What is Digg?121 Comments
- Sc5i, on 10/12/2007, -4/+105Not to be the naysayer here but why when ever Microsoft sponsors a study stating that Windows is the choice/winner/etc. do we all scratch our heads and say 'of course Windows was the choice/winner/etc. because they funded the study.'
So when a Linux organization, in this case IBM, sponsors a study we just assume it is correct?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but does IBM stand to gain a lot from such a result? - StephenChow, on 10/12/2007, -6/+62Yes they do, the IBM presdident gets mad bitches because of this study.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+18Isn't the headline just a tad misleading? It could easily be confused to apply to the desktop as well.
- Phil246, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14the keywords here are "IBM sponsored study".
Microsoft does these all the time and gets lambasted for it, likewise should IBM.
Linux is definately better suited for servers - no doubt about it to me but i would much prefer a completely impartial and independant study to prove this. - evilTak, on 10/12/2007, -5/+16It's not "Linux" that's making it a "convoluted mess" to use wireless or flash, it's the wireless manufacturers (I'm looking at you, Broadcom) and Adobe, who has actually (FINALLY) released a flash 9 beta [1] for GNU/Linux.
[1] http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/flashplayer9/ - richieh, on 10/12/2007, -8/+20Maybe since they alledgely have won the war, Linux software developers and Linux can concentrate on making their products usable by normal people who aren't total diehard linux geeks then...
- loqqq, on 10/12/2007, -3/+13I need to see Linus on an aircraft carrier with a "Mission Accomplished" banner.
- doodlebumm, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12@ Sithlrd
You haven't look at a Linux version in what - 5 or 6 years? You are so totally last century (and millenium).
"Better to keep your mouth shut and let people think you are stupid than to open your mouth and remove all doubt." - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10Oracle sucks man, that CEO has alot of nerve.. he hasnt done ***** for linux or open source exept badmouth redhat, i have absolutely no respect for him, all talk.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -18/+26Linux has code in it that was contributed by French programmers. You can't get any more un-patriotic than that.
And that's what Linux is, unpatriotic! The terrorist OS!!
(Yes, this post is a joke) - shrewduser, on 10/12/2007, -20/+28"A new IBM-sponsored study on Linux sent me by Joe McKendrick, our SOA expert, goes a long way toward explaining the big Oracle and Microsoft moves regarding Linux."
translation: apparently linux is the next big thing and people know it... - adml_shake, on 10/12/2007, -5/+13Thats probably because your running the beige box servers out of your basement. Those of us in the working world have known this for a long time.
- dgh1973, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7@JJJG
I'm not convinced, I still think MS has a sinister ace up their sleeve. In the past they have agreed to partnerships like this only to leave the partner high and dry in the end. In fact they have done it to Novell before when they were peddling NetWare.
Something is rotten in Denmark... I mean Redmond. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -21/+27@Sc5i
Its because most digg users recognize that a Linux server is superior to a windows server in many respects and so they want to agree with this article because it makes them feel better. However when Microsoft puts out a study saying Windows servers are still better it just feels wrong and so they bury it and flame it because it they know it must be wrong because it would be too horrible to be true.
IMO in most working environments windows servers are still very prevalent for 1 reason. Any monkey with a stick can operate a windows server so they can save money by paying employees less to operate it, while it takes someone time and effort to get a linux server running and then if something goes down more time and effort to fix it. Usually IME linux servers don't go down once set up though, if set up correctly. But since Windows Server Admin's are cheaper to hire than Redhat Certified Admin's it makes business sense to spend a bit of money on the equipment so they can pay less for the help.
At least that's been my experience with small companies, large companies with whole departments devoted to IT might think differently. - clickwir, on 10/12/2007, -9/+14@sc5i
Yes, sure they do. But so do lots of other companies and competitors. When microsoft sponsors a study, it's to benefit themselves and no one else.
This study kind of just points out the obvious where the MS ones go against the grain.
In the company I work for, every new server runs linux or some variant of *nix. Mostly linux. You actually have to get 2 VP's, manager of the networking group and 2 network admins to ok and sign off if you want windows. It's a big hassle to get windows on a server here. Talking to friends at other companies, it's getting to be Linux is the server standard and windows, well theres a lot of expense and red tape and it's usually rejected.
If I was MS, I would immediately stop any and all work on "server" type products and focus more on the desktop. Because Linux is gaining ground there too. - Wootery, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8@Sith
Compiling the kernel? Take a look at Ubuntu, that renders your kernel-compilation and your installation comments out-of-date.
Well ok, installation can still be rather less user-friendly than Windows/OSX when you can't install something through GUI, but there is no need to compile your own kernel for desktop or server use. - fredclown, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7We should all dread the day when one company "wins" and there is no more competition to keep them on their toes. That is when stagnation happens.
- ztirffritz, on 10/12/2007, -4/+9You need to get out more.
- keef06, on 10/12/2007, -8/+12Wow, Linux's really better for servers? Tell us something we don't know, this isn't news.
- clickwir, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6you must not know the right people. Just look at netcraft. You are in the minority and falling fast.
Just because your little world humps MS, doesn't mean its good.
@EvilTesdall
Sure, ONE of them. The other 9 run linux. Hows your point now? :p
@koktakee
Actually it's more like the 80% market share thats vocal. The numbers speak for themselves. - Promantarius, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8ZeroRaiden Linux is actually incredibly complicated to set up properly if you don't know what you're doing, though you probably wouldn't agree as it would appear that you've set it up countless times. If you do something enough it'll seem easy, regardless of how difficult it actually is. Operating and setting up Linux may be easy for you and others around this site, but that certainly does not make it easy for everybody. Walking is easy for you, I sincerely doubt a baby would agree though.
Just a side note, vandread I'd appreciate it if you didn't attempt to speak for the majority of people when expressing your opinions in the future. You may be correct, but the majority of fan boy arguments start with the "everybody thinks the same thing as me" mentality. Better off speaking for only for yourself and no other :) - ZeroRaiden, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6@Vandread
Come on, also even a monkey also can operate a Linux Server (i know a lot of them LOL), i work with both systems, we have "Windows Guys" and "Unix Guys". IT is subjective, i know really good system administrators and even architects, integrating complex solutions based on IDM, CRM, Datawarehouse and other cool stuff in Windows and Unix. They don't care about the platform as soon as it satisfies the needs, the budget, etc. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8I'm a system admin at a fairly large medical facility. I may be getting a job with the city where I live....all windows there.
Like I said, just an observation......no need to digg me down. - dioscaido, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5"The big winner this quarter was Sun, whose revenue increased some 15.5 percent year over year. Additionally, its market share grew from 11.2 percent in the second quarter of last year to 12.9 percent this year, regaining the number three position in server market share rankings over Dell."
...
"Windows servers also continued to show strength, with 3.1 percent growth in revenues, and 11 percent growth in shipments year over year. Servers based on the operating system made up 34.2 percent of quarterly revenue, as opposed to Unix's 35 percent share, a 1.6 percent decline in revenues and 1.8 percent drop in unit shipments."
http://www.betanews.com/article/Sun_Windows_Make_Server_Share_Gains/1156349073 - 98acura, on 10/12/2007, -7/+11(and a lame one)
- cmiz, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7@projek7: when i reinstall linux i don't have to call microsoft and explain to them that i'm reformatting a machine and i need it to be able to activate. when i'm installing lots of different servers/software, i don't have to pay for the linux based solutions (not always true, but it's the trend). an internet connection and apt-get install (whatever) makes installing programs a dream. popping in cd's and typing in serials is a bit obnoxious. i don't have to install antivirus software on linux. i don't have to reboot everything when i update things with linux. i don't need to have a graphical interface running on a linux box (saves a lot of processing power). installing things with scripts is easier with linux (maybe it's easy in windows too, but batch files don't seem to cut it for me). secure shell... why hasn't windows implemented something like this? (no, remote desktop is a completely different beast). lots of different linux distros to choose from (i'm a fan of Debian and CentOS).
windows server is certainly a lot easier to set up out of the box, in fact i've seen developers pulling double shift as system admins. but just because they CAN set them up doesn't mean they SHOULD. most of the security problems with windows server 2003 comes from its ease of use allowing people that know very little about security to set up servers. sure you can set it up, but if you don't set it up right it will be a zombie in a few weeks.
oh, and if you run .NET apps, you don't really have a choice. - willistg, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6I don't care who won the "war" . Linux works for me. And with each *ubuntu release it gets more and more usable by the un-geeks.
As a full time .net developer... ubuntu + vmware is the only way to run I think. Since it seems to be nearly impossible to keep a vs.net 2002 environment, vs.net2k3...2k5 running smoothly on the same box without the use of virtual machines.
I'd also like to point out, that MS sponsored studies that claim lower tco for windows vs. Linux are considered to be FUD, so I think an IBM sponsored study claiming the opposite should probably be taken with a bit of salt. However, it does seem to agree with consensus that I see.
- zitch, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4This reminds me of the "Linux: A European threat to our computers" article on Shelly the pebublican: http://www.shelleytherepublican.com/2006/04/20/linux-a-european-threat-to-our-computers-by-tristan.aspx
Read the rest of the Linux-related rants. They're a hoot! http://www.shelleytherepublican.com/category/education/technical/linux/ - CurtHowland, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3THank you! That "shelley the republican" site is _hilarious_!
I like how they have asked Netcraft.com not to let anyone know what OS they're running. Gives it an air of mystery. - adml_shake, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6"Just like with Firefox or Apple, it's the vocal 3% who make the most noise...I'll stick with Windows too."
Based of that comment alone I know you don't work in this field. And these people who are saying "Oh but I run MS and everyone else I know runs MS" I'm guessing that your servers are either Poweredge Dells (the small ones) or beige boxes. Because anyone that's messed with the big mission critical machines knows that most of those aren't running MS. - clickwir, on 10/12/2007, -5/+8It has. Some people (MS) are just now starting to come to terms with this.
Denial is a bitch and it's sucking money out of MS. - sarhentolobo, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6@vandread
You're forgetting your economics: jobs (like Windows/Linux server adminstration), like most other things, don't arbitrarily become cheap or expensive; their cost depends on the law of supply and demand. The more companies need Linux administrators, the more expensive they'll be, and vice versa. Same goes for Windows administrators.
From your experience, it looks like the IBM survey has hit the mark :) - neoq36, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3when will they learn.....it doesn't matter what platform...all you need is good system administrators and good developers....and the rest depends on your budget
- vuke69, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2You are aware that the windows desktop market share is less than 98% right now, and (slowly) shrinking every day, right?
- schestowitz, on 10/12/2007, -7/+9Last week:
Linux has won -- long live the rest of the indemnified stack
,----[ Quote ]
| Welcome to the "Linux Everywhere" world. Microsoft now loves Linux,
| even if Steve Ballmer wouldn't don a penguin suit.
|
| Yes, Linux, I think we can safely say, has won. Oracle wants to get it
| to you cheap. Microsoft wants to let you choose how to deploy your
| applications -- on Linux or Windows instances, perhaps on the same
| machine or blade rack. Intel, AMD, Dell, HP, IBM, Sun -- they all
| just love Linux.
`----
http://blogs.zdnet.com/Gardner/index.php?p=2370 - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5Freedom toast!!
- bonklit, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5Wow, you people have no sense of humor.
I lol'd. - TritonX, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I knew it, you can be iliterate and operate windows. The article was talking about servers and so many windows fanboys are saying how good their windows is good for desktop.
- noddyxoi, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6installation in linux is the fastest thing on the planet ex:
smart install openoffice
takes me 2 minutes to get openoffice installed... try that on windows...
as for the command line, complex tasks may require more complex tools, if you can call the command line complex, but once you master them nothing is faster to acomplish than the command line.
Also command line is a nicer experiment with zsh or bash with completion, i just type the first command and the rest of the line is automatically completed... try that with cmd in windows... - EvilTesdall, on 10/12/2007, -6/+8Same, we use Windows at the local goverment scale, and some huge firms in the area, one of the top 10 Medical Centers in the COUNTRY uses windows.....but yet, linux is winning?
- CurtHowland, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2The vast majority of people upgrade their OS by buying a new computer with Windows pre-installed.
They believe that Linux is hard to install, because they have never had to install Windows.
Like the ridiculous comments about "restarting" Linux when upgrading software. No, the only time Linux needs to be rebooted is when the kernel itself is being changed. With Windows, every time some application makes a change to the registry the entire system has to be rebooted.
Installing Linux requires one reboot, when booting the new system instead of the install CD. That's it.
Seriously, one of the finest things to come around are the LiveCDs. Boot the machine into Linux, take it for a test drive, try it out. Save the configuration changes, or for that matter save the entire CD to the disk, and next time have any changes (like network configuration) come up working.
http://www.knoppix.net/ My favorite. Give one to a Windows-using friend today. - cliffzdude, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5My favorite: "Over two-thirds of the respondents said they will increase their use of Linux in the next year, and almost no one said the opposite." What they don't tell you is that over 2/3 of the respondents also said they'd increase their use of Windows in the next year.
- itisme, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4monkey
are you a system admin for a very large scale company or have you got a couple of servers for email and AD?
At the top end the big companies are looking at heterogeneous server environments and software companies are expected to play nice.
I'm playing with mono (.net) on GNU/linux and can say it seems alrighty, as I understand it there are loads of default gnome apps that are mono/.net Dependant I can see portability/interoperability of both desktop and server/web apps becoming more and more important. Perhaps thats why Microsoft have started to make public their strategy to deal with FLOSS environments.
- bloodylip, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4I love Linux, but I take this report as seriously as I take the reports of Microsoft sponsored studies saying Windows wins in the server world. IBM has a vested interest in Linux, so it's hard to look at it and say there is no bias.
- HarryBauzonia, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4"I have never been able to effortlessly complete a Linux install on any of my systems."
Linux is so much simpler and faster to install than any version of windows. I don't think you tried very hard. But then again, Mac users aren't accustomed to installing their OS. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -11/+13That information leads me to believe that if given the chance, it would surrender to any attackers. =D
- dygitaljoe, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3The foreshadowing struck me by surprise
http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=12&foo=A%20new%20Microsoft-commissioned%20anti-Linux%20study%20debuts%2009-25-2006
Seriously, Linux > Mac > Windows. - st1nkf1nger, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Ask an EX-IBM employee who worked on the server side I must say this:
LOL, Ya, right.. - nukexbi, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3Don't forget that Apache runs on Windows as well.
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