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29 Comments
- chubbymidget, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9Several years ago I installed one of the flavors of Linux and played with the configs and tweaks until they broke beyond my learning. Then I'd installed a different flavor play till it broke, repeat. Each lasted no more than a few days.
I went through several itterations of this until I installed Debian. I could not get it to break no matter how I played, tweaked, or tried. Apt-get made it impossible.
Apt-get is amazing! - aNoble, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8Many (if not all) of these can also be used with Ubuntu since it's Debian bashed and uses apt. Some of them (like atp-spy and apt-rdepends) are only available through the universe repositories though.
- anjinash, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7@JQP123:
Sure you can Google it, but you're going to thousands of different pages of varying degrees of accuracy or quality. With apt, you can use a gui front-end like Synaptic and run searches in one central location, each with long descriptions of what each package is and what dependencies it has. I find that to be much easier and faster than Googling everything. - nTensify, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8Better at wasting my time compiling software I wanted to use yesterday.
- haackers, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8I like using the APT utility in Linux because it very easy to use and does all the work for you.
- dotCOMmie, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Seems like the article is missing some very useful apt utilities including apt-file and netselect. In fact netselect-apt can find a fast mirror in a fraction of the time that it would take apt-spy. Instead of doing actual speed tests it just checks ping time and hops while not perfect its more than adequate.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4This is ridiculous. Use aptitude, and all your problems are gone. It's much more robust than apt-get and resolves dependencies better. The only problem is, I haven't yet figured out how to use wild cards (such as *) in aptitude queries.
- lysander, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Another one they could have mentioned is 'deborphan'. I usually purge everything it mentions after a big update.
- anjinash, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2apt-get -install *****
- PoptartKing, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I've heard a whole lot of love over apt as one of the main selling points of Debian-based distros. How exactly does it compare with other package managers like yum, pacman, and portage?
- BlackFlag, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2apt-listbugs has saved my butt more than once. I think it's essential if you are running Sid.
- Web_Weasel, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3They forgot that apt-get has Super Cow Powers
apt-get moo
Yea, it works in Ubuntu too. - zerblat, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2They're all similar. APT is older though, so when it came out the other distros didn't have anything like it.
As for *exactly* how they compare, well I guess the best way to find out is probably to try them out yourself. - gravityboy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Too few people know apt-cache. It's an absolutely critical tool for serious Debian and Debian-derivative use, so I'm glad the article at least spent some time on it.
apt-listchanges should have definitely been in there too, as it's the most important non-standard add-on to apt that's around. Hopefully it'll be put in the standard Debian install (no idea about Ubuntu), as some of us have been clamoring for. If you don't have apt-listchanges installed, then you're missing out on a pretty critical tool. For those running Debian testing or unstable, you need this program. Note that you may want to configure it to display and send changelogs in addition to news updates, if you really want to keep on top of things. - benplaut, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I read my digg in a console based RSS reader. Kinda like aptitude, ya know?
If you're so set on the web being a defacto standard for installs, with its wizards and all, go ahead and use it.
I'd rather have some sort of assurance that the software i'm using is malware free, reasonably bug tested, and is available without having to search around for a working mirror of the latest release.
I'm not a debian user, either -- most distros have some sort of centralized package management (I like arch's pacman), as well as supporting individually downloaded files.
There's still alot of charm in downloading off websites. It's a sort of nostalgia, just like the old days. - dhughes, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1 Looks like I've angered the Ubuntoids.
- t3hX, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Debian-bashed"... I think you don't exactly mean that, do you :)
- benplaut, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Looks like you have.
I've always found ubuntu to be very stable, especially considering that it's somewhat bleeding edge (almost). Don't compare ubuntu to debian stable -- it's only fair to compare it to debian sid.
Then again, I've really never seen a distro that wasn't very stable (except FC1, but you gotta cut them some slack... first release). - DrRider, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Alright, if you have a problem finding some apps, why don't you use its graphical frontend called 'Synaptic'? It'll provide a list of all apps in the repositories you have set; also, it has a search function. However, I'd like to use the command line since I know what I want and it's bloddy fast.
- JQP123, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"I'd rather have some sort of assurance that the software i'm using is malware free, reasonably bug tested, and is available without having to search around for a working mirror of the latest release."
None of which dictates the use of an obtuse command line interface. All of the above can be achieved just as easily (probably easier) using a "standard" web server with links to a "standard" search engine. But in typical Linux fashion, they chose to disregard the "standard" approach (probably too Windows-like) and re-invent the wheel in a decidely unfriendly format. Why? Apparently because that's just the way *nix geeks think. - r00tus3r, on 10/12/2007, -5/+3Because it's Ubuntu, it gets the obligatory digg, but I must admit, I'm somewhat underwhelmed ... :/
- JQP123, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0"Alright, if you have a problem finding some apps, why don't you use its graphical frontend called 'Synaptic'?"
I and most other idiots in the world already have a graphical interface with search capability. It's called a browser and it uses the "world wide web" and a search engine of which Google is the most popular. Don't take my word for it, do your own research, this is a very well established defacto standard that most users are already familiar with.
But in typical Linux fashion, this standard convention and methodology is ignored and much the same functionality is re-implemented with obscure command line syntax. In deference to all the n00bs, a unique, specialized GUI layer (with limited functionality) is added on top. This is followed by a whole series of articles along the lines of this one telling the world how easy Linux is and lamenting the fact that not enough of us idiots are willing to learn to use it.
The reason the n00bs have such trouble with Linux is that they can't imagine anyone ignoring convention and going to such lengths to create something this unfamiliar and counter-intuitative for the average user. If Digg had been implemented using an "apt-based" approach (it's entirely possible) do you think it would be anywhere near as popular? - Ramble, on 10/12/2007, -9/+5I wonder if there's apt-watch for emerge, becuase we all know it's better.
- dhughes, on 10/12/2007, -5/+1 I agree Debian and apt are great but it's funny how Ubuntu (based on Debain) is so bad in regards to stability!
- TheAttacks, on 10/12/2007, -8/+3Correction, I beat them by like 5 minutes :]
and someone else by like 2 hours. - JQP123, on 10/12/2007, -12/+4"you ever heard of "apt-cache search idiot_tool"?"
Maybe I'm just dumb but personally, I prefer "www.google.com/search?&q=idiot_tool".
I've found that this tends to provide much more comprehensive info with which to compare and select an "idiot_tool" app. Since I'm already at the "idiot_tool" web site, it would be real nice if they could simply offer a button labeled "Install". This way, an ordinary idiot could forget all about "apt-get", "apt-search", "apt-up_yours" and similar non-sense. But hey, an ordinary idiot probably has no business using Linux anyway, right? - JQP123, on 10/12/2007, -11/+0"Sure you can Google it, but you're going to thousands of different pages of varying degrees of accuracy or quality."
Maybe it's just me but I've never had to go to thousands of different pages. Generally, publishers of said "idiot-tools" are listed at or near the top of the search results. Since the info is typically coming straight from the horse's mouth (so to speak), I find the accuracy or quality to be as good as any available and often much more comprehensive than what is available from command line tools such as "apt-cache search" or "apt-cache show". Otherwise, why do they bother with a web site at all? - oDin420, on 10/12/2007, -14/+1dupe. someone beat you to it by like 5 mins.
- JQP123, on 10/12/2007, -24/+2"... because it very easy to use ..."
Assuming that the user somehow knows precisely what package they want to "apt-get". And what happens when you ass-u-me too much?
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