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- LordSkywalker, on 10/12/2007, -4/+33For the low, low cost of $2,074. Awesome!
But on a serious note, this is exactly why I play mostly console games despite loving PC gaming. I can't stand it that the "high-end" setup I got in late '04 for Half-Life 2 is now "old and busted". I try playing Dark Messiah or Company of Heroes and find out I've gotta upgrade unless I want to run them at hideously low quality. - Satanael, on 10/12/2007, -1/+22I long for the day when news articles are restricted to one page only.
- sandfish, on 10/12/2007, -4/+23@jerigo
The power supply is actually the most important component in a computer. You should always invest in a well built, efficient power supply. - alexcurpas, on 10/12/2007, -0/+11I wish Diggers would like to the print version directly ... I know the website will lose add revenue this way, but multiple page articles are annoying.
- ZeroG52, on 10/12/2007, -0/+11$2000 is a "budget" gaming setup?
- Grimdotdotdot, on 10/12/2007, -3/+14You give a ***** about the power supply, or you should if you want your PC to keep running.
- Rickler, on 10/12/2007, -6/+15"You should always invest in a well built, efficient power supply."
That being said, chances are that your 200+ dollar PSU is just a rebranded 50 dollar PSU. - vexter, on 10/12/2007, -9/+18Yea, but consoles look HORRIBLE compared too PC, even with an HDTV and a 360. And a HDTV is 600 bucks at least, so that evens the cost considerable. Plus PCs can do so much more. Its really a silly position. PC games right now look better then anything you will ever see on your 360, and it only gets better.
- MrBabyMan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8Click the 'Print Article' link on the first page for a one-page format.
- Shivetya, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8Well as typical the these sites tend to go to overkill with their base systems. I guess they have to get revenue somehow and they do that by including every name brand component they can.
Don't know about Intel motherboards but on the AMD side a Nvidia6150 based chipset has great sound built in as does any good motherboard these days. 650w power supply? For what? SLI doesn't require that much. Just over kill. The case selected isn't the best option let alone the cheapest. Corsair? Who gives a rats ass, good memory is easy to find and the difference in timings is only noticable by a performance program. Also, don't forget they include the cost of the monitor in the mix... - Vwise, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9The Parts
Intel Core 2 Duo E6600
ASUS P5NSLI
Corsair TwinX 2048MB PC2-6400
2 x PNY 7900 GS 256MB
Creative X-Fi XtremeGamer
Seagate 7200.10 320GB SATA
Lite-On SHM-165H6S DVD+/- DL
Antec Super Lanboy
Antec Trio 650W
Logitech G11
Logitech G5
Logitech Z4 or Sennheiser PC-165
Viewsonic VX2235VM
Total $2,074 - TellarHK, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8DX10 won't be a big issue for a year or so at the most. Sure, it is the 'New Hotness' with Windows Vista coming out, but there's a pretty simple little paradox that's going to happen with DX10/Vista.
Vista will be the only OS that supports DX10.
DX10 games will not be backwards compatible with DX9 systems without adding a whole new layer of programming complexity.
DX10 cards are still not on the market.
Three things need to happen for the DX10 shift to really take effect:
1. Vista's installed user base among gamers needs to become a significant statistic. With Vista being harder to pirate, and the "cheap" versions of Vista being almost considered crippleware, you're going to see a slower uptake among gamers. Because, let's face it, most hardcore gamers that aren't getting a whole new system aren't likely to be paying for Vista unless...
2. There needs to be a video game that requires DX10. And Halo 2 just doesn't cut it, no matter what they tack on. Sure, there'll be some die hards that will bend over backwards (and forwards, for the Bill Gates Cash C***) in order to play their beloved Halo 2 on the PC - but most gamers bought and played it already, and to death, on the Xbox or 360. It might be nice to play a version of the game without horrible texture pop, but is it worth buying a new OS for $200, the game again for $60, and...
3. There aren't any DX10 video cards yet. Sure, they're in the pipeline. We all know they're on the way, but have any samples been sent to reviewers? Have DX10 cards even been hinted at as far as a timeframe? If so, someone please point me to where because I haven't found them yet.
It'll take all three of those conditions being fulfilled before the whole idea of DX10 takes hold. Vista adoption and cards are going to have to come first for obvious reasons, but without games there's no real incentive to give a damn about either of those. My suggestion is to take a lesson from Valve Software when it comes to thinking about your system needs.
Valve did an amazing thing by keeping the Source engine capable of running on some seriously low-end hardware. Half-Life 2 scales down insanely low, to levels that don't even come up as "low-end" gaming rigs these days, and because of this, they've got a broader slice of the market to sell to. Higher requirements equals lower sales and lower customer satisfaction since some people will just be pushed out of the loop altogether.
Personally, I'm shopping for a new $200-250 card within the next week or three. I thought about waiting for DX10 but it just doesn't make any sense at all yet. The $200 I spend now will go further with all the games I'm likely to play for at least the next year or two. It would really surprise me if there are any killer non-Microsoft games that come out DX10 only before the end of 2007. - riverside71, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Ok who's the target audience here? $1500 'budget' rigs?
How about my $700 AR budget rig made from scratch:
E6300 @ 3.2GHz - $175
GA-965P-DS3 - $144
Patriot 2GB DDR2/667 - $170
WD 250GB SATA-II - $61
ULTRA X-Finity 500W - $15
GeForce 7600GT - $120
Antec Super Lanboy - $15 - vexter, on 10/12/2007, -4/+10ANY person who knows about computers.
- Waredgo, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Yeah, that's if you want to build it FROM SCRATCH. Most people who would want a serious gaming rig already have many components that they had in the previous gaming rig. That would lower the cost of the list above considerably.
- TellarHK, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5People are just confused because of DX10's method of backwards compatibility and the lack of DX10 support being ported to XP. And remember, most gamers don't really know the industry as well as they just know they want the latest thing.
- Rickler, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5There is no such thing as a low cost SLI rig.
SLI is a scam; it sucks up cpu ussage; double the cost; double the power consumption. - pathy, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5No, they won't. Not at all useless.
THey're still going to run DX9 games, and if you think game designers are going to up and drop DX9, think again. You won't be running everything on everything high, but that only applies if you're going to go for the high end.
Why people think DX10 means No DX9, I have no idea.
Games still support DX8 for christ sake. - Nistavar, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4You should still wait, since the new cards are going to be considerably more powerful...for a price of course. Well at least thats what I am going to do, and would advise others to do.
- brendanc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3You guys are quite misguided. One of the parent posters is absolutely correct to say that you should invest in a good, efficient PSU.
First of all, If you buy from a GOOD brand, for example, Enermax, who actually uses quality components, then you will get your money's worth. Antec is a big brand, but I wouldn't trust the quality of their PSU's because they are so big. PCP&C probably have the best consumer accessible PSU's available.
The big deal about "quality" PSU's is the 12v Rails. Many cheap power supplies will boast "30A" or something similar, but it usually occurs in such a fashion that one 12v rail is 20A, and the other is 10A, making the second rail effectively useless. The difference in rail ratings is how much each side of the PSU's circuit can handle load wise. A good PSU will have 2 or 3 20A or higher rails, which provides a very even power distribution to ensure that no particular circuit gets overloaded--unless you daisychain everything off of one cable, which is also a horrible idea-- try to utilize as many plugs on your PSU as possible without using splitters or extensions.
In the end, the PSU is probably by far the most worthwhile investment in your computer. A high quality PSU ensures that:
a) your motherboard will have a much lower chance of being affected by power surges, spikes, or outages, preventing your circuitry from being toasted.
b) your graphics card(s), hard drives, optical drives, and other peripherals connected to the PSU directly do not suffer from the same problems above
and c) that you will not have any problems with load on your computer; a poorly constructed powersupply can cause OS level crashes because of inability of hardware to perform at an optimum level
Also look into buying a UPS (uninterupted power supply) to prevent your computer turning off in a power outage and also providing an extra layer of protection from shorts and surges. - Ciantic, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4"You should always invest in a well built, efficient power supply."
I don't agree either, If your computer keeps running then the power supply is enough, thats all it does. So I've always bought the most silent you can get for ~50-75EUR price rate and has always worked like (not mine ;)) a charm, no needs to use extra bucks on PSU. - jeriqo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2We are comparing video cards, right ?
- saggygrandma, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3I made the decision to go dual 7900gs for bf2142, which it doesnt play well in sli as other games,
I would recommend anyone wait for the nex nvidia dx10 card to come out in several weeks.. - Slovenian6474, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Consider it's an SLI system with 2 $200ish video cards, knock $200 for the non-sli system....$1800. Budget system!? Wish i had enough money that a $2k system was a budget system.
- Stevethegreat, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3You can always buy a DX10 card to play DX9 games since they will be a lot more powerful than anything that exists today. I'm wondering if the 64 shaders of R600 and the 128 shaders of G80 are saying to you anything. I mean if these new cards utilize the power they announced they will have, these little beasts will eat alive any DX9 game in the highest possible settings, while they will DX10-ready.
I'm personally waiting another 3 months before buying a new card. Whatever I can buy today it would be obsolete in 3 months time since with the same money I would buy sth 2 times more powerful, for me 3 months waiting is not that of a hurdle - Slovenian6474, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@LordSkywalker
Your highend 2yr old machine is now "old and busted"!? I built my MID-highend for about $1000 2 yrs ago and it plays company of heros just fine! I haven't tried dark messiah so can't tell ya how it runs that. - SirNuke, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2You can get a 7950GT for less than $300 (check newegg), which is probably the best price per performance deal right now (in video cards). I'm not sure how that compares to two 7900GS, but still a better card for a budget machine. For people wanting new machines, I'd wait for the quad core CPUs to come out. Even if they are prohibitively expensive at launch, they will drive the price of single and dual core CPUs down.
$1800 isn't budget, though their machine includes a very nice monitor and speakers. - dewfish, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1good comment. the one in the article is very overpriced for a "budget" rig. you showed you dont have to pay an arm and a leg for a self-built computer. Sometimes i wish I could vote for a comment twice. wheres DIEBOLD when you need them?
- pathy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2...Not exactly low cost when you're buying high end components, and building the entire PC.
Granted, it's an SLi system, but you could really trim down the price by going for some lower end components, although I suppose that wasn't the objective for this test. - tektalk, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1homebrewing comps are fun, paying for some high end vid-card is rewarding but sucks when you get the bill.
i got an nvidia Geforce 6800 XFX card and it runs quake 4 ok, only serious hardcore gamers get the cards, if you suck balls at games consider high end vid-cards not worth much of you're investment unless you just like to show off. - Slovenian6474, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Even with that system right there, switch the video card for a high end 7950 GX2, add $400 and you're beating their $1500 system with a single card(sorta) $1100 system!
- dbr_onix, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Nearly All"? 2 Were around when the PC was made (CoD2 and San Andreas). Medieval : Total War was out years ago, Medieval 2 : Total War, how ever, was not
http://www.totalwar.com/?lang=en - I'm not sure it's been released yet, the demo is out though.
Anyway, the games I listed were hardly the point. I can play new games fine, without a $1500 "budget SLI rig"
- Ben - jeriqo, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2"by sandfish 9 hours ago
+ 19 diggs
@jerigo
The power supply is actually the most important component in a computer. You should always invest in a well built, efficient power supply."
19 diggs, 19 dumb asses.
How did you test your power supply ?
It's only important for analog audio. - salinemist, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I once paid $2500 for a 60mhz Pentium with 8mb of RAM.
- dacheetah, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2@LordSkywalker:
"I can't stand it that the "high-end" setup I got in late '04 for Half-Life 2 is now "old and busted". I try playing Dark Messiah or Company of Heroes and find out I've gotta upgrade unless I want to run them at hideously low quality."
My year old, low end laptop (~US$620, AMD Sempron Mobile with a Radeon Xpress 200M (Which shares system memory) is definately not intended as a hardcore gaming machine, hell it struggles with Q3 based games at it's native res (1280x768).
It can still play Company of Heroes at about the quality I've come to expect from a console, and it perfectly playable most of the time, unless you use the "crab" minesweeping tool on the Sherman tanks.
My desktop that was probably around US$1200 when I put it together in what was probably early '02 and is using a second hand video card is very noticably better for games.
If I had bought a "high-end" desktop (US$2500 or so) in late '04, it would absolutely kick the arse of this laptop, and given the results of playing it here, it should be able to make Company of Heroes look pretty darn nice. - ICSU, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2RTFA
2 cards for $400 are almost as good as (and in some benchamrks better than) a $550 card. - funkspiel, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Nvidia G80 launch set for November 8
http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=35310 - TellarHK, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1The problem is that without seeing cards on the shelves now, you have no way of knowing what the price-performance is going to run. And I strongly suspect that it's going to be skewed in favor of price. There's a huge difference between 'outdated' and 'obsolete'. If you look at the last three generations of ATI cards for example.
The Radeon X800 Pro was double the power of the 9800 Pro. And the X1800 Pro looks to be about double the power of the X800 Pro. When the X1800 launched it was about twice the price of the X800. I don't see DX10 cards breaking that mold of pricing. Don't decide based on DX10, buy based on a card that doubles your power for double the cost of the current generation, because that's how the trend has gone.
DX10 won't matter for at least a year. - jmke, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3it is NEVER a good deal to invest in SLI/Crossfire, unless you buy the TOP of the range GFX card right away, in SLI/CF.
money wasted on 2 mid-range cards to equal 1 high end card for the same cost, is a bad idea, in best case scenario you get similar performance to the single card, however overclocking is more limited, it's noisier, uses more power, and you are stuck in the upgrade path;
SLI/CF and "value" don't mix. - MetaDFF, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2Apparently there is:
http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=35110
But it's from the inquirer so you have to take it with a grain of salt. - alexcurpas, on 10/12/2007, -5/+5No, your comments are incredible!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+4"In the last week I've played Company of Heros ("Unoptimized" demo), Medieval 2: Total War demo, Battlefield 2142, San Andreas, CoD2..."
Almost all of these games were originally released at around the time you bought your PC in the first place (Medieval 2, San Andreas, CoD2), and you wonder why it seems to run these games without any problems?
Well, hell, my old Pentium 200 MHz computer can still run Quake 1, Starcraft, and Half-Life 1 reasonably well! That must mean it's good for games, right? - Slovenian6474, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Depends on what you considered a good power supply. I wouldn't buy a random $40 PSU, but i also wouldn't recommend a $200 PSU unless you've got money to blow on bragging rights. I usually gravitate towards the quality $80-120 range.
- markcrules, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2isn't there going to be a version of DirectX for XP called DX9L or something that to all intents and purposes is DX10? If this is true I am going to wait for a DX10 card and run XP for the foreseeable future.
- iamshades, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1analog audio wtf?
seriously go shoot yourself. - iamshades, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0uhmm yeahhhh compare $2k SLI system to $6k SLI system, a $200 gfx card is a decent one, the highest I've seen them is $700. I've built a few high end $6k machines for dedicated gamers. $2k is a bargain.
- iamshades, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0if you're building a budget high end pc why would you use low end parts?
***** - iamshades, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0any one who wants a SERIOUS gaming rig doesnt use old parts from their old pc, thats called a CHEAP 'gaming' rig used for cs or hl.
- justice7, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2this is why i bought a 360 instead of a new video card
360 + a couple games < high end pc video
plus i already have a plasma hdtv so it made sense. - dbr_onix, on 10/12/2007, -6/+3I have a P4 2.8GHz, 1GB of RAM (Stuff out of PC World that would fit, nothing fancy), and I used to have a GeForce FX 5600, which I changed to an ATI Readon 9550 (Saw a cheap one and bought it).
The computer is several years old (Around 3, though I'm not sure), but it still runs nearly all games I want fine - In the last week I've played Company of Heros ("Unoptimized" demo), Medieval 2: Total War demo, Battlefield 2142, San Andreas, CoD2, and some others. They are all perfectly playable, most are around medium settings - Sure, the games will be slow on the super-highest setting, but I really don't care, aslong as they don't look too bad, and they run without random freezing, it's still fun..
I've never seen the point in SLI cards, nearly all games are designed to run on one video card, and unless you have an excessively fast computer, there will be other bottlenecks that will slow the game down more than SLI will speed it up (I.e it'd make more sense to upgade your harddrives, memory etc than shoving another graphics card in).
But, then again, thats just me, who is perfectly happy to play games on low/medium settings..
- Ben -
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