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Kickoff - The new KDE start menu

home.kde.org — This is a nice little flash movie about what the new KDE start menu will look like. It looks like this will be in openSUSE 10.2

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hijinks 1 year 337 days ago, made popular 1 year 336 days ago

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SimonGray, on 10/12/2007, -3/+32Certainly an improvement on the fairly cluttered current KDE menu!

Resembles the Novell SLED Gnome menu in function, but retains a slightly more iconified look; and it's much better use of icons than the SLED Gnome menu in my opinion.

Still prefer standard Gnome menu to everything else though.
- SimonGray, on 10/12/2007, -11/+3Hmm, a bit of grammatic errors in that reply, sorry about that!
  
  I would just like to add, that I really like the "All Programs" view of Kickoff, something that is missing in the SLED menu.
- kingfoot, on 10/12/2007, -24/+4when can we get this for windows? it looks superb!!
- ggoyal, on 10/12/2007, -20/+13Dont ask Microsoft if you want Vista out soon. They'll probably require another 3 years to copy (innovate TM) this feature
- Oakes, on 10/12/2007, -15/+22It's funny that the story calls it a start menu even though it doesn't say "start." I wonder what inspired it.
  
  (And yes, I'm aware that people above me are suggesting Microsoft is the actual copier. I'm laughing too.)
- NuDreamer7, on 10/12/2007, -7/+7Finally - some real usable GUI innovation from the open source community... (and I mean it in a good way) Now the closed source companies should start getting worried. This looks more functional than anything out there.
  
  Now if someone developed a ressolution independent GUI kernel...
- vuzman, on 10/12/2007, -12/+7But why are they still using that ugly font? It's not easy to read and the spacing between the letters is completely screwed up. Look how almost every "t" is squished against the following letter. Look how many of the "i"s have too much space to their sides (Index, Internet, second "i" in digiCam).
  
  This is really a big deal for me as the font is used throughout the OS, and in programs. It really annoys me to have to read that font all the time.
- jamsea, on 10/12/2007, -4/+12Um, why don't you just, you know, change the font...?
- reevolutn, on 10/12/2007, -7/+1heh, "Click here for a mpeg of this animation if you can't view Flash."
- eqisow, on 10/12/2007, -4/+4This menu is *****, did you see the way they had to scroll through the All Programs section? Not on my desktop, ever. Then again, since getting Katapult installed I hardly ever use the K menu.
  
  (Katapult = Alt + Space then type the app name)
- muffinmanpoo, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3"Then again, since getting Katapult installed I hardly ever use the K menu.
  
  (Katapult = Alt + Space then type the app name)"
  
  I've never really understood the point of Katapult. Why not just press Alt + F2 and type the app name?
- vuzman, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2That's the standard font, and most people are not going to change it. I'm not thinking about me here, I'm thinking that every new guy is going to install this and think "what's up with this font? If this is the font they thought would look the best (and thus chose it as standard), the other fonts must be even worse. And if they're this incompetent at choosing fonts, what else are they incompetent at too?".
  
  It's a first impression, and first impressions do count.
- danjal, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1i'm glad to see it's getting simple, soon as it has good enough wifi support i might make the switch, for now i'm sticking with it xp cause it's too hard for me, but soon i can see myself making the switch, good luck linux guru's
- mxcl, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@egisow
  
  The reason they changed it from a multiple menu system like the Windows start menu to a scrolling menu system is due to the "lose your place" effect, as I call it.
  
  You open 3 nested menus then misclick, the start menu collapses and you lose your place.
  
  By keeping the clicks well inside the menu border and keeping your mouse in the same place you prevent this kind of mistake.
  
  I'm sure the new scrolling menu will take time to get comfortable with, and require some tweaking (a quick back-to-root method would be nice I expect), however I am certain the new system is superior.
  
  I'm absolutely certain!
Tsiolkovsky, on 10/12/2007, -1/+23I must say that it looks like a big improvement over the current KDE K menu. Can't wait for the next openSUSE 10.2 Alpha/Beta to check out how it works and feels.
eFiniTi, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11Wow, very sexy indeed. Now both Gnome and KDE will have cool start menus in openSUSE.
- nofxjunkee, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3So this is what we're reduced to... start menus. I hate the start menu in Windows. Thank god I have xfce and fluxbox to save me from this madness.
Gijsterbeek, on 10/12/2007, -15/+4It would also be very nice to have this in Kubuntu! And it would be even cooler if typing "THE END" in Search would return the Shutdown button. Or format the harddisk.
- macewan, on 10/12/2007, -8/+1or just typing END - that's a cool idea.
  
  I wondering if maybe they shouldn't have a more obvious 'reset menu' button. In the event that it becomes totally f'd up.
- Gijsterbeek, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0Just to be sure: I do really like the new menu. So now you can digg me under.
bigtomrodney, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5I like the look of it but I can't help think it's not great timing with KDE 4 previews to be released before openSUSE 10.2. KDE4 will be replacing the entire architecture behind the current kicker/kmenu with plasma which will include elements from superkaramba

It has to be said though - It's not called a Start Menu, it's called the K-menu.
- Tsuroerusu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3KDE 4 won't be out for a little while, the thing that just got released, "Krash", was very early previews of the new libraries, and even when the first full technology preview rolls around, it's scheduled for October, there's still a lot more work to be done.
  
  openSUSE 10.2 will have KDE 3.5.4, and 10.3 will have KDE 4.0, as 10.3 is to be released around August of 2007, so why not make the very best of the KDE 3 series since that's what we're gonna use for a little while to come?
- bigtomrodney, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I think SUSE are on a 6 month development cycle, which would mean 10.3 (OR 11?) should be released next April. I agree that there is much work to be done in KDE4 - obviously - but strictkly speaking it is scheduled for late 2006/early 2007. I'm not saying that there is no time to get it into a SUSE release, just that it may not have been worth all of the work(and users getting familiar with it) if it's going to be replaced in the following release.
- Tsuroerusu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@ bigtomrodney
  "I think SUSE are on a 6 month development cycle"
  
  Nope, they are on an 8 month development cycle, which means that after 10.2, we'll probably see 10.3 in August, and then 11.0 around April of 2008.
  SUSE used to do 6 month, but with 10.2 they've changed it to 8 as it matched up better with the internal corporate processes at Novell.
  
  "I agree that there is much work to be done in KDE4 - obviously - but strictkly speaking it is scheduled for late 2006/early 2007. I'm not saying that there is no time to get it into a SUSE release, just that it may not have been worth all of the work(and users getting familiar with it) if it's going to be replaced in the following release."
  
  Well, I think it's good, because not everyone will move to KDE 4 right away, when it comes out, it's gonna be new code, and new stuff all over, business users for example will wait a while before adopting it I think, plus KDE 3.5 is a great desktop, which is very mature, why not add a little more polish to something that's very solid and make it last a little longer?
elkos, on 10/12/2007, -12/+5it's eye Kandie
illicium, on 10/12/2007, -10/+2Interesting. Too bad I use Fluxbox and not KDE.
macewan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+20Even though I'm a GNOME guy I think this is quite nice.
BT-Wang, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6it's kind of nice, the tabs at the bottom are way too huge, I hope that's configurable.

I stopped using the menu a long time ago though. when you know the name of the programs you want to run it's easier to just hit alt-F2 and type it.
- mxcl, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Fitts Law, common actions should have big buttons.
jb55, on 10/12/2007, -9/+9I don't trust that iguana.
- psion01, on 10/12/2007, -1/+28Trust me, it's a chameleon.
- PlancksCnst, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1I don't either. That stupid lying lizard told me I'd save 15% or more on my car insurance. Yeah, right.
BlindIrishman, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7Eh, there is too much space wasted, but then again I'm a list lover, who needs icons?
bloc76, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1looks nice
Urusai, on 10/12/2007, -11/+4KDE: for when Windows is too "lite".
tuna1, on 10/12/2007, -9/+2I'll stick to fluxbox.
gharding, on 10/12/2007, -14/+4Jesus. KDE really needs to get some UI designers. Maybe they can find people to overcomplicate that even more.
- jgjay, on 10/12/2007, -7/+0Agreed! This looks like a bad imitation of openSUSE's Gnome menu.
- Tsuroerusu, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6@ gharding
  "Jesus. KDE really needs to get some UI designers. Maybe they can find people to overcomplicate that even more."
  
  !!!!! RTFA !!!!!
  "openSUSE 10.2 will have a redesigned KDE start menu created by the KDE and usability team at SUSE, after doing usability testing with other start menus. We now have a working prototype, code-named 'Kickoff' (started during world soccer championship, obviously), which is currently being tested with real users in the SUSE usability lab."
adminsr, on 10/12/2007, -6/+3Purty.
carbon12, on 10/12/2007, -5/+10"Slab" (the redesigned GNOME menu for NLD 10) is far superior. Have a look: http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/original.php?release=700&slide=6
- HonoredMule, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4ew.
  
  Way to make users use a tiny combo box in the middle of nowhere to switch content groups. I'll take KDE please.
  
  I suppose it's fine if you want simple, I prefer functional.
- vitriolix, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3here is a video of it in action:
  
  http://youtube.com/watch?v=eyaa16HbjvI
  
  these both look really nice, can't wait to get this on my desktop
flag564, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8That is just frigging nice.
The search bar and help button looks a little clunky though.
seanmc303, on 10/12/2007, -12/+10Suck it Vista
morphie, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12It looks great and has big potential.

But it's not -the- new KDE-menu. It's a KDE-menu by suse for KDE 3.5. If it will make KDE 4 is still a question, since this is based on KDE3 technology and for now doesn't use plasma.
flibuste, on 10/12/2007, -6/+1Just awesome and very clever. I need this.
Oh wait! I can have it for free, like beer!
Falcorian, on 10/12/2007, -2/+26Only one problem with it...

He removes Amarok from his favorites! What's up with that!
- idonthack, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5I noticed too!
  I said, "wtf! HEATHEN!!!!"
- spooq, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Maybe he never closes it ;)
StuMan1337, on 10/12/2007, -11/+6So what makes this so different from the Vista start menu?
- CaptainMordecai, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7Why the ***** is this being buried? Its a valid comment...
  
  Vista has a similar feature and it seems like a fairly obvious inspiration to me. But even XP does it better than Kickoff - why the do they think its a good idea separating the Favourites and the recently used like that. They should be both there ready to go.
  
  Don't get me wrong its a decent idea, and an improvement on KDE currently, but just too damn complicated. They need to step back from all these different tabs - they aren't the answer to everything. And they don't really help much here.
- HonoredMule, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3I love tabs and tab scrolling :)
- kevinski, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2People love tabs, apparently. It's sad, really, because it seems that people just can never have enough tabs. You have multiple desktops and a taskbar, but you need tabs in every application and applet. It's pretty ridiculous.
  
  I'm not a huge fan of the new Start menu in Vista (although it looks a bit cleaner, with the exception of the scrollbar), but it's better than this monstrosity.
- mxcl, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Complicated? I'd argue that having everything in one menu through fear that tabs are "complicated" would make it look far more complicated.
  
  Then what do I know? Oh actually, I do know, having designed software for 7 years now.
c64plus4, on 10/12/2007, -8/+9The old KDE menu system is better. I don't like that at all!
- 0v3rk1ll, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Then don't use it, moron!
digitallysick, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6i like it alot better seems more functional
astrosmash, on 10/12/2007, -14/+7OS X doesn't have any sort of "Start Menu". Weird huh? I think KDE is moving the wrong direction with this.
- RWTechgage, on 10/12/2007, -7/+21Yeah. It sucks being able to access things so quickly.
- Kazrog, on 10/12/2007, -6/+13The usability and versatility of the Mac OS X Dock allows for infinitely faster and more intuitive ways of accessing your applications and files than the Start menu ever will.
  
  The whole concept of the Start Menu was flawed from day one. All it is is the Windows 2.x and higher Program Manager, turned into a menu. It's helped foster people's fear of files and folders (along with Microsoft's other ever-evolving weapons in their ongoing battle to keep your files hidden from you), and it's helped nurture the sloppy developer habit of tossing random DLLs and preference files inside C:Program Files
  
  And why the hell doesn't it auto-sort by alphabet? This is 2006, get with it Microsoft.
  
  Back to the topic though, Linux parroting this same flawed interface design isn't going to do anything but harm to Linux as a desktop/workstation OS.
- avatarpalin, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5Quicksilver is the answer for that.. Or do this
  
  - Open 'Macintosh HD' icon on the desktop
  - Drag the 'Applications' folder to the right side of the line on the dock (the one where the bin sits on.. DONT PUT IT IN THE BIN)
  
  - Right click (or hold the left mouse click down ) to get a start menu like display.
  - Left click once to get the folder and browse with 'Catalog style display'
- Zatko, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Quicksilver + the osx dock is pretty sweet indeed. I just learned about quicksilver only a few weeks ago.... what an awesome program.
mpeters13, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7OS X indeed doesn't have a start menu... and Apple has found a great way to make work fast in their own way... But lets be honest.. I think KickOff is the boost that KDE has long since needed. It's gorgeous, FAST, flexible and remarkably intuitive from a previous linux standpoint. I'm supporting this move all the way :).
yathosho, on 10/12/2007, -7/+7good to see some innovation with guis and open-source. usually i'm under the impression, they just copy things from the osx or windows.
- Kazrog, on 10/12/2007, -5/+5That's a great post if it's sarcasm actually.
sulteth, on 10/12/2007, -4/+4This looks strikingly like the XP start menu. Maybe not in looks but functionality. It's a really good update though. Hope this makes its way into KDE proper.
TomP, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2I like how the eye moves :)
Exiler86, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6I don't care for how it slides forward/back when you open up a group in all-programs, I prefer to see sort of the whole menu (since I often don't know precisely what folder something is in). Looking at one set of stuff at a time is sort of constricting. Hopefully you can adjust the animation speed and delay so its a little faster too.
jellygraph, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2cool
n0xie, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5It looks too much like the Windows XP start menu, which isn't a good thing. It gets the 'Windows' feel: just run through these 7+ menu's and click on that thingie over there and then it will do something... hopefuly... or not... or crash.

People who work daily with computers want an efficient Desktop: i.e. sidebar with shortcuts/symbolic links to all the software they use every day ( I guess that's what the 'favorites' is for?), and nothing else. Everything else is just clutter: waste of useful desktop space.

I think KDE should innovate, not imitate. Apple and GNOME both have a pleasant (not perfect mind you) desktop enviroment. Of course to each it's own, but you have to admit that burrying all your applications under piles of menu's just isn't the most efficient way to control your computer.
bevans, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Looks good. KDE is my preferred desktop because of all the nice little features it has.

On a side note, it would have been funny if the flash video was made for Flash 9
renegadeafk, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1Looks great, much better than the XP start menu, although I do like the SLAB menu in SLED 10 a bit better
farm3r, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Really nice. I digg
MrViklund, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1LOL, he removed the "Shut down" button? What's he gonna do now? ^^

But serious now. Very nice looking. Looking forward to test it.
sei0n, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Bill Gates: "I invented this"
srudes2, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5nice
The vista start menu and the suse (kde).... really lookalike.
Compare here:
vista: http://70.85.12.163/albino_vista/Startmenu1b(www.albinoblacksheep.com).png
kde: http://home.kde.org/~binner/kickoff/sneak_preview.html
- Kazrog, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3They are similar, and although I feel that KDE needs to come up with some more efficient navigation, I think the layout of this menu is far more intuitive than the Vista menu, in some subtle ways.
Kazrog, on 10/12/2007, -5/+8I hate the Windows XP start menu, and this is just repeating the same UI mistakes. Why not come up with a significantly better UI rather than just copying Windows? One of many reasons I can't taken Linux totally seriously as anything other than a server OS.

Mac OS X is years ahead of this kind of mindless cloning. Open Source has a lot of potential but Linux just isn't there yet as a serious desktop/workstation OS, and this is one of many great examples of the inconsistency and visionlessness of the KDE and Gnome UIs.
- plkrtn, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Try Gnome then.
  KDE has always been Start Bar influenced.
- Kazrog, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I have used Gnome as much as I've used KDE, and they're nowhere near as different as people claim them to be. They both are nearly identical to Windows in terms of UI.
mikewhite314, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3cool, I prefer Gnome, but the only reason I haven't tried KDE is mainly the start menu, which this changes.
jeriqo, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8So much wasted space.
Fat menu.
Are we back to 1996 ?
gxcdesign, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1Guy apparently doesn't like FireFox anymore lol
junesix, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0For mouse+menu users, this should be a significant upgrade to the standard start menu. But for pure speed, features, and ease of use, I haven't found anything that tops Quicksilver for more keyboard-oriented users. It doesn't require me to touch the mouse/touchpad and yet I can access almost any application within 2 or 3 keystrokes and access many functions within the app in just a few more. On the work PC, I always feel like I'm wasting time when reaching for the mouse to browse to an app.
MrTea, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Nice; I hope that makes it into the next Fedora.
Magadass, on 10/12/2007, -5/+2wow thats ***** ugly! my first reaction was a gag reflex!
- 0v3rk1ll, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Good. I hope you choke and die.
Szekely, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1I agree with some of the above in that it is too much like Windows.
- plkrtn, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5When hasn't KDE been like Windows?
- Tsuroerusu, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1@ plkrtn
  "When hasn't KDE been like Windows?"
  
  My sentiment exactly!
  KDE is very stable, a lot more functional, and runs a lot better on older machines like a Pentium3 550 MHz with 128 MB of RAM, XP was DOG slow, KDE wasn't exactly lightning fast, but it was very usable.
  
  KDE may do a few things that Windows does as well, but what's wrong with implementing a feature if it's useful? I personally love Konqueror being both the file manager and the web browser, that way you can embed an HTML page anywhere, and Konqueror is in the email client etc. etc.
plasmatic, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I like my current menu in kde :(
fatas, on 10/12/2007, -5/+3That's pretty sweet. I have never like KDE because of its ugliness (this could change) and Konqueror's Microsoft attitude of wanting to do everything ( which is still a turn off)
- HerbertScrunge, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0"and Konqueror's Microsoft attitude of wanting to do everything ( which is still a turn off)"
  
  Strange, I've never thought of Emacs as having the "Microsoft attitude". I wonder what Stallman would think of that?
plkrtn, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3My God. It looks like Vista.
OK, Linux zealots will rip on me for this, but it makes a change for the pinching of ideas to come from Microsoft rather than the other way!

But KDE has always been heavily influenced by Richmond anyway.
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Kickoff - The new KDE start menu

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