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156 Comments
- taylanol, on 06/01/2009, -8/+73Homeopathy is just a scam. Unfortunately it has become such a big economy with a cult following that it's hard to fight against. There is absolutely no clinical evidence that it offers any remedy beyond the placebo effect. It doesn't even make sense at the basic physics level: Some homeopathic solutions are so diluted, that it doesn't include even a single atom of the diluted material.
(For a doctor's oppinion, see, e.g., http://www.everydayhealth.com/blog/zimney-health-a ... - directedition, on 06/01/2009, -4/+52Ahh, homeopathy. Another example of how superstition puts lives in danger.
- marklestrange, on 06/01/2009, -3/+37Homoeopathy is not a general term for 'natural' medicine you know ...it refers to a way of diluting an ingredient till it is scientifically undetectable in the medicine - this is NOT natural medicine and is hardly ever used anywhere in the "3rd world' it is a very particular branch of alternative medicine favoured by neurotic middle class westerners.
I'm all for alt medication - but homoeopathy is bunkum. - farfromsubtl, on 06/01/2009, -4/+37Reason, FTW.
- tieInterceptor, on 06/01/2009, -2/+35selling water as medicine... isn't that the definition of fraud?
and if you sell water as medicine to someone with a deadly disease .... when that person dies, aren't you guilty of murder by deception?
seriously, it's lame that we still have people talking about this like it works, if you dilute something to the point that there is no compound left, and you call that a medicine, then why on earth tab water is not considered a medicine? it has residues of many compounds, and some poo for sure.
water has memory, ... but it seems to forget all the ***** that had in it before. - ArJooDeJew, on 06/01/2009, -3/+32I don't believe having Doctor Who condemn homeopathy is going to have any effect on public opinion.
- barc0de, on 06/01/2009, -4/+32The irony is that a lot of these countries need sources of clean water, and homeopathic medicine is about the cleanest water there is.
- DouglasQ, on 06/01/2009, -0/+27A friend of mine was a homeopathist. He killed himself by taking an underdose.
- directedition, on 06/01/2009, -2/+23I don't think you know what homeopathy is..... the tea they made actually contained aspirin in it. Homeopathy 'medicines' are so diluted, each 'treatment' could contain as few as a single (mathematically extrapolated) molecule of the original medicine. Or even none at all.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy#Medical_an ...
http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Homeopathy/Pages/Resu ... - ralph123, on 06/01/2009, -1/+22I hate to tell you this, but it isn't.
For the 600th time, homeopathy does not equal using plants as medicine, on the contrary:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy - NSResponder, on 06/01/2009, -0/+19No, marijuana has active chemicals. Homeopathy is nothing but water as a placebo.
-jcr - NSResponder, on 06/01/2009, -0/+17"In many such countries it is either homeopathic medicine, or nothing. "
Same difference.
-jcr - ralph123, on 06/01/2009, -1/+17I think you are making the mistake of thinking that homeopathy equals using plants as medicine. But nothing could be further from the truth:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy
No modern drug came from homeopathy, a lot of modern drugs came from stuff found in nature. - skintigh, on 06/01/2009, -0/+16How is homeopathy age-old? It's the latest fad, and completely devoid of logic. According to homeopathy you could cure any disease by drinking sea water since every chemical/medicine/herb ever was at one point in the ocean water and thus diluted into a panacea.
You take your snake oil, I'll stick to repeatable, verifiable science. - NSResponder, on 06/01/2009, -0/+15"Also, homeopathy worked for me after orthodox medicine failed. "
No, your body healed itself. We can do that, you know.
-jcr - ApokalypseNow, on 06/01/2009, -0/+14http://dic.academic.ru/dic.nsf/enwiki/10419694
Summary: standard homeopathic dilution causes concentrations best measured by atoms per cubic hecto-lightyear. - carbonetc, on 06/01/2009, -0/+13Homeopathy was devised around 1800 AD. It's hardly age-old.
- theirishman16, on 06/01/2009, -1/+14People selling this crap as a valid alternative to medical care are essentially committing murder
- savocado, on 06/01/2009, -1/+13homoeopathy doesn't work and it's pseudo-science
- NSResponder, on 06/01/2009, -0/+12"You do realize that all modern drugs came from Homeopathy at some time."
WTF?
You don't have any idea what homeopathy is, do you?
Watch and learn:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xd23gBkhf9A
-jcr - Wag3Slav3, on 06/01/2009, -0/+12You will die in agony.
- DrWordSmith, on 06/01/2009, -0/+12I have a friend who's wife is a naturopath. Much of the practice involves trying to find a "natural" way of solving the underlying problem that a person has by adjusting diet, or using herbs instead of mainstream medicines. So far, I am completely in agreement.
Unfortunately, naturopaths also prescribe homoeopathic medicines. When asked why, she claims that there are plenty of double-blind trials showing they are effective. However when asked how it works, and why it works, there is no good answer to this. The "memory" of water is one typical answer.
From what I have read, it seems the most plausible reason homeopathy seems effective is it is a mix of the placebo effect. Along with the fact that people that prescribe homeopathic medicines are typically much more involved in listening to their patient's problems thus reducing anxiety and stress. - smemily, on 06/01/2009, -0/+12If water really had memory, every drop of water on this earth would remember being urine, and would be transmitting urine vibrations.
- lyso, on 06/01/2009, -0/+11Erm - it doesn't fit the mold of traditional eastern, northern or southern medicine either. You do realise it was invented around 200 years ago in Germany?
But yes, they are rejecting it because it doesn't fit the mold of Western medicine - it isn't evidence-based and there is no good mechanism for it to work by. The WHO has a responsibility to support good science. - Mnementh2230, on 06/01/2009, -0/+11This crock of a "medicine" needs to be stopped, forever.
- ausdigger, on 09/15/2009, -1/+12care to tell us the story? have any scientific backing to show before and after homeopathy?
- smemily, on 06/01/2009, -0/+11It's called coincidence / placebo effect / humanity's need to find pattern and cause in the patternless and causeless.
- LilJimmyNordin, on 06/01/2009, -0/+9Because if he doesn't, the one final hard-to-kill rumor of homeopathy's efficacy (the placebo effect) is gone too.
- CaptainPanda, on 06/01/2009, -1/+10If it took months, then your body probably just healed itself.
- BenjoBanjo, on 06/01/2009, -0/+8I think the reason they are so against it is that there is no logical reason for homeopathic remedies to work beyond the placebo effect.
Calling them "old school monoliths" for challenging a completely unproven form of 'medicine' prescribed to people with terrible diseases like HIV is absurd. - Suricou, on 06/01/2009, -0/+8"quite arrogant for Western scientists to dismiss homeopathic medicine simply because it does not fit the mold of traditional Western medicine"
Oh, it's all a great conspiricy! The great white men of the medical establishment are trying to destroy the traditional medicine because it would infringe on their cultural superiority!
Shut up and get a brain. Western medicine is evidence-based. That means it doesn't select treatments based on what feels right, or what the doctors think is good, or what the tribal elders value. No, it selects treatment by running carefully controled studies - first in animal models, then in humans over a period of many years. The results are then analysed by cold, hard statistics, free of the subjective values and biases of human judgement. And it's those numbers that determine if a treatment should be considered or not.
In the case of homeopathy, countless studies have concluded it doesn't work.
Exactly one respectable, published and peer-reviewed study has concluded that it might work.
That one study was later withdrawn after the equipment was discovered to be contaminated, invalidating the results. - lyso, on 06/01/2009, -0/+8This study appears to merely anecdotally report other studies. Yes, it is possible to pick out studies that have a statistically significant effect. If we look at 20 studies then on average one will have P<0.05 by chance. This doesn't mean that homeopathy works. In addition, (I haven't read through the whole thing, but) lots of the studies seem to compare homeopathy with another drug (e.g. aspirin). I would say a positive result here is evidence that the aspirin is no better than placebo, rather than that homeopathy works.
- unixfg, on 06/01/2009, -0/+7Ida, you actually believe that water could have a 'memory' and the same effect as the stuff that WAS in it as long as you shake it after diluting it?
- sensor, on 06/01/2009, -2/+9"Right now, we don't have enough comprehensive evidence to make an assertion"
Yes we do: Homeopathy doesn't work. - prompel, on 06/01/2009, -0/+7But it still contains Oliver Cromwell's piss.
"Scientists have calculated that in each glass of water we drink, at least one molecule has passed through the bladder of Oliver Cromwell".
http://www.richarddawkins.net/forum/viewtopic.php? ... - charlietuna, on 06/01/2009, -3/+10Classic prove I'm wrong Area 51/Roswell reasoning. You're not wrong, there is simply little peer reviewed scientific evidence that you are right.
Nice long essay though. - lordmike, on 06/01/2009, -0/+7It's important to note that Homeopathy does not mean "alternative medicine" or naturopathy.... Homeopathy is basically giving water to people and hoping they get better. That is a lot different than using herbs or natural treatments, since those actually involve "treating" something...
I just want to make sure that people don't view this as an attack on alternative medicine as a whole... just a subset of it that is nothing more than a scientific crock.... - inactive, on 06/01/2009, -1/+8The problem is, as this thread shows, that 99% of people who believe that homeopathy works don't even know what the heck it is. They think it has something to do with magical herbs or something.
99% of people also think that chiropractic is a fancy word for physical therapy. - tieInterceptor, on 06/01/2009, -1/+8"those basic things it does well" are placebo cures.
same thing as giving a sugar pill to a patient... if he believes it's a miracle cure, he will feel better for a while.
placebo is a powerful self deception, but it does not cure anything. Just makes the wait to get naturally feel shorter.
Just like playing computer games helps burn victims tolerate the pain of removing the bandages, if your brain is distracted or wants to believe something makes you better, it will feel better ... for a while, until the placebo effect goes away. - LilJimmyNordin, on 06/01/2009, -0/+6I don't know if that's true or it's not, but SOMEONE'S making money off of it. Get to those people and you're at the heart of the beast.
- unixfg, on 06/01/2009, -0/+6In what city will you be practicing?
- schmidt349, on 06/01/2009, -0/+6There's nothing in a standard homeopathic dilution except water. You are essentially saying water is a cure-all, which it is not. We are not making moral judgements here, we are saying that allopathy is far, far more likely to get you better than homeopathy. If you choose to read that as "condemnation" then whatever.
- tigertiger, on 06/01/2009, -2/+8No, it doesn't. It doesn't clear up warts any more than it cures diseases. Homeopathy is ***** and you're a moron if you believe it.
- charlietuna, on 06/01/2009, -0/+6Take *THAT* Oprah!
- inactive, on 06/01/2009, -0/+6Yes, because an expensive drug that works is nowhere near as good as a cheap one that does not.
- Exilon, on 06/01/2009, -1/+6Unfortunately, there is paucity of evidence-based recommendations using homeopathic remedies in these conditions.
Now go away. - spook69, on 06/01/2009, -0/+5Once again, homeopathy is not synonymous with natural medicine. Homeopathy works 0% of the time because there are no active ingredients entering the body, and any benefit from the use of homeopathic medicine comes from a placebo effect.
You don't seem to understand that when somebody is too poor to pay for traditional medicine, charging them money for sugar pills is especially heinous since it represents a larger part of their income that's going toward a BS treatment. If you still don't understand how condemning homeopathy is different than condemning natural medicine, then I suggest you do some research to clarify the distinction between those terms. - smemily, on 06/01/2009, -2/+7Uh huh, does it contain any active ingredient by the FDA's definition?
- philcolby, on 06/01/2009, -1/+6Let's recognize it for what it is, the powerful effect of placebo, which has documented benefits in certain situations. As a practicing physician, in my opinion, there is no scientific basis for the direct pharmacologic utility of homeopathic remedies. But pour some water or alcohol in a bottle, slap on a label, and tell someone of its miraculous curative powers, and you may be surprised to see an effect, albeit an indirect one.
- halleyscomet, on 06/01/2009, -0/+5You might want to learn what terms actually mean before you run around defending quackery, thinking' it's the same thing as herbal medicine.
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