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- chiklit, on 10/12/2007, -6/+48Sony could stand to learn something from Nintendo by making a simple dev kit for people to make their own games instead of trying to fight them off on the PSP.
- iluvatar, on 10/12/2007, -5/+46Nintendo did the camera thing first: Game Boy Camera
They were even talking about using it with the transfer pak to put your face in perfect dark, but the feature was scrapped before the release. - jpcoombs, on 10/12/2007, -2/+37The reason everyone dislikes Sony's approach is that they have contridictory statements. When Nintendo unveiled the Wiimote (then Revmote) at the Tokyo Game Show, Sony said that motion technology isn't what consumers are looking for. Four months later they get sued and lose over the vibration features in their controllers, which they stole from Nintendo. And then at E3 they unveil the exact controller from the PS2, minus vibration, with the addition of a feature that they said no one would be interested in. It's all very transparent to the gaming community. And for Sony this is just business as usual.
When Nintendo sucks, they just suck. Virtua Boy sucked. N64 was too late. They lost Square. Gamecube sales were mediocre at best. But they don't rag on Sony, then 6 months later have the exact same technology come out and say "Innovation at it's finest." - jpcoombs, on 10/12/2007, -3/+31@darksquirrel
Sony is Evil. They represent everything wrong with gaming.
First of all, because Nintendo wants to make a profit does not make them evil. And because Sony and Microsoft are losing money on their ventures does not make them good. It's just business. If anything, you could say that Sony and MS are bad at business, and their stock prices would reflect that since E3. But wanting to make money does not make you Evil. Wanting to make money at the expense of others is. Nintendo just didnt put a $700 HD-DVD player into their system. Makes sense to me.
Sony launched a smear campaign against Nintendo's controller when it was unveiled at the TGS, saying that consumers were not interested in that technology. Low and behold, 6 months later it's in their controller and suddenly, they have been working on the 6 degree technology for two years. Oh, and the lawsuit that they lost concerning the Vibration feature they the stole from Nintendo has nothing to do with the reason that they took the feature out of the controllers.
The graphics are bad campaign seems to have a real following as well. Campaigns are only effective if people accept their message. Nintendo isn't paying anyone in here to agree with them - we just do. Graphics have hit a ceiling and when you have to have 50 people work on a game that is mediocre at best, well, that's very frustrating from the point of view of the true video game enthusiasist. Somone that enjoys games, the industry and the process that goes into the games.
And please. Do not talk about over-charging on a system. The PS3 is atmospheric in price right now. No one is complainging about a $250 price tag. $600 for a video game system (yes, its only a game system, just like a PS2 is a game system, not a DVD player with a gaming system in it) is going to put a dent in anyone's pocket. Give me the $600 game. What game is worth spending $600 over. Cause from what Sony is dishing us, I havent seen anything that merits $600. Not when I can buy a $400 Xbox360 and get a similar experience. At least Nintendo is offering us somehting we have NEVER done before.
There is your rebuttal.
And I gave you a digg, cause you are entitled to your opinion, even if it's wrong. I digg based on content, not bias. - jpcoombs, on 10/12/2007, -2/+27@popularme
If this was four years ago, these forums would be filled with PS2 fanboys. There were no Nintendo fanboys, cause they all bought a PS2. I think sony's approach to the consumer, with quotes like "We still think its underpriced" and calling their "new" PS3 controller "innovative" is obnoxious.
It's very easy to like Nintendo right now. In fact, a company who I have never cared for, Microsoft, has really grown on me since E3 of this year. Sony, however, has done nothing to sell any of their products to me. In fact, its very reflective of Nintendo 8 years ago, when all they were doing was pushing their most avid supporters away. At the end of this generation, I think we will all be looking back saying "Wow, I can't believe Sony lost a nearly complete market share." Just like Nintendo did. - Mark_H, on 10/12/2007, -1/+24Even if he isn't lying, I wouldn't trust GI for my Wii news.
GI said this during all of the speculation about what the secret of the controller would be (April 2005 issue):
"However, Nintendo may have to pull a rabbit out of its hat to become a major player in the next generation. That rabbit, GI has learned, is a touch screen. A source at a major development studio recently revealed to us details regarding Nintendo's development kit for the Revolution…
The most shocking is that the Revolution uses a touch screen as it's controller. There is no analog stick or shoulder buttons. The touch screen on the face of the controller is designed to be fully customizable. So, the developer can configure the buttons any way they see fit, instead opting for virtual levers or other stylus-related inputs."
Two issues later, they said something again about how there was going to be a touch screen, so I doubt it was an April fools joke (plus, they have an April fools section that this wasn't in). I don't believe anything from GI until I see it.
Source:
http://www.joystiq.com/2005/03/18/nintendo-revolution-to-include-a-touchscreen-controller/
The whole article from GI is pasted in the comments of the joystiq article. - mobbydick, on 10/12/2007, -8/+27From the link:
"And a development interface that centers on a AI-controlled command-line interface."
I think this guy is lying. - ishmael5, on 10/12/2007, -3/+21the PPU is something that has been in the credible rumor side of the Wii for quite awhile.
- TehSuper, on 10/12/2007, -3/+21The only reason people are modding you down is because you are an idiot.
- J1X1, on 10/12/2007, -6/+23sure there's no proof to back up his statement, but it's still a fun read.
- gabebear, on 10/12/2007, -10/+26I think it's a lot more likely that Sony is going to ship Linux with every PS3 than this rumor. This reads more like a wish list than a feature list.
- jpcoombs, on 10/12/2007, -7/+23@darksquirrel
http://wvigei.blog.com/789255/
Sony : "PS3 will replace the PC"
This is reason we can't stand Sony right now. This ***** seems to happen by the day for them. Just stupid comment after stupid comment.
They are the Bush adminstration in game form. - Lososaurus, on 10/12/2007, -1/+16NURBS interpolation, deforming and rendering takes up oodles of processor power, so that's one part I'd call shenanigans on.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -6/+20Its all coming together and starting to make sense! ATI saying its just the tip of the iceberg, All of the developers not saying anything about the graphics capability. the Hollywood and Broadway reference just like the North and South Bridge on a PC. The camera and Wii faces. Project Reality back in the day being reused now.
Especially this Post here, read it! its almost all the same things this guy said!
http://wii.veteransoutreach.org/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=92&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0
In that post the author also talks about almost every single thing stated here including the AI and other things. If this is true... just wow! - Lososaurus, on 10/12/2007, -2/+16@Zukeft: You must be new to the internet, Wii hype isn't 'dying' at all.
- gotamd, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15The Wii is shaping up to be an excellent console. Affordable and fun...exactly what I like about consoles (that's been slowly slipping away with the XBox 360/PS3 generation).
- Lososaurus, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14Does the average consumer(IE: 20-45 y/o) run emulators and is part of a community trading them?
I'm not sure about you, but I want to play me some damn Duck Hunt. - NOFXY, on 10/12/2007, -4/+16Not only that but i'm sure it wont be done half-assed. If you're going to copy something at least do it right
- Spaz007, on 10/12/2007, -4/+16Posts from a forum are not news...
- millixaw, on 10/12/2007, -2/+14Project Reality... wasn't that the codename for the Nintendo (Ultra) 64 ???
- L337_M4CH1N3, on 10/12/2007, -3/+15Do you even remember the Gameboy camera? I still use mine to but my face on that juggling game.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -8/+20@ darksquirrel
That's because Nintendo isn't evil. - Klarth, on 10/12/2007, -4/+16Sony weren't the first people to release a camera attachment for a game system. I'd like to introduce you to the Game Boy Camera.
...Although, saying that, it was somewhat different in functionality considering it was black-and-white, and only involved static images. - Mejogid, on 10/12/2007, -8/+18What would that be? I can't even begin to visualise it...
Also there's no way a 7gb sd card could be priced reasonably. I mean if apple can't do it with their iPods, no one can (I say this not as an apple fan boy, but someone who vaguely comprehends economics of scale). - jpcoombs, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12@Deadalus81
My thoughts exactly.
@popularme
What games do you see for the PS3? Please tell me which game is worth $650. Because I can buy the entire Wii lineup and still save money. Your pitching the games. Great, I think we can all agree to that. Sony is pitching a BLU-RAY HD-DVD player. They don't care about the games. They care about cutting into the HD-DVD market so that they can control that format.
Is there anything wrong with that? Hell no. Not from a business stand point. But if you look at every major gaming forum, Sony has become a punching bag. From a gaming stand point, the path that MS and Sony are on represents some major problems for the industry:
1. Producing games for these systems requires tripple that of Nintendo. And no, programming for the controller does not add THAT much to the production costs. This results in raised prices, less games and many many more sequels. Are the grpahics better? Absolutely. But the problem you run into is that creativity, risk taking, basically all facets of truly great games to a back seat to making up your initial investment.
2. Innovation is low priority. Let's take Nintendo out of hte picture. What big changes does this generation bring to the table. I would go as far as to say that the Xbox360 Live system is a big jump as far as online gaming is concerned. Sure, it's been for PC's for years now, but now it's for everyone. Good for the industry. But besides that, whats the number #1 feature for the PS3. Graphics? Ok. Next? Blu-Ray. That has NOTHING to do with gaming. It's a DVD player and that cost is being pushed onto the gaming industry because Sony has a bottom line. Put Nintendo back into the picture and you get the push for independent gaming, low dev costs, TONS of games, and of course the controller. That's all very good for the industry.
Yes, there some good games coming out for the PS2, which should tell you that this generation still has life in it. I remember the last switch over from PS. It was basically, goodbye PS, were moving along. To me, the generation we're leaving behind wasn't complete. Time will tell.
And don't use the "well, if it's too much, dont buy it" argument. That's tired. It is too much and I'm not buying it. However, theres a lot of people like me and that's why Sony has become a punching bag. They're putting their core audience second to their profits and bottom line.
Nintendo fan-boys didn't create this mess, Sony did. That's the reason Sony supporters get so angry. Because we're right. - bnoj13, on 10/12/2007, -3/+13I think it could VERY well be possible...but we'll find out come the July Game Informer, won't we?
- count_z, on 10/12/2007, -3/+13Also n "ray tracing" support? In realtime? No way... no even heavy-duty workstations can't ray-trace anything other than extremely simple objects at low resolution with limited ray-intersection in real-time, and even then at a relatively low FPS.
I'm not entirely sure about the PPU thing either, since it's been shown that PPUs demande more graphic power (since you've got a lot more objects to render with all of the explosions and particle effects... which doesn't seem to be what the Wii is all about). Also given the cost of adding a PPU, wouldn't they have been better served to beef-up the GPU and let it handle the physics functions (since ATI developed their GPU and they've demonstrated that in their PC video cards). - radda, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11Since Nintendo already said that it's not gonna cost more than $250, I don't see that as a problem. It's gonna be cheap, no matter what they put in it.
The camera doesn't seem all that useful though, as the Wiimote already does all of the motion sensing stuff...and the face mapping thing can backfire (i.e. little kids getting people they don't like put their face in a game so they can shoot them or whatever). - TehSuper, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10I think motion tech will be ready around November.
- rishubhav, on 10/12/2007, -8/+17I meant as an advantge over the Wii
- playerx, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10You are a big boy already, go on and play.
- Etheo, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10Hmm let's see:
1.) no source
2.) a forum post from random stranger with no credibility
3.) Con's only on the theoretical side and not hardware wise?
4.) 7GB of SD card?
5.) and the list goes on...
Don't get me wrong though, I'd like this to be true as much as the next fanboy, but this sounds like a madeup list instead of something to chew on. - bar10dr, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10"Playing old Nintendo games on the Wii will not move systems"
Talk for yourself Mr. know it all, it made the sale in my case. - chicken101, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10I hope this is true. Some of it sounds more likely than other parts, but the AI-controlled command-line interface sounds like BS to me.
- muleking, on 10/12/2007, -1/+81)The technology was there at e3 apparently, although it needs tweaking
2)Ninteno WIFI is already a huge sucess, although limited it has a greater percentage of users who own a DS than xbox live has
3)If you think emulators have a great enough penatration that it will negate the appeal of the virtual console to the masses you're living in a delusional geek bubble
4)Saturn coming out at $400 worked well for sega. Panasonic 3DO was a real deal too, they couldn't keep them on the shelves. - jpcoombs, on 10/12/2007, -4/+111) Analog control had 0 presence in 1996.
2) I belive the Nintendo WiFi system has had 1 million unique users since going online. Thats with like 6 games. I think they will do just fine. Just because its not xbox live does not mean it wont be fun and effective. Im not looking to get find out what percentage of every stroke I take in a Ping Pong game. I just want an opponent.
3) Thats wrong. Of the people that really ARE interested in playing retro software, most of them have no idea what emulation even means. You're thinking that the crowd that populates this and all the other gaming forums represents the masses. If you asked 10 random people if they were interested in playing old games through an emulator, only 2 would know what your talking about, if that.
4) Historically, gaming systems havent been hybrid HD-DVD players with un-proven market appeal. DVD was 4 years deep when PS2 jumped in with a DVD playback capability. And DVD represented a much improved jump from VHS, both in storage and ease of use. The jump isnt nearly as drastic for BluRay/HD-DVD and only time will tell who will win that battle (it may go the way of Laserdisc - no real winner, just a niche tech for film buffs). $600 for a gaming system? Yes, i think that will be fairly significant.
However, you are correct about Japan - is not nearly the factor that it used to be. But it will be difficult to declare PS3 or XBOX360 the winner of this generation when the XBOX owns the US market and the PS3 owns the japanese and the two systems break even in the European markets (which is what I believe will happen).
I think motion technology gaming is far past due. People want something new. I was supremely disapointed when the PS3 controller was unveiled. No innovation and I feel that it is just time for gaming to try something new.
Nintendo's approach so far has been nearly flawless in my opinion. If motion technology doesn't bite now, I don't know what else it will take. Guess we will be stuck with analog controllers for 10 more years. - Daedalus81, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9You really seem to be grapsing at straws and flip-flopping.
You said:
"My point wasn't that one company was evil or not evil based on their goal for profits my point was your answer. "
But earlier you used that exact point to aid Sony, why?
"While the other companies are taking a huge loss to get there console to you Nintendo going to be churning quite a profit, but there still far less evil than any other company right?"
Nintendo people are entirely capable of having their own perspective. Simply because they agree with Nintendo doesn't make them in the palm of Nintendo's hand or biased.
And on the subject of the actual article i'm sure it is all crap...none true... - dracula7, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6well it is confirmed that indie developers will be able to distribute their games over the virtual console..
- foofightrs777, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8This has to be BS.
1. SD cards "reasonably priced" at 7 gigs?
2. Chipsets to incorporate research from Project Reality study....Yeah Project Reality aka Nintendo 64
3. a "development interface that centers on a AI-controlled command-line interface"? I could be ignorant but to me that sounds like Hollywood tech talk where they have to "defibrilate the flux capacitor in order to initialize the AI caching sub-routines".
4. I highly doubt that NIntendo would create a mesh network which allowed you to use others' net connections. Isn't this on shaky legal ground?
5. A wireless headset would seem to defeat the purpose and be partially redundant in light of the speaker on the remote.
6. Development will be cheap, but also cost near 360 and PS# levels?
7. Surprising Nintendo would reverse its camera stance after the Perfect Dark debacle. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+9Nice! Let's hope it's true!
The "Make your own games" idea is great! - rishubhav, on 10/12/2007, -7/+12Ouch. Looks like Son'y won't even have the EyeToy anymore "
-Wii will include a built-in decent resolution camera that can be used to add your face to character models and add innovation to games. These snapshots can be tweaked as well. It is still being decided whether to allow camera to record and stream video. Mention made to have this feature be a strong feature in online play." - xodex, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4I don't think Wii is capable of Ray-Tracing, But if it is... DAMN! What's stopping small powerful clustered workstations from doing it with out low resolutions and low fps.
- bigpixl, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7Again, it's called the Gameboy Camera.
- Tiberius, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5"3) Those that are truly interested in retro nintendo gaming are already doing it with emulators." - Not necessarily. Alot of people who are interested in it have no idea that emulators even exist. I know alot of people who grew up with nintendos, but never had the know-how in computers. They wouldn't know what to do and where to look for emulators. I think you are giving the layman interested in old games too much credit.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -6/+10I put a ton more information together about similarities on this and previous articles here! This is getting crazy!
http://www.wii-volution.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=97 - Optimus, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Who calls their penis a "wee"? I've heard weewee, but never wee. The jokes were broken and lame from day one.
- Tsuroerusu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"Funny how times have changed - Nintendo was once filing lawsuits against companies who made games for Nintendo hardware (Tengen aka Atari) without permission..."
I personally think it's because Nintendo has a good president these days. Satoru Iwata is not some kind of office-***** like the idiots at the RIAA and MPAA, he has a major in computer science and was a game developer himself at HAL Labs., 'ey he probably still gives a few people some hints here and there, who knows?
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satoru_Iwata)
Nintendo's previous president Hiroshi Yamauchi, really had his moments man, you could practically write a book with really weird quotes from that guy, but hey, I'll give him credit where credit is due, he turned Nintendo into a video game company from more of a toy/card game maker.
Notice how radically Nintendo's strategies and ideas have changed since Satoru Iwata became their president, the DS was something absolutely new, and the Wii is just the same, I may sound like an Iwata-fanboy here, but it's just ironic that shortly after Nintendo gets a completely new president, Satoru Iwata is the first Nintendo president who is not related to Nintendo's original founder Fusajiro Yamauchi who founded the company in 1889, they start doing completely new stuff. Coincidence? - dracula7, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4look at the nintendo ds,, the 1st generation games didnt take full advantage of the touch screen - but as time when on developers learned to use the hardware effectively. what we learned from e3 is that these things do work,,its a matter of developers interpretating the data now which will happen
nintendo's wifi service for the DS has been amazingly successfulddddf - Joyrex, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6It's been stated before that Nintendo wants to encourage developers to make basic, fun games for low development costs - there's no reason why that wouldn't include homebrew games as well.
Sony did it with the PS1 Yarouze (remember the black PS1 running Linux?), and I think they even released a "best of" on CD of all the Yarouze games that were worthy at that time.
Funny how times have changed - Nintendo was once filing lawsuits against companies who made games for Nintendo hardware (Tengen aka Atari) without permission... - dharm, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5affordable true, fun... looks fun, but time will tell... i can see myself having fun with wii controller, i can also see myself throwing the damn thing when its out of whack...
its not even out yet, and most things are speculation... -
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