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43 Comments
- OrangeCrush, on 10/12/2007, -9/+27I'm not sure about the whole accuracy of things, New Scientist has an awful knack for over-sensationalizing things and drawing conclusions based on misread or just flat out wrong assumptions.
Oh crap, this is Digg.
Nevermind. Pretty "wooo woooo" wavy lines!!! YAY! ;) - Linkage155, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9Direct Link For Video: http://www.nasa.gov/centers/goddard/mpg/146898main_viz_shiftingall_21.320x240.mpg
*Mirror if possible, server seems to be dieing. - sdbryan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4What do you mean there is not time travel? Of course there is and Einstein predicted it long ago. The catch is that the time travel I refer to is one way. Obviously we all travel into the future but time dilation allows one to travel (without violating basic laws though things like power source and shielding are open questions) into the far future. Take a look at the calculations at this web site: http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/physics/Relativity/SR/rocket.html
(that web site refers to the books Spacetime Physics by Taylor and Wheeler and Gravitation by Misner, Thorne, and Wheeler for a derivation of the basic formulas).
For instance if you had a safe, relativistic rocket capable of constant 1 g acceleration and deceleration you could travel to the Andromeda galaxy in a time that would appear to you to be about 28 years. Since that is 2 million light years away an observer on Earth would see your travel time as over 2 million years (distance traveled at almost but less than light speed). Now you reverse the trip and arrive back on Earth after another 28 years in your reference frame. But it will be over 4 million years later on Earth. Voila, you have traveled 4 million years into the future and all in less than 60 of your own years. That looks like time travel to me and it is in accordance with special and general relativity. As Thorne points out in his book Black Holes & Time Warps this same relativistic rocket could be used to travel billions of years into Earth's future within a human lifetime and always at 1 g acceleration).
The schemes for time travel into the past involve more speculative mechanisms but time travel into the future just requires some heavy duty (and maybe impossible) rocket science. - RFInfection, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Certainly not real: Simulation.
- andy69com, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Wow, very impressing .. looks like a dance ..
- carletonknight, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4I worked on the LIGO project for a while, if in a relatively minor capacity. The animation is actually showing some really neat physics - if you're interested in learning more, I'd suggest starting out by watching the 7:38 minute video "Gravity: Making Waves." It's available online, for free, at http://sciencebulletins.amnh.org/astro/f/gravity.20041101/assets/94/index.php
The animation is quite good, given that it's trying to depict a four-dimensional effect on a two-dimensional computer screen. Also, keep in mind that most scientists really have better things to do than make videos. Videos are really just eye-candy after the science has already been done. - carletonknight, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2The problem is where you find your "external observer." Since the 'system' under observation is the whole universe, you can't really step outside to look in. This is the reason that LIGO has two arms - one arm by itself wouldn't be able to detect anything. By accurately comparing the lengths of two arms they're measuring the transverse stretching/compression of space-time.
You can't really 'ride' a gravity wave. Gravity waves are passing through our bodies all the time, but even a very, VERY strong gravity wave alters the length of your body by less than the diameter of one atomic nucleus.
Jeebugorn - a good answer to your question would require the use of Einstein's general relativity, which needs tensors. I'm going to defer to the literature on this one (since I don't have an intuitive understanding of tensors), but once you work through the math it's pretty clear that space and time are both affected. However, you can't be 'inside' the waves any more than you can be 'inside' an FM radio signal. The waves pass through ordinary (space / matter / people / Howard Stern) at the speed of light. - Auburnate, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Video was cool ... but what was with the zoom out when things were getting interesting ... i.e. when the two black holes were just about to merge?
- valkyries, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4i think its really hard for people (including me) to realize how big this is.... but its pretty interesting at least.
heres a mirror
http://www.netblues.org/users/digg/146898main_viz_shiftingall_21.320x240.mpg - Zjm7891, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5What exists where your brain should be
- carletonknight, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Careful when saying that anything is "the real truth." Expecially when you're going to say things that aren't entirely true.
Time is not locked as an immutable measure of change. That notion went out with the entrance of relativity.
Black holes, as far as humans can 'prove' anything, have been proven to exist. To doubt the existence of black holes, at this point, would be to go against most of known cosmology. However, you're right in that science doesn't 'prove' anything. Anything at all. It just develops progressively better & better theories with better & better evidence.
A black hole's gravitational pull doesn't have units of m/s^2, so you can't say that it's "more than the speed of light" - they can't be compared like that. However, a black hole DOES cause such extreme warping of space-time that light can't escape. - bsoric, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5You were expecting Hollywood CG effects?
- purezero, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4As if black holes colliding would be terribly exciting to watch? It's not like you would see anything in the first place.
Very interesting and cool to watch. - Burgerman851, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Pretty "wooo woooo" wavy lines!!! YAY! ;)
Comment dugg for that last line, OrangeCrush. - simpleid, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1That was a great video, much enjoyed!
- Izzie, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1the other simulation, the ones that can't be shown are also very interesting:
"Some of these choices lead computers to crash because the grid-like system that describes space-time becomes "all twisted up because the grid lines fall on top of each other" " - nurvus, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2i agree with OrangeCrush. i'm not an astrophysicist, but i do think it's nigh impossible for any computer to accurately recreate a black hole collision. just too many factors scientists aren't aware of (and they admit it)
- grenz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1well maybe it's not terribly accurate. Maybe they should have said approximation? Or accurate approximation?
oh well cool "wavy lines" nonetheless - tnvwboy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Blackholes are always worth a digg. Scary and cool at the same time. I wouldn't want to be near enough one blackhole, much less two about to crash together, to observe/record the effects, though I bet they would be something beyond our imaginations. Humans can only dream of ever creating/using the amount of energy that will be released. If anyone thinks humans mean much of anything in the grand scheme of the Universe, they need to look at cosmological events like this.
- newevilmind, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2oh it says black hoLes collide!
I didn't see the L at first.
I thought it was video of my neighbors ex girlfriend and his current girlfriend in another one of their midnight fights out in the street. It really is something though. maybe I'll record it and offer it up on youtube or something sometime. - Jeebugorn, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1how exactly do they know that it affects space-time? would you be able to move to different points in time just by being inside the "waves"? (not trying to be an ass, these are legitimate questions)
- p9s50W5k4GUD2c6, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2Try staring at THAT video in loop mode. Damn - that has a dizzying effect!
- almighty, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Well with my very limited knowledge of the subject. When they speak of space-time they are talking about the 3D universe as we see it as the horizontal axis while time being on the vertical axis. With a reference point they can make calculations on what "may be " possible with the added info of the gravitational forces a black hole would have. This info could be used to bend space-time to move through space-time by "riding" on the gravitational fields.
- 72Nova, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0You're right, but only in certain situations. If there happens to be matter around the black holes, it will certainly be an amazing thing to watch due to such extreme conditions. Matter would be most likely following extremely complex orbitals due to not only one black hole's curvature of space, but two! Black hole mergers are thought to also create extremely high energy X-Ray or Gamma Ray Bursts, which probably wouldn't be too pleasant to be near seeing how they are likely the most luminous events that take place in the current state of the universe.
- innternal, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I can't wait to see one
lolololol - angryredplanet, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0It is supposed that gravity bends space-time. By riding a gravitational wave you would move to different points of space-time or more likely attracted towards the source if you have mass. This effect is relative - you won't notice the movement within the wave but an external observer would.
I think I have that right. Anyone confirm or negate? - TwoSlick, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2It's probably wrong for the article to talk about how accurate it is, when they don't have the real thing to compare against. What they probably mean is that their simulation has high precision.... Which could still be highly precise... but precisely wrong.
- davidirock, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2I can see that some people still believe a few myths
below is the real truth about the matter
time is locked, it is a measure of change. Sorry kids, no time travel.
black holes probably exist, but have not been totally proved.
white holds and worm holes probably do not exist
a black holes gravitational pull is more the the speed of light (thus the photons can not get out and it appears black)
Just wanted to clarify a few things for those who didn't know. - Urusai, on 10/12/2007, -4/+3OK, I saw lines and stuff. Are these supposed to represent electric/magnetic fields, gravity warping space-time, or what a Pink Floyd concert falling into a black hole looks like?
- Poco, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1This looks like the last Disaster Area concert.
- RandomSkratch, on 10/12/2007, -6/+4I'm pretty sure I've seen this on my Electric Sheep screensaver. (Also available in taupe and periwinkle blue)
- Chongo, on 10/12/2007, -8/+5True, but it at least draws more people to the topics at hand. The more people, the more debate.... Not such a bad thing.
in other news, batboy has been spotted orbiting pluto - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -5/+2the crappy itunes visualizer can do that too....
jk, nice story - Sarev0k, on 10/12/2007, -10/+6The video simulation isn't worth watching, just a bunch of unanimated wavy lines with dark balls in the center orbiting each other until they collide. If this is the best simulation, I'd hate to see the worst.
- netjd, on 10/12/2007, -13/+9i gave you a digg just for the ending... made me about piss my pants LMAO
- TeenageBugaboo, on 10/12/2007, -5/+0way cool
- chkMINUS, on 10/12/2007, -6/+1Does anyone else think that video is very similiar to the one's that play at Tool concerts?
- pairanoyd, on 10/12/2007, -10/+5Beh.. I saw this the other day on C.O.P.S., they were kicking ass and cursing like mad.
Oh, wait, black HOLES...... DOH! - Blah_Blah_Blah, on 10/12/2007, -7/+2What's a black hole?
- Scourge, on 10/12/2007, -9/+4I've seen melting cheese that's more entertaining
- daRoach, on 10/12/2007, -10/+4I saw a more interesting animation on Nova the other night.
- kingfoot, on 10/12/2007, -9/+1yes, it may be accurate...but i was expecting a much better video, that simply sucked IMHO
- majorbabu, on 10/12/2007, -19/+7Fake!
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