What is Digg?59 Comments
- GergMeister, on 11/20/2008, -2/+33Mythbusters did a good segment on this as well:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dgpsI1MdQI&feature ...
There's more after that, basically showing it's not voodoo. - Chainheart2, on 11/21/2008, -4/+24In all fairness, I'd like to see some experienced monks try firewalking on a long stretch. You know, like Thich Quang Duc, that monk who immolated himself, or the monks who can maintain their body temperature while meditating in freezing temperatures. But then again, it would be difficult to maintain the meditation state while you begin to walk, as you'd lose focus.
Also, I'm not saying there is a supernatural explanation for the state of mind that meditation can achieve, but it certainly does exist. - GeeksSpeakFont, on 11/20/2008, -1/+17well i know what i'll be trying out in my backyard this weekend!
- inactive, on 11/21/2008, -3/+18science>magic
- calebian, on 11/21/2008, -2/+14wow. that sucks for those guys. their whole way of life debunked in one night. back to computer programming i guess...
- Chainheart2, on 11/21/2008, -0/+7The effects meditation can have are extraordinary and well-documented. It makes you want to take it up for yourself after reading about it. It takes great consistency to get good at it, though.
Here's a study by Harvard; it's the one about temperatures I was referring to: http://www.hno.harvard.edu/gazette/2002/04.18/09-t ...
"In 1985, the meditation team made a video of monks drying cold, wet sheets with body heat. They also documented monks spending a winter night on a rocky ledge 15,000 feet high in the Himalayas. The sleep-out took place in February on the night of the winter full moon when temperatures reached zero degrees F. Wearing only woolen or cotton shawls, the monks promptly fell asleep on the rocky ledge, They did not huddle together and the video shows no evidence of shivering. They slept until dawn then walked back to their monastery." - kelly, on 11/21/2008, -0/+6Nobody said anything about this being a God issue.
I know this is digg and all where everybody is a God hater, but you really need to shut up. - m4csrgh3yk3v, on 11/21/2008, -0/+6If it's "mind over matter", let them try hot iron.
- Rndm_Tngnt, on 11/21/2008, -0/+6Data plz?
- Th3Kyle, on 11/21/2008, -1/+7"*****...is this going on TV? What am I going to use to get laid now....?"
- JustJoe4Life, on 11/21/2008, -1/+6Nah, it's *****.
- inhaler, on 11/21/2008, -1/+6There's also the idea that they use hypnosis and enter a deep trance to minimize pain.
The American Journal of Clinical Hypnosis did an article about simulating chemical analgesics with deep hypnosis, oftentimes procuring better pain reduction than said chemical alternatives. Link: http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa4087/is_20 ...
I'm not saying they aren't getting burned. I'm not saying it's supernatural. I'm just saying they might not feel it. - voodoosteve84, on 11/21/2008, -3/+8Science. It's good to be on a winning team.
- voodoosteve84, on 11/21/2008, -1/+5It doesn't look like he's walking on coals in the video.
- reeseboy, on 11/21/2008, -0/+4Your feet callous up. I used to work on the beach 6 days a week barefoot in 95 degree weather (rare days of up to 105) and daytrippers would ask wtf was wrong with me as they would sprint-hop by me on the sand.
That was 3 summers ago and now I am one of the sprinters when I occasionally hit up the beach.
I know its not nearly as extreme as a hot coal... just an example of building up a heat "tolerance" in the form of callouses.
(I also found it soothing to grind my feet on rough pavement then... I am sure I would lose my foot skin today) - mrb4b00, on 11/21/2008, -0/+4Monks also score higher on tests that requires awareness. Yes if you spend all your life training into something, you can achieve the extraordinary.
- Tenetri, on 11/21/2008, -1/+4buried as inaccurate
- inactive, on 11/21/2008, -0/+3either way... why would you want to do it? its not fun, you just walk over hot coals for a few seconds.. like its gotta be a pretty big effort to setup a large pathway of coals just to walk over it a few times. do chicks think this is pretty sexy or something? cos there would be no other reason i can see that anyone would want to do it.
- AstroZombie138, on 11/22/2008, -0/+3I think the firewalking that occurs at seminars, etc. is more about getting people to change their beliefs on what they can do vs. what they can't than having some type of special power.
- OSXpert, on 11/21/2008, -2/+5Through the darkness of future past,
The magician longs to see
Once chants out between two worlds:
Fire, walk with me. - Myztry, on 11/21/2008, -1/+3It's all the rate that heat transfers. The same effect that allows you to pass your hand quickly through a flame without harm.
Though I can't imagine being the first person to try such a thing, without previously seeing someone else do it. - technicolourbob, on 11/21/2008, -0/+2"I just know our current level of science is missing a big part of the picture"
No *****, if we knew everything we wouldn't have any need for the scientific process. - saintgasoline, on 11/22/2008, -0/+2What a classic case of projection. You call the science "smug" and "condescending," yet all the evidence shows the insecurity and smugness coming from yourself as you say things like "How do you explain 100 ***** METERS, bitch?" Show me something analagous to this degree of smugness in the video. I dare you.
And you obviously don't understand science if you think it proclaims itself a "throne of perfect explanation". The whole reason scientists continually test and retest theories and emphasize blinding and randomization is because they realize the fallibility of human reasoning. Science is not absolutist like you find in your silly dogma; it is fallibilist and that is precisely why it is so successful.
What part of the picture is science missing? The problem with your view is that you are incapable of demonstrating in any justifiable, knowable manner what is being missed, and instead you must make appeals to the unknown, in effect arguing from ignorance. Science is the only way to truth simply because any other method would lack any sense of confirmation, justification, and so on.
And as for Scott Bell:
http://www.blazefirewalking.com/newsitem-souls3.ht ...
Bell has been on recorded as previously burning his feet. What happens when you severely burn your feet? You damage the skin and nerve endings, and in effect you won't feel as much sensation in burn tissue. Hence, it isn't a surprise he could walk the fire walk without having to jump off, having previously burned the hell out of his feet. Once again, evidence-based explanations are more plausible.
Bitch. (By the way, I AM being smug, just so know in the future what smugness looks like.) - fenny45, on 11/21/2008, -0/+2That's actually not new. Some patients who for whatever reason can't take analgesics have been able to undergo surgery just by using hypnosis, no drugs.
- AWidgetIHaveNot, on 11/21/2008, -1/+3I've done it. I needed the right state of mind.
The official Guiness world record is 220ft and there are reports of firewalks over 300ft.
http://www.firewalks.ca/Press_Release.html
Whatever, 220ft without being burned is impressive. - disraeligears54, on 11/21/2008, -0/+2I think I just heard the noise of their careers burning up in the coals..
- poet, on 11/21/2008, -0/+2Twin Peaks WTF?
- palehorse864, on 11/21/2008, -0/+2Dude just proved a negative?
- asdffdas1234, on 11/21/2008, -0/+2There are many things that can be done to minimize the heat conductivity further and increase the buffer (thick damp callous, etc). So it is hard to say that 50 ft or any specific length is the absolute maximum, but it is pretty close if all the preparations you have made are just mental.
Then there is always the final cheat, simply get permanently burned and put up a big smile. I bet those 50 ft are what you can do safely without any burn level or maybe 1st degree (heals). - inhaler, on 11/21/2008, -0/+1That's my point: It's been in application for hundreds of years. I'm surprised they didn't mention it on the show though.
- Superc00kie, on 11/21/2008, -1/+2I have, and I didn't get burned, even though I wasn't medidating or any of that new age crap. I did it multiple times, and not even a single first degree burn! Mythbusters tested it with sensors that actually measure the amount of heat you get (thus eliminating the mental part all together) and confirmed it has nothing to do with the "right attitude". It is not a sacred rite, it is common physics. If you believe otherwise I challenge you to walk over a red hot steel plate.
- gixxer600, on 11/21/2008, -0/+1science answer ------> high conductivity =BURN
- saintgasoline, on 11/22/2008, -0/+1I assure you that if you were to examine that woman's feet, you'd see evidence of burns and scarring. Unless what you mean by "without being burned" is that she didn't feel intense levels of pain that caused her to jump off the coals.
- CJArgus, on 11/21/2008, -0/+1I feel bad for the guy that failed at it, even if he was wrong. :(
- saintgasoline, on 11/22/2008, -0/+1Chainheart2, perhaps you should read the article a bit closer. The article essentially admits that the metabolism lowering is not all the different from normal sleep (15% for sleep, 17% for the meditating monks--and the difference of only 2% an be explained by the fact that the sleep percentage is taken from a much larger sample size that would have greater variation than one taken only from a couple of monks). Also, perhaps you missed the part in the article that mentions the monks' "drying of cold sheets" that the researcher himself admits the rooms were not cold enough for a proper test. Basically what has been demonstrated is that meditation is not all that different from sleep-states (surprise, surprise).
Also, to those who are citing those who have walked great distances on coals, obviously there are a number of other evidence-based explanations, such as callouses on the feet, or already existing healed burns, that would eliminate any pain. Or these people could simply have high pain thresholds and continue walking while being burned.
I propose a further test: IF this new age mumbo jumbo is in the mind only, then I submit that a practitioner should be able to lie down (that way you can't complain that they'd "lose focus," chainheart2) on a heated, red-hot metal pad. IF the spiritual mechanism proposed works, then it would matter not if they are walking or lying down for several hours on a red hot, highly conductive material. The reason I propose lying down is because this avoids creating callouses on small surface areas to prevail against hot coals, as anyone burned over that large a surface area would likely die. The test would certainly demonstrate all the monks dying from severe burns, and the world would be a better place having vindicated legitimate science and ridding the world of woo-pushers.
Too bad ethics would prevent such a test. But something less life-threatening and similar in nature would surely make much the same point. - saintgasoline, on 11/22/2008, -0/+1If the mechanism proposed by these new-age firewalkers is true, and the mind-state can prevent burning and pain, then other tests could be done that totally eliminate the soothing factors of having the fire contained to a small surface area, to having the feet in contact with the heat for a few seconds, and so on. I propose that believers find the most masterful practitioner of this sort of meditation, put him in a crematory's incinerator, and see if he comes out without a burn. After all, the mechanism doesn't demand that one be walking, or that the source of heat only meet the feet. Of course, after the master is burned the usual cries will be heard, "Oh, but he wasn't a REAL master, this other guy in India could have done it!" "Oh, his mind-state was probably disrupted by the loud noises inside the incinerator, and if he kept his concentration he totally would have lived." Just face it, if physics predicts you'll get burned, you'll get burned. Physics has a much better track record of predicting and explaining events, so deal with it.
- boombye, on 11/22/2008, -0/+1The first thing I thought of. Brilliant, I was about to post that too...
Believe it or not, I'm new to the series, I got it on DVD in October after watching a couple episodes on Chiller, and it's awesome. - ChinezePanda, on 11/22/2008, -0/+1The redhead is smoking hot!
I watch the show just for her. - headband, on 11/21/2008, -1/+1after mythbusters did it a bunch of my friends tried it (don't worry it wasn't at home)
they followed the directions given my the mythbusters and were fine, they said it was a little hot but not bad - Dystisis, on 11/21/2008, -1/+1I hope people realize the possibility of altering your mind so as to get in the state of not feeling pain is scientifically very possible.
Just seems these guys were pretty lousy. - khandy, on 11/21/2008, -1/+1Oh, i thought it was just an excess amount of alcohol.
- riskybeats, on 11/21/2008, -3/+3Wow those guys are idiots. But I bet I am above naturalistic laws, time to give this a shot.
- lpferris, on 11/21/2008, -4/+4Pssssh..."not voodoo." You of little faith. ;)
Are inside jokes allowed on Digg? We'll let the Bury Brigade decide. - outofmir, on 11/21/2008, -2/+1FIrewalkers are witches!!!!. call Palin's Pastor and send him to Britain.
- jivemasta, on 11/21/2008, -2/+1You could still do it, you would just have to be a manly man and just keep going. It's true that you can teach yourself to block out pain. Just not the physical effects that come after blocking the pain out. These guys are just using physics to their advantage. If they were real about it, and burned their feet enough, they would probably callous enough to do it without getting too burnt.
- AndrewDB, on 11/21/2008, -3/+1Meh. There's nothing to it. I've done it.
- GeezerD, on 11/21/2008, -3/+1So much for Tony Robbins.
- AWidgetIHaveNot, on 11/21/2008, -4/+1Or Scott Bell's Guiness world record of 328ft here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8o_pNN3Ndy0
Certainly not just a case of walking without proper instruction, you would be burned. It requires a a good level of self belief that you won't be burned. - DaftMonk, on 11/21/2008, -5/+2You're right. He's walking on the grit raked out of the coals.
It's not at all a perfect example of the point I'm trying to get across.
Ah, well. You can't have everything. What I'm really trying to say is that science today is missing a big part of the picture, that's all. - skatiespats, on 11/21/2008, -4/+0:) done it, 7 yards straight, no burns... scary for sure, but exciting above all. still - truly think its about the attitude and what you can do in your head... the scientific explanation in the video = not too convincing - I saw other guys walk the same stretch and same pace, who got burnt.
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