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46 Comments
- antiNeo, on 10/12/2007, -7/+28THANK YOU for hosting that image on imageshack... I can't wait till it exceeds it's bandwidth limit so no one can tell what it is.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+20Each project did do something useful though. While Compiz worked on the guts and made the thing viable in the future, Beryl made awesome plugins and showed off 3d desktop linux. And now they're merging and will hopefully become something even better.
- animus, on 10/12/2007, -2/+20do a beryl roll
- nixfu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+15>fork was a bad idea
Actually, EARLY in the life its a GOOD IDEA to fork a project....that way during the very fast changing period of inital development, people can implement and try widely different ideas without having to spend all the time worrying about stepping on each others feet during their development and then once things settle down a bit you can come together. This is essentially the way radical ideas have always been tried in software development. Even the Linux kernel does this quite sucessfully. People trying radical changes to the kernel will start a small fork off the main kernel to get their code developed and tested, and later bring the changes back to the mainline kernel.
Remember this: FORKS ARE GOOD.....the "forks" are scary thing is nothing bug anti-opensource FUD. - chrono13, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14"A registry is exactly what these things DO need."
Remove all GUI settings and store everything in the registry? Gnome (my favorite DE by the way) does that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gconf-editor
It is annoying, and sometimes outright frustrating.
Furthermore: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_registry#Criticisms_of_the_Registry_concept
One single point of failure for 90% of the system - a bad idea.
One single point of failure for the entire system that lumps user/admin configurations together: a much worse idea.
It has it's benefits, which you pointed out some of, but it also has a cost. I prefer xml files and ini files over a registry any day. In-file documentation, you know where it is stored (home/user/.appname/) for each application, and it makes the settings portable and more easily backed up.
/Opinion - BJ_Blaskowitz, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15For the 90,000,000,000,000th time:
Diggs != Page views!!!
Diggs != Page views!!!
ug - baalzebub, on 10/12/2007, -1/+12i for one welcome our merging eye candy developing overlords :)
- xutopia, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9He was sitting next to a very beautiful and stupid woman at some dinner party. "How about having a baby together?", she asked him, " If it had your intelligence & my beauty, it would be the perfect child"
"I'd never take the risk, Madam. What if it had my beauty & your intelligence?", he answered.
I believe this was said by Churchill. - nixfu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Didn't Microsoft announce they were going to abandon the whole registry concept in future versions of Windows server in favor of a DIRECTORY TREE of actual XML files?
- Domza, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Yay! Unified Linux 3D desktop dev!
- jlebrech, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6It's the old adage: Divide (Reassemble) and conquer.
- phuchead, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8He has made some points that i have been pulling my hair out over. I know that there are and will be differences in the way a young project will progress, but the fork was a bad idea, it should have been worked out to begin with. if that happened we could have a very close to stable and very full featured 3d desktop. I am looking forward to the merger of the code so that the whole of the linux and free software community can see that we do have a common goal of bringing a very full featured and well rounded desktop with lots of features, and with a little more work will just work on any computer.
-phuc - schestowitz, on 10/12/2007, -7/+12Here's what appears to be the new project logo: http://img104.imageshack.us/img104/7188/4405384556949eade53oxf7.jpg
- Zettablade, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6@ElitistSnob
Have you ever used Linux before? There are so many icons and themes and backgrounds that I could have sworn were professional.
http://www.kde-look.org/
http://www.gnome-look.org/
KDE has had a very nice standard icon set for a long time. And Gnome is currently updating theirs. Both look very professional. - oliveroms, on 10/12/2007, -6/+11The main reason I switched to beryl from compiz? Easy. Compiz depends on gnome. Gnome is bloat (but lean compared to KDE, but that's a totally different flamewar) and I use XFCE (and don't wish to install gnome libraries). The fix? For me, Beryl. So I hope that with the merger they also merge out that totally useless and redicilous dependancy. Cause we don't need no registry, and we most certainly don't need dependancy/dll hell. It's getting bad enough as it is.
- weijie90, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8http://michaelk.files.wordpress.com/2007/04/compizberyl.jpg
I hope that this whistands the digg effect. - Outdoor83, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4I admit to not really knowing for sure, but it depends on if the two projects are actually trying to do something different or not. What you get when you combine projects is, generally, a union of all of the respective ideas. If there aren't that many ideas (the ones they have are good), this is a solid solution... if they want to go in different directions, this causes bloat (and, now, you don't have an alternative).
I always saw the evolution of the projects much like how Gnome and KDE were structured: the same basic idea, but different ways to go about it. Don't like one? Use the other. We won't have this with Compiz / Beryl anymore.
I guess we'll just have to see how this all evolves. At least they're not fighting anymore. - sirhomer, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Yes it will. apt is insanely powerful.
- tiraid, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5@Zettablade Please don't feed the obvious Trolls.
- d0odx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"the war" was just silly.
- geminitojanus, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Believe it or not, Apt has a system for such contingency: it's called "remove". apt-get remove compiz and all of its junk.
- mazza558, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3How is this going to work in regards to, say, dist-upgrading in Ubuntu?
e.g, If I have compiz plugins and the compiz-extras, will it remove these and add the new, merged manager?
Who knows... - MilesTeg, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3it would be really cool to get 3D on other wm's with the future releases of compiz/beryl!
I like it the lightweight way, but some 3D accelleration wouldn't hurt :) - UNL1M1T3D, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2 (__)
(oo)
/------/
/ | ||
* /---/
~~ ~~
...."Have you mooed today?
Digg messed up my cow :( Looks kind of like dancing Satan. - bmartin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Isn't aptitude a bit more effective than simply apt-get, especially when removing packages? Why don't more people use it? I aliased apt-get to aptitude so that when I remove Beryl or Compiz, all the orphan packages will get removed, as well. I do miss apt-get's super cow powers (try typing apt-get moo)
- oliveroms, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2It has to be agreed upon however (off-topic i know) that there is some need for structure. Luckly this is slowly taking place, we now have /home//.config/ for apps configuration files, and yes they should start leaning to one type of file that can be opened/used with a simple library. XML works but has it's drawbacks (it requires parsing making it slow, and hand editing is a pain).
Since if there'd be one uniform standard for configs, we might aswell have a readable standard underneath that's easly editable. Look at xorg's .conf. Maybe not the perfect example, but it does work quite well i think. - paulnasca, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Here is the forum discussion about it:
http://forum.beryl-project.org/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=5484 - Apreche, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Compiz and Beryl are nice. They make the desktop much more pleasing to the eyes. Even now, they both make the desktop very unstable. It is also relatively difficult to get either one working properly in the first place. The merger of the two projects would be a good thing because it will help to more rapidly solve the instability and ease of use problems.
Regardless of that, I find myself not really caring about this so much. I've tried both compiz and beryl, and found myself immediately switching back to just plain X and Gnome. They do make the desktop nicer, they make it less usable. In Mac OS X there is lots of eye candy, but most of it serves to actually enhance the usability of the interface. That has not been my experience with Beryl or Compiz. The wobbly stretchy windows make the GUI harder to use, not easier. A lot of the effects are very pretty, but they take too much time. I actually use my computer to do work and such. I can't be bothered waiting for a cube to rotate when I could be changing desktops instantaneously.
So yeah, Beryl and Compiz merging is a good thing. I'm sure it will make shiny Linux desktops more stable and usable, and it will also attract many new users to Linux with its attractive eye candy. However, if I ever end up actually using either of these projects, or a merged project, I will be turning the vast majority of the features off. So far the only useful feature I've seen are drop shadows on windows. - mobilehavoc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Hopefully this merger will lead to better QA and more stable releases again as was the case before the Beryl fork...the last couple of Beryl releases prior to Beryl 0.2 were ***** horrible...they constantly broke XGL among other things.
- bmartin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I haven't been able to get direct rendering working in XGL; I read it's unsupported. This is a big problem for playing a lot of video games (try Super Tux, or run Unreal Tournament in WINE with the OpenGL driver). If you can get it working, AIGLX is a good substitute for XGL.
- bmartin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Brevity is the soul of wit (damn Shakespeare fanboys [/sarcasm]). You've been beaten about 50 times, as far as making your point.
- nahun, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2oh come on, there is no way someone could digg that comment down, its just funny
- shredswithpiks, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1dugg down for the chastising comment "it's called growing pains people..."
- ChristianD, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1bmartin, "Blessed is the man, who having nothing to say, abstains from giving wordy evidence of the fact."
-- George Eliot
How's that for breif!
Just joking, you're probably right about my paragraph. - yoble, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0Awesome. I dont get it.
- selrahc, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2Deleted
- xtlosx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0i'm a beryl user and I love... it's running on top of gnome, which I also enjoy quite a bit.. the beryl roll comment was great, dugg for that one! ha
- snnycl, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0finally :)
- cuemkid, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I u used IX, go to http://www.onboom.com/downloads/ to download images
- EmxBA, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0Finnaly merging after a fork was built? Never seen this before. Anyway, it should *rock* :)
- Domza, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2It was crapulence anyway. No one is going to miss anything.
- ChristianD, on 10/12/2007, -3/+0Let it be said that on this day, the impossible has become possible. In truth, the split was the best thing that could have ever happened. The Compiz people discovered that sometime quantity has to be included in the quality you want to put out. You can set a pace to make 2000 Astin Martins a year or you can set a pace make 80,000 Jaguars.
The Beryl community demonstrated much like ubuntu demonstrated to the debian community(I hate those ubuntu fan boys) that when you have a good thing, you've got to be prepared to go mainstream. You have to realise that an open source project is not your baby. The beryl folks realised that while it's great being an adult and holding your own, there's nothing like going back home for some good home cooking (coding in this example) and working together. Just like brothers and sisters, both communities will bitch and moan about i want the name to be this, i want my plug-ins here, i want this, i want that, but what we all want is a stable Compositing manager with radical ideas in a dev branch and stable ideas in a mainstream branch. Dave can crack his code whip all he wants, but just like any parent he has to let the kids make a few mistakes, so they actually learn something. Yes, those mistakes kick a little dirt on the family name, but it's called a family for a reason. You stand together when they're saying Linux is just as innovative as OSX and Vista, and you stand together when they say it's just a UNIX hack with eye candy on top.
The Beryl Fork pushed the Compiz developers to step their time frame up a bit as the releases have been coming at twice their original speed. The Fork also shined light on the fact that everything isn't meant to be done as a beryl plug-in and some of that code needs to be pushed to the xorg server. It's called growing pains people, but fortunately if they really do come together it will be called better, because getting better as a whole while working together is all that open source is really about. - j4200, on 10/12/2007, -7/+1I'm thinking late night diggers sometimes poke at a websites innards and try to hack the gibson an *****. ERRORD! SPLODED!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -11/+3A registry is exactly what these things DO need. I'd much rather have everything stored in one, generic, supported-by-everything file with easy access via CLI and GUI tools than have to sift through two or three files just to change my network settings. Admittedly it is getting better, but settings are still spread across several files in dozens of directories all over the place, and it's really surprising that we havn't fixed that.
- DigitalDaiquiri, on 10/12/2007, -14/+2Digg effect after 50 diggs?! ug (X_X)
- ElitistSnob, on 10/12/2007, -23/+2Bring in the graphic designers? Who is going to pay them? Skilled creative professionals don't work for free, so good luck recruiting talented artists to design a logo for a "FREE4ME" open source project for no compensation.
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