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- GoingPostal, on 11/21/2007, -0/+30You better hope AMD does well and survives. Intel's CPU prices were sky high before they had any real competition.
- kcchan1, on 11/21/2007, -2/+28Don't forget that AMD/ATI powers the graphics behind the Wii and the Xbox 360. Judging by how they're selling, AMD should be making a pretty decent amount cash from those sales.
- pinetree, on 11/21/2007, -2/+28I felt the same way until a couple of months ago, when ATI completely changed their attitude toward Linux:
http://lwn.net/Articles/248227/ - cynic573, on 11/21/2007, -0/+11So THAT'S step 2...
- Daiken, on 11/21/2007, -4/+14And it also costs over $1000. For the pricing, AMD is not too bad, but it does need to improve still. Chip design is tough work and usually they don't know how well the chip will perform until it's been manufactured. Intel has just come up with a good design and they're going to continue sitting on it for a few years making only small modifications until AMD can out engineer them.
- sanman, on 11/21/2007, -1/+11The AMD-Intel balance swings back and forth like a pendulum, or like the economy.
Intel has the larger market penetration and thus the larger resources, but after awhile their success goes to their head, they slack off on the product offering, and then plucky AMD comes from behind with some innovative engineering. Intel starts to feel the pinch, gets on the ball to redesign their chips, and then hands AMD their ass.
If AMD hadn't hit Intel hard before, then you know there wouldn't have been the Core 2 redesign. Likewise, with the speed crown again in Intel's hands, you know they'll get lazy again sooner or later. I'm hoping that AMD's Fusion chip will be a big comeback for them in 2009. I don't see what the rival offering is from Intel there. - schnikies79, on 11/21/2007, -2/+12If you're going to make a comment, at least be informed. What pinetree says is exactly right.
AMD is fully opening up their products. What they are allowed to anyway. - smokeydbear, on 11/21/2007, -1/+10May I suggest a "Don't give up on AMD/ATI" sign?
- Daiken, on 11/21/2007, -1/+10From what I've read 3870 is better than the 8800 gts.
- Uchikoma, on 11/21/2007, -1/+8I wouldn't give up on ATI yet. While history has shown that they absolutely blow when it comes to Linux, recent developments are, at the least, very interesting. (at best? ATI > Nvidia in the linux/oss ring) Specifically, they are hiring more linux developers, and releasing some developers from NDA's (who were previously out on NDA). For those interested in the OSS development, there should be a r500 (dri?) branch now in the radeon driver (read: not the radeonhd driver in dev by the guys over at SUSE) and randr.
Finally? Official AMD rep is actually talking to the common joe (Phoronix, forum name is Bridgman) about the OSS effort with regards to ati linux drivers.
So, I wouldn't count them completely down for the count. I'd give them the benefit of the doubt. - whyufail, on 11/21/2007, -0/+7I found myself ultimately torn by the merger because while I have always favored AMD for their processors, I have always preferred Nvidia for my GPU. Ati and Intel have never sat well with me.
- KewlerKid3, on 11/21/2007, -17/+24Intel is kicking their ass. Their newest processor slaughters AMD's
- inactive, on 11/21/2007, -1/+7which is what they have usually done in the past, its just been a bad year since core 2 pwns
- iofthestorm, on 11/21/2007, -0/+6And voila:
8800GT on newegg (note that the lowest price is $300): http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Sub ...
3870 on newegg (note that they are all priced at $219, although they are also all sold out even though ATI made a lot more of them than nVidia made 8800GTs): http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Sub ... - muniak, on 11/21/2007, -0/+5No, step two will always remain unknown; I think hes just making it up. :(
- iofthestorm, on 11/21/2007, -0/+5Umm, but the 8800GT is in short supply and actually selling for much higher than the MSRP of $250, whereas the 3870 is still selling around the MSRP of $220.
- systemghost, on 11/22/2007, -0/+4Basically the short of the long of the article: "AMD and ATI need to do better because they could do better if they did better."
- hydroplane, on 11/21/2007, -1/+5 They may not score as high in some performance tests, but in my experience AMD/ATI has operated with less quirks than their intel/nvidea counterparts.
- iofthestorm, on 11/21/2007, -0/+4Nah, around 90% of the GT which is almost as fast as the GTX from the reviews I've seen. Either way, two of them should be able to hold their own against a single GTX.
- Tenoq, on 11/21/2007, -0/+4Haha - read the release notes for an nVidia driver recently? It's pages and pages of glitches. :p
- roberpb0270, on 11/21/2007, -0/+4I built a rig just this past year based around AMD and ATi and I'm ecstatic that they've released all this new stuff and hope beyond hope that they don't die, not yet. I can't wait to throw a 3870 and phenom inside and enjoy the speed boost, a X1950 and 4600+ should improve at least some. right?
- iofthestorm, on 11/21/2007, -0/+4Oops, I guess when you sort by price newegg puts the out of stock ones at the bottom. But still, the lowest price for one that's out of stock is $269 which is $50 more than the 3870. Not fairly close by any means.
- Daiken, on 11/21/2007, -1/+4Yep, big improvement. It's also one of the advantages people forget about going with AMD. The new line of chips are all compatible with the old am2 sockets, meaning no buying a new motherboard. Where as for Intel, not only do you have to spend a premium for the Intel brand, but you also gotta shell out more money for a decent motherboard.
- GrizzlyWG, on 11/21/2007, -0/+3sidenote: New drivers for ATI cards today for download
- iofthestorm, on 11/21/2007, -1/+4Umm, you can? Unless you mean an intel chipset board, but nVidia does make SLI chipsets for Intel as well as AMD. They have been that way for a long time now. nVidia only started out with AMD SLI chipsets at first because back then AMD was the processor of choice for gamers.
- sirmo, on 11/21/2007, -0/+3AMD has traditionally always been better as far as power consumption is concerned in the mainstream desktop/server CPUs. Not until Core Duo did Intel finally come out with an energy efficient CPU. And even then many testers don't consider that Athlon CPUs have a memory controller on the CPU die. And as far as 3870 is concerned it consumes less power than the nVidia 8800 GT.
Personally I've been looking into getting 8800 GT however given the attractive price and low power consumption I may go with a 3870 instead. - Tenoq, on 11/21/2007, -2/+5*****. AMD has been running cooler than Intel since the Athlon XP. What have you been smoking? Or are you not REALLY an IT person? :p
- UnWeave, on 11/21/2007, -0/+3Yeah, well you just write that out and send it to them, we should expect results within months. It's clearly where they have been going wrong.
- iofthestorm, on 11/21/2007, -0/+2The RV670 is just a die shrink of the R600 core. Performance is the same as the 2900 series, except better in a few cases but power consumption and heat are now halved. Price is also halved. Now you can get two 3870s in crossfire for much less than the price of an 8800GTX/Ultra and I'm almost certain you'll get better performance, since if a single 3870 gets maybe 80-90% the performance of a 8800GTX, two should at the very least match up to if not beat the 8800GTX.
- iofthestorm, on 11/21/2007, -1/+3Uhh, 3Ghz by summer '08? I think they need to hit 3Ghz by early '08 to even begin to compete with C2Quad. Although I have a feeling the unlocked chips are going to be great overclockers, so people might be able to hit 3ghz easy with the unlocked ones and go even higher with water cooling. The new Windows overclocking tools look great, and they seem to actually work, so AMD may be in a position to take back some market share in the enthusiast/overclocker market. Of course, the real overclockers will continue to use the BIOS anyway but the new software could open up overclocking to a whole new group of gamers.
- rune420, on 11/21/2007, -1/+3If AMD/ATI is gonna make a comeback, this might be a good time to get into their stock. If they could just get back to where AMD was early '06 that could mean a nearly 400% return from todays quotes.
- iofthestorm, on 11/21/2007, -0/+2Yes but nVidia makes intel chipsets too, and nVidia generally seems to make the best chipsets for gaming performance so I don't know why you wouldn't just get an nVidia chipset intel motherboard if you wanted to SLI. Also I think there might have been a hack to do SLI on intel chipsets but I'm not positive. I see what you mean though.
- Breepee, on 11/21/2007, -0/+2Well, lets be honest for a second: NVdia's Linux drivers are and will be for the time being be the best there are. I really like AMD/ATi as a company, and choose them over Intel/Nvidia anyday, they just do have some problem. Ati is shaping up in the Linuxdriver department, but are a long way from Nvidia.
As far as the CPU's go: maybe we have reached to point chips don't really matter anymore. 100 euro buys you a damn fine chip which can do anything you can think of. Perhaps some hardcore gamers or researchers will want to pinch the last drop of performance out of their PC, but come on. The dualcore 2.5GHz AMD you can get for 100 euro is a damn fine chip. - UnWeave, on 11/21/2007, -0/+2Well if AMD can keep it going, when they get to a point where they really aren't much of a competition for Intel (IF it gets that bad), and Intel jack the prices, people might turn to AMD again. Of course, that assumes that they will be able to keep the ingenuity with a lower budget... Far easier said than done.
- SleepingOrange, on 11/21/2007, -0/+2Welll... from all I've heard and read, it's actually a mixed bag.
In most cases, the 8800GT is equal to or slightly better than the 3870... The 8800GT also kicks 3870's ass in Crysis, which is a great benchmark piece of software (and oblivion too)
but... the 3870 is far far better than any card lower than the 8800GTS..... Nvidia or ATI.
I have a feeling when the 3870 releases the X2 architecture, it will be right up there. 512MB or greater would help too.
Personally, i'll be sticking with my AMD athlon X2 and a 3870 I think. - Hexogen, on 11/21/2007, -0/+1Most of it is related to the $5 billion acquisition of ATI. But the last quarter they only lost $200 million as opposed to the $400 million and $500 million of the previous 2 quarters. Now with spider, good vid cards, and a mediocre processor, they should be able to increase profits. This claim that AMD is going to go extinct in the near future is bogus.
- flessa, on 11/21/2007, -0/+1"RV670 CPUs"
He meant GPUs. But at any rate, decent article but nothing I didn't already know. - floodyberry, on 11/22/2007, -2/+3AMD didn't hit hard, the P4 was just godawful. AMD was either tied or in the lead all the way from Athlon up to Conroe, but ever since they've been way behind. I can only imagine how much money they're flushing down the toilet just to keep their newest CPUs price competitive with Intel's older chips.
- Daiken, on 11/21/2007, -1/+2Yeah, and they're still lost over a billion dollars this year.
- bilangew, on 11/22/2007, -0/+1P5-233? NOW thats some overclocking skills! :)
Seriously though, this poster probably meant P2-233 (but P1-233 actually exists too, if I remember correctly the difference is more cache added to the processor, or may I say card in this case.)
Anyway, we should be all kissing AMD's ass, otherwise we would be nowhere close speed-wise. - inactive, on 11/22/2007, -0/+1whatever happened to the 3. ??? 4. Profit
It seems to be missing... - inactive, on 11/21/2007, -1/+2powerPC FTW
/s - Arramol, on 11/23/2007, -0/+1The drivers for my GeForce 6600GT have been giving me absolute fits. Besides having to do things like manually adjust driver settings to get it to properly display at 1680x1050 (the resolution is an option in the Windows display properties, but it doesn't actually render it correctly unless I do some tweaking), it gives me lots of happy fun surprises like arbitrarily ramping up the brightness on all of my videos to make them nearly un-watchable, to the time it garbled my display so badly (without me changing any settings) that I had to boot into safe mode to install new drivers because I couldn't actually see anything in a normal boot up. A bit of Googling reveals I'm not the only one with these problems either....apparently the resolution problem is fairly common.
- Glanzer, on 11/26/2007, -0/+1I've been a great fan of AMD for years, and all the PCs I've bought have been AMD. Even the new one I'm buying today. Unfortunately I've also been a great fan of nVidia for years too, so it's kinda hard for me to cheer for AMD/ATI.
- mister711, on 11/21/2007, -0/+1I must admit that I go for whoever has the best CPU for the price. My first PC that I built was K6-233. It was a bit faster than the equivalent P5-233 MMX but much cheaper. My next one was a Celeron 450 that I overclocked to 750 which beat whatever AMD had at the time. The I went with the P4 1.6 GH overclocked to 2.1 because the chip was $150 and this was before the X2 came out. I would have bought the X2 if I upgraded my machine sooner, but now I went with the quad cord q6600. Sorry AMD, but if it was not for AMD, we would be years behind in technology.
I am however a Nvidia fan. I did start off with the original Voodoo 3d along with my Riva 128. I then went to Voodoo 3 and then I upgraded to Geforce 2 MX and later to Geforce 4 T1 4200. If I were to upgrade now, I would go with 8800 GT. - paker, on 11/22/2007, -0/+1You had to buy a motherboard too, unless you got it free.
- tomz17, on 11/22/2007, -0/+1WRONG... the E2160 IS a core2...
- xrenjrvt, on 11/22/2007, -1/+2The products don't matter when you have such poor managers running the company.
- Uchikoma, on 11/21/2007, -1/+2Linux drivers. They don't offer much except notable except perhaps Linux 2.6.23 (missing 2.6.24) and possible (official?) support for Ubuntu 7.10. I guess that if it means what it appears to mean, then you can use the graphical installer instead of building a distro specific package via the cmd line.
- nakani, on 11/21/2007, -1/+1source?
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