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76 Comments
- Rocco03, on 12/21/2008, -13/+82But now they don't have the drivers for the missiles.
- inactive, on 12/20/2008, -5/+54About friggin' time DoD. The NSA has worked to secure Linux (SELinux) and Windows has major architectural flaws that will keep it from ever being secure.
- traemccombs, on 12/21/2008, -1/+42I just got hired as Website Administrator / IT support for a mid sized city. I'm hoping I can eventually help spread Linux - F/OSS to our city. Why make the taxpayers pay for an inferior product when you can get something better for free.
- inactive, on 12/21/2008, -2/+40BECAUSE the defense department can ensure that the underlying code is secure and also they can customize code, unlike MS products where you need to trust the company that the software does what it says and has no backdoors.
- inactive, on 12/26/2008, -1/+22Hah! I'm sure those bureaucrats care about taxpayers money...
- syst3m3ltdown, on 12/21/2008, -2/+21it's prob built in the kernel like everything else
- Rothbardosaurus, on 12/21/2008, -3/+19http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG2MnhrrY7s
The counter-intuitive thing is that OSS permits the DoD to have code that is *more* secret, not less. If they bought their security at retail, they're no better off than everyone else who buys it at retail. If they can write their *own*... - DangerCollie, on 12/21/2008, -1/+15This isn't new. I remember reading about open source gaining certification for DoD projects back in '06. That was right as the Navy was completing their transition to a managed Windows infrastructure. The infamous NMCI project. One of the worst defeats in Naval history. Casualties were 250 million American taxpayers.
- inactive, on 12/21/2008, -0/+13Do you have to kill us now?
- GeigerRulesBig, on 12/21/2008, -0/+13No, but I would if I told you that our ICBMs use puppy Linux.
- GeigerRulesBig, on 12/21/2008, -1/+13I am in the Navy, and so I work for the DoD, after a fashion. I can tell you right now that a lot of the Windows solutions I have seen in boot camp and in my Connecticut base simply do not make sense. The IT guys are constantly running into virus problems in the Windows labs, and energy usage is through the roof since the computers must be left on at all times to push updates to them. The entire process just does not make sense from any stand point. When you throw in the classified material systems, Windows becomes an even worse choice due to all the convoluted software required to make the system secure. Luckily, our submarines make us of Unix (Sun, Solaris) and Linux (RHEL, I think.)
- mrBitch, on 12/21/2008, -0/+11And the gentle jab at Microsoft :
" ...while Microsoft has paid for research that counterbalances the apparent rise of open source in U.S. defense agencies, it's hard to argue with the facts. " - Anand999, on 12/21/2008, -1/+12They just have to load the Windows drivers using WMDWrapper.
- mrBitch, on 12/21/2008, -0/+11Agreed. My fave bit FTA :
" the CTO of a powerful agency within the U.S. Department of Defense boldly declares open source's superiority as a development model:
' Open source brings to us the ability to have collaborative and agile development environments....Additionally, open source benefits the Department of Defense through...simplified licensing...and security....Security through obscurity just doesn't work. ' " - Midnitte, on 12/21/2008, -2/+13Sure they do, means more taxpayer money they can spend on hookers.
- TheSabre, on 12/21/2008, -1/+11I work for a bureau within the DOJ and we are starting to embrace OSS as well. In fact, I'm on the committee to create bureau-wide OSS standards. Even though this article only mentions DOD, I'd be willing to bet that just about every cabinet-level department is at least researching OSS for use in their department; they just aren't quite as open about it yet.
That doesn't mean that we'll see a switch from MS Office to OpenOffice or IE to Firefox right away. I think we'll start seeing new systems with OSS rather than using OSS to replace old systems. We'll have MS Office and Windows on the desktop for a bit throughout the government, but new projects may start turning to MySQL or Linux/OpenSolaris when they are being developed. - gavintlgold, on 12/21/2008, -0/+9sudo apt-get install missile-control-plugins-ugly
- z0rk, on 12/21/2008, -0/+9NASA/JPL use about 50/50 Solaris/RedHat, with RedHat slowly taking over. The Mar Science Laboratory project uses almost exclusively RedHat.
- NeptuneZen, on 12/21/2008, -0/+8Actually the navy has been using open source software for awhile. My last boat had fedora on a couple of servers. Unfortunately all the stuff I administered was either NT 4, HP unix (10 years out of date), or solaris 8.
- omgwtflawl, on 12/21/2008, -1/+9I work at a small open source RFID conference, and while at an RFID convention my booth was approached by a DOD guy. He said that his department was looking into investing in open source, because of the security advantages it offered. It sort of amazed me, because I thought all those pentagon guys liked the big corporations more then the small, open-sourceish developers.
- cuoops, on 12/21/2008, -0/+8yep - http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060820-7545 ...
- cassaffousth, on 12/21/2008, -0/+8I think you misunderstood the article. Going from closed to open doesn't means so much change (e.g. replace Internet Explorer for Mozilla Firefox).
Open source is not equal to GNU/Linux ;-) - motters, on 12/21/2008, -2/+9I guess that open source is important in military applications so that it can be independently checked for flaws or backdoors, and also more mundanely checked for compliance with the relevant standards and specification documents. If you buy closed source stuff how do you know that whatever nation which supplied it hasn't inserted some backdoor or logic bomb into it.
However, I know that over the years many FOSS developers have held reservations about their code being used by military organizations for unethical purposes. - Rothbardosaurus, on 12/21/2008, -1/+7An excellent essay.
- OBKenobi, on 12/21/2008, -0/+6Maybe now they'll stop getting hacked.
- bakshi, on 12/21/2008, -1/+7That seems like it will be a hard job, especially with all those old bureaucrats born and bred on Windows and the Microsoft applications. They'll have a hard time adjusting to the open source derivatives especially if Microsoft is openly paying them off to use their costly suites.
I hope you succeed! - linuxeventually, on 12/21/2008, -0/+6Java of all things on a plane? Oi.
- init100, on 12/22/2008, -0/+5"The counter-intuitive thing is that OSS permits the DoD to have code that is *more* secret, not less."
Wrong. It permits higher security, but without secret source code. It's no more counter-intuitive than the concept of using open encryption algorithms with secret encryption keys, a widely appraised best practice among cryptographers. - bonez56, on 12/21/2008, -0/+5have a nap, then sudo apt-get install fire-ze-missiles !!
- blackturtleus, on 12/21/2008, -1/+6Wow! Signs that the phrase "military intelligence" might not always be an oxymoron!!!
- DiskCrasher, on 12/21/2008, -1/+5They're running Linux and Java on some of their war fighters already.
- Meheren, on 12/21/2008, -1/+5I Truly hope you succeed!!! good luck
- int19h, on 12/21/2008, -0/+4DKMS
- ethana2, on 12/21/2008, -2/+6Creative missiles contract: bad idea.
- inactive, on 12/21/2008, -0/+4seriously, throw some icons on the desktop for them and it really isnt that hard. I have seen computer illiterate people navigate my linux desktop like they had used it for months.
- brettalton, on 12/21/2008, -0/+4That's only if they redistribute the code, which I doubt they will.
- TheSabre, on 12/21/2008, -0/+3The problem is that employees within the government are just regular people. Do you think a secretary, auto mechanic, photographer, lawyer, etc. are going to be open to something different from what their home computer has? That is why Microsoft Office is the de facto productivity suite... because a vast majority of employees who enter the job have already used it. There is no overhead.
Surely you must be joking to consider using MS Office or Windows a violation of human rights. It's all about using the best tool for the job and best is not simply limited to cost of procuring. There are training costs involved, there are staffing costs involved (Windows sysadmins are a dime a dozen in the government, Linux sysadmins are more expensive). Up until now, the government saw a better ROI on proprietary software. OSS has made its way deeply into academia and now IT/CS graduates have more extensive experience with the products. It's a trickle-down effect; there are more resource available to the government, so it is become more cost beneficial. - TheSabre, on 12/21/2008, -0/+3I wouldn't say that the government is going to be a big contributor to open source (not counting agencies like DARPA and NSA who have always been pretty big contributors). Open source is just starting to be used. The government, at least from what I've seen working within, is still going to be relying on the open source community.
- stonefoz, on 12/21/2008, -1/+4So, my tax dollars paid for THOUSANDS of applications while there might have been a FOSS alternative, that would have been more secure and cost less up front? Well, lets just keep shooting ourselves in the foot, it's worked so well so far. ***** Uncle Sam!
- Daniel591992, on 12/22/2008, -0/+3Hope it doesn't freeze the plane
- boerema, on 12/21/2008, -1/+4You're an idiot. NASA's applications are far too specific for any standard software package. It would be like saying, "Using Linux for a nuclear reactor control system has some drawbacks." Of course it does. However, the beauty of Unix/Linux is that a small group of dedicated people could customize a Linux distro is a couple of months that would be a good as, if not superior to, what NASA is using now. Nothing relating to advanced science works "out of the box".
- inactive, on 12/22/2008, -0/+3"Having done a lot of work with the DoD, I can pretty much say that shifting over to a Linux environment would be very expensive due to the amount of in-house applications and support boundaries imposed by their current software providers"
Did you just violate your DoD secrecy contract? - Slade605, on 12/21/2008, -3/+6http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar ...
A good read on the development model, Also the essay which made Netscape release source code and start the Mozilla foundation, if my memory serves me well. - brettalton, on 12/21/2008, -0/+3Isn't that only their webservers?
They don't use Solaris or Red Hat for their spacecrafts... (yet)
http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS5714800202.html
http://jaboutboul.blogspot.com/2008/02/fedora-on-f ... - blueimac540c, on 12/21/2008, -0/+3Groton FTW?
- syst3m3ltdown, on 12/21/2008, -2/+5iv'e said this before and I will say it again. If all government, health, police, and even school computers are switched to linux or any other open-source os, it would save America Billions, that's how you combat a recession. It would also create more jobs because their could be outside contracts with all kinds of programmers, not just Microsoft programers.
- dotRoot, on 12/21/2008, -0/+3When I was in the military and then recruited into the DoD for awhile, we used to use Linux terminals for secret and above classification stuff. Linux has had the same security rating as Windows. In fact, its rare that I see a Windows terminal for that sort of thing, unless its specialized, because of some manufacturer's driver developement is only Windows.
I haven't seen any SELinux terminals, but it doesn't really matter, because classified and unclassified aren't ever mixed, or it all becomes classified. - LastDitchHero, on 12/21/2008, -0/+3Everything can be used for evil if applied correctly. Google search has evil things but more good than evil. Facial recognition could help catch bad guys or just monitor our movements.
People don't always think before they make something GPL. - mrBitch, on 12/22/2008, -0/+3RE: " Windows becomes an even worse choice due to all the convoluted software required to make the system secure. Luckily, our submarines make us of Unix (Sun, Solaris) and Linux ... "
Open Source Subs ! - ScottyMcBaggs, on 12/22/2008, -1/+3You just got hired as a website admin and IT support role, not exactly decision maker roles.
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