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DX9 games run faster on Vista than XP
gamespot.com — What's interesting is that Yerli told us that if you have Windows Vista and an older DirectX 9 card, you should still see better performance with Windows Vista than Windows XP, even if the hardware remains unchanged. "DirectX 9 on Vista will run faster throughout due to the better device driver model..."
estvir- 690 diggs
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- jontintinjordan, on 10/12/2007, -63/+9But if you have Vista and a DX9 graphics card, you won't be able to take full advantage of DX10 games, which presumably is one of the main points of upgrading to Vista in the first place?
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -7/+54Congratulations, you have totally missed the point of this Digg.
It's not about playing DX10 games, it's pointing out that [apparently] DX9 games run better on Vista than XP, which is a huge suprise.
DX10 is a great reason to upgrade, if you're a GAMER, if you're not, there are more than enough reasons, start here - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Features_new_to_Windows_Vista - jer2eydevil88, on 10/12/2007, -16/+44@estvir
I'm sorry but when a company calls DRM a good reason to upgrade to a new platform I think they are crazier than a guy who goes shopping in a tinfoil hat.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Features_new_to_Windows_Vista#Digital_Rights_Management - mastercheif, on 10/12/2007, -17/+8This might not be true at all. For people with 1GB of ram or less, it wont happen. Vista is hogging more ram than ever before, and if you don't have 2GB and your doing harcore gaming, you are not going to have the same FPS as you would with XP.
- samnmax, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15I'm not sure Vista being faster, at least for this one specific game, is that much of a surprise. I guess it's sort of sad that people seem to expect a newer Microsoft operating system to only introduce more bloat, but they do actually optimize things.
I think one of the more interesting aspects of the Vista video driver model is that most of the driver is run in user space rather than kernel space. This should make development of drivers much simpler, as developers will be able to make use of user space debuggers. As well, it makes it easier to 'reset' the video card if something goes wrong, which it often does unfortunately, instead of the whole operating system. - endy64, on 10/12/2007, -11/+2I wonder how much Vista is going to be, wouldn't it be just as good to buy a newer graphics card?
- goat77, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Endy, you will need a new graphics card for DX10... so you'll end up spending quite a bit for all the advantages.
- DuoPros, on 10/12/2007, -10/+4Did you read the part of the DRM bit that say's:
'Rights Management Services (RMS) support, a technology that will allow corporations to apply DRM-like restrictions to corporate documents, email, and intranets to protect them from being copied, printed, or even opened by people not authorized to do so.'
That sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. - Fentekreel, on 10/12/2007, -5/+2i cant see the hardware working any better in vista than on xp....except for the possibility that vista has higher hardware requirements to run....
- cquinnd, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4 Fentekreel
Better kernel, better drivers, better driver model, optimization for the kernel, supported apis and drivers.
Just the idea that under the new GUI interface the game no longer has to force the system to switch over to using the GPU for additional rendering should make most games faster in comparison.
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -7/+54Congratulations, you have totally missed the point of this Digg.
- RichPowers, on 10/12/2007, -3/+14heh if I wasn't such a hardcore gamer, I would've stopped buying Windows years ago. This is great news.
- LR2_, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9This was covered on DigitalLifeTV with Patrick Norton and Robert Heron.
Here is the link to the episode: http://dl.tv/blogs/digitallifetv/archive/2006/07/25/16710.aspx- gwolf, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I would pay $100 to get more FPS. Gameing PC's are expensive to keep up to date, that's cheap by comparison.
- jer2eydevil88, on 10/12/2007, -14/+4As great as this sounds... for the target audience.. I have a feeling Microsoft won't end up selling many people a $400 copy of Windows Vista just to get better FPS in a game.
- goat77, on 10/12/2007, -7/+9Perhaps they won't. Perhaps people will get systems with vista preinstalled, or perhaps people will pirate it, or perhaps they'll buy it not only for the extra FPS, but for all the new features.
- Clbck, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8Isn't it supposed to only cost around $100?
- glafira, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5You would be surprised.
- vertigoblue, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4its only going to be around $100 OEM just like XP has always been...
- Jugalator, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2"I have a feeling Microsoft won't end up selling many people a $400 copy of Windows Vista just to get better FPS in a game."
Perhaps not, but Dell and others will sell new cool Intel Core 2 Duo's *or* upcoming quad-core Athlon's and either equals Vista sales for Microsoft. They didn't have retail sales as a main source of income to grow this big.
- goat77, on 10/12/2007, -8/+4I heard about this on DL.tv, it's great. I can't wait for DX10 (and nvidia's G80)
- StatusQuoRules, on 10/12/2007, -11/+3ATI R600 FTW!
Maybe next generation nvidia will let you use AA HDR at the same time...? - NightBlade40, on 10/12/2007, -4/+3@StatusQuoRules
You can now, I play Far Cry with both AA and HDR enabled on my 6600GT.
- StatusQuoRules, on 10/12/2007, -11/+3ATI R600 FTW!
- psYcon, on 10/12/2007, -17/+10The latest build of Vista is still slower for DX9 games:
http://anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2805&p=2- goat77, on 10/12/2007, -17/+15It's called a beta.
- Promantarius, on 10/12/2007, -6/+24You can't use the "It's a beta" phrase to nullify all negative comments. He noted it was the current build that he's referring to, and is simply pointing out that their promises are hollow at this point; DirectX 9 games on Vista are not faster yet. DirectX 9 games might run faster when Vista is released, no one knows for sure - theoretically they should (according to Microsoft), but reality hasn't proven it yet.
It's pretty premature to listen to what Microsoft (or any other large company for that matter) says will happen in the future, if they have no solid proof outside the realm of theory. - goat77, on 10/12/2007, -14/+5Well I guess I just appreciate logic more than a general distrust of large companies.
- Araya213, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6Where is the logic in beliveing something that cannot be proven, and at the present time has been disproven?
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -5/+7If you actually take a look at that article, you'll see some interesting things.
First, look at the CPU usage of Aero, it's down to 15%, which is half of Beta2 and uses about a third of what XP does.
Second HL2, it's improving, so the next builds will also and they actually aren't very far away from XPs performance.
Third, app performance is barely different, considering what all these morons shout like "Bloatware" and whatever else they feel like repeating.
That article shows that they're actually improving, a lot, and they still have a bit until release.
- earthtoandy, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8Will there be any DX9 games left when vista finally comes out?? :D
it will be retro gaming by then.- KibibyteBrain, on 10/12/2007, -0/+16Oh, my friend, you must not get to Gaming LAN Cafes too much. To this day, there always seems to be some people playing Counterstrike. Always. I am certain in 2050, this will still be the case. In short, there are always people who will play the same games forever, especially FPS and RTS games, and to them at least, those games never become "retro".
- goat77, on 10/12/2007, -12/+3To be fair, counterstrike SOURCE is a dx9 game.
- earthtoandy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7I am a big fan of playing old dos games like Blake Stone or Red Baron. Man good times. Reminds me of a simpler time
by the way i was just kidding, of course they will be around. I was just making a joke as to vistas delayed release schedule..... - Linkage155, on 10/12/2007, -19/+3>>KibibyteBrain
Dude, wtf are you talking about? Of course people play CS, it's only like the greatest game in the universe (well, sort of) but still, what do you spect us to play? some single player game? Please! - ilLH, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9Diablo II and Starcraft.
- icefrakker, on 10/12/2007, -0/+11"Of course people play CS, it's only like the greatest game in the universe"
you know, that reminds me of that idiot in ctrl alt del who works in the gameshop - spindrift, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4Hey dude, wanna see my leet CS models??!?
- romainechester, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5"you know, that reminds me of that idiot in ctrl alt del who works in the gameshop"
Hehe.. Rob... - an0nym0us, on 10/12/2007, -5/+5In soviet korae, starcraft plays you!
- JorgeGT, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2I'm forwarding his comment to Tim of Ctrl-Alt-Del
- soulpiercer7, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3right on.
- sirmasterboy, on 10/12/2007, -4/+4I'm only getting Vista if it will run Duke Nukem Forever faster than XP!
:-P- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -3/+18Welcome to the club, you're the 40290393 person to make the same joke.
/hands masterboy a medal and a cookie.
Run along now !
I kid, I kid.
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -3/+18Welcome to the club, you're the 40290393 person to make the same joke.
- spindrift, on 10/12/2007, -11/+2lolz, does it have bigger pipes so I can bittorrent an Internets of the Daily Show talking about Duke Nukem Forever while running a Xen virtualization of Ubuntu?
- ImTheDarkcyde, on 10/12/2007, -7/+4the biggest problem is the nvidia64 drivers suck so horrendously on vista that you'd have difficulty proving this
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6And it's obvious that NVidia drivers on Vista are improving and that have quite a bit of time to finish working on them before Vista is released.
So, what's your point ? You don't really have a valid reason to complain, if all you're saying is "Oh noes, driver support on the beta is bad lolol." - goffy59, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2It will be good in this up coming year.
- ImTheDarkcyde, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3sure i do, when i still can't play half life 2 on vista, there's still a problem
and its not just a case of "lol no hl2 means bad os"- openGL is broke PERIOD for me in vista, which means i can't even play quake3, or many of my other games - MioTheGreat, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2The nVidia drivers suck for Vista x86 too. If you have a Geforce 6 series card, you're pretty much SOL with their drivers. I wish they'd just put out a new release. It's been like 2 months.
- ZergyPoo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5"sure i do, when i still can't play half life 2 on vista, there's still a problem"
No you don't, you're complaining about lack of driver support for an OS that hasn't even been released yet. If it's released and the driver support is still bad, then come back here and complain, otherwise, please shut the hell up. - cquinnd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I've been playing half life 2 on Vista since Beta 2, using drivers downloaded from Nvidia's site.
Half Life 2 is directx not OpenGL. For a OpenGL game you need something like Sin 1, which I have
been playing since a later driver release about three weeks after Beta 2 came out.
Playing (or have played)
Half Life 2 SMOD
Half Life 2: Lost Coast
Half Life 2: Episode 1
Sin: Emergence
Sin 1
Half Life 2.
I don't do much gameplay, but I would be happy to fire up Half Life 1 to confirm it still runs as well.
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6And it's obvious that NVidia drivers on Vista are improving and that have quite a bit of time to finish working on them before Vista is released.
- goffy59, on 10/12/2007, -9/+16Again more morons from digg miss the ***** point. Thats great games on vista work better then windows xp (direct x 9). And for those who are so obsessed with drm or whatever.... get over it.. its just like xp, theres way around it. Stop ruining digg.
- endy64, on 10/12/2007, -11/+5Ahhh, and when DRM bites you in the ass you can always install Linux, say sorry and all will be well ;)
- goat77, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6I applaud you, goffy.
- goffy59, on 10/12/2007, -6/+4@endy64 Or the article has nothing to do with linux and I can find a program to get rid of the drm altogether. Remember I have nothing against linux, my server runs great.
@ goat77 I'm glad we both agree heh! - jer2eydevil88, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8@goffy59
Maybe more of us "morons" care more about DRM than gaining some game-play performance. In any case Digg is all about letting people decide what they want to talk about. If you want a "content site" to discuss news articles without members who are able to "ruin" that site then maybe Netscape.com is your new Digg.
@goat77
I can tell from your other posts that your highly anticipating this new technology because your into gaming. I think its great that Microsoft's new operating system will include features geared toward gamers. I find it wonderful that they can eek out better performance from the current generation of games. I still feel strongly that including DRM and parental controls for computers is not necessary. If you disagree fine, mod me down, do it the (diggers) democratic way. - JorgeGT, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3@jer2eydevil88
Of course a person whose avatar is the Apple logo doesn't care abour games ;-)
Nah, seriously it's a good comment, so clear and polite. But I think DRM for your documents it's a good idea. I'm tired of people using my work! Also, it offers new ways to companies to offer us new products. I'll be glad to rent a cheap ($2-$3) movie that self-destructs after three days, for example.
And parental controls is necessary. Restrain the children from playing mature games or browse inadequate internet content will avoid people like Jack Thompson blaming videogames and Internet. It will give parents true and *easy* control over what their kids do.
- goffy59, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4To commet on the people who dont like single player. There are still real games left who enjoy a good story and the gameplay. Most games coming out are all the same. Theres no difference in Guild Wars, WOW, and ever quest.
Games life Half Life 2 or quake 4 still give me hope of great game play. I never really liked multiplayer because orginally games were mostly single player and back then games were alot more fun. Doom 3 was a peice of crap and a disapointment for most gamers. On counter strike you do the same ***** over and over again, at least one battlefield 2, the more you play, the most medals and guns you get.
Im waiting for deus ex 3, half life 2 series/half life 3, and much more.- ShakeWell, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2you sir, obviously have never played one or both of WoW and Guild Wars... no difference? pishposh.
- blueigloo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"no difference? pishposh"
Having played both - I can say they are both HUGE wastes of time and money (Guildwars being less waste of money) - ShakeWell, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0won't try to convince you that those games aren't a waste of money (to you), you are entitled to your opinions after all...
but, how is them being a waste of money supposed to be an argument against my statement that they are very different games? please enlighten me
- WiBu, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5I might get pie on my face but the reason why people aren't seeing the increased build in current builds of Vista is because it is not yet using the new driver model and the new dx9 (which will come out with dx10, it has another name other than dx9 but I forget) is not functional.
- goffy59, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2I was saying theres TONS of ways around DRM. of course Im concerned with DRM. But this was about gaming in vista/xp. Not DRM.
- radiofrequency, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1Is it just me, or are the screenshots of crysis starting to look more cartoony (less realistic) the closer it gets to release?
As far as performance, benchmarks of //currently available games// show them running faster in XP than in Vista.
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1697,1969002,00.asp- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Yes, we've already covered this, it's due to performance optimisations not being done (Until recently anyway, in 5472) and drivers not available or in early stages.
- WhispSil, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0I'll be really surprised if they tell the contrary... They don't want to give another reason not to switch
- ChileanGoD, on 10/12/2007, -5/+1Is this another proof that XP was a piece of crap in the first place?
- estvir, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6No, this is proof that the new device driver model in Vista is good.
- BrainedChild, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1I call shenanigans on this rumor. I couldnt even get Warrock to run on Vista. and warrock will run on ANYTHING
- aggies11, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3DirectX 9.0L should be faster/optomized. They've been saying that for a while now. Obviously they aren't quite there yet with the beta. But it's still a beta afterall, and not even a Releae Canditate yet.
Only the final product will tell.
Aggies - TheGrizah, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1That's pretty nice and interesting. Although I've been waiting to upgrade just for Vista and DX10, and DX10 cards anyways.
- 12340987, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1Is MS not going to release DX10 for XP?
- odiHnaD, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Ya'll might call me crazy but running WoW on my Laptop (Dell D820 w/nVidia 120m) I noticed a nice jump in frames from XP to vista (10fps increase minimum) and that's running on the public beta version with sketchy drivers, I'm looking forward to see what the final release can do for gaming performance...
- ChileanGoD, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Any benchmarks for UT2K4 ?..
- BassCadet, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1BTW, Prey doesn't work on Vista. :(
- psych0fish, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1FTA: "Yerli told us that if you have Windows Vista and an older DirectX 9 card, you should still see better performance with Windows Vista than Windows Xp"
If this is true, then why do I see a %30 drop in framerates for counter strike:source?
They didn't do any benchmarks, and they have no data to back up that claim.
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