What is Digg?30 Comments
- ccrook, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Gates shouldn't be concerned. The drop in graduates will only leave the most dedicated, innovative and passionate students left in the field. All those pricks who rode the wave in the 90's for the money have finally started fleeing.
- dfj225, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I think a lot of the drop in CS students is a result of the .com burst and the news stories about IT jobs being outsourced. I don't really see the drop as a bad thing, coming from the viewpoint that this trend is probably eliminating the people who don't love the field or would just enter it because it seemed "exciting" or lucrative. I don't really think either reason is a good one to enter a field. I wouldn't want a doctor or a lawyer that wasn't dedicated or simply just in the field because they could make a lot of money. I think the same should go for CS.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1And for the moron who said outsourcing is a decline, its not they are just more qualified and cheaper than you. If you were that much more qualified they would hire you. That's the way it goes. Bottom line if you're a good engineer there is work, if your a bad engineer or a subpar one, there is competition.
- jefflundberg, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1OMGLINUXWOAH is correct. One of the main reasons jobs are being outsourced is simple: more educated employees are willing to work for less else ware. The U.S. is going to loose technological superiority (and economic superiority, subsequently) to China and India. China will produce 600,000 engineering graduates next year. India 350,000. Compare that to only 70,000 in the U.S. Add the fact that a typical programmer makes $100k/year in the U.S. In China, an equally educated & skilled programmer makes only $20k/year. If you owned a global company, which would you pick?
People need to stop whining about outsourcing jobs, focus on education, and (once again) create high-value jobs that workers in the rest of the world can't do yet. The alternative is to sit back, complain, and watch U.S. living standards fall as the rest of the world's increase.
/me steps off the soapbox. (Bill Gates is correct) - openglfan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1That's because you outsource us and HP fires 15k of us, you miserable bastard.
- mastershake, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1how are they greedy and you arent
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0He's right to be concerned. Look at this thread. He took computer scientist to mean IT and MCSE, rather than the actual programmers he's speaking of. India is kicking the ***** out of us right now and the American education system is a joke. Want more proof? Just look at how many people attribute this to IT and not to real programming.
- burtts, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0LOL! =D
- Guti, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0What billy you want more people with MCSE?
I think people already fetched the idea that its *****. - ,,|,_, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0We're breeding a generation of 'morans'!
- bryantee, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Good for Bill. Use incentive.
- flash, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0IMHO. Indians are in no way smarter or more qualified than US computer scientists. There are three main qualities about Indians that make them seem like such
good candidate for the IT field. 1) The majority of them who are here on visas are willing to work for cheaper wages in order to get their company to sponsor
them for a visa. (I have several Indian friends in the Comp Sci field that are currently just waiting to jump on the first job offer because they just
graduated and their visas are about to expire) 2) They form a very large network. You should see far a homework assignment/old exams/projects travel in a
university throughout the Indian population. I know this because I have many Indian friends, everyone knows everyone in the Indian population for the most
part, they stick together. Thus of course they probably earn better grades, but this is mostly due to their robust social network. 3) They are more ambitious
than the average American since most of those from overseas come from more impoverished areas. We'll Asians are pretty ambitious as well, but Indians tend to
speak the English language better.
I know the majority of my comments may seem like stereotypes, I'm simply basing this on observations from my college campus. I'm not saying this is true
about ALL Indians, but it is true at least for the most part at this university (which I will not name). - NDFord005, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0To watch the video of this conversation between Bill Gates & Maria Klawe: http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=3563573
It's pretty sad that Bill misunderstood Computer Science for IT but they both bring up very good points throughout the conversation. - bonlebon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0^^^Bullseye dude, your model of the Indians matches with mine, I worked with Indians and they formed a community in the company I worked at, most of them couldn't come with decent solutions to problems but sure they helped each other.
- Ir0n_mE, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Yay, less competition for my future job.
- bonlebon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0In other news there is a growing and healthy workforce of burger flippers with PHDs and BSC in computing sciences. Time to compete with Mc Donalds William.
- nox327, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0
Hahaa Gates is so funny.
People are not becoming Computer scientists because they fear that they will one day train a Indian guy to replace him. Like many people did here in Seattle. Just keep the Indian guys coming, there is plenty of room in my apartments where they make up 50% of the residents.
I have nothing against Indians(they are one of the nicest people i have met), but there is no way in hell that they are smarter than the scientists here. They are cheaper that's about it. - Gringo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I don't know of many Indians that come to America to work in the IT field. From my experiences they work in India at call centers. The advantage for companies like M$ is they pay very low wages, they don't pay benefits, or any kind of social security. In the US they would be paying $20 or more per hour plus all the benefits. In India they work for $20 per day. Greed has gotten the best of them and it makes my day to see them with their balls in a vice.
Hopefully they will bring those jobs back to the US. - BrianHolt, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0It will only get worse. With an increasing global economy we will see more and more of this. DELL used to have great tech support. Since their tech support is outsourced their tech support sucks. If WAL-MART can open as many stores as they want in communist China The U.S. government will allow just about anything. I would not be surprised if company headquarters started moving out of this country to avoid taxes. The ironic thing is that programmers in the U.S. for the most part do not get paid as well as they should in my opinion for the amount of hours programmers put in on a weekly basis. I was a salaried programmer. Boy did that company squeeze
every ounce out of me. - Joe_rigby, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Gates doesn't want more Americans over here that demand high wages with full medical benefits, and he doesn't want Indians over there that work for pennies, he wants Indians over here that work for less, and visas with less time restrictions. I don't remember where the article's at, but wasn't he like talking to George Bush about it or something .. Saying we needed visa reform, or loosening of rules as to how many overseas employees you can have?
- flash, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0If they are so freakin good...why the hell does their tech support suck so much? Tell me that? If that was the case, companies would outsource everything. It't not that they are better engineers...for the most part we use out own engineers...we outsource the "busy work" draw out the plans...send it to them to get it coded. You are getting outsourcing confused with what Bill is trying to accomplish, which is to get more foreign workers into the country by giving out more visas.
- bryantee, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"I have nothing against Indians(they are one of the nicest people i have met), but there is no way in hell that they are smarter than the scientists here. They are cheaper that's about it."
I've seen it just the other way around. There are some Indians that are so brilliant I can't even think straight. - Ixliam, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Maybe because real computer scientists don't use WinDoze
- carlic578, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Since we are talking about outsourcing and Indians check out this video making fun of the topic.
http://www.illwillpress.com/tech.html - burtts, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Both, Well Said!! =D
- sdcdiggs, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Yeah that seems right too, and its not a sterotype, but more of a reality. They speak better english because they were a British colony....
- flash, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0well said. Heh, yall remember the 9 year old kid who got a microsoft certification.
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/07/15/0651245&tid=109&tid=146 - jefflundberg, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0The current issue of Fortune has a good article on the topic: http://www.fortune.com/fortune/subs/article/0,15114,1081269,00.html
- isoprophlex, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0ditto
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