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48 Comments
- kazamx, on 10/10/2007, -1/+38We hear about migrations to Linux all the time, 1000 desktops here, 500 desktops there. This is on a MUCH bigger scale, 560,000 students.
I know students also have their own machines, but at my University (Manchester, UK) most students would use the computer labs pretty often. This could be a chance to at least expose over half a million people to a non Microsoft OS.
If they are running Linux it also means that all these students will be exposed to Open Office too. When these students leave and start up their own companies they will be asking themselves "Do I really need to pay out for Office, Windows etc. on all my machines or maybe just on a couple?" - mercurysquad, on 10/10/2007, -1/+11"A real musician who can actually compose(meaning not loop programs but actual notation) would have no use for a mac."
Sorry to be rude but you're an idiot for thinking so. What are your needs exactly? To rephrase, what Windows apps do you use? Notation? Finale and Sibelius, two of the biggest notation software, run on a mac. And check this page out: http://www.hitsquad.com/smm/mac/NOTATION/ More notation software than you can shake a stick at.
That said, I should also add that traditionally macs have been used for professional audio/music creation, most studios still use mac-based software, and it is only recently that the likes of Sonar and Cubase have made Windows even a viable platform for a digital audio workstation.
I installed OSx86 precisely for the audio/music apps, while using Ubuntu as the regular day-to-day OS. Glad to get rid of Windows - which was keeping me from migrating to Linux 100%, because of the music apps. With OSX and Linux now, I have the best of both worlds. - omarciddo, on 10/10/2007, -0/+7Not bad. This way even non-tech-savvy students are exposed to Linux and open source software.
- mercurysquad, on 10/10/2007, -1/+7Great, my uni already uses SuSE. But it's not that big a news. In Germany, if it's Linux, it's (open)SuSE.
- polyGone, on 10/10/2007, -1/+7Wow, with this and Renault they are certainly boosting their user base. Nice.
- dusanmal, on 10/10/2007, -0/+6Universities in the USA, particularly science and engineering departments, have long been users of the Linux. "Twofold" reason: Universities are not rich and care about the costs (particularly maintainance, at my department that difference is a factor of 10); applications relevant to the sciences are typically *NIX oriented (ex., try to publish a Physics paper without using some form of *TeX...). This goes unnoticed because for a long time one have not been able to purchase mass-produced PC without some form of MS Win on it. Hence, (partly as a reply to schestowitz comment above) MS have been leeching monies that way for too long (at my University we have literally room-full of unused MS Win licenses and disks from machines immediately converted to Linux). As far as Linux goes (and we use both RH/Fedora and SuSe), not a penny went either to SuSe/Novell or indirectly to MS that way. No need for any payments and I suspect the German Universities follow the same (obvious ) free path.. Fortunately, similar story now happens with the hardware as well (Dell,...), so MS won't be getting that free ride either...
- mikedoth, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5ubuntuforums.org
- mercurysquad, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5And to qualify my rudeness, it stems not only from you saying that a mac has no use for 'real musicians', but also for the term 'real musicians' itself. I am offended by your attitude.
Loop-based music is not about triggering random sounds in eJay, hoping it sounds good. There is a lot that goes into it. Choosing the right sounds and the right texture to create the feel, then using counterpoint effectively so that it all blends in. Just because you write music for a string quartet or a 60-piece orchestra on score-sheets doesn't make you a 'real' musician and the rest imposters. Listen to some dub, d-n-b, breakbeat, psychedelic trance, hell even house music. Try to create a single such track yourself, then tell me if you're not bogged down by the mind-boggling amount of detail that goes into it. You need to pain-stakingly craft every aspect of the entire sound, right from using three saw wave oscillators and modulating their parameters, putting effects on top with just the right settings, and then creating musical phrases for those sounds. You *create* the entire sound. Not just jot down notation for instruments, leaving all the other details to the arranger/performer.
There is art everywhere: "real" art. And no form of art is lesser than another. So next time think about what you're saying. - commernie, on 10/10/2007, -1/+6Finally, a university who sees the obvious benefits of not paying hundreds of thousands of dollars in licenses. Let's hope others follow their lead.
- binaryloop, on 10/10/2007, -1/+6“First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.” -- Mahatma Gandhi
Who's laughing now bitches? - inactive, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5Agree. But Novell has a better support in Germany since SUSE Linux was a German company.
It's good new either way. - commernie, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5"But I like a lot of what Microsoft comes out with. I love watching development, cause I like future and progress. Linux moves way too slow." Are you ***** kidding me? There are new major versions of the kernel approximately once a year, and new minor versions every two months. Microsoft's last release was Windows 2003 (which is not even a major release, since it's so similar to Windows 2000), four years ago. As for distributions like Ubuntu, new versions come out every six months. Clearly you don't know what you are talking about.
- srg13, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3livevil is right - how do you expect Linux developers to make drivers for your network card if the manufacturer won't publish specifications etc. Even so, there are other options available (ie. Ndiswrapper).
This is one of the reasons I don't own an ATI graphics card - I don't support companies who don't support me. - oobuntu, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3We can only hope. I've switched from solaris-heavy admin to Linux-heavy admin in the last few years. I hope the job market agrees.
- simon275, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3All the client PC's at my uni all dual boot either XP or Fedora and the servers run unix of some description.
- MeneerR, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3Just email microsoft. Explain them you are going to switch to linux or you want windows liscences for free.
Then you sell those liscences on ebay, and go install linux. ;-) Should be good beer money. - abhiroop, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4I totally agree with you on this. Although I don't know much about the music aspect, in my SCHOOL we got a mac for the 15-20 students who were doing film and wanted to use final cut pro. From what I've heard the Mac rules supreme when it comes to any A/V editing
- OpCzar, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3I think the incentive for installing Linux on school pc's is to have a more limited and controlled experience. No spyware, virus problems nor p2p - students will strictly see them as work computers. Also, no one would expect an update of software/hardware every 3 - 5 years which saves money.
- OldMacNeco, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3Not really, there are also some unis that use Fedora.
- sukimashita, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Can you explain how Microsoft earns Money when the Universities use/migrate to openSuSE?
- abhiroop, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Um I believe MS last release was Vista...
- gummih, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Being a capable Linux admin is going to be seriously profitable soon. Even today an admin that can confidently go into a company with 2-300 windows licenses and shift it over to Linux saves huge wads of cash for the company. Even if all of them are OEMs it saves a heap of money when it is time to ugrade the hardware.
- xrenjrvt, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Make sure you install Vista first then Ubuntu otherwise Vista will destroy your boot loader. I don't run windows but I have SATA and IDE hard disks working together fine.
- livevil, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3Invest in a better laptop.
- rhowell, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Link to the real article (although it's just as short)
http://www.computerweekly.com/Articles/2007/08/28/226420/german-universities-migrate-to-linux.htm - inactive, on 10/10/2007, -4/+5If you think Microsoft and technology progress go hand in hand, look at MSN vs Google. Look at the real world. Microsoft markets great! They innovate like crap.
- oobuntu, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1In my day (at Manchester Uni) in the Comp Sci department they ran SunOS and Solaris on Sun and Twinhead machines. I didn't touch a Windows PC during the whole course (gladly). It set me up well for a career in Unix Systems Administration.
- mattscape, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Pressrelease by Novell:
Translated: http://www.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pressebox.com%2Fpressemeldungen%2Fnovell-gmbh%2Fboxid-122957.html&langpair=de%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF8
German: http://www.pressebox.com/pressemeldungen/novell-gmbh/boxid-122957.html - Stemp, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Renault ? I think it's Peugeot (PSA Peugeot/Citroën in fact).
- Philluminati, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1***** BLOG SPAM
- commernie, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1Actually, no. My university pays for thousands of Windows licenses each year, and it costs them a fortune.
- blackwinged, on 10/10/2007, -1/+1...but you know Renault is French? This country left of Germany...
I know three german universities - and all of them are running linux for years now. Exclusively. Mostly Ubuntu.
So this is strange news to me. - MmmmmDonut, on 10/10/2007, -0/+0actually, universities can generally get their software for free. When I was a sys admin in school, most of our software was considered corporate donations.
- Brabus, on 10/10/2007, -2/+2Wake Up!
- schestowitz, on 10/10/2007, -1/+1They still get a portion. The unis should have gone with Debian, just like Munich.
- commernie, on 10/10/2007, -1/+1I agree with you that fanboy-ism is wrong. I disagree that Linux (or Mac) fanboys "ra[n]t about how much they hate MS." Rather, fanboys LOVE a particular thing, and may or may not hate the alternatives of the thing they love. I think that MS-haters (myself included) have damn good reasons for hating it, most of which have nothing to do with Linux (or Mac). In fact, if Linux (or Mac) didn't exist, we would hate MS anyway.
- Goosemaster, on 10/10/2007, -5/+4Databoy:
Sit down, grab a beer....let's have a chat.
"Windows is a general purpose operating system. Probably 99.9% of Windows users are appliance operators. Windows software is general purpose hence the bloat. The software will do the job, but like any other application you need specialised software it has to be written user specific and expensive."
....why use a jackhammer to drill some holes for a decorative fence when all I need is a hammer-drill?
Just because one is bigger and looks like it can do anything does not automatically mean that it will do a better job.
relationship to OS's: the more resources you are taking up, the less that are available to the application(s) and in business that hurts the bottom line. Whether you are using Windows Server 2003, RHEL 4, or DOS, this ends up ranking up their with the laws of physics.
if you see the Longhorn 2008 roadmap, they are focusing on segmenting server roles, much more so than they have in 2003.
Ask yourself why.
"In the Windows world, time is money. A Windows computer is part of the office business structure. The overall costs in operating Windows in relationship to the business generated income in negligible. For a small to medium business to change over to a Linux environment the costs involved are not worth considering."
Perhaps a windows computer is part of the structure, but most large enterprises uses *nix for the infrastructure. Sure many are gravitating to and from it, and with good reason in many cases, but one must understand that there is the server, the blade, the appliance, and the workstation. It's not just about Windows or linux on the server or the desktop. IF you are going to address the issue, do the issue justice.
May I add that when discussing mission-critical apps, it is indeed NOT a "windows world," as your put it. Sure events such as grabbing the London Stock Exchange's contract do indeed fit into that category, those implementations are quickly outnumbered but the *nix ones. That's not to say that one is inferior to the other. Simply put, it is simply NOT a "Windows World" in that environment.
"If changing over to Linux is as easy as the Linux proponents profess Red Hat, Suse. Mandriva would be large worldwide corporations."
Change isn't necessarily good. For clients with either type of OS.
"There is a difference between a University and the real world. Universities have over 30 years of Unix experience and Unix Professors to help in the transition. In the Real world you are on your own."
Sun gives Solaris out for free....what does that tell you? They all make their money on support. If you pay them enough, they will build you a custom kernel out of popcorn...although support is always an issue with any software or hardware vendor if you don't pony up;)
"So stop flaming Windows. Small minds have small and closed views in life."
Remember, you said that.
Everyone seems to be happy that the fruits of the laborious and yet open-source, and OPEN MIND movement has bared fruit. People put in generous amounts of work into creating a OS for the world that is free for all to use, enjoy, and learn from/with.
And yet we are close-minded......I guess you can't please everyone.
"NO I AM NOT A MICROSOFT LOVER; I USE A COMPUTER DO DO A JOB REGARDLESS IF IT IS WINDOWS OR LINUX."
No one said you were.
Frankly, I don't think you are a MS sympathizer.
I just think you have no idea what you are talking about. - TKn00b, on 10/10/2007, -4/+2I gave up on Ubuntu after trying to install it about 5 times using alternate and live cds along with x86 and x64, so I went back to SuSE and couldn't be happier. Ubuntu isn't for everyone so my advice would be to shop around. (I know that this does not fix your problem at all. just my $0.02)
- rabidjade, on 10/10/2007, -3/+1Great answer, it's a software issue, not hardware. Typical fan boy answer.
- nephilimx, on 10/10/2007, -2/+0"When these students leave and start up their own companies"
More like they will get a office job with there business degree and be crippled without the expierence of advanced techniques, even basic first year stuff like macro editting will mess them up in the real world - MusicalGenius, on 10/10/2007, -4/+1I disagree but even then my intention was towards the fact the MS is more open about development than most companies.
I also meant no malice towards any digger but only stated that Linux and Mac fan boys who only rat about how much they hate MS all day are one sided only and are purely annoying. - MusicalGenius, on 10/10/2007, -5/+2I can't get Ubuntu working. It just says missing operating system when booting and ALL the files are there. I really don't get it, but I could use a lot of help I have one of my sata HD's running Vista 64 and Ubuntu on an IDE. Is it not possible to boot this way? Or is it possible but something is screwing up. I'm not even customizing anything really. I let Ubuntu choose to do it how it wants and it works. If I customize it, still nothing. I've searched countless sites... but if anyone has any good input, I would greatly appreciate it.
- inactive, on 10/10/2007, -9/+2YaaAAAAWWWN.
- kidlinux, on 10/14/2007, -9/+1Good for them! They've taken the first step towards migrating to macs.
- rabidjade, on 10/10/2007, -10/+2Yeaaaa, another company goes with Linux. Do we also get updates when people farts smell less disgusting than the last ones too? Maybe they can get my laptop working with wireless when my Linux die hard fan friends said there's no better solution without going back to Windows. I tried Linux and it's not a windows replacement.
- schestowitz, on 10/14/2007, -12/+4They should have gone with Red Hat or something. Microsoft earns money from this, for unsubstantiated claims and FUD.
- MusicalGenius, on 10/10/2007, -15/+6There is nothing wrong with people wanting windows. I love windows. Why? Because I have tried Macs for my music needs and they do little. A real musician who can actually compose(meaning not loop programs but actual notation) would have no use for a mac. My PC can do much more and does. Now about Linux. I will be honest, I love the concept to the end of the universe. But I like a lot of what Microsoft comes out with. I love watching development, cause I like future and progress. Linux moves way too slow. I am currently having Ubuntu install problems, but when resolved I will finally have used more than Suse. I am excited. BUT even Linux doesn't meet my music needs. Though I am working on Linux and programming so that I can make great Linux music programs.
Point is, I like Linux, I love it's potential. Not enough people jump on. BUT even if I converted to using Linux primarily, I would still like windows because I have great value in it and yes(though suicidal to say) I like Microsoft. I don't like all of it, and there are things I hate. But I primarily like Bill Gates, not as much as a philanthropist as much as I LOVE watching technology progress and I think he does as well. So I have value in the company and it's products.
I love Linux, I do. But I am sick to death of all the Linux diggers who think that theirs is so superior that they have to get in your face every day and can't let you like your own. A lot like Mac fan boys really. Live and let live. (And sorry for posting this here, but I have a tech question I will put in a reply to this if you would read it) - inactive, on 10/10/2007, -12/+3I am getting tired of Linux no brainers blowing hot air out of their rear end.
Linux and Windows are two different Operating Systems for two different types of people. Linux is for technical people who use it as an educational tool or specialised purposes.
Windows is a general purpose operating system. Probably 99.9% of Windows users are appliance operators. Windows software is general purpose hence the bloat. The software will do the job, but like any other application you need specialised software it has to be written user specific and expensive.
Linux is for people who want to learn about computers and specialised applications.
Linux engineers are employed in the movie graphics industry because it is easier to train an engineer to become a graphics artist that training a graphics artist to become an engineer.
In the Windows world, time is money. A Windows computer is part of the office business structure. The overall costs in operating Windows in relationship to the business generated income in negligible. For a small to medium business to change over to a Linux environment the costs involved are not worth considering.
In large corporations where there is specialised applications Linux makes sense as it is not only the workstation which is considered but the up line servers and mainframes.
If changing over to Linux is as easy as the Linux proponents profess Red Hat, Suse. Mandriva would be large worldwide corporations.
There is a difference between a University and the real world. Universities have over 30 years of Unix experience and Unix Professors to help in the transition. In the Real world you are on your own.
So stop flaming Windows. Small minds have small and closed views in life.
NO I AM NOT A MICROSOFT LOVER; I USE A COMPUTER DO DO A JOB REGARDLESS IF IT IS WINDOWS OR LINUX.
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