What is Digg?126 Comments
- Th3_anOmoLy, on 10/10/2007, -2/+511) Good list. I'm going to show this to a friend of mine who I spent an hour stressing the importance of #'s 4, 5 and 6 last week.
2) The title never, ever, says it all. - sdub74, on 10/10/2007, -2/+21Can we add some rule that stops people from posting links with the description "the title says it all"? If the title said it all, then they're be no reason to read the story, so clearly, the story does not "say it all".
- trghpy, on 10/26/2007, -28/+45Pshaw.
Linux is all about freedom.
1: Freedom to run as root
2: Freedom to ignore the community
3: Freedom to ignoramus
4: Freedom to let them hang with out support
5: Freedom to be blind
6: Freedom to stay where you're comfortable
7: Freedom to fear command lines
8: Freedom to replicate what ever OS you're gay for.
9: Freedom to give up because you're an free balling Root-aholic ignoramus, who fears a world with out windows.
And we'll make fun of you for being such.
Cheers! - sepelester, on 10/26/2007, -0/+15Addendum (AKA the guy-who-always-knows-better-comment)
1."su -" means "spawn a login shell as root", thus exactly the same as logging in as root. You should only do this if you want to perform a bunch of tasks at the same time, without having to sudo them each. Always log out when you are finished. If your session gets hijacked and you are logged in as root, a root kit can be planted and the logs deleted or edited, removing any evidence that you've been hacked. Plus - and this is more likely - YOU can screw up the system with root access. You can not with user access only.
2. You can break the package management when you compile and install software yourself. This could leave your computer in an unbootable state.
3. Don't expect everyone to contribute to the community. You will both be disappointed and scare away a fair bunch if you try to force them. Just advocating Linux is enough.
4. man pages, c'mon. Welcome to the 21st century. No one can seriously expect a new Linux user to study man pages. They're far too technical. Pressing F1 is usually enough, and if it isn't, something is wrong. And it's not the user. Also see point 6.
5. People who want to help are located at IRC, look in the proper channel. #ubuntu for ubuntu related questions. They will guide you to the right channel if you don't know. (You can use BitchX or Pidgin/Gaim to connect to IRC)
6. Imagine hanging out in the #kde channel and there is a new bug that broke something hard. People logging in and asking the same question once every five seconds are gonna make you go postal. Please don't mind their verbal abuse, just look at the channel topic or google the error message. You'll probably find a solution or a workaround within the first five results.
7. Or just be satisfied with your daily porn session. Linux is very customizable though, so you could probably get your porn delivered hourly to your tivo with a bit of exploring.
8. If you're not interested in development (see 7) or testing, you shouldn't ever need to use the terminal (command line).
9. Linux is made to be better than Windows. If you think it isn't, try again, you'll like it when you get used to it. Seriously.
10. You're welcome to try again in a year if you do give up. Linux is always under heavy development. Main features are added daily in contrast to Windows and OS X where they are added with new versions and releases. You can get that with Linux too. They're called "stable" releases. They have been tested by the entire community for quite a while, so they really are stable. - severedsolace, on 10/26/2007, -1/+16Most of the linux documentation I've ever used is *loads* better than any of the windows documentation I've ever run across. There have been times where the software gets updated and the documentation doesn't so a feature isn't where you expect it to be. Most of the time though, the documentation is dead on. Some even goes as far to explain everything in detail followed by "If you just want to get it working to play around, Copy and paste this: [Long as hell line of code to run in bash]"
- matrixbandit, on 10/10/2007, -1/+14If the title said it all, we wouldn't need a ***** article.
- lengau, on 10/26/2007, -0/+11Except that you can accidentally kill your system and there will be no "please enter your password" prompt to stop you.
- cricoste90, on 10/26/2007, -13/+20Thou shalt not feel the inside of a vagina.
- mpdickso, on 10/26/2007, -3/+10Thou shall install for my parents
Everyone has parents that don't know how to use computers...what better way to spread linux, and save some time from having to fix their systems all the time! - ha1f, on 10/26/2007, -1/+8Buried for completely undermining the true purpose of Linux: choice.
- bromac, on 10/26/2007, -5/+12This elitist attitude is why Linux isn't on the desktop. Yeah, make fun of them. Just ridicule them and call them stupid if they don't use Linux. That'll work!
Users should be free to be an ignoramus about their computer. I shouldn't need to be a mechanic in order to drive a car. - init100, on 10/26/2007, -0/+6Hardly. Documentation such as man pages and API references are not tutorials, and should not be made into tutorials. Tutorials are good for their purpose, but they should be kept separate to not clutter the reference documentation for experienced users.
- sumguy231, on 10/26/2007, -2/+8Well I sure don't want that. I'm going to digg you up just to be safe.
- GMorgan, on 10/26/2007, -0/+6Even if the above were true (and there is some merit to the idea that your data is more important than your install in a single user system) there is no compelling reason to run as root when you don't need to.
At the very least it saves something. If I run as root then I lose my data and my system. Without running as root I only loose data and keep appropriate back ups. Restoration is easier then. - init100, on 10/26/2007, -0/+5"4. man pages, c'mon. Welcome to the 21st century. No one can seriously expect a new Linux user to study man pages. They're far too technical."
Man pages are not meant to be a tutorial for new users, but rather reference pages for experienced users that wwant to look up arguments to a command or the syntax of a C function or system call. For this purpose, man pages are fine. For a slightly more newbie-friendly system, look at GNU Info, though more visually pleasing systems exist (such as the web).
"8. If you're not interested in development (see 7) or testing, you shouldn't ever need to use the terminal (command line)."
Some things can be done much better in the terminal than in any GUI. Exhibit A: Any user who has tried to process many files at once, such as rename them according to some pattern. This is fairly easy in the terminal, but would require a specially created application in the GUI. - TypeEE, on 10/26/2007, -0/+5I am too ashame to tell chicks that I know how to use linux as that's really a turn off!
- OneAndOnlySnob, on 10/26/2007, -0/+5Not running as root keeps you organized. I like that all my stuff is kept in one place: my home directory. I like that I have just one thing to back up and migrate to new installs.
Being able to make sure random programs don't edit my apache settings, for example, is important to me. Seemingly innocuous programs could easily do retarded things to my file system with the best of intentions. Not running as root protects you from that. Sure, malware would still have access to my precious porn, but it's still another layer of security, and a quite effective one at that. - jbohlinger, on 10/26/2007, -1/+5Dugg for correct.
- CoBrA9891, on 11/12/2007, -0/+4exactly... thats why they use linux instead *rolls eyes*
- TypeEE, on 10/26/2007, -2/+6If all your parents do is one set of tasks, then linux is possible. I tried linux myself but I went back to windows. Linux desktop is really not for me.
It does makes life easy if all you want is a LAMP stack. You can be setup in no time, while windows was hell to setup the 3 items - sundancekid503, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5#11 - Don't submit some campy story to Digg about "My experiment switching to Linux". It's been done already. A million times.
- chris9902, on 10/26/2007, -3/+7"read the documentation". You seem to think most people would even understand it.
- NedSlider, on 10/26/2007, -1/+5Not just for the new user - I have over 10 years experience running UNIX and Linux, and found those 10 commandments to be equally valid for experienced users, lest we forget.
- init100, on 10/26/2007, -1/+4The user interface is only a part of a desktop operating system. The argument is probably not that people should not do Mac- and Windows-lookalike GUI themes, but rather that people shouldn't complain that the directory structiure is dissimilar to Windows, etc. I've read a lot of complaints that Windows directory structure is much more logical than the Linux directory hierarchy. It isn't, it is just different. When you get used to it, it becomes just as logical as anything else.
- sishgupta, on 10/26/2007, -0/+3How about the fact that both the 2nd and 3rd commandments cost money.
Deepfreeze is 100 bucks and so is windows xp.
At least with linux, there is no need for that third commandment (though they do offer a linux version) - GMorgan, on 10/26/2007, -0/+3Personally I think brevity is the way things should be. Quite simply if you take 6 words to tell me something you could in 5 you have wasted a word. I once spent about 45 minutes reading through worthless MS documentation to find a particular feature in Powerpoint, in the end I gave up and scanned the menus an item at a time.
Linux documentation tends to be terse. If I grep for x I quickly find a short description of what x is and a quick run down of how to invoke x. This is exactly what you want, I don't want a marketing pitch when I need help*. Documentation should be to the point.
*which seems to be how MS approach documentation, instead of how to do x they tell you why x is great without telling you how to do it. I know x is ***** great you mindless moron of a writer, if I didn't I wouldn't be trying to use it. - init100, on 10/26/2007, -0/+3"1."su -" means "spawn a login shell as root", thus exactly the same as logging in as root."
I think that they are rather referring to logging in as root in the graphical interface. That is quite different from running su in a terminal, because only commands executed in that terminal runs as root, while if you login as root in the GUI, *everything* runs as root.
"2. You can break the package management when you compile and install software yourself. This could leave your computer in an unbootable state."
Fortunately, the default location for packages built with GNU Autotools (a lot of packages) install by default into /usr/local, which does not interfere with packages installed by the package manager. - jdhore1, on 10/26/2007, -0/+3Documentation is the most important thing on linux...Wanna know what a program does? Read the README. Wanna know what switches/options a program has? read the man page. Wanna know what's changed since last release? Read the ChangeLog. Wanna know what stuff is upcoming? read the TODO. Wanna know how to install a program? Read the INSTALL doc.
- bromac, on 10/26/2007, -2/+5I was going to say the same thing as TypeEE. The reason Linux isn't more easily adopted is that they just document complexity, instead of trying to make things simpler. People don't want instructions on how to complete 27 steps. They want 3 steps.
Also, the article says that the advantage of linux is package management. I had a good chuckle at that. - anjinash, on 10/26/2007, -1/+4I totally agree with your first point - things need to be streamlined and made simpler in Linux. When everything the cli does can be replicated in the gui, then Linux has a real shot against OSX and Windows. This is 2007, the cli is still useful but should not be mandatory for using your OS of choice.
Your second point, meh. With Synaptic I can add and remove just about any package I want, with all dependencies worked out automatically for me.. and updating every last bit of software on my system with just a click or two is too awesome for words. With the right package management system in place (deb being my preferred choice) Windows and Mac can't even compare. Installing and maintaining software in Linux hasn't only gotten pretty user friendly, it wipes the mat with Windows and OSX. - thecheatah, on 10/26/2007, -0/+3I install linux on everything i can get my hands on. "my computer has viruses" format, install ubuntu, "my computer is slow" format, install ubuntu, "i got a letter from comcast saying i am sending spam" format, install ubuntu
None of these people have complained so far. Most of them are teenagers who dont know much about computers, but do everything teens normally do.
I REALLY dont know what you do that REQUIRES windows. For games i dual boot ;-). but other then that I havnt had a complaint about anything for some time.
Life is good :-) - sepelester, on 10/26/2007, -0/+3Try Ubuntu. Just download the Live CD and give it a spin. It boots up linux without installing it. A bit slower, but lets you try it out for a while. If you want to install it, just double click the install icon on the desktop.
Or you can try the windows installer - WUBI (http://wubi-installer.org/), to install it on a file on your windows file system. It's completely uninstallable from your add/remove programs in the control panel in windows. That one is still beta though, so I won't catch the flame if something get screwed up. - CCmachined, on 11/09/2007, -0/+3are you some kind of demon? what sane person would do that?
- vornan19, on 10/26/2007, -0/+3Did you RTFM?
- Samurailink3, on 10/26/2007, -1/+4The most newbie-friendly distro I've run across is Ubuntu, but give Fedora a spin as well, its very fast. SuSE is ok, having to use Yast was hell though...
- geminitojanus, on 10/26/2007, -0/+3I guess all of that work Ubuntu's been doing to make things simpler is all for naught then. Thanks for generalizing. Things are getting easier every single day on the Linux desktop, but there's still complexity, and reading the manual can not only document the need for said complexity, but also how to avoid it.
Believe it or not, even on Windows you'll find people consulting the documentation to do things or to find out if things are possible. Feel free to crack open the help programs on both platforms and you'll see that both are pretty neck-and-neck. - Acolyte357, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2I have no idea how you can't understand the man pages.
- bitORlogic, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2"Man pages are not meant to be a tutorial for new users"
And yet noobs are routinely told to read them, as if that would help them. - desibabu, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2Don't need to! Microsoft already does a fine job!!
- anjinash, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2One word: Photoshop.
I don't mean to come off like I'm against Linux. I'm not.. I run Ubuntu alongside Vista, XP and OSX on a daily basis. If Ubuntu would run all of the CS3 applications I need, I would spend a lot more time using it. Of course this is not the fault of Linux per se, but those applications DO require Windows or OSX right now. And before you say "Wine", Wine can run Photoshop 7, which is not good enough... and try getting a Wacom tablet fully functioning with pressure sensitivity in Linux. It can be done, but it was a total nightmare last time I did it on Ubuntu Breezy last year.
My wife is open to using Ubuntu and I may just throw it on her system. The rest of my family relies on various Windows applications that are not feasible in Linux. It's easier to maintain their Windows boxes with the occasional update and spyware scan than it is to teach them a whole new OS that is not compatible with what all of their jobs, friends and co-workers are using. - Takalth, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2Why are people digging him down. Show that list to your average computer-illiterate Windows user and they won't even know what the heck they just read.
- jdhore1, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2Manpages ARE written by developers (who else is gonna write them?), but i think they're pretty easy to read if you know the basics...If you have no idea that wget is a file downloader, the manpage won't help you much.
- xino, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2When they say "the title says it all", I think of "it" as the description and some times the title is a good enough description that there isn't any thing more to say in the description field so why write a description if it is identical to the title?
- vornan19, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2You're as bad as UtopianTheSky
- kenadamsmith, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2try Ubuntu, you don't even need to install if you don't want to. Load the CD and reboot. That's all. If you don't know how to do stuff, ubuntu website will be helpful. http://www.ubuntu.com . I'm not saying it is the best distro, but it is easier to use compare to Suse and Fedora.
- sepelester, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Haha! Good one.
- init100, on 10/26/2007, -1/+3People like you would probably call it a hobby OS even if it took over the entire world.
- vornan19, on 10/26/2007, -1/+3Of course.
But only if it's OS9. - init100, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2Man pages are not meant as tutorials, but as a reference for experienced users.
- CCmachined, on 10/26/2007, -0/+2on Linux, my home directory is: /home/username.
on Windows, My Documents is in C:Documents and SettingsusernameMy Documents.
how is the the former not simpler? the latter is a pain when im trying to use a windows partition on Linux, it's case sensitive remember... -
Show 51 - 100 of 126 discussions
Browsing Digg on your phone just got easier with our enhancements to the 
© Digg Inc. 2009
— Content created and posted by Digg users is