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184 Comments
- kahrn, on 10/11/2007, -12/+125I won't be suprised if this never reaches the front page, but bleh.
This article has made my day. I (like a lot of other people) started using firefox (back in the pre-1.5 era) not to oppose IE, but to have a browser that was a.) Open Source (more likely to get patched, you know what you're getting) and b.) Speed on older machines, while being able to customize it to a reasonable performance level.
If firefox could run on old machines, I wouldn't be suprised if the firefox margin share increased quite a lot. All that people seem to care about now is taking over IE and _forcing_ people to use firefox (take a look at the ignorant comments on dell ideastorm and hell.. digg.com for proof). Why can't we go back to what made the browser good, like the ability to run it on almost anything?
Hell, personally I don't even mind if it isn't even part of the official project - just a fork like Swiftweasel that achieves performance on par with firefox-1.0.
All those people that started using firefox just to oppose IE don't seem to care about the original benefits or firefox. They only care about stealing market share. A lot of people I talk with share the same view - they want a browser which they can use on older platforms again. The reply you seem to get from the youtube generation will be "buy a new computer", well, if it ain't broke why fix it? Besides, a lot of us like experimenting with different platforms and such, or we cant afford to, or we dont want to.
My plea, just like many others is to go back to the original goals. Go back and build a browser that we can ALL use that is not designed to steal users from other browsers, or to please grandma, but to offer REAL benefits.
Hopefully firefox 3 wont be the mess that firefox 2 was. - aurath, on 10/11/2007, -6/+52Opera is lighter weight, has more out of the box features, and has a faster rendering engine than firefox. Also it had all of the "Modern" features of a web browser (I.E. tabs, sessions, built in search bars, mouse gestures, etc) several years ago. The only downside is that it's not open source.
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -6/+45Hmmm, Opera 9.5 kestrel.
Firefox started as bare-bone alternative to its predecessor. - chuuchdizzle, on 10/12/2007, -4/+38OR get Opera, and enjoy all the features that "firefox lite" proposes to offer and then some, and then some more. all in a smaller package that uses less memory, works reliably, and is lickity fast.
- Urzeitlich, on 10/11/2007, -6/+34Is that a DUDE?
- iDiggIt42, on 10/11/2007, -2/+27And you've got... a leaf. A very special leaf.
- JasonCox, on 10/11/2007, -1/+22I'm all a new version of Firefox thats smaller, more memory effiecent and gets rid of the code bloat. The fact of the matter is the Firefox we're all running today is a bloated peice of crap compared to the alphas and betas that we tested for the original Firefox.
- lighty14, on 10/11/2007, -0/+21Opera hasn't cost money for what, two years now? Seriously.
- chuuchdizzle, on 10/11/2007, -5/+23its not ***** up, educate yourself before you condemn a rather benign symbol
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika - crownedgriffin, on 10/11/2007, -4/+21So, basically this article is asking for a Firefox without the memory leaks...
I find it hilarious that a browser, which comes default with minimal functionality, can use up so much memory that the author needs to beg for an even more stripped down version. - mrmacky, on 10/11/2007, -1/+14FINALLY, Firefox will not lag my awesome Pentium III gaming rig.
866mhz shall have it's revenge!
(I really should invest in a new computer) - inactive, on 10/11/2007, -3/+16I can imagine how things would be censored if the Nazis had chosen a plain triangle or square as their logo.
- Dumbledorito, on 10/11/2007, -1/+12Whoever dug you down is in denail. I like Firefox. I like the layout. I think the new IE is cumbersome to use. But it has fewer instances of deciding it wants to use all 2 gigs of my ram at a whim. The first step to solving a problem is admitting you have one. Digging down someone who points out Firefox's biggest god-damn irritant doesn't help anyone.
- Speaking, on 10/11/2007, -6/+17Firefox the "best" browser? Used by many people who like it? Yes. But out-of-box, feature by feature, Opera is the fastest most feature rich browser available (and forget the features, its just blazing fast). I have no problem with individuals preferring one browser over the other, but lets not make subjective opinion and pass it off as fact. When you start looking at available features (built in spell check, read text out loud, seamless zooming, custom css sheets, notes, mail, torrents, grease-monkey, powerful news-feed reader .etc) Opera is the clear winner when judging based on features and speed as criteria. That doesn't mean you have to like it though (maybe your more familar with FF interface, that's cool).
On a side note, after much reluctance I switched to Opera's email client M2. Since then I have never had a problem with Email's pilling up, I have the "Mail" sidebar open at all times and always get my mail the second it arrives. Once you take the 2 days to adjust you never have to worry about Email management again.
Just my 2 cents. - alwaysmc2, on 10/11/2007, -0/+10Why care? It's just market share, not a crusade.
- Cherubim, on 10/11/2007, -0/+10Firefox 2.x is starting to piss me off with its incessant memory leaks and high CPU load. It's still a solid, standards compliant browser but the performance is getting worse with each release. Just for kicks, I reverted back to Opera 9.22 for a day and the difference is quite striking. No weird memory leaks and much faster page rendering. I don't like the way Opera handles tabs and the lack of plugin support is a downer. Overall though, Opera is a fine browser for current and older machines. I have it running on a P3-500 w/256MB RAM and it performs quite well. No need for a "Firefox Lite", Opera will do the job.
- p0tent1al, on 10/11/2007, -0/+10From the Article
"However, I think that the memory-hogging issue isn't really too serious for slightly-above-average PCs these days"
*****.
I run a Core 2 Duo Processor, 2gb of ram, Nvidia GeForce Go, on Windows XP (just reformatted) and Firefox memory leaks get very very bad. Mozilla REALLY needs to do something about this situation, because I installed Firefox on my moms computer the other day, and she actually liked it. A couple of days later, I saw her using Internet Explorer, she told me because Firefox was slow..... Seriously now, if my own mom is calling it slow, your software has issues. Fix them. - Protoss, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10Damn, learn to use punctuation.
- andburn1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Opera is so clearly superior, it's sad. I used to be a DIEHARD Firefox user, really. I would defend it against any and all criticism, except for one thing: it was a little slow. Opera is not only just blatantly cooler and feature-rich, but it's also faster. Opera ftw.
- Megatog615, on 10/11/2007, -1/+8Where's the article?
- andburn1, on 10/11/2007, -0/+7Come on, that's just ignorant. You gotta work on that.
- Speaking, on 10/11/2007, -0/+7Actually... http://opera-usb.com/operausben.htm or just google "portable opera".
- cj10111, on 10/11/2007, -0/+7One's already been created. It's called K-Meleon. It uses the same Gecko engine, comes complete with tabs and a few handy extensions, a slew of great features, and is incredibly fast. The reason behind its speed is that it uses native window widgets rather than the Firefox XUL libraries. Check it out http://kmeleon.sourceforge.net/
- polywaffle, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6I have used opera on a 500mhz laptop with 64mb of ram in windows xp. Computer is slow as already, but opera makes browsing on there just a bit less painful. Although if the laptop had a decent amount of ram I'd probably be able to run firefox at a reasonable speed too.
So while opera lacks in extensions and is closed source, its still one of the quickest graphical browsers for older computers. - Speaking, on 10/11/2007, -0/+6Yeah, I used to think this was a problem as well. But Opera has native User Switching and an add-on called Developer Console (it's mostly firebug with some "web developer" thrown in). I used to have a button that would open in IE (it's easy to find) but no longer have a need for it. I run portable IE6-7 and FF for testing. Quite frankly, I typically use Portable FF for developing sites and Opera as my browser. I view FF as a solid developing assistant, that way I don't have to mix my "browser" with my "development tool". Give it a shot, I prefer it. Oh and Opera has a crazy robust adblocker that is FAST, easy and native, its not a very well advertised feature though.
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -2/+8Seriously someone still only knows it as the symbol demonised by wartime propaganda?
- ilikejonessoda, on 10/11/2007, -0/+6As a person that supports his family with browser based applications, more important than cross platform support, is standards support. Where would IE be today if people didn't get behind Firefox despite how bloated it currently may be? You know, the same Firefox, that has long standing support, or more support, for say PNG's with alpha channels, SVG, CSSv2.
- EXreaction, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7The real problem with Opera is the lack of plug in support.
Add ons like Web Developer, Firebug, User Agent Switcher, view in IE lite, view in Opera, etc are extremely useful as a web developer, I don't think I could get around nearly as easily without them.
And of course Adblock is a must. - chugger1992, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8I've used Firefox since Firebird (that was before the name change), and up until 2.0.0.4. I can now say that I'm an Opera user. So many users go blind with the "open source" catch. Open Source does not mean better. A good developer has swift bug fixes, but a great developer don't have the bugs in the first place.
- Stonekeeper, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5A XUL compiler would sort a lot of speed issues out...
- Speaking, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5Yeah you can customize them, just google it, or go click "help" in the menu bar.
- chriskeyes, on 10/11/2007, -4/+9Why does everyone have to make such a browser war out of IE, FireFox, and Opera? They're just free browsers. If you like FireFox and some of the stuff it offers, good for you. If you like IE and the stuff it offers, good for you. Same for Opera users. It's just a browser.
If you don't like IE, well fine. But do you have to make such a big deal out of it? Users will find what they like better, and they'll move to it. But trying to push your friends and family out of Microsoft's way, just because it's Microsoft is not the way to do it. The better browser always wins. - aaronm67, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Go to tools -> Preferences -> Shortcuts -> Mouse Setup. Edit away.
- Speaking, on 10/11/2007, -1/+6I agree with you, everyone is allowed to have a browser preference, but this article called FF "best" and I think thats silly. Its like saying "red is better than blue". That said, if you want to see what is really the fastest browser, run FF and Opera in a PE environment, Opera works so much faster its unbelievable.
- OrangeTide, on 10/11/2007, -1/+6that will play counterstrike just fine. why bother? there are no other good games.
- diggalf, on 10/11/2007, -3/+8What's wrong with FF2?
- DiggFight, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5Mozilla used to be the bloated beast, and Firefox was created to be the lean mean alternative. Now Firefox has turned into Mozilla, so they are creating Firefox Lite.
- abandonedhero, on 10/11/2007, -1/+6I personally think your icon is more "***** up" than his. Do some research, dumbass. Research that doesn't involve smoking yourself stupid.
- stephenwq, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5Portable Firefox is simply the original firefox with a launcher to wrap everything up into a standalone package.
If anything, its likely its slightly slower than an installed version of firefox, especially when running off a usb drive.
Its still an awesome app though. - OrangeTide, on 10/11/2007, -1/+6that's what a public education nets you.
- cooleyandy, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4It's not really that Firefox or IE7 should run leaner/lighter, but that Adobe needs to optimize and make Flash faster. Nearly every site these days have two or more flash objects running at the same time. I've tried running Firefox on my my slower P2 and P3 computers with Flash objects blocked, and they run fine.
- chugger1992, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4I love highlighting text and pressing "V" to make it read to me XD
Opera has many great polished features that Firefox still doesn't have through add-ons. - Tippis, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4RTFA?
"I would suggest that the Mozilla community produce a stripped-down, bare-bones version of Firefox -- 'Firefox Lite', if we're going to follow beverage naming conventions. [...]
No, a truly great super-lightweight browser would have the security of Firefox, without the add-ons, without the tabs, yes, even without favourites, history lists and customisability."
Oh, and by the way, Opera most certainly supports add-ons -- it's just very *very* rare that it needs any considering what it can do out of the box. - awhiteflame, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5Because the web uses markup languages, not programming languages. Sites are interpreted and rendered by several engines, and most of them do it slightly different than others, regardless of the fact that we have text for a standard.
So it gets kind of hard to web design when people still use archaic browsers that can't even render PNG's. - andburn1, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5Except rocking out in its own glory.
- qbproger, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5I've been using MOZILLA since M17 before Firefox was a thought, where is my prize?
- andburn1, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4***** open-source - if it's better software, I'm going to use it, and that's the bottom line. It's fast, feature-rich, and can do almost anything Firefox can do, only better.
- andburn1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Why wouldn't you pick the best browser availible? It's still free, who gives a ***** if it's open-source?
- chuuchdizzle, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7oh do read, what i say, go on read it, im sure you missed a thing or two, if you want i'll quote it for you.
"enjoy all the features that "firefox lite" proposes"
you see what i did there? i nulled your point. but i'll digg ya up just cause. - aacidusX, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4both?
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