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- insinuate, on 10/12/2007, -3/+45Stop.
Grammar Time
Dun dun dun dun - roosterjm2k2, on 10/12/2007, -6/+34I think that come from the awkwardness of refering to a person as "it" and the innaporiatness of referring to an individual as "they"
"he" has become a unisexual representation...unless, of course, you as the femi-nazis... - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+25Since 1990?
- LucasVB, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12I've seen studies and documentaries where this "sense of presence" is explained as a response to low-frequency sounds. You don't know where it comes from (due to the long wavelength), so your brain assumes it's behind and around you.
The documentary was about "hauntings" in a crypt. They detected a low-frequency sound coming from a water flow. They then proceeded to make a experiment in a controlled environment, and everyone was freaked out. It was pretty interesting. - zodieman, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10I sent the link to George @ Coast to Coast. Let's see if he picks it up for tonight's show...
- devindotcom, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10I would describe that as a sort of proprioceptive "deja vu." Imagine if the information about your limbs' positions and statuses was sent twice, or to the wrong area - say, an area concerned with other people's limbs' positions. Sounds kind of ridiculous, but I assure you there are already many connections between those kinds of areas. Interesting phenomenon, though!
- jdb252, on 10/12/2007, -6/+15Notice how the patient said that the shadow person was of indertiminate sex, but when she had the card in her hand she told doctors, "HE doesn't want me to read"... Interesting.
- nlatimer, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9Only if you are what you eat, and your shadow person is too.
- LucasVB, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7How hard is it ty type "duggmirror" over "digg" in the address bar?
http://duggmirror.com/general_sciences/Scientists_Discover_Shadow_Person/ - cobaltgrc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7They talk about 'shadow people' on Coast to Coast AM all the time. Who knew it wasn't just a nutjob theory. Creepy...
- misfit815, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Here's one to chew on... I was diagnosed with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seasonal_Affective_Disorder and first tried Prozac to manage it. After a week, the drug gave me this exact feeling. I presume that, in my particular brain, Prozac decided to affect the synapses dealing with my 'Shadow Person' region. Try explaining that one afterward... "Yeah, uh, doc, it made me paranoid."
It was this experience that convinced me that giving these drugs to kids for ADD/ADHD was not just a bad idea, it was completely insane.
By the way, I tried Lexapro a year later. That attacked the correct region. - b0nb0n, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Does this theory apply to Peter Pan? His shadow has a life of it's own.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -6/+12Peter Pan suffers from a paranoid neurosis of schyzophrenic dementia. In other words, he's an idiot. That led scientists to investigate the actual causes of stupidity and although they didn't get to a solid conclusion, they found that its genetic seed comes from the state of Texas.
- JEmerson, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6The sad thing about it is that the condition has become the swamp gas of the new century. Anything and everything is thrown under its banner, which makes a lot of people rather annoyed to hear any mention of it. But, aside from the hype, it's an amazingly facinating aspect of the human condition.
It's one of those instances where I find myself getting a bit annoyed at people whose underlying philosophy I agree with. As much as I don't believe in most 'spooky stuff', it's hard to not find myself with eyes rolling to the celing whenever this is moved out to explain things taking place under conditions where it wouldn't be viable. Partially just because I hate seeing skepticism tainted by the herds following our human herding instnct instead of logc, and partially for the fact that the condition itself is so...well, dare I say, cool. It's just that rare combo of awesome mythology, history, and science. - yukevster, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5I've never heard of or experienced a 'shadow' before. However, there is this guy who follows me around sometimes and mimcs my every move (even when I use the bathroom which really disturbs me). Could this be related?
- Bassguy, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7This was a really interesting read.
I'd love to find out more. - discobiscuit100, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Anyone who has ever experienced heavy sleep paralysis will be aware of 'old hag syndrome'. This is the feeling of another presence being in the room, usually an evil spirit or entity.
The two most common spirits seen are the old hag/old woman and the shadow man - which relates to this article
I know some of you out there will have encountered sleep paralysis before, and perhaps the shadowy man themselves!!! (makes ghosty noise, wooo)
Linky - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_paralysis - ant71, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Well, considering it was featured in Nature, the world's leading peer reviewed science journal, I think the term quackery may be a little too strong. But then again, what would they know? I'm sure some armchair geek on Digg knows so much more than all of those scientists and editors put together!
- Inbal, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Can you please link to some of those studies/documentaries?
- cobaltgrc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Yeah me too, I bet he'll pick it up if a couple people send it to him.
- zentropa, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4French philosopher Jean Paul Sartre used to describe being followed by several lobsters around the streets of Paris. I wonder if this might explain thta strange little story?
- LucasVB, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4I just remember the exact location of one: http://skepdic.com/infrasound.html
Googling for "ghost infrasound" got a lot of results too. The documentary was on Discovery Channel, so I can't really link to anything. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7They did an experiment on one person and came to this conclusion? Sounds like more quackery to me. The lady sounds like she has the symptoms of new age ***** syndrome to me.
- rezophonic, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Just because the experiment is limited it's automatically "*****"? Sounds like you're drawing conclusions too early, as well...
- Osjpr, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7women are paranoid about being stalked and raped. They've learned by instict well over thousands of years ;) (she would naturally think of it as a he)
- SkeletaLlama, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Dude, that's just your siamese twin.
- EmileVictor, on 10/12/2007, -7/+10I don't know if this is related or not, but the samurai of Japan used to use this skill to their advantage (the prickly haired feeling when someone's behind you) in combat. It is how they got their reputation of having "360 vision".
- bflfab, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Here is the article from Nature.
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v443/n7109/full/443287a.html - oblongmouth, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3This sounds somewhat like Phillip Pullman's idea of the other world in the His Dark Materials books - 'cept the shadow is in the form of an animal & is visible to the person.
Its a lovely concept - OBDriftwood, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3My shadow person is wearing a tin-foil hat and cleaning my handgun collection.
- EmileVictor, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4I should follow up on that by saying that my statement was just hearsay. Might be correct, might not be.
- Jeebugorn, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4can we get a duggmirror to this site? it seems to be down.
- GrayV, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I've certainly experienced the "shadow person" or "old hag" feeling before, after some hefty sleep deprivation, on a number of occasions.
I found that a bit of research and a little bit of understanding took away the "paranoia" effect and just left me with the more physical feeling of self-proximity. I just made up "self-proximity" so if it gets used in a journal I want cash. - Jeebugorn, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3my wife has suffers fro soemthing similar to that. night terrors, not paralysis. sometimes she'll wake up and see this shadow man figure (or sometimes or things, like huge spiders on the wall) at the door and start screaming. i'm sure our neighbors in the next apartment appreciate being woken up by a woman screaming at 2:45 in the morning.
- riffermike, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Good luck. http://www.google.com/search?q=self-proximity
- Lanser84, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I think this is an interesting phenomenon.
In combination with a good imagination has been used to explain many experiences of alien-abduction/experimentation now, and things like experiences with Incubi and Succubi common in centuries past. - maiku00, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I would love to see this if anyone has any more information
- Jeebugorn, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5obviously by asking i didnt know that all i had to do was replace "digg" with "duggmirror" *****
- Inbal, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Read the Wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrasound and this article: http://ghosts.monstrous.com/infrasound.htm, it has some extra information after the story of Vic Tandy that already appeared on Skepdic. I got all the spooky feelings described when I read the "flying Dutchmen" anecdote; suddenly there was a loud, cold blow of wind outside (in a moderately chilly evening until then) and I couldn't get over the feeling that somebody is standing right behind me. What to make of that?...
- AlbinoRaven, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Jean Paul used to also quaff Absethe (green genie) by the buckets. Whoever invented wormwood liquor should have been shot, it's all of the worst parts of being drunk with a LSD high.
- Gholas, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I used to get this feeling while working long hours out in our warehouse. I finally asked one of my co-workers if they had ever seen anything like it before. He responded, "Oh. That's just Shadowman." It was apparently common for people to see "him" while working in that area.
@LucasVB - it could correspond with low-frequency sound. The area was refrigerated and the cooling units would produce a low humming sound. - gormly, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1you should have used:
When I'm in the shower
I'm afraid to wash my hair.
I might open my eyes
and find someone standing there...
I always feel like.. somebodys watchin me... I have no privacy oh oh ohh oh - Lanser84, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Science is about controls and variables.
Repeating an experiment is one nice method of getting at that. In this case it would be a control on the idiosyncracies of this one woman. However, in combination with the neurological things they are doing this is not something to dismiss.
The next step would be stimulating those brain regions (and suppressing others) in other people to see if they can get the same results...or if this woman has other contributing psychological or neurological factors that cause this in her.
The fact that it is one woman does not make it quackery. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I do find the pronoun bit interesting; language is always a bit limiting...
English does actually have a few gender neutral pronouns, they simply have not gained much acceptance and/or fallen out of use
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender-neutral_pronoun#English
Sie and hir are (very very slowly) gaining popularity, as they seem a bit more natural than the alternatives. - AlbinoRaven, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I might have to mention that you'll need more than week of vacation.
In anycase. The hidden thing seems to be dependant on the person. Some people find jesus, others find wombats, others see the dead. My thought is the illusion is superfical, what you hope to find is what is bugging you or just to relax.
First time it was to find my name, second time I was because I needed a break and a reminder. Might go for a third in a couple of years for another reason. But if you are interested, look up spirit quest and pacific northwest. You'll find something on google. - mukashakapaka, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I, personally, am now very interested in experiencing this.
Not to sound stupid or anything, but it just sounds like it would be amazing to experience... - ramallama, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men? "
- OdinEye, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1The paper was published in nature, but the article referenced here was not. It' s likely that the authors of the article took leaps and liberties with the available information.
The cold fact is that this is a single paper about a single woman for whom, when a specific region of the brain was stimulated, described a shadow person. It was repeatable for *her*. There are no studies on other people - no replications. At this point, the information is only accurate when it references *her*.
Any application to other people is speculation at best. - AlbinoRaven, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1One of the fellers before mentioned the idea of samurai 360 vision. Self looking at self. I've read about it in cases of folks whacked out on PCP. Most of the times though they just tend to go crazy and stay that way.
The other mentions I've seen are in the Hagakure. Basically the Samurai guide book. It's not exactly explicit in the how, but it does describe who and what is felt.
Personally, as a right of passage as an aborginal, I've done a spirit quest twice. Basically you go veggie eating for a month, clean out the system, then (supervised to make sure you don't do anything stupid) go into the woods and starve for a couple of days (you drink water when you need it). You mind gets loopy from the lack of food and you feel like something is there and it gets closer until you "see" it.
In my case, a big white crow the size of a big dog, twice. Then you call out, light your fire and someone comes and helps you back to the lodge. Then you try not to throw up while eating food for the first time in four or five days. - AlbinoRaven, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I understood that they did the same thing with high powered magnets placed around the skull. Some of the invitee's had visions of god.
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