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143 Comments
- crunchmuffin, on 07/07/2008, -12/+42No love for GIMP? Last time I checked that was the one of the biggest alternatives to photoshop... and its included in almost every distro...
Anyway, it would be nice to see a move away from proprietary software. The world would just be a better place that way. - Dumbledorito, on 07/07/2008, -3/+28It's an alternative to Photoshop in the same way that carob is an alternative to chocolate. You might be able to make it do what you want, but few who work with graphics for a living are going to want to use it exclusively.
- jgasm, on 07/07/2008, -6/+31Move Your Business from (name of OS) to (name of OS) and spend more money on IT. Again.
Get all new "qualified" staff. Again.
- brstilson, on 07/07/2008, -1/+24Most of the people who pirate Photoshop (and face it, that's what they're doing) don't need it. Photoshop is designed for professional print houses where color accuracy is an absolute imperative. Matching what's on paper to what's on a screen is tricky business. Light acts completely different than ink does. If you mix all the colors of the light spectrum, you get white. If you mix the three primary ink colors, you get black. Matching a color on a monitor with a color on a piece of paper exactly requires heavy duty software like Photoshop to accomplish that, that's why most home photoshop users aren't using and will never use hundreds of its features.
Nobody needs an $800 software title to make lolcats. Gimp works just fine. - inactive, on 07/07/2008, -4/+24i think the biggest thing scaring most windows users away from linux is people insisting they use gimp instead of photoshop ;)
gimp sucks
photoshop rules
fortunately photoshop runs perfectly fine on linux using wine - Olfster, on 07/07/2008, -8/+27Your post reminds me of those MS Cert exams I had to take many years ago, all product names and no substance.
- Boagrius, on 07/07/2008, -7/+23From an IT consultant standpoint:
Ok, Windows has unexplainable ***** problems that can gain 3 hours of billing alone a day. Our bread and butter at our company is spending 3-4 hours 1 or 2 times a day consulting on Windows based problems. The biggest problem is little follow-ups after those problems are solved. The quick-little 10 minute fixes is what we try to stay away from. Big waste of time, money and very hard to bill.
OR
We can move our clients over to Linux from Windows!!! What do you think the president or owners of these companies or going to think on this approach? Here are a few sales pitches from our company’s standpoint.
We never work with Linux, yes we can give you our fast, reliable service but since there really are not a lot of Linux consulting companies out there, we will charge more and take longer to fix the issues you have.
What? Your employees have no idea how to use the Linux operating system? They want to use MS Office products that they have been using for 10 years? Ok, after we save you a few hundred dollars on Windows licensing we will have to charge you thousands (depending on # of employees) to teach them the Linux operating system and the weird free programs like GIMP you can find.
What? The 3rd party “your business specific programs” don’t run on Linux? No alternative? Well, we can spend extra money on hardware on the computers you already have to throw a Windows-based shell over Linux to run those programs! You use those programs more than the Linux programs? No, we are gonna shell Windows over Linux, not Linux over Windows, why? It’s free, horray!!
And those are just SOME of the reason NOT to switch over…..Anyone think of others? I would love to hear it…..actually I would love to hear some good, financial, reasons to switch a 10-50 employee business over to it….. - thecosmicpope, on 07/07/2008, -2/+17GIMP is fine for a free image manipulation application, but to suggest it is an alternative to photoshop is madness.
- skipdog172, on 07/07/2008, -1/+15If a business PC only needs basic non-exchange e-mail, a web browser and an office suite, than sure Linux would work fine.
The problem is that most businesses use highly specialized applications. In fact, I would say 95% of businesses use these specialized applications. These applications don't work in Linux and there is no Linux alternative. It is moronic to attempt to virtualize these applications within Linux when employees already know how to use Windows and you would need to purchase a new PC to "save" the cost of purchasing Windows. Then you have to consider the time to setup these PCs and train employees in very basic tasks.
As more apps become browser-based, the more practical Linux will be in businesses.
Until then, we ALL know that if we just need a web browser and maybe an office suite, Windows isn't necessary, and we have known that for a long time now. There will be no Linux surge in businesses as long as software companies are primarily developing for Windows. - czeman, on 07/07/2008, -2/+14You obviously have no idea what the various Linux distributions have to offer. You're either mis-informed or don't realize that Linux has come a long way from being geared towards techies fluent with the nitty-gritty of the Linux kernel. It's a relatively simple task to deploy servers capable of doing more than Windows servers. It's a breeze to install any app available in a distributions software repository!
I don't run Windows for anything mission-critical. I can sleep at night knowing that all of my Linux-based equipment and control systems are functioning just fine. - flavioribeiro, on 07/07/2008, -0/+12You're ignoring the server market.
Linux has widespread use when reliability is necessary. For example, Linux is the leader on Wall Street, where you absolutely can't tolerate lag or downtime.
I develop instrumentation for the power industry. My company can't tolerate downtime on any of our services, so we also run Linux all around. - tcpip4lyfe, on 07/07/2008, -3/+15There is a place for Linux in business and that's on the servers. We run about 20 ubuntu servers and a handful of Red Hat web servers. We serve our mail, DNS, VPN, PBX (asterisk), fileserver (samba), webservers, LAMP servers all on Linux. We do have 1 Exchange server though because like it or not, Exchange and active directory are extremely easy to administer. You'd be a ***** goon to put Linux on the workstations though. Open Office is not ready for prime time yet and there is not an mail client that interfaces well with exchange. Evolution has a plug-in but it can't do half of things that outlook can. Not to mention the support calls you'd get when people try to open 2007 .xls files or try to view the flash e-vite their friend sent them.
- thegodfaza, on 07/07/2008, -1/+12GNU Image Manipulator Program
- theaceoffire, on 07/07/2008, -0/+11Because Gimp is legal, and you don't have to steal it.
This is important when they come to audit your software. - lonnieh, on 07/07/2008, -1/+12I don't think watching movies on a TV hooked up to an Xbox is something that business are actually into. We are talking about the same ***** article, right? No? Did you just ***** your pants when the headline crept into your view?
- jgasm, on 07/07/2008, -4/+15madness?!?
this... is... LINUX! - mossblaser, on 07/07/2008, -1/+11True but by the same measure, few who use photoshop actually need photoshop.
- Hercules, on 07/07/2008, -3/+13Any decent business looks at the applications they need to get their job duty done, and done well and efficiently. If you look at Linux because Linux is free, and don't look to what business applications you might need, or then have to create because they simply don't exist in Linux (Sharepoint? Office? BizTalk? Quark? Photoshop? Illustrator?).
Look, I know there are 'equivalents' for lots of software, but when you are a business, you generally do business with OTHER businesses. And there are standards here. If you send somebody a OpenOffice document, they won't know how to open it in MS Office. If you send somebody GIMP formatted pictures, they will not open it in Photoshop. If you want to share and collaborate on documents in real time with OTHER companies, then OpenOffice isn't going to do it -- you need Sharepoint, or Groove. If you want to do layouts, you need Quark or something else.
The idiocy of people choosing something based solely on an OS level (I'm looking at you Mac fanboys) is ridiculous. And beyond stupid. Choose the best platform that you feel will deliver the best results and the least amount of overhead cost. For 90%+ of businesses, this continues to be Windows. And not because Windows is uber anything -- it's because the applications are there and management is simple and cheap. Development is cheap too. Sometimes you can use a Mac and be cheaper -- it's rare. Linux, it's even MORE rare since the open source applications save Firefox, generally suck ass compared to what is commercially available. Gimp compared to Photoshop? OO.o compared to Office? Give me a break. I like Linux for the sake of liking it, but as a business decision I would generally stray away from it unless I was doing database clusters or web server clusters, where its powers are strong.
Again, use the best tool for the job. Don't make this a religious war, because your business is doomed to fail because you're an idiot. Although if you're an idiot... odds are you won't get far anyway. - wiggles, on 07/07/2008, -1/+10Dude, not every business in this world is a graphic design / web development house.
- Canadian0207, on 07/07/2008, -0/+8R2D2-C3PO!
- snurfle, on 07/07/2008, -1/+9No, my Saturn looks bad all on its own.
- daftman, on 07/07/2008, -1/+9SourceSafe? What the *****? Even Microsoft Development shops are using subversion.
If you are going to go with proprietary solution, at least go with Websphere, Oracle, etc. Those things are industrial grade software solution, not lame ass products that can't scale.
The thing about Microsoft solution is that they made it so easy a highschool kid can set it up. So when the real problem hit, you have uneducated system-admin who flood Microsoft support asking from screenshots of how to do things. - daftman, on 07/07/2008, -0/+7> We never work with Linux, yes we can give you our fast, reliable service but since there really are not a lot of Linux consulting companies out there, we will charge more and take longer to fix the issues you have.
I guess the point here is for Business who want to move to Linux to move a Linux vendor or a consulting companies. Unless you are living under a rock, ALL large consulting companies, e.g Accenture have a Linux experts on hand for dealing with Linux, Unix, Solaris and other solutions.
> What? Your employees have no idea how to use the Linux operating system? They want to use MS Office products that they have been using for 10 years? Ok, after we save you a few hundred dollars on Windows licensing we will have to charge you thousands (depending on # of employees) to teach them the Linux operating system and the weird free programs like GIMP you can find.
Judging from this, your level support is probably limit to desktop IT support. Most business applications are deployed over the intranet via the web. It's ***** easy to support Firefox than IE. When everyone solution is sitting in a browsers, the only thing that you need is an office suite (open office, lotus notes, neo office) - Olfster, on 07/07/2008, -0/+7You want the truth? You couldn't handle the truth!
Total truth: We have saved tens of thousands of dollars by using Linux/Ubuntu and Open office in our business. That is the truth. Maybe no one in your world cares about that, but I sure do. - InorganicMatter, on 07/07/2008, -21/+28Funny, I'm moving my company away from Red Hat to Windows Server 2008. Nothing on Linux can compete with the rapid deployment, user simplicity, easy management, and rock-solid (when properly hardened) security of Active Directory + Exchange + Outlook + SourceSafe + IIS + Microsoft SQL + Windows Routing and Remote Access. There's just so many cool and convenient things you can do easily in this that would take weeks of tweaking and troubleshooting in Red Hat. Throw in some AVG mail server edition antivirus and Cisco firewalling, and you've got one rocking system.
As a bonus, Hyper-V is an excellent virtualization product that comes free with Server 2008. It does everything Xen offers, and has tight Windows support as well.
Like the poster above me said: Linux is the Corvette you continually tweak for maximum performance, Windows is the Ford you drive to work and school every day. - hugolp, on 07/07/2008, -2/+9flavioribeiro and dont forget the embeded market where linux has taken by storm. In fact, the only market where windows is still holding is the desktop. All other markets has been taken. Its a matter of time. Linux is better, easier to use and cheaper than Windows. There is no competition. Windows is only holding in the desktop because of tradition, but, like in the other markets, it will fall.
- rotten777, on 07/07/2008, -5/+12Windows helps with your trolling too, eh?
- beejay54, on 07/07/2008, -5/+12Amen! Has anyone tried to read books or online docs on MS tech? They 'brand' ****ing everything and you have to decipher 3 paragraphs of marketing speak just to figure out what they're talking about.
- jellygraph, on 07/07/2008, -0/+6Peoples dependence on Windows is a bit like our dependence on oil. We know its wrong and it contributes to all the problems we see today, like data theft, fraud, zombie networks, etc... but people just can't give it up. Until Microsoft released Vista. No one I know likes it. Ask my wife. She'd switch to Linux at the drop of a hat if it weren't for Photoshop and I never tried to convince her really. And since I got a Mac, she taken a liking to that as well. She used to mock Apple zealots.
- mdude85, on 07/07/2008, -2/+8Photoshop is a filet mignon, GIMP is ground chuck. They're both meat, but one tastes a lot better.
- inactive, on 07/07/2008, -0/+6>If you send somebody a OpenOffice document, they won't know how to open it in MS Office
You do know that Openoffice can save in pretty much every single word format right? - 1uk34dd0, on 07/07/2008, -0/+6That a kinda funny site - bookmarked for entertainment value. :)
- elementop, on 07/07/2008, -1/+7ROFL! That was hilarious!!!
Oh, wait...you were serious. - Rudegar, on 07/07/2008, -2/+8i even use gimp on windows photoshop is a bit bloated for my needs and it cost money
gimp dont - Barackalypse, on 07/07/2008, -7/+13Nothing increases worker productivity like completely changing systems on them! However, if you're looking to get rid of your IT help desk without costly severance packages or fear of gettign sued if you terminate them, this is a great way to do it. They'll either kill your dumber users outright and then go to prison, or they'll off themselves or quit from the stress!
- czeman, on 07/08/2008, -1/+6@caseycoold
MY grandmother and cousin both use Ubuntu with no difficulty. Others have mentioned in other Linux articles that they have set friends and family members up with various distros, and the results were fantastic! The only reason Linux isn't catching on faster is because people, such as yourself and crampy 20, are mis-informed. - stutimandal, on 07/07/2008, -1/+6I don't use Photoshop or GIMP for my projects. For me the debate does not exists. I prefer Inkscape since I can generate scalable graphics and editable paths in it.
- tnoy, on 07/07/2008, -1/+5Why does every article about this always quote the full retail price of Windows? No business is going to be paying the full retail price of Windows. Virtually every business isn't going to upgrade the OS until they do a hardware upgrade, at which point the cost of Vista goes down dramatically. It'll be less than what you'd pay for the OEM version of Vista Business from places like newegg.
Also, every article like this first points out the cost of Windows, then says you can use VMWare to use applications that will not run in wine.. which requires you to purchase a copy of Windows and defeats the whole purpose of saving the money by "not having to buy Windows."
I'm all for the widespread use of Linux, but this article is crap. - Olfster, on 07/07/2008, -3/+7Now your post has substance and I agree totally with it. However, for us, we had some legacy apps, that are proprietary to our business, that easily run with WINE. We maintain the code for these apps so there is no need to upgrade due to a vendor. If the business is at the mercy of a software vendor, that is on the MS "bandwagon", it may be tougher to realize a OS switch.
- 4321234, on 07/07/2008, -3/+7GIMP works fine for me. I haven't bothered to pirate a copy of Photoshop since ver. 6.
- Olfster, on 07/08/2008, -0/+4Magamiako, what is there to understand about IT it's all about I/O right? MS is a monopoly and most of their products are built upon that monopoly. What more does one need to understand? Now I have to ask, do you understand business? Do you understand marketing? Do you understand how to determine if you are being white washed? Have you ever taken a MS cert exam? No need to reply I know the answers.
- mooninite, on 07/07/2008, -7/+11This is a joke right?
I smell SPAM and/or flame bait. There's no substance to this post. - Olfster, on 07/07/2008, -2/+6Considered it? We actually have realized cost reductions from it.
- freezerburn666, on 07/07/2008, -1/+5its true
- bumcheekcity, on 07/07/2008, -1/+5Windows costs £80 per computer. Each person uses one computer, and they're paid £20,000 a year. Windows is NOT the expense here.
- ldog, on 07/07/2008, -1/+5Many mid sized business that do have a marketing department with at least a handful of graphic guys are ok with that group of guys using Macs.
Switching the other 95% of the desktops from windows to Linux has no effect on the marketing dept. - BlackJackJester, on 07/07/2008, -3/+7I read the words but all I see is the girl without pants on the right.....
- Katana314, on 07/07/2008, -1/+5- Now try doing that under linux
OK.
- without any emulator/crack/hack software
Wait, what? Where'd we get the arbitrary rules? - theaceoffire, on 07/07/2008, -0/+4*sigh*
Dude, listen carefully.
The true cost of Windows is a lack of options.
When you have 30 Windows 2000 computers, which can't handle more than 256 MB of ram *total*, you can't run Vista.
So you either have to buy 30 comps + Ram to handle the new system, or move to a Linux OS.
Linux lets you keep using ancient hardware while offering stability, security, and business programs. - Zounas, on 07/07/2008, -1/+5"In Hollywood, Linux is considered the state-of-the-art, and 95% of the desktops and servers used at those big budget movie production studios, like Sony and Disney/Pixar, to create special visual effects and animation, are Linux based operating systems."
http://news.softpedia.com/news/Hollywood-Loves-Lin ...
I guess they use more efficient software. -
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