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A Linux computer in every garage?
linuxdevices.com — A U.S. government- and industry-led coalition aiming to equip every car and roadside in America with wirelessly connected computers has tapped Linux for a prototype design. The Vehicle Infrastructure Integration Consortium (VII-C) hopes to lower driver death rates, reduce traffic jams, and media-enable cars before 2017.
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- schestowitz, on 10/11/2007, -5/+37Can you imagine Ballmer stepping out of his car to 'collect' for these devices? Even the US government (by affiliation) is not deterred and Linux has become the /de facto/ system for such applications.
- 7of7, on 10/11/2007, -44/+13What the ***** does this have to do with Ballmer? You people can't even go five seconds without insulting Microsoft. I guess that explains why the software seems so half assed.
- NOgiuliani, on 10/11/2007, -7/+25Big Brother is watching.
- Technopundit, on 10/11/2007, -6/+36Most Linux machines came out of somebody's garage ... former Windows boxes.
- Synapse84, on 10/11/2007, -20/+6@7of7
don't bother, at least 90% of the digg community is linux fanboys, and just like apple fanboys they have to see how much they can "insult" Microsoft. and bury anyone that states otherwise.
hell, bet most of them look/sound like this too
http://tv.truenuff.com/mac/upgrading.php - darkciti, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3I think they're working with the Dashwerks Group to help bring mesh-networking / on-demand wireless node infrastructure to the masses...
As for VIIC, I think that's just an extension of the AMIC specs (Automobile Multimedia Interface Collaboration)... - rharris, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10Is no one else scared sh1tless about this? I love Linux, but I don't want any system tapped into my car tracking it 24/7.
- ophello, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7I gotta say, this looks pretty sweet:
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Mulligan has a lot of suggestions for how VII technology could one day improve driving safety, efficiency, and enjoyment, including:
- Cars receive alerts about approaching emergency vehicles
- Alerts if cars in area activate anti-lock braking
- Cars serve as data collectors, for example with windshield wiper activity being used to map weather patterns with high precision
- Media-enabling cars
- Vehicle firmware upgraded over-the-air
- Inform car owners of recalls - Tenoq, on 10/11/2007, -0/+16Awesome - Linux can be used to hand out speeding fines too now? :-p
Might not happen in the States, but you can bet your ass it would happen in Aus. ***** speeding nazis.
/rant
Of course the many other uses are quite cool. Just the big brother aspect of this connectivity is always worrying. How long before the FBI can request a 'tap' on your car telemetry? - JonForTheWin, on 10/11/2007, -2/+9It'll be the first time I smash a computer not running windows.
Wait that's ***** . . I might shoot it several times with my gun because I'm lazy. =/
But yeah, destroy the ***** computer. Kill big brother. - daftman, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3@7of7
What the ***** has it got to do with you? Oh that's right. You can't go 5 seconds without trolling linux stories.
I hear there's a microsoft section in digg. Go there and join your flock.
Someone eventually gonna hack this system. - chingy1788, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2This is where Linux Excels
Linux has an interface setup so there is a high level of abstraction between the user and the inner operations of the OS
They have to have a good interface
you cant drive a car and type at the same time, unless you want to become a vegetable or worm food
Linux is Stable but for Desktops its complicated, for everything else (that has a GUI that is very simple) Linux Excels - EntropyFan, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3@daftman
No one will need to 'hack this system'
This is the government we are talking about. All you need to do is wait for the data to be put on several hundred unencrypted laptops... which should be about a week after the program is started.
- derekstech, on 10/11/2007, -0/+17yeah my server is in my garage already with the car out side!
- syafthegeek, on 10/11/2007, -3/+17Linux is everywhere and even the Govt use it.
- Robotsu, on 10/11/2007, -3/+38Okay, I like linux, but let's not pretend the Government adopting something makes it great.
- wildfire, on 10/11/2007, -3/+10One scenario he didn't mention and I thought could be somewhat easy to implement would be to conserve fuel. The system could alert and inform the driver of driving behavior to allow him/her to adjust for better fuel consumption.
Also, he did mention engaging the ABS in near-collision incidents. If they could take it one step further and integrate it with the fuel conservation system it would make driving much more bearable (especially here in Florida). That way cars could be somewhat in sync with the vehicle ahead of it reducing traffic tie-ups by staying a set distance away the entire time.- tamrix, on 10/11/2007, -6/+13Yes we could save fuel while crashing!
- cbaileyau, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3As far as driving in bumper-to-bumper traffic goes, there are already systems available in luxury autos called adaptive cruise control. Using a radar device on the front of the vehicle, the system detects the changing distance to the vehicle ahead and adjusts the speed. I'm not sure if you can enable these adaptive cruise control systems at low speeds, but it only makes sense.
- Mountaineer1024, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3I (for one) will never buy a car with an automated driving system I cannot turn off.
And that's where this is going, cars that do the driving for you.
I don't care if it's a safer system, I don't have to give my buying power a rational basis. - 4UIDigg, on 10/11/2007, -3/+2As far as saving fuel, there is a device called a "scan guage" that plugs into the OBDII port. The device manufacturer claims that the device displays the MPG for the car, as well as a bunch of other params. I haven't tried it yet, but if it really displays the MPGs, it could be real useful in adjusting the driving style to save $$$ on gas. With the OBDII computer mandated in all cars made today, there might not be a need to wait for 2012 just for an MPG readout.
Another thing that would be real nice is if an onboard computer kept track of how often oil is changed and other maintenance is performed, and had some GUI to manage all that, otherwise it is a real pain to keep track of.
- mannymix03, on 10/11/2007, -15/+5in ur garage, running your linuxz
- Kr4t05, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2/b/tards GTFO my digg.
- Technopundit, on 10/11/2007, -18/+30Wireless? Linux? HOW???
- Marthinus, on 10/11/2007, -2/+6@technopundit
Since I upgraded to Ubuntu 7.06 which uses the new network manager software, I do not have any problems connecting to my wireless network and I am not using ndiswrapper or some other hack either.
Maybe you should give wireless access using Linux another try before making comments based on old releases. You are aware that most Linux distros has a frequent release cycle unlike Windows with its 5 year release cycle? - kd1s, on 10/11/2007, -4/+2Too funny! My co-worker just installed Ubuntu on his Dell Latitude D610. Oh it runs, but the wireless is a royal pain in the ass. He's figured out that much of the problem has to do with getting the correct firmware for your wireless card.
I commented that for all the bastardization in Windows it pretty much knows about all the wireless chip sets out there and can get it to run with very little effort, though most Windows machines have either a Broadcom or Intel chip set.
Linux hasn't yet figured that out yet. I explained it's because mainstream Linux is used for one thing and one thing only. You use it to build a server, be it Samba, NFS, Mail, Web, Database, etc. You never put a server on a wireless network, it's always wired and has a hard coded IP address.
So Linux networking needs to catch up. Otherwise I'm encouraged by the desktop improvements and system management improvements in Linux. It's almost ready for the desktop, and we've done so with three of our public machines. They all run Ubuntu.
- Marthinus, on 10/11/2007, -2/+6@technopundit
- Floggeriffic, on 10/11/2007, -10/+1A VIC-20 in every car?...is this the 80's?
- upsilonh24, on 10/11/2007, -5/+9Linux saves lives.
- yongke, on 10/11/2007, -4/+0Because it's on the front page of Digg
- silencerider151, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2At the cost of our privacy.
- Shaggy3, on 10/11/2007, -3/+9I don't understand what "Media-Enabled" means?
Isn't a driver at high risk if their driving down the road watching TV?- Optimaximal, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Porn on the dashboard!
- morpheus69, on 10/11/2007, -3/+22Umm, in all the enthusiasm over Linux, aren't we forgetting something? This will give the FBI, NSA, CIA, Police, etc. the ability to track every vehicle anywhere in the country. I wouldn't be surprised if they require a secret "off switch" that lets the police turn off your car engine and lock your doors remotely. In fact, I've heard rumors that they can already do this using GM's OnStar.
The benefits here are minimal, and the cost is enormous. I, for one, hope this is a voluntary system if it ever does get built.- akinser, on 10/11/2007, -4/+2I agree. I don't think that this is all a network this large is going to be used for...
- Authustian, on 10/11/2007, -1/+8While I understand where you're coming from, remember, linux is open source. So even if they try, the hacker community will keep them honest... it's what the script kiddies are going to do that should truly frighten you.
- BleedingCello, on 10/11/2007, -2/+5It's already implemented in rental cars, DUI drivers, and on some leased cars. It runs on Linux because the kernel is made to run on such devices. Try booting Windows on your newfangled dishwasher....
http://www.vehicle-infrastructure.org/WhatsVII.htm
the fact is, this is a consortium(sp) of auto makers to bring technology to the roadside. Granted, the government is ultimately responsible.....it'll look even worse if they said..."Hey, it's not Windows, make it Windows". Linux is known for its dexterity, lets not make this something its not. It's got nothing to do with government spying (or maybe it does) but the point is...the purpose of this software is to make us safer on the roads, is it not?
Nobody has mentioned the obvious here.....Linux is open source, so why wouldn't automakers use it? - JonForTheWin, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5>I, for one, hope this is a voluntary system if it ever does get built.
It will be, at least in the beginning. Incrementalism is a bitch. - Flashman, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3@morpheus69:
I agree that there are a lot of privacy/security issues here. But vehicular computing has a LOT of advantages and there will be a ton of money in it. So I think the best course of action is not to reject the system outright, but to lobby for an open-standard system through which in-car systems can talk to each other and the internet. - AngelBunny, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3I doubt the gov would ever use anything open source to monitor others. It is just to easy to get around. 1) If they did then the public would know about it. Not a good move. 2) If it is open source it would be very easy to change. Imagine making your own version that tells FBI you're in another state. It wouldn't be hard to do. 3) It is open source and a computer. You could put any software you want on it. Imagine putting in software that notifies you where others are. You could know where every cop is. That is a speeders wet dream. No more worrying about a ticket. Speeding only when it is safe.
And of course there is: Programming a virus for other peoples cars. It would spread like wild fire probably if something was made finding an exploit. Imagine remotely controlling someone elses vehicle? oh my.
It is way to unrealistic the gov would ever use anything open source unfortunately. - GnuTzu, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5No, we don't want to be spied on.
But, we REALLY don't want to be spied on with proprietary software.
Whatever they require, let's be sure that it's all true open source (not tivoized), so that we can know exactly what is being monitored and transmitted.
- darkjedi52, on 10/11/2007, -5/+5This sounds like a good idea, but its BULLL***** Its just another way the government will be able to track your every move.
- wevegotthejazz, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4definitely a good idea and will probably save countless lives
on the other hand I think the idea of having your car networked to a government run traffic system could pose damaging consequences in terms of our privacy and civil liberty rights
hopefully the ACLU and other privacy watchdogs will ensure the infrastructure of this system will be as transparent and non-intrusive as possible- woodcoxcb, on 10/11/2007, -7/+1screw the ACLU. if you have something to hide, be worried. otherwise, why do we even care?
- UrsaMare, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3@woodcoxcb
Had to login to reply to this, even if it is feeding the trolls:
Not quite the link I was looking for, but it hits the essential point.
From: http://www.eff.org/Privacy/Email_Internet_Web/?f=email_privacy.faq.txt
"Whatsamatter, I've got nothing to hide. Why do I need e-mail
privacy?
Show me an e-mail user who has no financial, sexual,
social, political, or professional secrets to keep from
his family, his neighbors, or his colleagues, and I'll
show you someone who is either an extraordinary
exhibitionist or an incredible dullard. Show me a
corporation that has no trade secrets or confidential
records, and I'll show you a business that is not very
successful.
Robert Ellis Smith, Publisher of the PRIVACY JOURNAL,
quips, 'An employee with nothing to hide may well be an
employee with nothing to offer.'
Privacy, discretion, confidentiality, and prudence are
hallmarks of civilization."
Basically, it doesn't matter if I don't have anything to hide. The government doesn't have any business snooping in my business whenever they feel like it. Even if they think a crime has been committed, I'm innocent until proven guilty and they better not try to get my information without a warrant. That's a constitutional right that is being eroded. I'd think the entire political spectrum could agree to that. Conservatives and libertarians don't like big intrusive governments. Liberals have been burnt enough by government spying (e.g. FBI investigating anti-Vietnam groups and civil rights workers). I can't understand how this idea keeps propagating, but it has to be fought.
- ZPWeeks, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5It'll only be in every garage if it's light enough to move it upstairs from every mother's basement.
- PinkoComrade, on 10/11/2007, -1/+1And Tux airbags?
- BleedingCello, on 10/11/2007, -5/+0Sorry morpheus69, i buried your comment by accident.
http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/pdf/nrd-01/NRDmtgs/2005Honda/Resendes_VII.pdf
This page is weird, it's showing me thumbnails when I scroll down....some strange javascript or xhtml Web 2.0 thing I haven't seen yet. Nifty.....its relevent btw - blankman, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5in other words, they want the ability to ticket you for all your driving mistakes without having to pay a single traffic cop.
From the article they make it seem like cars are going to "talk" to each other and know when another car is about to enter their path, but it's more likely they'll just use the system to determine whose fault the accident was (which by itself isn't really a bad thing).
But if they have a system that can monitor all cars, where they are, and what they're doing; there is no way they would let the opportunity for automatic ticketing to pass them by. They have to make up the revenue this system's going to cost somehow.- galore, on 10/11/2007, -1/+0On the positive side, it will also make unreasonable speedlimits stand out a lot more. Example: The 55mph limit on the Dallas Tollway. Outside of "rush hour" (=snails rushing), the average speed is about 70mph. I doubt the 55mph limit will last in a scenario, where hundreds of thousands of people get fined automatically. And no, people won't accept 55mph on a wide open 6 lane hwy, if there is a 100% chance to get a ticket.
- savingaurora, on 10/11/2007, -5/+1too bad we're all dying...2012...dang
- BleedingCello, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1don't be so pessimistic, nobody said anything about dying (blood of patriots and tyranny aside)...(and don't jump the gun)
- atb12688, on 10/11/2007, -2/+8***** the RIAA and the MPAA and DRM
- nationalist, on 10/11/2007, -6/+4totally agree, but what does this have to do with the RIAA?
- BleedingCello, on 10/11/2007, -3/+0I dunno if theres gonna be enough "*****" to go around.......
- BleedingCello, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4Ouch check this out.....
http://www.boozallen.com/
Booz Allen Hamilton, the company thats implementing this....19,000 empoyees on six continents....this agency was also deployed to Afghanistan and Iraq, shall we digg a little farther?- mshade, on 10/11/2007, -2/+0Don't know how this ended up here.. Digg down
- getrealnow, on 10/11/2007, -0/+8I don't have a garage
- fantasticFlan, on 10/11/2007, -3/+2And I suppose you don't have a pot for you chicken, get with the times, man.
- gafasiesornivek, on 10/11/2007, -3/+2Huh? Wha? The English schools you at night and it's doing sometimes good!
- silencerider151, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I wouldn't condemn someone on their English if I were you....
- gafasiesornivek, on 10/11/2007, -5/+1Dear Linux, if you aren't on the glitzy get a Mac commercials then please go and live in Dvorak or Reiser's basement.
- thrill, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2That's extremely interesting, considering that the "Telematics" industry is expected to grow to over 25billion dollars this year. So now we have 'government designated telematics' providers? I researched this very thoroughly a couple of years ago when I realized that cars needed to have complete computerization in them. This started in September 2005 when I wanted to replace my old VCR in my SUV.. maybe the gubment would like to give me a few million dollars so I can put my product on the market.. I smell GW or Dick involved in this somehow.
--thrill - webNV, on 10/11/2007, -2/+0Shall we get free cars for beta testing?
- centsless75, on 10/11/2007, -2/+1Sounds like BS to me:
1) Cars receive alerts about approaching emergency vehicles
Ya, sometimes you see drivers having a hard time with the approaching emergency vehicles, but is this going to help these same drivers?
2) Alerts if cars in area activate anti-lock braking
OK, so someone locks up their brakes, if you are following at a safe distance this isn't an issue. Also, this would seem to cause a lot of false alarms, as well as false security which could actually lead to more accidents.
3) Cars serve as data collectors, for example with windshield wiper activity being used to map weather patterns with high precision.
There are already RWIS (Road Weather Information Systems) implemented all over the country. Also, if you need time to make preparations for driving in rain then you probably shouldn't be driving in the first place.
4) Media-enabling cars
This technology is already here and doesn't need to be attached to your car to work, MAN wireless networks, 3G, etc.
5) Vehicle firmware upgraded over-the-air
This is a private enterprise concern, viz. the automobile manufacturer's, not the governments. Why pay more tax dollars to help out private business. That's not the governments job. Plus it's another BS reason, if the manufacturer found it important to do firmware updates on their vehicles they should and would develop the means to do themselves.
6) Inform car owners of recalls-
The automobile manufacturers already do this for major recalls. It is their responsibility.
My question is, "Will these six functions actually help make the streets safer?" Doesn't add up. Which leads me to my next question, "What exacty IS the motivation behind this project?" All of these functions require the car to be tracked. So since all of these function have this one commonality doesn't it seem like maybe the main reason IS for tracking cars? Pretty sure our forefathers would be pissed right now. Be afraid, very afraid. - Stonekeeper, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2At least they went for a decent OS. Remember what happened when they put windows in a car?
http://www.zdnetasia.com/news/hardware/0,39042972,39130270,00.htm
(It says electronic failure - yeh right) - aggemam, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0People should relax. Just because there'll be an onboard system in every car, it doesn't mean it has to invade your privacy. I can easily think of a design where no unique IDs are used; rather, a new vehicle ID could be assigned for every trip, or even multiple times during a trip.
If care is taken, a system like this can be a great improvement to car traffic. Just think of the many times you wait for a red light -- for what use? Newer sensor-equipped signals help a bit, but they do little good in coordinating traffic on a larger scale. It's good to try avoid Big Brother, but we shouldn't scare ourselves too much to actually improve things.
And also, I'll be having so much fun hacking my car to send out fake "ABS triggered" messages to nearby cars... I wonder if the media system will allow for goatse? - MadN, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0One more reason to ride my motorcycle!
- riddla, on 10/11/2007, -1/+0All I can say...
Pure pwnage!
I cant wait until this is released, especially since its based on *nix. Its gonna take no time before we see all sorts of 'interesting' stuff that can be done by the basement cracker with this. - galore, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0If an idea like this will ever see the day of light, MS will do EVERYTHING in its power to supply the required OS. There are simply too many vehicles on the road for MS to let this go to Linux or another non-MS OS.
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Once again...OS has little to do with application.
- Kr4t05, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Reading down to the bottom, I have to commend all of you on the tinfoil parade. Such amusing paranoia is rare to come by.
The logic behind your fear is, of course, warranted, with *****-rag laws like the Patriot Act, and other legislation that guarantees Bush a peek into everyone's lives at the utterance of a word. However, this is slated to be in vehicles by 2017. If this is the government I know, I wouldn't expect it before 2020. By then, Bush should be long gone, and the Patriot Act could be repealed.
Stop worrying, it makes life so much more enjoyable. - caponumen, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1By 2017 all cars will be "Goremobiles" that run on hot air and fairy farts, that cannot exceeded 15 MPH.
So safety will be just another "feature". - snakeman01, on 10/10/2007, -0/+0read about this on http://www.automaticgarages.com/ and was referred here. Sounds like a good story.
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