What is Digg?544 Comments
- zed260, on 10/11/2007, -107/+622that's good news in my opinion digg should also block IE users (probably gonna get dugg down big time) digg might lose some users but if it makes even a single person switch from IE it is worth it
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -51/+270I hope more websites do this, IE rendering bugs are unacceptable.
- KnightMareInc, on 10/11/2007, -47/+191blocking 70% of the internet makes perfect sense
- mrbro, on 10/11/2007, -12/+126What gives? I'm using firefox and the site still looks ugly.
- raynevandunem, on 10/11/2007, -23/+127I find this a bit much, but the rationale behind it makes sense. Hopefully, this can become a trend.
From the forum: http://www.devin.com/ieblock_howto.shtml for a how-to on blocking IE. - kupa, on 10/11/2007, -41/+139Ok, I hate IE rendering bugs as much as the next guy, but blocking people from viewing your site totally? Isn't that like shooting yourself in the foot? Hell, that thread had a poster "can't view it from work" -- Hello? IE maybe ***** at rendering, but I'd rather people see a ***** render then block them completely. That or, one could stop using convoluted menu systems.
What IE Users see: http://www.openaddict.com/ie_reject.html
I don't mean to sound rude or offensive or anything, but when you design sites, IE is just something you have to contend with. "oh noes it doesnt render right, so i'm just gonna be lazy and give up!!!11" - Senn, on 10/11/2007, -9/+94If you don't like having to work around IE's lack of support for standards (it pisses me off considerably), perhaps a less extreme method would be to present IE users with a splash page that includes a warning that the site may not render properly with IE, and at the same time recommend alternatives.
- CarolynMittens, on 10/11/2007, -7/+70i applaud this article and the idea behind it, but is blocking IE users really the way to go? i think all you need is a disclaimer on the site recommending IE users to switch to something more designer/programmer friendly, and throw up a link to firefox. that's what i did on my site. shoot, half the people who use IE don't even know there are other options!! (ie everyone here's mom). blocking IE all together just seems a little harsh to me.
- aliengoods, on 10/11/2007, -9/+66As a web developer, IE is far more troublesome to develop for than Firefox, Opera, or Safari (I try to keep compatibility with all 4). Javascript is loads of fun in IE, and by fun, I mean pain. Bottom line is Open Addict has the right idea. And for their market, how many people are using IE anyhow? I don't think they would have blocked it if they were going to lose 75% of their user base.
For the record, I use Firefox. No, I wasn't abused as a child. It just has too many great extensions with a simple, easy-to-use interface. - EvilCheeseWedge, on 10/11/2007, -30/+86As a consumer, I have a right to use an “inferior” product if I want to. It’s okay with me, I just won’t visit your site. I will, however, note the inherent hypocrisy here. If Microsoft did this, but the other way around, a war would freakin’ start. But what, it’s okay if open source, or the smaller guy does it?
Forcing people to either use an alternative, or “deal with it” is not really the best way to convert people to open source, in my opinion. - nevesis, on 10/11/2007, -5/+49I think this says a lot about programming practices at the various browser organizations:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/winfamily/ie/default.mspx --- Failed validation, 208 errors
http://www.apple.com/safari/ --- Failed validation, 3 errors
http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/ --- Failed validation, 1 error
http://www.konqueror.org --- Passed validation
http://www.opera.com --- Passed validation - dcoolidge, on 10/11/2007, -3/+47This is the first time I ever heard of open adict...
- whataboutdave, on 10/11/2007, -17/+59I don't think it's unreasonable. We don't allow 1910's steam-powered horseless carriages on the highway, do we?
- MioTheGreat, on 10/11/2007, -6/+48We might if 85% of the population was driving around in them....
- SoCalChris, on 10/11/2007, -6/+47You've never had to create a PROFESSIONAL site, where you get paid by someone who expects ALL of their visitors to be able to see the site correctly irregardless of browser, have you?
- houndeyex, on 10/11/2007, -4/+38Holy crap, W3C validating the Internet Explorer home page only throw TWO less validation errors than myspace.com
That's ***** sad. - Giga, on 10/11/2007, -7/+40Why not? I'm willing to bet that the type of people who come to digg are the type of people that don't fit in the >50% of the market that still uses IE.
- Zachariah, on 10/11/2007, -2/+33Or, better yet, just strip all of the CSS and javascript out for IE and leave just the info (plus the message saying that the site is functional in all browsers, but looks best in ones that are standards-compliant).
- roadtrippy, on 10/11/2007, -1/+31So who is Open Addicts target audience now? People who are using open source software already? I'm betting it will be kind of hard to advocate the greatness of open source to the vast majority who are still using IE.
- Virak, on 10/11/2007, -21/+49You've never had to make a website work with IE, have you?
- david76, on 10/11/2007, -5/+32This isn't "extreme" it's ridiculous. Half of the problems they're having with layout are because they're using bass-ackwards techniques like positioning everything using absolute instead of relying on the document's natural page flow.
It is kind of ironic that a site dedicated to open source would actively block users from getting access merely because of what browser they use. I, frankly, find it very hard to believe this site couldn't be rebuilt to look correct in IE. - Nossie, on 10/11/2007, -5/+31I'm a huge linux / os x advocate and digg users seem to love burying my comments because of that, but even I cant help but feel this is the pot calling the kettle black. If it doesnt work in IE then fair enough, but why cant he just tell users that complain to take their issue to MS or download firefox rather than to actively block their browser :(
- ball3r, on 10/11/2007, -9/+34When accessed from Internet Explorer:
If you're reading this it means you're using Microsoft's Internet Explorer to attempt to view Open Addict.com. You're being blocked because Internet Explorer doesn't adhere to web standards and some of our website code, which works *perfectly* in Firefox, Opera and Konquerer, doesn't work at all in IE and I'm tired of hacking workarounds for IE's bad implementations of standard technologies. This isn't anything against you as a user, rather against Microsoft for thinking they're too good to play with the rest of the world and build their software in compliance with published and accepted standards. Try to validate Internet Explorer's home page and tell me if you think Microsoft cares about building a standard's compliant browser.
Anyway, this site works perfectly in Firefox, so I recommend you use that. If you don't have it installed, you can get it from http://www.mozilla.org/firefox/.
Sincerely,
Rich Morgan
Open Addict.com
P.S. Hopefully IE rendered *this* page correctly for you... [sigh].
P.P.S. If you have a website and would like to use the same PHP code to block IE, here it is:
- damentz, on 10/11/2007, -0/+24Don't block them, just let them view the page regardless of render bugs.
- CaseyUCF, on 10/11/2007, -26/+50Was he touched by a guy while using IE one time or something?
- houndeyex, on 10/11/2007, -3/+27Not to mention all the CSS "hacks" you have to use just to get IE to work right.
- cephelo, on 10/11/2007, -12/+35This is retarded. There is NOTHING in that site that is not easily accomplished with IE. Not that IE users are missing much -- the design and content presentation is awful at best.
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -24/+46I am all for Firefox but this is just stupid. They will lose a bug chuck of their audience.
- maninblac1, on 10/11/2007, -9/+29google.com 50 errors
yahoo.com 34 errors
excite.com 199 errors
digg.com 2 errors
slashdot.com 6 errors
fark.com 0 errors
boingboing.net 113 errors
IE homepage 208 errors
Redhat.com 6 errors
So tell me, why is it so important that everything be standards compliant and abide by the strictest conventions? I'm seeing a trend here, errors are everywhere, no one is following the strictest conventions, some are simply following them better than others. - inactive, on 10/11/2007, -0/+19Judging from their forum activity, they don't seem to be a big site.
- invader, on 10/11/2007, -2/+19Every time my site gets featured on Digg, I check out the browser stats. I consistently see a little over 70% FF coming from Digg. But still, blocking up to 30% of their millions of users would be costly, advertising-wise.
- adidax, on 10/11/2007, -6/+22That's awesome what you did there, ya know, prejudging users intelligence based on browser choice.
I say everyone who doesn't use lynx is less intelligent than I am, because I use lynx, and I am intelligent. - maninblac1, on 10/11/2007, -2/+18(And new tabs opening next to the open tab in IE7 is ridiculously annoying)
You can change that, it's called a setting, go change your tab setting, or are you too lazy to do that? - joeshlub, on 10/11/2007, -12/+28My bet is that IE users are the less intelligent of the digg crowd. At least the less technologically adept, and this was SUPPOSED to be a tech website, so....
- Aupajo, on 10/11/2007, -3/+18Yes, it's bad - for the hundred reasons we all know it's bad. But at the same time, if you have to work in this area, and you've felt the frustration, you can understand that here are a group of people, willing to stand up and scream defiance in the face of that malignant, glowing blue "e" that is the subject of our loathing and the source of all the restrictions standing in our way to develop a better, more powerful, more involving web. I looked at this and I thought "Damn that must feel good. If only we had the strength to stand up."
- kh99, on 10/11/2007, -3/+18My bet is that the most intelligent users don't spend any time worrying about who uses which browser. Some day you will realize that being technologically adept is not an indication of intelligence.
- Loonacy, on 10/11/2007, -3/+17Probably a lot of those errors are hacks to make it work in IE. I know when I'm working on a page it usually passes with 0 errors until I have to hack in some workarounds to make it look right with IE6/7.
- grumpyrain, on 10/11/2007, -2/+16Particularly when you consider the proportion of the 70% running FF using Adblock Plus or equiv.
- whataboutdave, on 10/11/2007, -1/+15Friggin' democracy.
- lordtyros, on 10/11/2007, -3/+16The post said most of their viewers are using IE. So yes, this was a bonehead move.
- Seabrook7, on 10/11/2007, -24/+37I agree. I wish more large sites would follow this example. I am a web designer by profession and I get tired of designing something by standards that looks great in Firefox then I view it in IE 7 and realize I have another couple of hours of work ahead of me. Then look at it in IE 6 and realize it is even worse. I applaud Open Addict.
- houndeyex, on 10/11/2007, -2/+15Honestly, do you think all the standard IE users are going to be crying over how they can't get to their favorite open source website? They probably don't even know what the ***** open source is.
- jasmus, on 10/11/2007, -1/+14THat's exactly what most people would do, if they had not have bothered to just fix the issues. I agree the issues shouldn't exist, but they do. Makes me wonder if a website advocating open source should be turning away people that aren't using open source products. Aren't these people their target audience?
- Naga10, on 10/11/2007, -0/+13Because the average IE user knows how to do that.
- zholmquist, on 03/04/2009, -2/+15With IE7 most rendering is the same, IE6 tends to be the one that throws the most errors! Why not block IE6 and suggest *updating* to IE7 or moving to Firefox. As a developer I loathe how much time is spent with cross-browser compatibility.
- theholycow, on 10/11/2007, -10/+23Dude, chill. I hate IE and refuse to use it and I really hate sites that refuse to allow me to even TRY to use Opera or Firefox but IE isn't ruining lives, and I dare say it does at least provide me with more income opportunities as I get paid to clean up adware-infested systems.
- fkr3, on 10/11/2007, -17/+29For the record, if you're struggling with html/css/javascript for IE you're in the wrong industry. The issues and incompatibilities are all well known and well documented with widely discussed and demonstrated workarounds. Most of them date back the best part of a decade.
Would you accept "I don't work with Ford cars, sorry" from a mechanic? No? - eplawless, on 10/11/2007, -4/+16If the car being a Ford doubled the repair time, every time, then I would accept being charged extra to work on a Ford, or being told that people don't support it because Ford refuses to standardize their motors and they very often break for no reason at all.
- flyguyjm, on 10/11/2007, -4/+15/Applaud
Even the small websites I have designed require many hours of overhead getting the code to work in IE7 and then finding another hack to get it to work in IE6 too, then once it works in IE6 it is broken in IE7 again.. - pxlpshr, on 09/04/2008, -8/+19although... no offense to OpenAddict but there really is no excuse for that site not too look fine on IE... there's nothing complicated about their site at all. While MS is fixing their browser, I think he needs to brush up on his CSS.
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