What is Digg?203 Comments
- pedepy, on 08/10/2008, -54/+192FOR THE THOUSANDTH ***** TIME: NO
- atdigg, on 08/11/2008, -15/+55It was ready for my desktop 4 years ago...
- inactive, on 08/10/2008, -18/+50one thing i don´t get
people bashed microsoft for 6 versions of Vista, but linux has far more different flavours... how is the average consumer expected to know what is what, and works with what? - wheatley, on 08/11/2008, -4/+31It's because microsoft charge different prices for the different versions, so if you want a feature found only in the high-end product, you get ripped off and pay a hell of a lot more to buy it - this is the economists' "price discrimination". With linux, features can usually be added and changed at zero cost.
- ericdano, on 08/11/2008, -7/+25Um, no. The "If I say it a thousand times it will be true" thing isn't going to work either.
- ilikechaitea, on 08/11/2008, -11/+28hehe, you made me laugh, dugg!
I'm running Ubuntu and Vista, and although I still hate Vista sometimes for its sluggishness, and I love Ubuntu for its speedy and light behaviour...I have to say, I still prefer Vista.....and not to get into a fanboy discussion, but I say this not because i love Vista, but because for the basic user, Vista just works.
its little things like the level to which you can customize your power settings through a nice simple GUI, with no config required.
Vista's awesome new Wifi network handling, which just relentlessly pick up anything, and keeps it, its awesome.
But regardless of features, unfortunately there's more to a successful OS than features, and that's just the way it is.
people can hate on Windows, and i can see why, its massive, but is so many good ways, its such a mature, solid OS....and while most users don't care, its the simplicity that keeps non techs using it. - inactive, on 08/11/2008, -8/+23If any distro will ever do it, it will be ubuntu. it's still not quite ready though.
- svensko, on 08/11/2008, -11/+25Linux is too involved for your casual user. I've spent hours and hours learning how to install and configure different parts of my system. My window manager is custom tailored to me and I like that way. Your average soccer mom just want to check her e-mail and beanie baby auctions. This is the reason why it will never become mainstream. The entire idea behind Linux is customization. If you can find an entire world of people willing to spend hours getting their computers up and running then it will become a replacement for Windows.
Also, Ubuntu and other OSes that make you afraid of the terminal should not be considered Linux. They're just gross. - slythfox, on 08/11/2008, -2/+12My view on this whole situation is that the general public is slowly starting to learn about the Linux OS and about open source programs. It's the people, not Linux.
That said, articles like this should go away. - morphir, on 08/11/2008, -9/+18true, but that was you. Are you a regular user? Or maybe above average? Given that you read digg, I take it you are not a traditional housewife or a mainstream computer user that is.
- jer2eydevil88, on 08/11/2008, -0/+8It's okay you can revert to a terminal based experience and use Lynx to browse around the web posting comments to sites like digg about being a geek.
Also on a side note craigslist.org is basically a lynx optimized masterpiece. - luckless, on 08/11/2008, -1/+9Ubuntu is as much linux as any other distro, saying that it is not is just trying to gain "geek cred".
I have installed Gentoo from source on my desktop and I have ubuntu on my laptop, I can do the exact same thing with both once they are up and running, but at the same time I have gotten my mom to install ubuntu on her computer over the phone and she's happier with it than she was with windows.
It surfs the net, it checks email, it doesn't get viruses or spyware, and it runs faster than the vista that came bundled with her computer.
It doesn't make people afraid of the terminal, it just is good at UI so it doesn't require people to use the terminal in regular use and all that is is innovation not getting away from linux. If you hate a graphical UI then you don't even need gnome, or KDE, as soon as one of those is installed saying that a distro is bad because it doesn't require terminal use is just hypocritical.
In fact I find that ubuntu does not make people afraid of the terminal but rather it makes them see the terminal as a way for them to fix something easily without having to understand it, for example when I get calls from my mom asking me to help out with something on her computer I feel it is a lot easier for me to tell her to open up the terminal and copy-paste what I email her rather than going through a bunch of UI hoops, and ubuntu allows me to do that but it does not force me to do that. - salmonmoose, on 08/11/2008, -2/+10This is a good point - it's ready for MORE desktops.
There are still weird problems that need to be nutted out.
I'm at the point where I'm likely to start installing Linux on "low end" machines that don't change config very often. - LD1o1, on 08/11/2008, -2/+10Takeover... No.
Increase in user base... Hell yea. - JamesBrown, on 08/11/2008, -1/+9yes "year of desktop linux" is a pointless discussion.
don't get me wrong. I use Ubuntu and think it's fantastic. Incredibly user friendly, better UI than Windows in my opinion, very easy to configure and maintain. But there are just too many little problems for it to be ready for "the desktop". For example, ATI Linux drivers are *****. Flash for Linux is unstable garbage. And then there's the lack of certain "killer apps" not available for Linux. (MS Office and iTunes for example. And while I think the open source alternatives are impressive, they're just not the same.) Plus, and this is just my experience, overall application stability is a little lower than Windows XP.
Linux has made much, much progress over the years, but even these minor barriers mean that Linux will continue to be relegated to a niche product in the desktop market. - santasing, on 08/11/2008, -19/+26The Linux desktop has been ready for me for the past 3 years. And I don't give a ***** about you.
- bobbarkerbilly, on 08/11/2008, -3/+10My mom checks her email and surfs the web. Doesn't know a single thing about computers except how to turn the computer on, operate thunderbird and firefox, and turn the computer off. She's running Ubuntu.
- GTPilot, on 08/11/2008, -1/+7i'm hungry, so if OS were pizza, you are saying one linux pizza tastes really good with anchovies, and others taste really good with olives, when in fact i could just add the anchovies to the olive pizza and the anchovies would taste just as good.
and all wheatly was saying is that MS offers pizzas at different prices, that each come with a specific set of toppings, while the linux pizzas can be customized precisely how you want with no charge for most toppings.
the idea of ultimate linux is silly, but an ultimate pizza actually sounds good right now. - Myztry, on 08/11/2008, -0/+6Why? Did your mum setup her windows system. It's no harder to do in Linux than Windows. Did she understand the difference (or sameness) of her incoming and outgoing mail servers. So did she?
- RetepNamenots, on 08/11/2008, -0/+6wine PhotoShop.exe
- bobbarkerbilly, on 08/11/2008, -0/+6That won't happen until said companies of commercial software port to linux. Until then, enjoy the free software, help increase the user market share, and hopefully the companies will listen and port.
- rolf, on 08/11/2008, -4/+10Ubuntu is too involved? You spent hours configuring your system but the average person doesn't have to - they aren't as finicky since they probably don't care as much.
I will say this: Windows is not really that easy. Depending on what the manufacturers install, Vista can go from feeling like a dog to feeling 486 slow (Acer, I'm looking at you) with all their anti-virus, spyware/malware detector, and firewall pre-installed "solutions". Not to mention the fact that they may have only an integrated video card yet crank the Aero settings all the way up out of the factory.
I would say the learning curve is the same but some things with Ubuntu is infinitely easier:
1. Less reinstalling because the system gets borked
2. Uninstalling Programs (with Windows one at a time boring procedure, Ubuntu uses Synaptic and you can uncheck all you don't want at one shot)
3. Microsoft nags you like a little bitch. Just one example: Updates/Security. Ubuntu shows you updates but leaves you alone. Microsoft hassles you with that icon in tray always popping up it's nag balloon when security settings aren't exactly to it's liking.
I could go on and on, but it really just comes down to Windows having vendor support for major Apps. Ubuntu is making strides but programs are missing. Fortunately, some great OS programs exist to fill the vacuum but it isn't enough yet. - WoollyMittens, on 08/11/2008, -3/+9There a handy 36 step guide that involved typing a small magic book worth of magic words into a terminal. :)
I did get the wireless in Ubuntu to work on my eee pc, but I wouldn't wish the experience upon anyone else. - init100, on 08/11/2008, -0/+6@mathben
Likely not, but what's the point? Most Windows users didn't set up their own systems either. They either got it preinstalled when they bought their computer, or the local Windows geek installed it for them. - WoollyMittens, on 08/11/2008, -3/+9Microsoft gambled that computers would keep growing bigger and faster, but the trend is small portable devices that sacrifice brute strength for battery life. Maybe Microsoft has grown too big to react to this, maybe not, but you can't deny that this opens up a whole new market for lighter operating systems. Anything that can browse, email and instant-message will do just fine.
- directrix13, on 08/11/2008, -0/+5The terminal is never needed for most people. Power users understand how the terminal helps them set things up very quickly. And they do not need to fix "any and all driver compatibility issues," they just need to fix the common ones. Not as insurmountable a task as you propose but still a task.
- TheZorch, on 08/11/2008, -0/+5To say that Linux will never be accepted in the mainstream is pure arrogant stupidity, plain and simple. At a ten year veteran of technical support for desktop PCs I can say that Microsoft Windows is not a very user friendly operating system. Vista is actually hostile towards users. Ubuntu however, after using it for a while has proven itself to be very user friendly and easy to use and manage. Windows is not, and unfortunately there are people out there who won't admit it. They'd rather talk smack about Linux rather than face the truth. MS Windows is one of most badly designed and piss poor excuses for an OS I've ever seen, period.
- BarriedaleNick, on 08/11/2008, -3/+8Any article that contains "They are in no way lesser ..." deserves to get buried..
- PaulRay, on 08/11/2008, -0/+5I've been using Linux (ubuntu) exclusively an my laptop and two work computers exclusively for nearly two years. "Is it ready" isn't really the question. Are people willing to drop their fear of something that's a bit different is a better question.
I'm also tired of people parroting old information like "My WiFi never worked and I had to give up". It's just not true any more unless you happen to have one of the few cards not supported by the latest distros. In the mean time, I'm happy and don't really care if Linux becomes "popular" because the community keeps growing despite the nay-sayers and as eeemart said, I'm not ready to give up my "Geek Cred". Honestly, ubuntu is so easy, I feel like I'm cheating when people are all amazed that I use Linux. :oP - alphgeek, on 08/11/2008, -1/+6Jesus, if all linux users are like these two wankers ^^^ I'm going to keep avoiding it like the plague. As if I really needed another reason...
On a serious note, so what if I can kludge up a solution to get windows apps running under linux - why bother? Just run the ***** under windows and be done. - Myztry, on 08/11/2008, -0/+5Linux is ready for the desktop. But the software catalog isn't.
Vista was not ready for the Desktop but fortunately for Microsoft, the 3rd party software catalog mostly was.
Microsoft takes way too much credit for the critical applications that 3rd parties provide that just happen to be written for Windows.
Anyone notice how the 'killer apps' like Photoshop, Firefox, Crisis, etc are written by everyone but Microsoft?
Microsoft rides on the backs of the 3rd party developers, and their loyalty goes no further than critical mass. - spritom, on 08/11/2008, -2/+6How often do we get one of these articles? It seems like every three and a half months somebody is blowing the this-is-the-year-for-Linux-on-the-desktop bugle.
I use Linux every day, and have for several years. It almost does everything I want, but some of the things are still a pain. It's closer though. - jamesdew, on 08/11/2008, -0/+4He is a geek without any skilz, the saddest kind of geek.
- FairDinkumMate, on 08/11/2008, -0/+4Yeh, because gamers make up over 90% of the PC market don't they? MORON
Linux doesn't & won't target gamers - EVER. If gamers want to use Linux, they will need to help develop the software & lobby or hope 3rd party software developers write code for it as well.
Linux will target the corporate & home desktop market. When your local bank, city council & car dealer have Linux desktops & your mom uses Linux on her laptop, then they'll have serious market share. Gamers are irrelevant to Linux desktop penetration. - alphgeek, on 08/11/2008, -1/+5^^^ Have they implemented 'paragraphs' under Linux yet?
But seriously dude...when was the last time YOU created your own version of Linux? Most of these arguments are the usual kool-aid swilling propaganda. Viruses - haven't had one under Windows for like, 10 years now? Hmm have I EVER had one under Windows...? Security - what are you, the NSA?
How about you give those Windows users a REAL reason to switch - Christ knows that these routine arguments you are regurgitating haven't worked over the last ten years or so... - DangerCollie, on 08/11/2008, -0/+4"Your average soccer mom just want to check her e-mail and beanie baby auctions. This is the reason why it will never become mainstream."
That's exactly why Linux will become mainstream. Because the inexpensive appliances for web surfing and email will be running Linux. MSFT extended XP for appliances to try and stop the bleeding while they crank out an appliance Windows version. They got caught totally flat-footed by sub-notebooks but had they bothered to spend any time in Japan, they could have seen that trend coming.
You'll be using Linux whether you like it or not. In your wireless router, your cell phone, lots of places you don't even know you're using it. That's how easy it is. I love the Winders fanboyz who tried Linux in 2001 and keep spouting their experience. - mmijatov, on 08/11/2008, -6/+10There are a few things going for Linux right now:
Web based applications that are platform independent
Great distros like Ubuntu
The ability to run on relatively low end hardware, a suitable Ubuntu desktop will likely cost less than it's Mac or Windows counterpart
And you can't beat free when it comes to price
I don't think those are enough but it's certainly better than Linux has been in the past when it came to penetrating the mainstream market. I would absolutely feel comfortable building a low end box for Mom to perform her basic computing needs. - Plotinus, on 08/11/2008, -6/+10Of course linux is ready for the desktop. It has been ready for a while now. If functionality and usability were truly the criteria for adoption MS word would *never* have ousted Wordperfect. What linux lacked (and now has) is large company backing; novell, ibm, google, etc.
"Your average soccer mom just want to check her e-mail and beanie baby auctions" well Linux does that so much better than MS Windows on cheaper hardware that that is an argument for yes.
Have to go but will add more later. - tama00, on 08/11/2008, -2/+6Because the better products arent all that better.
Microsoft makes money unethically, which is why its so hated. They rip you off, over price their products, use dirty business scams and marketing (copying prodcuts from other companies, up-selling users unfairly ). I could go on and explain but im sure everyone here is well aware of it. - travist120, on 08/10/2008, -17/+21It's there, just not ready yet. Maybe a couple more years.
- cantormath, on 08/11/2008, -2/+6Linux is for everyone EXCEPT those who think they are computer people and only use windows.
- init100, on 08/11/2008, -0/+4Care to explain how Ubuntu sucks? I don't use it (I use Fedora instead), but it could be interesting to know if the suckage is Ubuntu-specific or not, and more specifically what your problems were.
- melat0nin, on 08/11/2008, -1/+4"I take it you are not a traditional housewife or a mainstream computer user that is"
Ironically, I would suggest that these are the people it is most suited to. If all people want to do is use the internet, check emails and write documents then Linux is absolutely ready for the primetime.
I would suggest that it's not ready for the more advanced user, or at least the non-'mainstream' user. For those who want to game, or use specialist software like Photoshop etc (let's discount Wine for now) then it's not ready.
I've had my mother on Ubuntu for over a year now, and there's never been a problem. She needs a browser (FF3), email client (Thunderbird), word processor and spreadsheet (OOo) and a PDF reader (Document Viewer). All that stuff runs great on Linux, without a hitch.
Once you've set it up, which admittedly can be difficult, it's absolutely ready for mainstream use. - maninalift, on 08/11/2008, -0/+3what is the point of this article - no content. Yes Linux is great. There are a broad range of distros and desktop environments, plenty of which are as user friendly or more so than windows (overall - there are of course things which windows does better).
- init100, on 08/11/2008, -0/+3"That said, articles like this should go away."
I think they should continue coming, just to piss off the naysayers. :P - rdvon, on 08/11/2008, -1/+4Wine-doors let's you install photoshop, and it's free.
It also let's you install half life 2, steam, and a bunch of other windows programs.
It's not mature enough yet as a viable alternative though. *sigh* - maninalift, on 08/11/2008, -0/+3Be specific, what doesn't work?
- javaroast, on 08/11/2008, -0/+3"But until a person who has previously only used Windows can sit at a Linux computer and instantly know how to use it"
Not happening. Honestly there is a large group of Windows users that can't even sit in front of a Windows machine and "know how to use it." If you mean figure out how to launch a program Linux is already there. Switching to any new OS will have some learning curve whether you are switching to new version of Windows, to Mac, or to Linux.
Running MS Office should never be a top goal for the Linux Community. Their goal should be improving the usability and compatibility of OpenOffice or some other bundle. Why would they want to submit themselves to the whims of MS by making Office a high priority?
The low end hardware argument isn't for existing hardware it's for new hardware. Think net books, MIDS etc. But anyone still running Windows 98 should really be switching to something if they are doing anything on the internet.
Linux has both "tried and true" product and support. Any of the major vendors have available support plans and while Linux is not Windows it most certainly is tried and true at this point. I can probably predict some of your arguments about tried and true, but I can tell you that Windows has certainly been tried, but if you look at it's track record it has been a little weak in the true department especially for the less technically inclined users. - DinX, on 08/11/2008, -0/+3I see you read xkcd too
- Edogz, on 08/11/2008, -0/+3I disagree when you say Ubuntu is gross and degrades the overall linux image..
Ubuntu is just as capable as any other distro.. I like it because it has great up-to-date support, but it's not that different than say, debian or fedora, etc. etc..
I've used several distros, and typically the only main difference is what's installed by default... -
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