, Kubuntu, and now Ubuntu. Each experience has proven to be many times better than the last. Linux community, I thank you for your efforts. - elnerdo, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6My problems with Ubuntu when I started were that no matter what I did in-OS, the sound volume was always at max (unplugging the speakers was the only way to fix that). The second was that I could not get a resolution of 1680x1050 to work. I found that these problems (As attempting to fix them was my first experience with Linxu) were incredibly difficult to fix. It's the hard problems right at the beginning of Linux use that turn people off.
- mccord, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2i guess you found the solution already, but anyway:
if you use alsa (standard in most distributions i think) to store the settings of the mixer (alsamixer) you have to type "alsactl store" at the console :)
have a look at the forum or mailinglists of your chosen distribution if you have a problem,
most times you'll find a solution to your problem right there! - bombadier337, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2**I use Ubuntu on 95% of the time and love it most of the time**
I wouldn't say that. After using Ubuntu for 3 months on my desktop it took me 3 days to get audio working on my tablet. That was a lot of trial and error, and no one in any forum or anywhere else had a solution. I wrote a howto eventually, which had helped many people with the same problem as me.
What I'm getting at is that many people like to help others, and a lot is definately written, but there are many questions that are not answered anywhere, especially when it comes to specific hardware. - brundlefly76, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4He lost me at installation: Easy.
I've said this 1000 times, but how easy it is to install any Linux is determined by how good the distro is with hardware and what hardware you have.
Ive done a ton of Linux installs over 11 years, and it can be easy, it can be hard, it can be very hard, and in some cases the hardware is simply not supported in any way (notebook modems and X-Fi sound cards come to mind, but there are many more...) - brundlefly76, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@humptydank
Actually VMWare Workstation is my favorite way to run Linux recently. It is no surprise you got it working because you are actually *adding* a layer of hardware compatibility.
Since VMware is bridging hardware from your Windows drivers, VMWare Linux under Windows will run on any hardware Windows can run on, even if Linux has no native support. - jonnyq, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I really really agree with #6. I think Add/Remove Programs should include absolutely everything that's in Synaptic except simple dependencies and libraries. In other words, it should include absolutely everything in Synaptic that will put an icon in your Applictions menu in Ubuntu and in your K menu in Kubuntu.
Well, I guess in Gnome Ubuntu it shouldn't include applications that are KDE specific, necessarily, it should be an obvious option. (The downside is that the first time you install a KDE specific application, even if it's just one, you end up installing pretty much all of Kubuntu - not a particularly bad thing, but takes forever) - deanshultz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1 "I don't want to start ***** here, I always appreciate your comments Roy and I am a big Linux fan but this time I do not agree at 100%. I think that for the average Windos user even following the step-by-step set of instructions can be difficult, you konw those noobs are always scared by command line prompt. Anyway I think that wine does a great job and indeed sometimes installing a Windos game on Linux is very easy for Linux users"
Must disagree with Ace77. The statement, 'noobs are always scared by command line prompt' is a generalization and inaccurate. Speaking for myself, I used to write dos batch files in the mid-90's and so, was not concerned about the Linux cli as much as what I did not know about syntax and the classic dos bugaboo, needing to know the commands before I could type them. Sort of a seeing the forest for the trees problem. That is where the user forums have been most helpful and made taking the plunge easier. Personally, I ran Linux on vmware for about two weeks, checking off items on my gotta-have-list as i figured out how to make things work. Then, one day, after a Vista demo, I decided to just wipe my drive and just do it. no dual boot. If linux didn't have it, i didn't need it. Needless to say, the Linux environment has had what i have wanted, Scribus, VLS, gimp, blah-blah, and more. It's been a cool ride, so far. So, before tweaking noobs' noses, make sure you do not mind pulling back some goo. :)
-d - Lorian, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1EnderTheThird: I do a similar thing, I have 2 monitors and whenever I am in Windows, TeamSpeak always starts on the first monitor, it is a pain to have to double click the top bar, move it across and double click in again, in GNOME I can just drag it while its maximized and it does it all for me.
- EgoDemens, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2@SimonGray
Man are you ***** wrong. nm-applet runs in the notification area, nothing more integrated with gnome/kde than clicking a little icon by the clock and selecting a network, oh whoops it's a secure network, hey no problem network manager has popped up and is asking for the WEP or WPA key! Type it in, you're done. The only thing "wrong" with Linux wifi is device support, as the developers are at the vendor's mercy for documentation. Most of which can be overcome with ndiswrapper. I don't get all the rest of you cry babies on digg: you have enough technical competence to download an iso, burn it, partition, install, and boot a completely different operating system and yet as soon as it comes down to installing a driver you all hit some mental brick wall and become retarded. How the ***** did you losers install the network card in your pirated copy of windows when you had to install that for the first time?!? - EnderTheThird, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I've used Wine and/or Cedega for a decent number of applications and games, and it's worked pretty well. Granted I'm a pretty experienced Linux user, but I think the main problem from a former Windows user's point of view is that installing and using those programs is made more difficult and less intuitive in Linux. Of course, that's not the distro's or Wine dev's fault, but rather the result of choices made by the original software developers. Nevertheless, from a new user's point of view, it's a lot more effort just to use a particular application in Linux than in Windows.
It's also important to note that other tasks are significantly _more_ intuitive in Linux, especially in a more user-friendly distro such as Ubuntu. For example, if a user needs a more robust CD burning or multimedia application, he or she need only look through Synaptic or Add/Remove Applications. In Windows, you could be googling for an hour trying to find a free piece of software with comparable features, especially if you want one sans all the spyware and adware.
The desktop environments are typically more conducive to productivity as well (at least for me). I can't count how many times I've tried to use Alt+Left Click to move my windows in WinXP at work or press Alt+F2 to bring up the Run dialog to start a program. This point is a lot more subjective than the previous one, but I still think Linux DEs offer better productivity and customizable options without searching for a bunch of 3rd party software. Most of the "Windows features" I miss are actually just 3rd party applications (or hardware) that don't have Linux ports or alternatives. - ace77, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2@misterhektik
Ok you are right, "noobs" is not the right term, i didn't want to offend anyone. By using the term "noobs" I wanted to refer to all the users switching from Win to Linux, you know we all have been noobs, me too. I don't consider me a linux guru and I don't like the elitist attitude that a some Linux users have. - deanshultz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Dugg. Nicely done, thanks for taking the time and doing a thorough, professional job. I found some useful stuff (dualhead).
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@ tamrix : Did you ever used the ***** HELP IN UBUNTU?
For example check the help about the network config dialog, and then check the dialog ir refers to. Some buttons mentionned in the help are missing from the dialog.
For the casual users, this is very confusing.
(dude, let go of the caps and the *****. Seriously) - msgyrd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1At the command prompt, "alsamixer" allows you to change volumes by hand in Ubuntu. It's also mentioned in nearly every thread at ubuntuforums when you search "sound problem". If that doesn't work, then yes, it can start to get difficult from that point.
I don't mean to sound elitist, but if a user can't search for answers and follow guides, linux probably isn't a good match for them. Just being a realist. - polymorphist, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1To those who oppose Automatix: Yes everything can be done without it, but can you honestly tell me you can do those choir as fast and correctly as Automatix can? It's all about efficiency, right?
- deanshultz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Excellent idea. Linux is not M$, yet so many posts seem to want Linux to do Windows specific tasks, play windows games, be Exchange-server, be some Adobe app, fill in the blank. However, I am not saying to aim low and not produce quality product. And don't get me wrong, don't take this as a flame of any sort, but if someone wants Photoshop, just-like-it-is-on-Windows, perhaps they should expect to pay for windows.
I am what we all call a noob. For me, the moniker is not a pejorative. In fact, I am excited at the idea of running Linux at home and am like the proverbial ex-smoker; I think everyone should quit the Windows habit, if they can, and try Linux.
My machine is only three years old, yet already too dated for Windows, hmm. For myself, the final straw with Windows was seeing a Vista dog-and-pony show, in which the UI had yet another layer of goo, and optimal OS requirements were 1GB of ram for Vista. Well, max ram on my machine *is* 1GB, leading me to conclude that now was a good time to jump.
At its current state, things, truly, (mostly) just work. For protection, I like how my PC needs just a firewall - maybe, but not anti-virus, et, al... And that I do not have to 'defrag' periodically, just to keep performance up. Or that a locked program does not mean BSD. It's all good.
Linux, FLOSS, Open Source, all of it, whatever you want to call it...is a gift. Personally, I am grateful. I mean, we get an incredibly cool OS, and commercial grade software, just for the asking, and a user-support community that is second to none - and the support is free, too.
wow.
Let's recognized Linux for what it is, an alternative...whose time has come. -
Show 51 - 92 of 92 discussions
© Digg Inc. 2009
— Content created and posted by Digg users is