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- FreeDeb, on 04/30/2008, -8/+88I wonder if Negroponte would give everyone who funded his "free software project" their money back?
- wylfing, on 04/30/2008, -18/+70Many people will say "Who cares what the underlying OS is?" It matters. A lot. Microsoft wants to kill OLPC, and will use all their dirty tricks (esp. vaporware teases) to accomplish it. But even if MS was a good citizen and initially tried to do the right thing, who's to say that a future manager wouldn't try to poison the well? OLPC is about "teaching a man to fish." Getting MS involved just breaks the poor guy's fishing pole.
- makosharkattack, on 04/30/2008, -9/+45I wrote a related article that in some ways is very complimentary to RMS'. My article talks builds on this one and talks more about why free software is the right choice for education and for OLPC educational philosophy in particular. You can read it here: http://mako.cc/copyrighteous/20080429-00
- paintpro, on 04/30/2008, -7/+41It makes me really happy to see such a big name in FOSS take up the OLPC cause. Forums such as olpcnews.com have been against the windows change since it was first brought up. If OLPC will accept the help of experienced linux developers, then I have no doubt we will be able to save program and return it to its original goals of education through free software.
- trogdor282, on 04/30/2008, -8/+40Seriously, how can you justify adding a $100 piece of software to a $100 laptop, when there's absolutely no benefit in doing so? Or if MS is offering it for less then it's nothing more than bait-and-switch.
MS is like AOL ten years ago. Nothing going for it except a pre-existing, addicted userbase. - PleaseJustDie, on 04/30/2008, -1/+27FSF = Free Software Foundation
Richard Stallman = FSF President
Negroponte = founder of OLPC project
OLPC = One Laptop Per Child
RMS = Richard Matthew Stallman (Richard Stallman's initials and a common abbreviation for him.) - Sammi84, on 04/30/2008, -2/+23Not our fault that you have been living under a stone.
- aywwts4, on 04/30/2008, -6/+24Is microsoft donating a lifetime subscription to an antivirus software?, is microsoft donating a good firewall? Is microsoft donating the double the hardware required to run all that additional overhead just to keep the system secure?
I have never run antivirus or a firewall on a linux box, and I have never had an issue ever. Now try connecting directly to the internet and take your firewall down... Installing windows and throwing it to the wolves is basically just saying you want a OLPC botnet out there. - kipmartin, on 04/30/2008, -1/+18have you heard of Wikipedia yet? its an online encyclopedia. look all that stuff up there--you might learn something.
and dugg down for mentioning NAACP and Black Panthers together. you pinhead.. - theOster, on 04/30/2008, -0/+17if kids learn on linux, they'll do fine adapting to windows...or mac...or unix....
- paintpro, on 04/30/2008, -1/+16The XO and the eee are very different. The XO is cheaper at $188. It has mesh network capability. ( It can connect to the internet through another XO, even if it out of range of the wireless router) It has this really cool e-ink mode that allows you to turn the backlight off and still read the screen. Speaking of the screen, it flips around for ebook mode and it has better resolution. Oh, and I spilled a 32 oz coke on my XO and cleaned it up with a wet rag with no negative side effects. You also don't have to pay $50 extra for a webcam.
- rmxz, on 04/30/2008, -5/+19Putting Windows on an OLPC really reminds me of the allegations against Nestle who's accused of giving "aid" including infant formula to babies in third world countries, knowing that this would interfere with the mother's natural lactation so that the family would have to continue buying the formula. [ref: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nestl%C3%A9_boycott]
Microsoft "helping" here is exactly the same. While they pretend to be helping, their goal is to hook the victims of the Windows-OLPC so that if they ever do become successful Microsoft can tax their future profits. - Stonekeeper, on 04/30/2008, -10/+23It's his right to do what he wants with his own damn laptop. Not everyone agrees with his position, but most will agree that the world is better off because of him.
- mckooiker, on 04/30/2008, -6/+18It has nothing to do with communism, I know it's difficult to understand, but it's about freedom. Freedom to do what you want with a product you bought. Buying a computer with windows and change the system is illegal. You could be sued. Isn't that rediculous? Being a slave of the big proprietary corporations?
Free yourself! Eepc is not completely free, besides the BIOS (sincerely there are only a few persons who know/mind the non-free BIOS) there are several non-free software packages...... - MattBD, on 04/30/2008, -8/+20I seem to recall that Steve Jobs offered them OS X and they declined it. Now they want to have Windows?
I'm not a great fan of OS X, I prefer Linux, but I think OS X would be a much better choice than Windows for the OLPC. Of course, Linux would be the best of the lot, but Windows? No way. - afx1, on 04/30/2008, -2/+13your argument is strong and makes many valid points
- rmxz, on 04/30/2008, -2/+13OTOH some people donated because the "cause" they contributed to was
"give them a computer that they can learn a lot from - even extending to learning how operating systems work"
not
"getting kids locked in to some expensive system that'll tax all of their future projects should they ever become self-sufficient.
Putting Windows on those is just like the allegations about Nestle who was accused of giving African Mothers formula to feed their newborns with the knowledge that this could *cause* them to produce less breast milk (milk production adjusts to how much the babies consume) making them buy even more formula for their babies. - possiblyneil, on 04/30/2008, -5/+16And then charges they guy for the privilege.
- grimward, on 04/30/2008, -2/+12I was surprised when I read that, because I've always found RS to be an intelligent person, but now I view him as a zealot too :(
- pilobilus, on 04/30/2008, -7/+17Astroturf troll brigade hard at work, I see. Anyhow... the only reason M$ would be interested in "partnering" with OLPC is the same reason Intel "partnered" with them: To get inside access to sales contract negotiations. This will enable them to identify opportunities to stomp down the OLPC project. It's all about future market share, and knowing exactly who to bribe to break contracts with the OLPC project is the key. Then they sell them fragile, low-function Wintel "student laptops". Intel was the first to do this, now M$ wants to have their turn.
- Fartag, on 04/30/2008, -3/+13Please learn why Windows and Microsoft are hated first, it's terribly tiring to reexplain to people that shill for Microsoft as a hobby or worse. Vendor lock-in is not a good thing, fostering dependency is not a good thing, removing control from the user and pursuing all manner of anticompetitive actions are not good things. Active opponents to free (as in freedom) software (while on the other hand "embracing" it) and all the other things are _not_ qualities that lead to a bright future. Supporting them in any way is therefore resisted by people that know better. Hopefully this is obvious!
Secondly, Linux is far more highly powered out of the box than Windows. Free software is absolutely the way to go here, so I'm having a hard time understanding why someone would want to anchor it down with underpowered, expensive, proprietary, closed source software. Where's the upside? That more people happen to use an inferior product and it's hard for them to all switch so join them? - RoboDonut, on 04/30/2008, -1/+11A firewall doesn't really do much.
As terrible as it sounds, the biggest threat to an OS is its users.
Windows doesn't have access controls. If a user accidentally executes something, there's nothing to stop it from infecting the system.
On a Linux machine, the infection could not spread outside ~/ or /tmp/. It could not alter any vital applications.
If I recall correctly, the OLPC was supposed to have ad-hoc wireless networking. A virus could spread very easily over such a connection. - RoboDonut, on 04/30/2008, -4/+13A laptop doesn't last a lifetime and Windows licenses aren't cheap.
How long do you think the average Windows installation lasts? A few months?
It might seem "free", but it really isn't. - RoboDonut, on 04/30/2008, -1/+10A programmer's skill is directly proportional to the size of his beard.
- TheSwashbuckler, on 04/30/2008, -0/+9Microsoft offers Windows for a few dollars in some geographies. They could and probably are doing the same for OLPC.
- aywwts4, on 04/30/2008, -0/+8If there was no internet access then what would the point of a laptop be, the web browsers, and the wifi cards, and the mesh network functionality?
People DO write viruses for kicks, some of the most disastrous viruses have been teens who just thought it would be funny.
While I'm sure there is enough internet to attack these PCs, I doubt there is enough bandwidth to download service pack X or whatever new fix comes out, You never notice on highspeed its a blink of an eye, but updating a pc on dialup, "crap, microsoft is running an update, that's why my internet stopped working, and there is no way to pause it without killing the process I guess I will try using it again in a few hours." So these PCs will likely remain perpetually venerable to whatever new automated holes are found in the OS. - zadadka, on 04/30/2008, -8/+16Microsoft's stance is simple and obvious : all Open Source / freeware products that offer a viable alternative to their own products represents a loss of revenue stream.
Education has so far been solid repeat business for Microsoft, and the more that this is undermined by Open Source, the smaller the Quarterlies become.
Worse, if the children grow up with OLPC demonstrating the flexibility of non-Microsoft products, they will be the generation that seeks off-the-shelf Open Source as first choice, a software house that will bespoke such a product as second choice, and Microsoft only if they have to.
School and Education is about giving our children a good grounding to later be able to make good choices, personally, professionally and otherwise.
It should not in any way make a brand synonymous with a particular activity, and IT should not be regarded differently in this respect.
It therefore makes complete sense for Open Souce to be the OPLC platform. - wiresjr, on 04/30/2008, -0/+8"zeal"
- lickmyback, on 04/30/2008, -4/+12I always respect RMS for promoting free software quietly behind the scenes while Torvalds and Shuttleworth soak up the limelight. I'm yet to see a review of Ubuntu that mentions "...and by the way, by using this software you liberate yourself from all manner of EULAs and proprietary restrictions". What happened to people wanting to learn from and contribute to these things?
- mrsteveman1, on 04/30/2008, -4/+11Since when is this about attacking Microsoft and protecting Linux?
This is supposed to be about educating children. - MattBD, on 04/30/2008, -0/+6Actually, it would be cool if ReactOS was sufficiently useable for this, since that's easily light enough to run on the OLPC, and is open-source, but also maintains a degree of Windows compatibility. If only...
- mrsteveman1, on 04/30/2008, -3/+9Heres a question, why the ***** do all these people want the source for bios? you can't randomly change it on the chip, and if you do you can likely brick your machine. Most users can't even read C code, and yet we have millions of them demanding the source for things.
Is BIOS spying on you mister Stallman? Really? 16-bit real mode code running on a rom chip that can barely bootstrap a modern OS reliably is spying on you?
And the firmware thing, the FCC requires that software controlled radios be incapable of tuning frequencies they aren't approved for. This means closed source firmware in some cases, so stop ***** demanding the source for things they CAN'T GIVE TO YOU. - mrsteveman1, on 04/30/2008, -3/+9Linux is also a work in progress, and is significantly behind Windows in a number of areas.
Want an example? This laptop has a 945gm chip in it, in Vista or XP connecting an external monitor requires connecting it, and continuing to work. The same task in linux requires restarting X11 entirely, meaning you get to close all the stuff you had open. Intel wrote and supports the driver on all three operating systems, yet on Linux it is crippled by X11.
Work in progress for sure, i just don't see it progressing all that much. - mirunit, on 04/30/2008, -9/+15Yes, because Linux is so unified.
- redxxx, on 04/30/2008, -1/+7Your IT friends don't care about their jobs much.
- Stroggoth, on 04/30/2008, -0/+6>M$ is all about stomping down competition
Also known as "competing". The problem is that people like competition until someone wins the football game. Once the game is won, they complain about the winning team. ("oh they used steriods", etc.). Bottom line is that someone needs to make a good football team and compete, and the Linux football team consisting of random charity players will always lose to a well-organized and talented team. - Ademan, on 04/30/2008, -1/+7It's not like that's what we WANT anyways, the point is to help them learn, not to teach them how to jump-crouch.
- RoboDonut, on 04/30/2008, -3/+9Microsoft isn't going anywhere soon.
- broodking, on 04/30/2008, -6/+12wtf did microsoft do to u?
- inactive, on 04/30/2008, -0/+6Admittedly, it was a FALCON PUNCH!
- Rikkochet, on 04/30/2008, -0/+6Sure, that worked for Apple. Remember all those computer labs full of heavily-discounted Mac Pluses? (Which no one ever bought for home)
- Stroggoth, on 04/30/2008, -6/+12>Windows is ***** and must not be allowed to go forward into the future - at any cost.
So much for capitalism, free markets and competition... so you believe that certain products should just be eliminated? By what, government mandate?
I think Linux is pretty rough around the edges and does not have the support I want, so without Windows, what am I supposed to use? BSD and OSX? - insanebrain, on 04/30/2008, -2/+8No. . It means increased OS stability/safety.
- aywwts4, on 04/30/2008, -1/+7cdahlkvist:
Do you have any evidence for your claims?
Ebay turns up 32 OLPC PCs, all but two of them are in the united states. the remaining two are being sold from the UK. That doesn't sound anything like widespread third world ebaying to me. I would expect to see something being sold from peru if your scenario were true.
Finally, the governments are Paying for them, these aren't world bank subsidized handouts, why would they buy them to sell them off? To whom, Other governments? - xenix, on 04/30/2008, -9/+14Oh noes it's Windows... Run for your lives
:P - cesclaveria, on 04/30/2008, -0/+5a she named Nicholas?
- mrsteveman1, on 04/30/2008, -4/+9How dare you put your own selfish usability concerns above freedom
Freedom hater, you hate freedom admit it. I saw you punch a bald eagle yesterday too. - Commodus, on 04/30/2008, -16/+21"Rescue it from Windows?" Especially when people link it to Stallman, that makes me want to install Windows on it, run MS Office, and stick to Internet Explorer just to spite the "FOSS or die" crowd.
Choose the OS that works best for the goal and the platform. That could be Sugar, Windows XP, or Mac OS X. Arbitrarily limiting yourself based on an ideal can be just as damaging as choosing Windows without awareness of alternatives. - misterjangles, on 04/30/2008, -0/+5I have one of the laptops. The concept is awesome but it did confuse me why they decided to go with a totally radically non-standard window manager. I suppose the kids can just go directly to the browser or the shell prompt, though.
Having used the computer myself, I can say if RMS is using this as his main laptop, he is really suffering for his cause. My machine is so slow it's just barely usable. I wanted to use it for traveling, but ultimately it just sits on my desk. - mattlee, on 04/30/2008, -2/+7The point with OpenBSD was not that he was critical of code released under the BSD license, but rather that there was non-free software in the OpenBSD ports system. I don't think that it's fair to say the BSD license is more free than GPL.. I think it has less restrictions for developers, as it allows for non-free forks of software, but that results in a lack of essential freedoms for the users of those proprietary forks.
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