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- Pac56, on 10/12/2007, -6/+65It's amazing that some people (Government) seem to make this a bigger problem than selling alcohol or tobacco to minors...
It all comes down to parenting...
If your kid needs a babysitter, hirer a babysitter; don't just buy little Timmy an XBOX 360 and Gears of War and then complain when he starts coming home with other M rated games...- SurrealDream, on 10/12/2007, -1/+57You know, when I was 15, I got ID'd when trying to buy Metal Gear Solid at EB Games, but didn't get ID'd when buying Cigarettes and a Lottery ticket for my Dad.
Strange world. - mastersquirrel3, on 10/12/2007, -16/+3@stanford
no you don't its a pain in the ass to have to take out your license whenever you want a new game. - dankosaur, on 10/12/2007, -11/+2For your dad... sure
- Software2, on 10/12/2007, -1/+47You know, I've always thought that stores forcibly restricting game sales based on age was a bad thing... then I played Gears of War online.
- broomett, on 10/12/2007, -2/+27How is it being presented as being a bigger problem than alcohol or tobacco? They are treating it the same, at worst.
The only way your statement would make ANY sense would be if they weren't cracking down on selling tobacco or alcohol to minors. But since they are (and being MUCH more strict) your comment is completely baseless.
Then again, you got lots and lots of diggs for it. Whcih shows the mentality of the average Digger.
Squirrel...Oh the HORROR! When I already have my wallet out I now have to show my ID, which, unless you are an idiot, you keep in your wallet anyway. How terrible. Such a pain in the ass. - hansblix, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10I find it funny that I was never ID'd until I was old enough to buy M-rated games.
The first time i was asked I literally laughed at the lady because i thought she was joking. - drouk1556, on 10/12/2007, -6/+3Its almost as if there's some mysterious force in the world making people believe that violent video games are the root of all that is wrong in the world.
Oh well. For now we can just settle for Jack Thompson. - saska, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11What an ignorant comment. If the goverment thought it was a bigger deal, they'd be mandating the step that GameStop is taking voluntarily.
Unfortunately, the only way the rating system will have teeth is if people start paying attention to it. I think all too often parents don't look at what their kids are buying or playing because they think the store wouldn't sell the game if their kid couldn't play it. Note that this makes them stupid parents, and that I don't think the law should decide who can buy or play what.
My kid is screwed. I'm a gamer. He's not going to put anything over on me. - theshazcat, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9Don't you guys carry your licence in your wallet?
Which I am guessing is also where you would be carrying your money to buy this game... - scootinger, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7Okay, so I thought that you only need to be 17 to buy M-rated games? (I'm 17 and I've bought M-rated games from GameStop and other stores with no problem - they carded me and everything was fine)
17-year-olds are still considered to be minors, so is GameStop changing this age to 18, or are they just making sure that their age rules get enforced? - schroeder, on 10/12/2007, -10/+2***** that! The rating system is run by stupid people with no clue and no public consultation. It is not law nor is it illegal in any way to sell this or R rated movies or music to minors. Buy your ***** somewhere else. That's what I did when I wanted R rated moves at age 16 (10 years ago and 29min). Until there is some sort of public consensus about what is acceptable for minors then it's all about a select few who are control of what's good for minors and that's dumb. And parents, parent your own damn children! I certainly will not show ID to purchase a movie or game and will take my business elsewhere.
- harmonica, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9I live in NZ, and I went to go see an R16 (over 16 only) movie with a friend. As I had no ID, I didn't expect to be allowed in. However, when I attempted to purchase a child ticket (under 16) for another movie, they wanted to make me pay for a adult ticket, as they didn't think I was under 16. They didn't let me see the R16 movie, and they weren't going to let me buy a child's ticket to a different movie. Eventually, with much argument, they let me buy the child's ticket.
- pagit, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10"if an hourly employee sells an M-rated game to a minor, not only will he or she lose their job, but the salaried store manager will be terminated as well, even if they were not present in the store at the time of the sale".
that would be illegal here, but what a good way to get back at your boss if you were a cashier and wanted to leave your crappy min wage job at GameStop - 81v3d07g0d, on 10/12/2007, -6/+1You're 100% right, think about this if you taught your kids the right thing from the beginning then they wouldn't make the inappropriate choice in the first place.
- vhcougar, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4"The first time i was asked I literally laughed at the lady because i thought she was joking."
I don't know what makes me feel worse, when I have to turn away some eager 10-year old trying to buy GTA, or when I ask to see someone's ID and their birthday's in like the 70s.
I think I would feel insulted that some kid I could have fathered thinks I'm the same age as him.. - k0ta, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1I whole heartedly Agree, If you have kids, You need to sit down with them, and have "the talk". No not the one about the birds the bee's and the apple trees. The One about Soul Calibur 3, and why Swords and guns are not allowed at school.
(I'm only 15)Don't take This Advice Literally......Unless your child has resources like guns and swords at hand. - bokchoi, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Well at least if this precaution is taken, parents have no one to blame but themselves.
- Asianwaste, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9I was at a Gamestop over the Holidays and this kid was trying to swindle her mom into getting Grand Theft Auto III. She was ready to just pick whatever game her son pointed out. The Gamestop employee picks out the game and before giving it to the mom he points out that the game is rated M. The mom says, "I understand, but a lot of those games are sometimes not as bad as they are rated." The Gamestop employee continues to tell her, "Yes, I agree with that, but these games are pretty violent."
The mom asks, "How bad?"
"The worst."
During that exchange, the kid's face went from excited smile to a droopy disappointed frown. I got a guilty laugh out of that. My mom got me Mortal Kombat 2 from the same store when it was called Funcoland and I turned out to not be a bloodthirsty ninja who can freeze you and rip your head off. Still it was good to see someone doing their job right. Hopefully anecdotes like this will shut Jack Thompson up. - dagobah77, on 10/12/2007, -5/+4@81v3d07g0d
Are you sure you have ever come in contact with a human teenager?
You can tell your children not to see R-rated movies but chances are they'll still sneak into an R-rated movie before they're 17. You can tell your child point blank not to buy/play M-rated games but if the parent does not monitor them chances are they'll still do it anyway.
Most parents I know let their teens play M-rated games. I think GameStop should have a registry in their systems that lets parents enable their kids to buy M-rated games alone. That is what the Hollywood Video by me used to do with R-rated movies. - PixelVision, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1When I was 13, GTA came out on the PC with an 18 rating (which is a legal restriction here in the UK I believe). My mum and I went into EB so we could get it, I had shown her the demo and she knows I'm no idiot so she decided it was fine for her to buy the game on my behalf. Once in the shop, the assistant began to try and "persuade" my mum that GTA is a game ok for 13 year olds even though it's rated 18. I have a feeling I would have been sold it if I had tried on my own.
- sztuka, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Gamestop can impliment any darn policy they want.
- Daiken, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Yeah, first time I was asked for ID was when I was in my early 20's. The EB employee looked at my card and acted surprised when he noticed I was born in the same year as he was. Whatever, I think it's good to enforce the age restrictions. If a kid is playing a game rated 18, the parents should be to blame for buying it for them.
- s0nicfreak, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4I have been carded more times when buying video games than I have when buying tobacco. And a lot of people don't keep their money in their wallet, because they're worried about getting pick-pocketed. So I can understand what people like pac56 are saying.
If you don't want your kids playing M rated games, it's pretty easy to NOT give them $50 and drop them off at the store. If they're mature enough to make their own $50 and take their self to the store they're mature enough to play M rated games, IMO (and therefore I think the M rated game age should be lowered to 16, but that's another discussion).
But we all know most people aren't going to actually parent their children, so just maybe (probably not though) requiring ID will cut down on the bitching of "how easy it is to get your hands on" M rated games, and maybe (again probably not though) people will stop listening to parents who claim it's everyone's fault but their own that their kid obtained M rated games. - Pac56, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Some people seem to forget that some states had passed laws that made it illegal to sell these games to minors; punishable by fines and jail time. Sure; judges have come along each time and overturned it, but not before it received a lot of attention.
I have never once been carded to buy alcohol (hard liquor, not just beer), but I was carded when I bought Halo 2.
I guess the pressure that the Senate was putting on the ESRB after the "Hot Coffee" debacle has nothing to do with Gamestop, a member of the ESRB retail council, putting this into place... - Nobi-Wan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Any policy that keeps as many little Timmys away from me in Halo 3 I have no problem with.
- ChillHomie, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5I bought half-life 2 last night and im 15...
- Pac56, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I definitely don't have a problem with the age restrictions. I used to work at a game store and I actually enjoyed telling those little kids they couldn't play the game. I also enjoyed kicking them out of the store since they were supposed to be in school...
I just think that firing the Manager because of a single incident is BS. Sure, if it happens more than once, than there is a definite leadership problem in the store, but to fire the manager... - EternalDarkWing, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I'm 16 and I used to walk up to the EB Games all the time to buy my games, mostly M rated. My parents had no problem with it and they couldnt always take me there to buy them. I was never hassled or questioned about my purchases. Ever since their merger with Gamestop, they have been cracking down on sales to minors. I guess I'm just going to have to wait 10 months until I can LEGALLY buy them. Thanks, Gamestop, for the inconvenience. ***** you.
- SurrealDream, on 10/12/2007, -1/+57You know, when I was 15, I got ID'd when trying to buy Metal Gear Solid at EB Games, but didn't get ID'd when buying Cigarettes and a Lottery ticket for my Dad.
- overbored454, on 10/12/2007, -1/+40Will employees also face instant termination if they recommend Barbie Horse Adventure as an alternative?
- Pac56, on 10/12/2007, -2/+28That should actually result in the entire staff being terminated.
- canti32, on 10/12/2007, -2/+20Followed by execution, cremation of the remains, and a shuttle launch into the sun. Plus all offending copies of said game will be carefully removed, so as not to contaiminate it's surroundings. After removal, the all copies of the "game" will be used in the USA's devestating new WMD, the Barbie Horse Adventure bomb. It is belived to be forty time deadlier than even the Q bomb.
- hove, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15I work in a games shop in the UK and the only difference here is it's not a company policy it's the law. My attitude it that i have not played every game and don't know the content but someone in the bbfc, pegi or elspa has and has rated the game. who am i to decide that a game is suitable for a child? In the end it's up to the parents with the help of the rating board.
on a side note i am constantly having to inform parent that games are rated on content rather than difficulty.- SurrealDream, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1I always thought that it was only against the law to buy games which have the same age rating tags as movie, and that ELSPA Ratings are just recommendations.
Just goes to show how uninformed even regular gamers like me are.
- SurrealDream, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1I always thought that it was only against the law to buy games which have the same age rating tags as movie, and that ELSPA Ratings are just recommendations.
- D3koy, on 10/12/2007, -19/+4I have been told I'm too young to buy games before, do you have any idea how angry that can make you?
Stand in line behind some mom buying a M game for their 10 year old and have to listen to the whole story then have the clerk just tell me, "sorry kid come back once you start shaving" (which I have been told before, yet I do...go figure)
I think I should be able to take a test and place-out, like in schools...if you are smart enough to know the difference between life and a game then you can buy a game...- imanihilist, on 10/12/2007, -5/+12I think you're the *exact* kind of kid that gets denied the ability to buy GTA, then goes on the internets complaining about it, then finally gets his hands on it, and then goes into school the next day with an Uzi and kills everyone who ever made fun of him. Which, given the fact that you are underage and online complaining about your inability to buy video games, means everyone except that really geeky kid in the corner who knows what BSD stands for. He lives.
- NSMike, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10And here, D3koy hits on the real problem - the ignorant parent who couldn't take two seconds to learn the ESRB ratings who ends up buying it for their child anyway just to shut them up. Then they see what their child is playing, wonder why he's got access to it, bitch and moan about how their child shouldn't be exposed to it, and the cycle repeats.
- broomett, on 10/12/2007, -13/+3What is funny is that NSMike is claling hte parents ignorant, assuming that they are just biuying the game to give to their kids without checking it out, and the very fact thathe IS assuming that proves he is ignorant.
Everyone wants to blame the parents for not checking up...well, how do you know that that parent in front of you wasn't going to play it first, or be there with the kid to discuss it afterwards? You don't. You just want to whine like the little bitches that you are. - blahtastic, on 10/12/2007, -5/+2broomet, The only games my parents ever willingly played with me were Super Scope and Mario Kart for SNES, and Wii Sports. And they're good parents.
Lets face it, parents pay no attention to videogames, no matter how strict they are. Only authoritarians, devoutly religious, or devout pacifists would actually pay any attention to whats going into these things before hand. It's not really their fault yet, they're just slightly too old to be in the informed loop. Informed, that is, that videogames aren't just a child's toy anymore. - Mizu, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Wait what? It IS the parents fault for not checking the game. They don't need to sit down and play the game with their child, all they need to do is look at that box that says rated M for MATURE. Its not a matter of being in the loop, its looking at what the age rating for the game is.
- blahtastic, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1If you ask parents what the ESRB is, or what the E, T, M, or AO ratings mean, I'm willing to bet they have no clue (actually the same is probably true for the majority of non-gamers). Granted it's right on the box, they may not know that if you flip the thing over it tells you why it got that rating. Now, if you ask the same thing about movie ratings... You'll most likely have different findings. (I'm ignoring television ratings, there are like a million of those and hardly anyone pays attention to anything besides MA)
- blahtastic, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1Disregard last post. It didn't defend that it wasn't parents fault in any way. :P Quite sorry for rambling like a moron.
My point of argument=Game ratings haven't been a problem long enough for parents to realize they need to take notice. Some movies have been very violent or adult oriented for decades. The first terribly violent mainstream game was probably Mortal Kombat, around the early 90's. In the next 10 years, people will most likely learn that movie ratings are much the same as game ones, and that both parents and stores need to be responsible for policing them (much like movies). One example of this I remember is that when an adult signs up for a Blockbuster account, it has an option which lets you determine what types of games and movies minors on your account will be able to check out.
Though I personally think the mature age limit should be dropped a year. But that's just my opinion and somewhat irrelevant. - Ramtech, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3dont worry kid... life will hit you faster than you know.. and you'll end up wanting to be too young for something....
enjoy it while you can....
and shut up - blahtastic, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Kid? Me? I can purchase whatever game I want, thanks. Just because I mentioned that my parents used to play Mario Kart with me doesn't make me a kid (that console is over 10 years old, and I wasn't a toddler when I was playing it). Granted those posts weren't my best thought out statements ever (though the last one wasn't that bad, just differentiated from the popular opinion) you just sound like a guy who just got out of college who already thinks he's wise to the ways of the world. I may be wrong, but you assumed I was a kid, so I'm assuming too.
Actually I wouldn't even have bothered with any of this had you not put shut up at the end. I wasn't being offensive in any way, so that was hardly necessary, except to seem like a tough guy on the internets, woo for you. Oh well, none of this matters, its an old story and most likely no one will see this anyway, lol.
- deetank, on 10/12/2007, -2/+14Yeah my friend was asked to show an ID when trying to buy Half-Life 2, then I bought a used season of The Sopranos and wasn't asked for an ID.
I think we can all agree that Half-Life 2 shouldn't be sold to kids, but The Sopranos is no big deal.- Avalontor, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1one is real life the other, isn't.
- dustinl4m3, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6@avalontor:
which is which?
- BM5k, on 10/12/2007, -16/+2If its unconstitutional to ban the sale of M rated games to minors, it MUST be illegal to terminate employees for this. ***** on GS and their playing government.
- broomett, on 10/12/2007, -0/+16It's not. On either count.
A private store can do anything it wants. As long as it is not discrimination. It can set up any policy it wants.
It is also not unconstitutional. - saska, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1The state constitutionality challenges to video game sales restrictions are rarely based on speech, although those topics are discussed in the rulings from the standpoint that the lawmakers often fail to make a compelling legal argument for the *restriction* of speech. (Note that state constitutionality rulings are at state levels and not federal levels.) Most often the challenges are based on the fact that the criteria for determining a game's availability to minors are "unconstitutionally vague," which means that the definitions in the proposed laws are not based on existing legal doctrine.
There is a legal definition of "obscenity," for example, which allows laws to be in place regarding the sale of pornographic material to minors. But obscenity rarely comes into play when we're talking about video games, and legal definitions of excessive violence don't exist, so such criteria can't be used to uphold a proposed state law.
- broomett, on 10/12/2007, -0/+16It's not. On either count.
- cam0man, on 10/12/2007, -7/+1Not that this is still an issue for me, but back when i was a teen, Best Buy was always the place to buy movies and games because they never had any policies like this. Don't these stores realize it's a great way to kill their business? People are just gonna buy the game someplace else...
GameStop can't stop shooting themselves in the foot lately....they need to learn how to run a business. - JordanM85, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2The only time anyone has ever carded me was for GTA 3, GTA VC, and GTA SA. Only the games that get everyones negative attention.... All the other M games are ignored.
- Four20, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9funny, that's how it should be. It's bad enough that the parents just go and buy anything their 10 year old asks for. Adult Employees should not be selling GTA and such games to minors.
- bryan4, on 10/12/2007, -6/+8damn digg has been owning GameStop/EBgames lately. With good reason though, keep it up.
- broomett, on 10/12/2007, -2/+14And yet life goes on for GameStop. Why? Because Digg doesn't matter in the world.
- unununium, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7How is GameStop getting "owned" by this? Because they are fairly enforcing ratings guidelines on games?
- punk90, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1I just go to Fry's electronics and buy my games they don't care what age I am. Only once did they ask for my age when I went to buy Doom 3 on launch day lucky for me I had my brother.
- badfrog, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Sadly, I'm old enough to have been able to buy cigarettes and go to rated R movies without being carded. No wonder kids huff paint now.
- triscuitbiscuit, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2I go to school in a different state than I live and I was going to buy a game (specifically Gears of War) from an EB near my school... I went to buy it and the kid asked me for my ID... I gave it to him and he didn't believe that I could purchase the game... He thought my license was suspicious... The annoying thing is is that I can understand not selling it to a 12 year old, but I definately look around my age.
- razrielle, on 10/12/2007, -4/+3reminds me of a time at wal*mart. My license is cracked due to a soft wallet, when I went up to the counter to pay for it the lady eye balled me and had a manager come check it out. She told the manager that she didn't want to sell me it due to the fact that its a deadly weapon and didn't trust the authenticity of my ID, the manager stared at her and told her it was fine. She then proceeded to marker every bill I paid her with, even the ones. Then I walked away with a brand new Remington.
- dannomac, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Reminds me of a school trip I took when I was 17. I went in to a Target store in Bismarck, ND, and tried to buy a CD. I forget which CD it was, but it had an explicit lyrics tag on it, probably Guns 'n Roses or something. The girl at the counter asked for ID. This was completely foreign to me.. before I had thought that ID was for cigarettes and alcohol. Of course I refused, I had never had to show ID for a retail purchase before and was somewhat offended and told her I'd just buy it somewhere else, to which she replied that I wasn't going to find anyone in Bismarck who'd sell it to me. She didn't believe that I could get it at home no questions asked, which I did.
To this day I can count on one hand the number of times I've shown ID for a purchase, and I've been legal to buy alcohol for 6 years.
- Draje, on 10/12/2007, -4/+2I find this quite rediculous. Many of my friends have pirated M-rated games specifically for the reason of them being underage and unable to get them without dragging their parents or someone of legal age to the store. My mom certainly is annoying by doing this. This only hurts sales.
- lazyman0, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10The id system is crazy. I got ID'd at walmart for buying whiteout at the main cash register but I sent my 14 year old brother to buy Gears and they didn't I'D him.
- Kratisto, on 10/12/2007, -9/+0With all the effort these assholes are putting forth to stop people from playing games that are no more graphic than an R-rated movie, you'd think they could... I dunno... Do something constructive? Buy some body armour for US Soldiers, crack down on drug use, put a dent in the amount of money we should be throwing at education... But no. Videogames. ***** video games. Great job, government.
- musicmantrs, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Yeah because it is Gamestop's responsibility to do all those things....
- h4mx0r, on 10/12/2007, -4/+2One more year and I'll be 18!
The Gamestop has always irritated me. Luckily, the EBgames right next to it carries a much larger PC selection, has a much more friendly/less 'greasynerdy' employees and has never carded me. Whereas the gamestop is the opposite.
Funny they are both owned by the same : /- triscuitbiscuit, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Shouldn't you be able to purchase M rated games anyway?
And speaking of ebgames and gamestops next to each other, why do they do that? I know they weren't owned by the same company originally, but a video game store is not a humongous traffic shop, so why would one bother putting itself there if it risking with getting less business?
- triscuitbiscuit, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Shouldn't you be able to purchase M rated games anyway?
- kenthorvath, on 10/12/2007, -4/+0If I were a minor, I'd just stop buying games from them. I'd organize a boycott and get all my friends to do the same and digg about it. I'd teach them to impose their sense of morality on me by imposing my sense of morality on them - that all censorship is wrong. I gaurantee you that it wouldn't even take a large percentage of minors to begin doing this for it to put a strain on their bottom line and things would change. I'm sure that minors comprise the majority of their customers.
EDIT: Come to think of it, just because I'm not a minor doesn't mean that I shouldn't join in on the protest. Henceforth, no Gamestop purchases for me. - standalonematt, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2When I was a kid I am glad I didn't have to drag my mom in to buy video games. She would have said no - not for any content - but she believed spending $50 was insane. I could have wanted to buy Tetris and she would have frowned upon it.
In that day it was Dungeons and Dragons and rock music that was causing all the problems, not video games.
Once we ban video games I am sure all the youth violence will disappear.- stajos06, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0its none of these things, If the music o today could go o say with out the cursing crime and explicity(also known as rap), and if it could go without the self intentioal hurting then we may not have this problem i mean talking about cutting your self killing yourself, slapping a ho', and rolling up wit' tha' homies' and shooting a nine while busting a cap in some dirty motha f***** butt. This is the reason we have the columbine incodent. lower the age to sixteen (im 14 and it would still b a pain) this is acceptable, if ppl risk theyre lives by letting you drive, they should by letting you buy a videogame
i mean more ppl are killed per year on average than are by ppl who played vice city, im not sure the same thing cam b said about GANGSTAS now can it n what is rap about? o yeah GANGSTAS
- stajos06, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0its none of these things, If the music o today could go o say with out the cursing crime and explicity(also known as rap), and if it could go without the self intentioal hurting then we may not have this problem i mean talking about cutting your self killing yourself, slapping a ho', and rolling up wit' tha' homies' and shooting a nine while busting a cap in some dirty motha f***** butt. This is the reason we have the columbine incodent. lower the age to sixteen (im 14 and it would still b a pain) this is acceptable, if ppl risk theyre lives by letting you drive, they should by letting you buy a videogame
- reed311, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3This is just one of those "feel good" initiatives. Violence among youths has always existed, but it actually has gone down in recent years even though more violent videogames have been released than ever.
- musicmantrs, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4As shown by the rise in school shootings. Over all the numbers have gone down but the fatality rate in youth crimes has risen tremendously.
- standalonematt, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Better firearms maybe.
- razrielle, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3No, just Silent Scope
- TheElectricMonk, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7thats not good enough for my tastes, im not big on censorship, but i dont see this as censorship at all, this is a means to stop people demanding censorship, anyway back to what i was actually saying, this isnt enough for my tastes, i think that stores should be able to refuse to sell m-rated games to anyone who shows that they are buying it for a minor, just like smokes and alcohol, i believe if a parents comes up to the counter and says "my son wants this game really bad" and the ten year old standing beside them says "yeah, i do" and the game is GTA, or another m-rated game, the clerk should be allowed to refuse to sell the game to that person
(and broomett, youre a douche) - Ashtonn, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0I thought you had to be 17 to buy M games, not 18 :$
- idigital, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0In Australia an M rating is 15+.
- cdf12345, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2Considering that the ratings for TV, Movies and Video Games are given by private groups, and have no legal bearing, I shutter to think of the govt enforcing the current rating systems via legislation. You you really want the govt enforcing what the MPAA thinks is rated R?
I mean 2 f words automatically changed a PG13 into an R rating. We don't need the govt to enforce this, which would amount to censorship anyways. That would leave the only legal ground to prevent minors from accessing them is to declare them obscene, and put them on the same level as porn. Not a good idea.
I find it funny that if real life was filmed for a day then had to be rated, High School in particular would be rated NC-17, and the students that live that everyday wouldn't be allowed to see it via film.- vhcougar, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1have you ever seen an nc-17 movie?
what the hell kind of high schol do you go to?
- vhcougar, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1have you ever seen an nc-17 movie?
- whiteguysamurai, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7This cracks me up, i went to buy a game at EB, and they carded me.
I have a full beard,and are starting to get wrinkles and thinning hair.
Still, they carded me. - wowbagger, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Good, kids have no business with this stuff.
- Liqwidraver, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2yeah they really are cracking down, i just got off work and my DM was really pushing the whole m-rated thing, spent a couple hours setting up ESRB signs everywhere.
- Inverno, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Thank god! I was in GameStop the other day (reserving Crackdown and trying to find a wiimote) and I saw a kid, couldn't be older than ten, purchasing the last GTA. I'm not the kids parent or anything, but I'm not sure I'd let my offspring play GTA. Shouldn't that demographic be more interested in Viva Pinata, Pokemon, or something?
Carding minors on video games is a good thing, imo. We want our hobby to be comparable to mainstream media (movies in particular)? Then we have to play by the big boy rules.- freetyme, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Agreed, they do it for movies and magazines, sure people break the rules but the rules are there. How hard is it to give your ID?
- freetyme, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Agreed, they do it for movies and magazines, sure people break the rules but the rules are there. How hard is it to give your ID?
- AndrewDB, on 01/10/2008, -2/+3As an ex-eb/gamestop employee (I'm the guy who wrote the story that was on retailsucks.com), I have to tell you I call *****.
Why? Because they told us they were 'enforcing it' before, and they never did...
I won't believe it until I ***** see it. - tavisjohn, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3It is about DAMN TIME that the Stores took some respobsibility! Instead of barring the sale of AO and M games the stores should be making sure that they only sell them to people who are OLD ENOUGH to play them!
If a magizine shop can prevent minors from purchasing porn, and a store can prevent a minor from buying boose, then a game store can prevent minors from getting adult games! - theokandroid, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Went into gamestop yesterday to sell some old games, and he told me that he had to check my ID just to even sell them back, and if they didnt the manager and the associate who bought back the games would be fired. Lucky for me I'm 19.
- Juroujin, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0I'm probably the only one who pointed out "Oops! That game is M-Rated and I'm not 17." to a Gamespot employee. I know he would have allowed me to buy the game if I had not been honest (I know because I bought an M-Rated game after I became 17 and he didn't ask for an ID).
- leftysrevenge, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1so what's the story about the parents who _are_ told about the rating system, explained the significance for a particular game, and still shrug it off in favor of their 12 yro's whining for the game...?
- Inverno, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'll tell you that story. Ready? Here it goes.
They might not be the best parents.
The end.
- Inverno, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'll tell you that story. Ready? Here it goes.
- HCHunter, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I used to work there and very fortunately I was able to move on. I usually asked kids for an ID or a parent, but most of the parents were pissed off that I even asked. When I tried to explain to them that the material isn't really appropriate, they said "Aww, hell. He's seen it already anyway. Can't hurt him now."
The problem with that is that it definately can hurt them. If they play a game at a friend's house and it isn't appropriate, you shouldnt just assume that the damage is done. Explain to your child the difference between video games and reality, and show a little backbone for once. Parents are turning their kids into heathens.- leftysrevenge, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0agreed. i see it all the time. but what can you do? certainly not their parenting for them.
- Ramtech, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1i was once a wii boy who lost his way to ebhood... they took my money, my cards and my insurance policy.. then... they stole my pony... let it be known to all... i
am
victim to indulgence - leftysrevenge, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0The real problem here is the atmosphere of paranoia they've created for their Store Managers. Regardless of their participation in the incident, all employees involved, SM included, will be terminated. True, the results should reflect the initiative and prove the company is serious about enforcing the ratings standards in place. But this also just proves that the Store Managers are as expendable as the part-timers they hire.
Instead they should try to encourage a positive spin on the significance of a game's rating, and focus on educating not only the people on their payroll but also their vital customers, who ultimately bankroll those paychecks.
...But that would be too productive.
Nah, let's go the easy route: Zero tolerance for noncompliance.
That only sends one message...loud and clear. - Comp1demon, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1Guess what - There is NO SUCH THING AS A GAME LAW - all Game laws in the USA are UNCONSTITUTIONAL.
If you sell a M rated game to a 2 yr old, 5 yr old, 12 yr old, 16yr old, ect.... NOTHING CAN HAPPEN TO YOU LEGALLY. No Fines, Can't get arrested, Can't be slapped on the wrist - and no one can influence your termination for doing so except the people at the company you work for.
Now binding contacts in most States are for minimum 18 Yrs old. SO Technically anything a KID buys is not bound my the stores return policy - So if john the 13 yr old walks into game stop and spends $55 on a game and mommy finds out - she can demand the store return the item for a full cash refund as Stores are not allowed to make BINDING contracts with Minors. Though most businesses will tell you you are wrong - one call to the BBB or atorney General for that state chances are your getting your refund. You can also Civilly sue the business but the cost would outweigh the benifit.
NOW onto the Opions for this Story here..
Now if MIKE the sales guy is caught selling a M rated game to anyone under 18 (I know M rated games are 17) OK 17 then. If Mike the sales guy is caught by a Manager, Corporate person etc... He can be fired. NOT arrested, not fined, nothing else - He only broke the rules of the employer he works for - that's it! - Now here is a interesting Dilemma to think about. The new Game stop policy says if any sales person is caught selling to a Minor they are fired - Well I assume if an Adult calls Game stop corporate and says to them - my son bought Gears of war (example) at Game stop in MAIN STREET MALL in Any Town USA - Corporate will ask for the sales receipt information - see who it was that sold the game on the receipt and fire them (and possibly their manager too - Which I think is ridicules - but we will get back to that later) and they fire the Employee for selling a M rated Game to a Minor. I guess the Adult that called is CATCHING the employee??? But is he/she? What if the parent allows the child to buy the game (parent present at sale) then later on has no clue what he/she bought the minor - No she calls corporate and complains about the game that the store sold her kid - with her present (but don't say she was present - just says her MINOR BOUGHT IT and they sold it to him) - That poor employee is going to get fired - that's absurd and it will be his word Vs the Adult who called for his/her minor and gamestop wont care and fire the employee. So i guess anyone can call game stop corporate and claim that someone sold their Minor a M rated game and get them fired.
Second problem - There new rules also say that the store manager can also be fired (though Can means it might not happen in every case) for the actions of his employees selling a M rated game to a minor. I think this is absurd too... Even with all the proper training and authority - the manager cannot look over the shoulder of every employee at every second. any dumb or SPITEFUL employee can Sell a M rated game to a Minor and get this manager Fired for no ill will on the managers part. So If I am Joe SHMOW part time employee at game stop and I hate my Manager - I can get my manager fired by selling M rated games to Minors as well as myself - That's BULL$HIT. I can understand if the manager was being fired for the actions of his employees where it is a Financial loss to the company - like the head of a division or research or something like that - perhaps a loss prevention manager who fails and continues to do a bad job at a loss to the company - but a STORE MANAGER is going to be responsible for the sale of a M rated game (which is not a crime in any state or even sue-able civilly) when he is on his day off or not around during the sale because some spiteful employee or an employee taking a chance figuring he won't get caught costing the Store manager his job - which probably isn't eligible for unemployment due to the nature of the termination - even though he wasn't there or around.
I say this is bull$hit too..
I say sell the kiddies all the M rated games they want - and companies like game stop should spend more cash on marketing campaigns to inform parent who care about what a M rated title is and how it can be as an influence on the child playing it. Untill There is a Local, State or Federal Law prohibiting the sale of M rated games (that is NOT UN-CONSTUTIONAL) - Games should not be compared to Alcohol, Tobacco, or Porn - and should sell to whoever they want to sell them too.
When I was a kid - I got to go to all the rated R movies, got to see hardcore action flicks and watch wresting on TV. We tried it all - Jumping off couches - throwing kitchen knives at box's or targets - trying to make light sabers out of florescent lights (not my brightest idea) - and a million other things that could have hurt or killed us - and the kids today's are babied because the games they play have realistic red blood - but I bet they watch CSI or something. They have curses in it - I was 8 and watched Eddie Murphy's delirious, Show drugs and prostitution - Well drugs are in every school (junior High on) and Prostitution - well I never used one but I knew about sex and masturbation and stuff like that when i was 12 yrs old. What are we trying to shelter kids from today. I was taught how to conduct myself based on all the influences I saw - and while we tried stupid things - we never tried to kill another kid - curse at authority (cause we got spanked - anything thing you can do anymore) or do anything Illegal cause we saw it on TV or in a movie or even in a ATARI, NINTENDO, or GENESIS Game.
OK this turned into a rant.
Anyways - I feel bad if you work at game stop. Cause anyone of us can get you and your manager fired these days. Also watch your backs has never held more truth at work now if you work at a game stop - weather you work 5 hrs a week or are the store manager - anyone can ***** anyone else over now. - AWooWoo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0 I remember renting R movies such as BasicInstinct,TheDallasConnection; which I'm sure rushed in urges and playing Mortal Kombat in the Arcade with the uppercuts and finishing moves with the blood and bones when I was 13years old. That when SEGA Genesis was better to have then a Super Nintendo because SEGA had blood, Super had sweat.
But to the subject of GameStop selling games that are targeted at an older crowd to kids is business ethics. Which at no point have I made any since in what I'm posting. Alright so a kid has a paper route, ya great thumbs up good start with work ethics. Kid saves money from job to go buy coolest newest game,system,SoftwareEtc.whatever. Yes guide lines are good but stop being a puss and travel at your own risk. - macweirdo42, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4You know, I've never had a problem with this. Maybe it's 'cause I'm old enough to buy those games myself, but frankly, I've never thought that kids should be playing M-rated games anyway. However, what really bothers me is the idiot parents who buy these games for their kids. I'm so sick and tired of Mommy buying the 10-year-old a copy of GTA3 because he whines and lies, and then they get home and suddenly the mom is all up in arms about violent video games. YOU BOUGHT THE DAMN GAME FOR HIM, IDIOT! READ THE FREAKIN' LABEL! I swear, what do we need, someone at the counter explaining the label to people when they buy games. "By the way, were you aware that is says right here that this game contains blood, gore, sex, nudity, and adult language, and probably isn't appropriate for your 10-year-old?" God, people these days...
- errornix, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0I was just recently carded for buying a Metal Gear game. I don't even get carded for booze anymore! I'm 22 btw.
- Merrick178, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Well duh! If it's M they shouldn't be allowed to order it themselves. I'm sure they could just get their parents to order it for them. In my opinion a lot of M ratings are stupid because any child 13+ has most likely seen anything that could be in one of these games, Not that I'm saying every kid with the cash should be able to waltz in and buy a Grand Theft Auto game... But I think the system needs to be readjusted.
- Forever-Zero, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I've been playing M Rated games since I was 11 years old...it didn't effect me at all. The whole "you have to be 17" thing is complete *****. Yes, there should be some age limits on games, I'm not trying to say that I want nine year olds playing GTA and beating up hookers. Being 17 is ridiculous though, no reason for it...
On a side note, I've never been carded while trying to buy an M rated game (18 now). - psylancer, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0yep
- mikeyeah, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1My brother manages a Gamestop in PA. He has told me that he never sells M-Rated games to minors. The problem is, according to him, that the parents come in with their kids and buy M-Rated games for them. He makes it a point to read the M-Rated label out loud to the parents but most still don't care. My point is that the problem is underage kids buying M-Rated games, the problem is that the parents come in and buy those games for them.
- andres9888, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0That not to fair to the manager cause i could easily get them fired by just selling a game to a minor.
- Nadsofed, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Doesn't this seem like a good idea though? Enforcing the no sale to minors rule will allow developers to push the envelope without fear of public outcry. Also it strengthens the idea that video games are not only for kids. Granted I'm a gamer and if I was a parent I would be aware of what my kids are playing and can make informed decisions but it doesn't seem crazy to have to get parents permission to play games that contain objectionable content. To get games to be respected in the same manner as movies they should be treated equally as well. Still think Gamestop sucks.
- skyfire1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I think the only time developers ever worry about pushing the envelope is if the game is rated teen.
- superdrew, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2To all the people who posted saying that this policy will only hurt Gamestop and EBs business I am sorry to tell you that you are wrong. Which demographic of the customers buy more games: The children under the age of 17 or the adult (parents)? I know that the amount of games that I purchased with my own money (not counting gifts) is small compared to the amount of games I buy now as an adult. The company is more concerned about their image to adults than they are about some pissed off 15 year old who can't buy a copy of GTA. The image that they want to portray is that they care about what their (adult and higher paying) customers wants not that they are the "cool" store that lets children but M rated games.
That said I think that the policy that the store manager be fired for the selling of a "M" rated by an hourly employee even if the manager is not on duty is incredibly silly. In fact, I'm going to say that it is not true. This type of policy leads to excessive paranoia by the manager and the job becomes extremely stressful. This combined with the fact that the managers are probably underpaid would lead to a lot of turnover within the company. Also, as mentioned above an employee who is vengeful and doesn't like his/her manager can get them fired. To me this leaves the company and the other employee open to a lawsuit. I think the policy is that if the manager is on duty and does nothing to prevent the sale of the game to the minor will be terminated, which is fine.
Do I think that this policy will keep the M rated games out of the hands of a minor? No. Will it make the company look responsible? Yes.- Inverno, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'd assume the SM would get ***** canned after a several register monkeys break the rules. I don't see someone who's been with the company for years getting fired because someone else is an idiot one time.
- skyfire1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1If you ever sell a violent video game to a minor, you will burn in hell forever. Think about how much your kid will be playing that game instead of smoking pcp or getting drunk. You have been warned.
- GolfDude, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1meanwhile the esrb hires underage kids to go to stores and buy M rated games and rat stores out, adn then what happens, they fine you 5 grand.. the fact their hire kids to do that should be illegal.. what government body gives them the right to fine a person.. or send a kid to do basically a fraudulent transaction b/c the game isnt for them, its for some overprotective group to fine and steal money from workers...
- mcnut, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Yeah this is old news. Gamestop has enforced this for several years. Case in point: I happen to know someone *cough* who was secret shopped the Friday before Christmas. First off, *my friend* worked in a neighborhood where most of the customer's parents had told us off because "damnit I don't wanna have to drive up here cuz he wants some damned game, he won't play em unless they've got an M on em enywayz", secondly it was the friday before christmas and I, I mean he couldn't have told you one face out of the millions that went through. So a 16 year old girl bought some M rated game and my friend either didn't realize the girl+ the game, or he didn't care and wanted to get all the people out of the store. But this has been a policy for at least a couple of years.
- DJPRIME90, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1doesthat include employee's buying M-rated games for their own kids :O
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