What is Digg?219 Comments
- RadicalBender, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Years ago, when I worked for HP through their territory sales representative program where they put us in CompUSAs and Best Buys to sell their printers, someone asked during a training meeting about all the complaints they received about their low-quality, India-outsourced tech support.
The specific advice (with the "nudge nudge wink wink" that I wasn't supposed to really tell anyone) I was given was to tell people to call the tech support line, but select the Spanish language option. ("Para español, oprima numero dos.") When you got to a human being, just tell them that you actually hit the wrong button and, boom! They always spoke perfect English.
This is because you were connected with HP's Spanish language support (i.e., bilingual) in Houston, not HP's English language support in Bangalore, or wherever it was. - rsgranne, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Both are terrible. I'm the guy who's being jerked around by HP. Read what they've done. If Dell's is worse than that, then I've been completely justified in avoiding Dell for years.
- Mark_H, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4"If Dell's is worse than that, then I've been completely justified in avoiding Dell for years."
Somebody who I knew who had little knowledge in computers had a game for his XP box that was not friendly with his GeForce-3 GPU. He disabled that GPU and was using Dell's onboard one for a short while, but then uninstalled the game and disabled the other GPU...which made the compy go to a black screen when it loaded. He could have put the graphics card's driver CD into the computer and had the computer boot from that CD, then re-installed the drivers (or done a number of other fixes), and everything would have been fine.
Dell told him that he had somehow fried his graphics card and, a couple weeks later, had a technician go and replace the card. It didn't work (Surprise!), and support told him to re-install Windows, which he did.
There are 12 year old kids who would have been able to solve the problem that day in - bob645, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I had a similar experience with an HP laptop. A client of mine wanted me to connect it to the network in her office. I connect the ethernet cable and soon find that windows is not even detecting a NIC. After serveral hours of talking with various reps at HP TS, we decided that it needed to be sent in for repair.
They fed-exed a shipping box and I promply sent them the computer.
The computer arived within a week and still could not detect the NIC.
I repeated this process 3 more times of shipping it back and fourth each time HP claiming it had been repaird.
It wasn't until the fouth time that I noticed a text document and a picture of the tech (or tech's gf) that worked on the laptop saved to the desktop called read this.txt The document informed me that this laptop (even though it has a RJ-45 jack) does not have an ethernet controller. He was nice enough to point out that the card inside the laptop was only a modem, and that I would need to order a different combo NIC/Modem card to make the RJ-45 Jack work.
It is beyond my as to why they could not explain this in the acutal paper letter that accompanied the returned computer explainging the repair the first, second, third, or fourth time.
To make a long story short I got a hold of a supervisor and explaied my frustrations with the company and he offered to reimburse me for the $145 I paid to overnight a NIC/Modem combo card to get me frustarted client up and running.
A week later I received a check from HP for $145. - digitalsin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I can definitely confirm that HP has about the worst tech support in the industry.
I had a very simple problem:
I bought an HP desktop which came with Windows XP HOME (which neither the box nor the descn indicated). I need XP Professional to work on a day to day basis. So the simple solution is to reformat the PC and put XP Pro on it (upgrade would not work). So that is what I did, but my mistake was not collecting a list of hardware information before doing so. XP Pro did not detect any of the hardware, so I called HP to ask about what hardware was installed so I could get the drivers.
Their answer was: "I'm sorry sir but we cannot give out that information".
WHAT?? Its MY machine, I bought it! I asked to speak to a supervisor, and was put on hold for 25 mins. After 25 mins someone hung up. I called back, SAME THING. All I wanted to know was what video card I had, what audio card I had, etc. Finally after 4 hours total, I was rerouted to somone in the US who took 2 minutes to give me the information.
Later on I had another problem where my DVD drive would not burn DVDs even though it had the capability to burn. I called them and explained the problem and said I just need the driver - Windows was just using its standard generic driver which worked fine for reading, but not writing.
I was told that I couldn't get the driver, but I could order a restore CD and restore my computer to factory defaults. So this meant I couldn't use XP Pro on my HP computer AND have a DVD Writer. I tried installing the driver made available for download on HP's site for XP Home, but guess what? The installer had a check to make sure you only used it with XP HOME and not PRO.
HP SUCKS - chriskzoo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3You might find this helpful when contacting tech support and you know what the problem is:
http://blog.thebalrogslair.com/images/dilbert.jpg - smiller329, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I gotta say this shows some bad thoughts on both user end, and on HP's end.
a) If you have to call tech support, jump through their hoops. "Did you boot the computer to the Console Recovery Disk?" Lie: "Yes, I did, and I got a blank screen." "Okay, thank you, we'll ship a new PC to you"
b) The problem started in September, but you WAITED 2 WEEKS to CALL? Dude, Call when it happens, as soon as it happens, and don't get off the phone until you've got something shipping to you.
c) NEVER MENTION SOME OBSCURE LINUX DISK aka Knoppix. Just say, "Yep, there's no display on my monitor, but the green harddisk light is blinking."
d) Don't delay in trying to get your data off the harddisk...no backup? You're fault, and if HP is expecting the machine back, don't wait two weeks before shipping it, and expect it back instantly. - leomyhero, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Averydedog...did you bother to read this article and see what a nightmare he has had??? I think Mr. Granneman has had more than enough patience with HP and has gone above and beyond what most people would even dream of trying to assist in troubleshooting. There is no excuse for this gross incompetence on HP's part.
- lukychmz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I purchased my laptop in October 06. First thing they say my warranty expired at the end of March which is odd for a one year warranty. I recently started having problems with the battery falling out of it. I spoke to customer service and they said they would send out a box. Came on time got shipped to them. They tell me it takes 5 to 7 days for repair. Right now I have been waiting 18 days as they say they are back logged. When I email them to ask for status they do not tell me whats going on. They say they will contact me back and tell me when I will get my computer back but they never do. I have twelve emails from them saying pretty much the exact same thing in every email. I had to ask 4 times to be put in contact with a case manager. When they finally did this I emailed to let them know I would prefer to be contacted by email as I canceled my phone number on record. They said OK but then he emails me and says he tried to call. I call him back and he never returns my call. They say they understand my situation but I honestly dont think they do. I then emailed them and asked to get a contact number at repair center but they said no to that too. I then asked can they just return my laptop to me without repairing it as I need it for school and I am tired of waiting and they just do not answer me no more. Also when they did reply they kept getting my name wrong! I do not know how they get rewards for customer care. I was in contact with a friend who said he has been waiting 12 weeks for his to be fixed
- trogdoor, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2HP customer service is crap, thier printer drivers are crap ( honestly how can you screw up printer drivers on mac and windows ) It will take a lot to ever get me to buy HP again.
- misterpony, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I like how you dropped "Gerald"'s email at the end. That's an awful story and I hope it works out for you. If he gets a few random emails, perhaps "Gerald" will make sure something actually gets done with this. IMO, the singular cause of most tech support problems is the out-sourcing and incompetent customer service reps. HP and anyone else who outsources their call centers obviously do not hold a belief in good customer service. Thus, they are liars and do not deserve our business. What's sad is that everyone is aware of the problem, but they continue to do it.
- bc9am, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1It's interesting to hear what people have to say about Dell vs HP support. I've used them both (in the UK, perhaps in the US its different), but for server support Dell is *MUCH* better. You get to talk to an expert who has the kit within feet of them, if you have any obscure question they will be able to find out for you on the spot. With HP if you call them up you get to speak to a general IT muppet, they usually will never know the answer, and they will then call the 3rd line guys for the answer while you are on hold. You will then get an answer that has been repeated through a few people that doesn't really answer your question.
That all said I still only buy HP servers. Simply because the actual hardware is far more reliable than Dell, and far more standardised. So long as the only conversation you need to have will HP is "this CPQ part number is broken, send me another NOW" you are fine. So long as you can "support" your HP kit in house they are great.
To give you an example of the muppetness of HP support we had a engineer come over to replace a server motherboard (they wouldn't let me do it for some reason), and he spent 30 mins on the phone to his manager trying to remove the "tape drive" (that was actually a standard HP hot-swap hard disk). In the end I had to put him out of his misery. All the Dell engineer on the other hand (or I suppose they are UNISYS or whoever they outsource to these days) are all very knowledgeable and know what they are doing. - burningmonk, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1You know, as overpriced as Alienware's computers are, they have incredible technical support. Best I've ever encountered. I've had a few issues with my old Alienware, and everytime I called in they troubleshooted perfectly. When one of the HD's died, they sent me a new one no questions asked. When the mobo died, I send the whole thing in, got it back in about two weeks, no questions asked. Unfortunately, they are expensive, and the craftsmanship is kind of shoddy.
- sheldonnbbaker, on 03/05/2008, -0/+1Battery failed on my Pavilion - spent 6 hours "troubleshooting" before I was sent a new one under warranty. They get the address wrong - I call to have it changed but am transferred to SEVEN different departments before yelling at them to get it done. Hard drive fails two days after warranty (finally got a hold of one nice guy who gave me a new one for free). After two weeks, still waiting for them to ship it to UPS.
Safe to say I'm getting a Mac so I can enjoy their customer service which is 10x better. - xLiKx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1HP's software and drivers always sucked. No surprise that their customer service is the same.
- Mark_H, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Cut off the rest of my comment...
Finished :
"There are 12 year old kids who would have been able to solve the problem that day in fewer than five minutes. Dell's support is uberly incompetent." - Stark, on 10/12/2007, -0/+15 Comments:
1. Always build your own desktop system. Only encourage others to buy Dells and HPs if you don't want to deal with being "Mr. tech support" (No, I will not fix your computer).
2. If you do have a problem with an OEM desktop, you can diagnose the problem, but then put the computer back together, call support, and act like a complete moron. Do everything they ask. When they ask you to try something, just make noises like you're doing something and say "no, that didn't fix it." Eventually their script will get them to the right solution. Don't try to help them along in the process by telling them what the correct diagnosis is. They will not listen.
3. Don't expect good support two days after Christmas.
4. Never by warranties on desktops.
5. in my experience with a Pavilion notebook with a bad wireless card, HP support did a good job. The guy was American and figured it out (see comment 2). - firehydra2k, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1It's all the ***** outsourcing. We need people trained in the computer field to take on these problems and not people who reads off a script.
***** tech support. Freelance junkies are better people to ask (that's what the open sourced community is for) - zenscope, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Never had trouble with my hp products: desktops, laptop, ipaqs, media receiver, portable DVD writer, printers (obligatory) but then again, i solve problems on my own, and when I need a replacement the return policies and procedures have been straight forward and flawless. Sure, some products are better than others, but I would hardly bash HP without going after Gateway and Dell in the same fight.
HP doesn't have a vendetta against an individual. Everyone has a terrible customer experience somewhere. - twid, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I suggest you contact the HP CEO through the form here:
http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/execteam/email/hurd/
In my experience, CEO contact forms like this really are monitored (not necessarily by the CEO) and you get a quick escalation, especially with a nice web page like what you put together. - rsgranne, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1averydog, I'm a pretty sophisticated user - I teach, write, and consult about technology - so this certainly isn't a case of a dumb-ass caller to HP. I've tried to help them every step of the way, but their systems are so poorly organized, and their help is so incompetent, that it's really been an absolute nightmare.
- leomyhero, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"This guy is stupid, claiming to be an expert, and he bought the extended warenty?!? is he loony? with the mnoney and time wasted on that, he could have easilt popped out the obviously flawed vid card and replace it..."
This comment speaks volumes about it's author...spell/grammar check? I digress, why is it foolish to purchase an extended warranty? The company has clearly not upheld their end of the deal by giving him the run around instead of shipping a new system or repairing the existing one. - weareglass, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This sounds horrible. I've had to call Apple's support numerous times and they are always very knowledgeable and helpful. Sometimes they just start up a conversation with you while you're waiting on a reboot. Consumers should look at the support approval ratings before buying a brand. When last I checked it was Apple #1, Dell #2
- Demagogue, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Also, we all talk about how bad tech support is for people, but think about how hard it is for tech support people. The people they hired are used to fixing the common problems which are in the database and a lot of the time they are the problems and can be solved.
When I have someone call me with a problem its hard to help them because a lot of the time, unless I'm there its hard to diagnose exactly whats wrong.
I honestly think everyone is too hard on tech support people, they have it rough IMO - Audiofan2, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1people in India and Pakistan muct think that those of us in the United States are always pissed off. When in reality it is just the stupid American companies who outsource the complaints.
- Mininday, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1HPs is good on the business side. I never use their phone support anymore though. I use all web based, so I can understand what the hell they are saying.
- Gaiwan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Eh, I've had good experiences with HP Support. I feel bad for the guy but this is no reason to categorize all of HP's support as horrible, unhelpful, and incompetent. It just so happens that this guys particular experience was like that. I think its something like for ever 20 complaints you receive you get 1compliment, you will always hear about the negative situations because people are much more likely to talk about them.
- chriskzoo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Here is a hint in how to handle tech support - tell them what you want and accept no substitutes. Say "Look, I payed $200 for this extended warranty, I don't need to be jacked around wasting my time repeating things for you that I already tested. Send me a shipping container and I'll sen this bitch back."
- dmron, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This is horrible but I think it's atypical. I hate to defend the big evil corporate machine, but I did support for HP (printers, not computers) about 4 years ago. Their policies were pretty fair to the customer, with regard to repair and replacement of broken products. I mean that was a while ago and it was a different department, so a lot could be different nowadays, but back then it seemed HP actually cared about their customers.
- Pxtl, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Buy local. Somewhere in your area there is a little computer shop. It may be full of Asians or Indians (if that bothers you), it may cost a little more, and it may be sleazy. But, if the ***** hits the fan and you've made a deal with them, they'll give you 10x the support from any faceless corp. There's a manager in the building, and the techs actually know their stuff (even if the solution to 90% of the problem is reinstall windows). And it's harder to dismiss you when you're in their store impeding their business.
Buy your computer from a shop if you don't want to build it yourself. - Blitzenn, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1People are dismissing this as an outlier. It's not. I have two HP/Compaq pieces of equipment. I have had to service both and both times it was extremely frustrating trying to deal with support. I would get half way through and it was like the guy I was talking to would completely forget what we had discussed and start over from the beginning. This happened several times during both support calls. It seemed very systematic, an attempt to get one to give up. I have personally decided to not buy any HP/compaq equipment in the near future.
- kkaabboomm, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1to those who say dell's support is bad: their general support might suck (of that i don't know) but their gold support (normally companies that buy in bulk from dell also buy gold support for their IT department to have no hassle) is wonderful. beyond wonderful, actually. gold support people actually tend to assume you know wtf is up (because most of the time it's IT support people calling) and they always ship overnight any part necessary...and if you chose they'll send their guy out and have him replace the part for you the day after you called them. what? the mobo fried within 3 years of you buying it? itll be there tomorrow with a guy who will take the computer apart and replace it for you, no charge (besides the gold service fee you initially paid). note: these are personal experiences, as i've worked in an IT department with gold dell support. you call and get a person within 30 seconds or less. so once again, normal dell support might suck balls, but gold support is the BEST support i've ever encountered.
- tulcas, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1He should try something like this guy:
http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7040 - darkwhisper, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Hp is awfull... they absolutly do nothing... also everyone u speak to is from India or pakistan and they cant understand you and you cant understand them.... never buy an HP computer
- silentauthority, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Okay, guys.
I can say this safely. For the little money more that people would have to pay for computers, they would much rather have americans talk to them than indians. The consumer has to pay 100 bucks or so more, and HP or whatever can build their reputation for good support.
HP is just shooting themself in the foot. - dBLiSS, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This is why I always build my own computer. IF you have a problem with a part, return that part. If something breaks then you can get a new one and you know exactly what is in it. No Restore CD BS, or tech support idiots.
As well, if you screw up your hardware you have no one to blame but yourself. - SoundScape, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Fantastic link. Absolutely Dugg.
I've had problems in the past with IBM, HP and Dell. They all suck beyond belief. - mcsurfer, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0count how many hours of your life was lost to your battle with HP & the Windows OS
you never get that time back
dont be owned - get a mac - oldcyborg, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Thats why I build my own. I am my own tech support, which is about average, but quick.... hehehe Many of HP and Dell machines have no troubles at all, BUT, when you have a problem, you are in a world of *****. You will wait, and wait, and do things you have already done, many times over, and you will NEVER find out, what was wrong to start with, so that it doesn't happen again.....
Learn how to build a computer, if you never build another one, you will know enough to be able to deal with it.
Verizons dsl is better, but it is the same game. I talk to them at least every other month....
Cyborg
yep - duke, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I've had great experiences with HP and their customer service. In fact, the HD on my HP rebranded iPod got hosed recently, and they repaired it and had it sent back to me ahead of schedule (not bad, considering it was over the holidays). After I got the box to send it back, I discovered that my earbuds were broken too, so I packed them and called to let them know. The tech said that the earbuds have a shorter warranty, and weren't still covered, but she said that she would see what she could do for me. Sure enough, brand new earbuds arrived a couple of days ago! W00t! 8^D
Over the past several years I've bought (for myself and others) 8 HP computers, and 7 or 8 HP printers, and I have been very satisfied with each. I can't say the same about a pre-merger Compaq, a Sony VAIO and a Brother printer that I bought.
If you want to talk about suck support, how about waiting over a year for Brother to release XP drivers for an all-in-one (and even then, the drivers only supported printing, not scanning), and waiting for hell to freeze over for a Linux driver (I finally had to hack another driver just to get basic printing)! HP consistently keeps drivers up to date, and is one of very few hardware makers that has drivers for WinXP64. I've never once had a hard time trying to scrounge Linux drivers for an HP product (other than for an onboard Winmodem, but that's to be expected).
I admit it, I love HP. Heck, I won't even use a calculator unless it has RPN. ;) - eblah, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Dell has the worst tech support. They tell people to buy Outlook when the user wants to use Outlook EXPRESS ... they tell them to reinstall Windows when a problem arises. I've had to help someone that had problems with their computer that was a Dell. I've since told people to avoid Dell like a plague. I've had to work on them too .... some of the worst parts that could be put in a computer go into a Dell. Ewwwww
- astral16, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I don't have to read the story to know it's untrue, my hp ipaq rz170 (low-end handheld) was completely replaced one-week before the one year warranty was up. The docking part was just worn out, i didn't treat it very good. I even took it apart several times, i know there was screws missing. And they still replaced it completely. It just sits on my desk unused and brand new.
- tcv2.00, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0This is an unfortunate situation among all the companies. It doesn't seem like anyone provides good product or support anymore. Even if you build your own, you're still restricted by the vendor' production quality and RMA policies. If you buy a hard drive directly from the manufacturer and it dies under warranty, then most companies will require you to send them the hard drive first before you get the "new" one. And I can't tell you how many routers I've seen die quickly and unceremoniously after the warranty expires.
- ayeaye, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Dell >>>>>>>> HP, Emachine, Gateway, etc.
Although Dell's customer service sucks, their products are pretty reliable. Also their warranty service is one of the best. Second day shipping for all warranty parts.
- scutter, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I'll never buy a product from them again. My wife's iPaq abrubtly stopped holding a charge. We sent it in, while it was under warantee, and they claimed that the device had been exposed to water. We are 100% positive that it was not ever exposed to any liquid. They refused to cover it and were rude an obnoxious until I did two things:
1) I asked to see photos of the water damage.
2) I called the local consumer advocate (Clark Howard) and got the name of a person within HP whose job it is to resolve these issues. I sent her an email promptly.
Not sure what did it, but we got a replacement iPaq within a week. In any case, I won't buy another HP product. - stisev, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0My unbelievably bad experiences with Dell.
http://www.notebookforums.com/showthread.php?p=1560622#post1560622
The Inspiron 6000d Samsung screens, which are the majority of i6000d screens shipped and the ONLY screen available for replacement (refurbs) have established issues with brightness, contrast, and light leakage.
Check out my experiences - IceUck, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I bought a Dell system to replace an older Dell system I already had. I couldn't order it *without* XP, even though I already owned more XP licenses than I own computers. I was decomissioning an older Dell with XP Pro on it, and my new computer came with XP Home, so I planned to install XP Pro on the new Dell.
WRONG
As configured, the system came with no floppy drive, and an SATA drive. There was no BIOS support for SATA, and my XP Pro install disk wouldn't recognize the new drives, telling me to load drivers from the non-existant floppy drive.
I don't remember all of the gory details now, but I tried attaching a floppy drive from another computer, slip-streaming the necessary SATA drivers into a copied XP Pro install disk, etc. No matter what I did, there was always something that stopped me. Seemed like you just couldn't get there from here.
This was equally Microsoft's fault, IMHO, but what really bothered me was Dell's insistence that I *HAD* to buy their Dell XP Pro CD if I wanted to run it on my machine. I kept trying to talk to someone to get help doing this, and their answer was always "you need to buy..."
NO I DON'T, GODDAMMIT! When I buy a new car, do I have to leave all of my old music CDs in the old car and buy new ones? All new furniture with my new house? All new food with the new fridge?
I not only own this OS, I own too many copies of this OS, and you make me buy another one every time I buy another computer.
They finally sent me two free copies of their XP Pro CD (they were only supposed to send one, but why suddenly start being efficient now?)
There was no upgrade option when I got it, and I ended up having to wipe the computer and do a complete install (I suspected this would be the eventual outcome, so I hadn't used the computer for the first two months while I called tech support day after day)
After installing from scratch, you get the joy of trying to get all of the other Dell drivers and software reinstalled.
Oh yeah, and they don't ship recovery/reinstall CDs anymore. They just put the data on another HD partition. So if your hard drive should fail or be overwritten... then what?
I used to be a *BIG* fan of Dell. Before that, I used to be a big fan of Compaq.
One by one, the business-heads emphasize profit over quality until they've destroyed the very business they were supposed to be managing. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Send the Whole unit back and say piss on you I want my Money back.... Dont put up w/ it... WOW
- DigitalBrian, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0My monitor from HP once blew, there was a HP service truck outside my home within 2 hours, and at the time they didnt even have a service center in my country, they sent the truck from Germany to Denmark to give me a NEW monitor and take the broken one. I have never heard of any other manufacturer doing that to ANYONE! I love HP
- ChewyBass, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Never had a problem with them. The one time I had to call support I was sent a box and it arrived back when promised and the problem was fixed. I'm now on my 2nd HP and it work great.
-
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