What is Digg?61 Comments
- LogicBomB, on 10/12/2007, -9/+34I guess that means you found the wrong news story to reply to then didn't you?
- badken, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15Unimpressive graphics? What are you nuts? Or are you playing it on some shared memory Intel video chip?
C&C 3 graphics are top-notch. Each unit has a unique look--many of them have hilarious idle animations (mechanical walker artillery scratching behind its "ears" for example). This is the first RTS I've played that uses the nifty heat & blast wave "mirage" effects. As far as the environments are concerned, the cities in this game look like actual cities, and the variety of landscapes, from the lived-in, lush green "blue zones" to the creepy, dead looking, ion-cloud covered, "red zones".
The "strategic elements" thing is a personal preference, I guess. Like any RTS, you can choose to only use a limited set of tactics, or you can exercise the full gamut. C&C 3 has more than enough strategic depth to keep it interesting for me. It's fast paced (or slow paced if you set it that way in skirmish options). The game has all the ingredients: squishy infantry, fast moving raid vehicles, tough tanks, a good variety of air units, long-range artillery type units (which are actually air units for one faction!), super-units and super-weapons. The only thing it's really lacking is waterborne units, but its maps are small enough that hovercraft, ships & subs wouldn't have much room to maneuver anyway.
That said, I don't play online, where currently one or two overpowered strategies tend to rule the roost. EA promises a balance patch to shake things up a bit--we'll see. Their history of fixing things with patches has been a bit dodgy. - LucasKane, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8NOD MUST AQUIRE NEW LANDS
- mrgreen4242, on 10/12/2007, -8/+16I think that the trouble with RTS games on consoles they're all ports. Sure, the RTS control scheme for a PC is going to be better, and the game will be balanced around that, but a control setup for game designed for consoles from the ground up, and balanced around that setup could be good.
Controllers have more buttons than they used to, and the extra analog stick (compared to the N64 controller, which I still think is one of the best ever made) which helps. Voice command in a reality now, too. Most 360 owners have headsets, and there's enough power to do decent voice commands - even if you have to go through a training routine first. You could EASILY have a system that lets you string together a bunch of commands from a menu, and then assign your own voice command to that to replace the macro system.
Just off the top of my head, "select all (unit type or category)" and "select all visible (optional unit type)" would clear up most of the issues with gamepads and RTS games. The motion sensitivity of even just the PS3 (that is, just accelerometers) might be helpful for panning and zooming through maps as well. Again, my points are that (1) console controllers and control methods are evolving, and (2) an RTS designed from the ground up for a console would probably handle a lot better than a port.
I've heard that Battle for Middle Earth was a really good console RTS, but I've not tried it yet. It's on my list for later in the year though. - vypergts, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6C&C3 is fun and one of the best in the series but I mainly like the cast they assembled for the cut-scenes: Michael Ironside (SeaQuest, Starship Troopers), Billy Dee Williams (no credit necessary), Grace Park (BSG), Tricia Helfer (BSG), and Josh Holloway (Lost). Any game with Lando in it automatically gets bonus points in my book.
http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/775/775650p1.html - marspidey, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Yeah if the demo doesn't really impress me I'll just have to get it for PC. Though Battle for Middle-Earth 2 for 360 was pretty well done for being on a console.
- BritishGolgo13, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8Me for one.
- cyberdude191, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8@chingy1788
You can use a keyboard with the 360 after the spring update! - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -6/+10i got into command and conquer after playing red alert on playstation. so far 3 is great, i intend on getting a 360, if for nothing else, just to play command and conquer on it.
- jacenat, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6my pc is worth about 350 bucks and can play cnc3 damn fine in 1280x800.
not to mention that it also complets other tasks such as transcoding, compiling, web-hosting ... all these things pc's can do ... - autocrawler, on 10/12/2007, -5/+9"can play like $2000+ gaming computer?"
Stop over exaggerating please. I built my PC for about ~$1000 a year ago, and it runs C&C3 PC in 1080p nearly fully maxed out on my HDTV. That kind of visual quality is something the console version can not reach
Yes, PCs cost more than consoles do, but consider the fact that they are able to provide THE most definitive experience, if you are willing to pay for it. - Dot0, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6"You can use a keyboard with the 360 after the spring update!"
Only for IMing though. I remember MS expressly stating that they aren't going to support Kb/M controls. I guess they don't want to reduce the PC's player base, which is good for PC gamers such as myself. - dclowd9901, on 10/12/2007, -5/+9Two Words: Achievement Points.
- jacenat, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5"I wonder: is the PC version of C&C3 so "dumbed down" because EA wanted to easily port it to X360?"
no. it has responsive controls and a very slick designed interface.
i am actually impressed such good things can grow in the abomination ea represents.
um yeah .. you can download the pc demo if you wanna test it.
its out for 5 weeks or so now. has 2 singleplayer missions and full skirmish support. - jacenat, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"Can I have a list of your specs so I can believe your claim of $350 PC?"
3800+ am2 -> 70€
1024mb ram @800 -> 55€
motherboard (pci-e x16 + ram 800 support) -> 50€
8600 gt -> 130€
80 gig sata hd -> 35€
tower + powersupply -> 35€
dvd drive -> 12€
sums up to ~390€, which is 40€ over my 350 mark. however, you can save these 40€ by getting a gf7 midrange gfx card. so to speak, this pc is capable of more than the x360, while costing even less. the only "advantage" the x360 has right now are exclusive titles, fixed/dedicated hardware (which can be "exploited" better) and ... um, thats it. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5The demo for this will make me buy or pass-by this game. I will purchase the pc version if it fails to satisfy me. But, full 360 cam support is a unique deal.
- RichPowers, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6I wonder: is the PC version of C&C3 so "dumbed down" because EA wanted to easily port it to X360?
Had C&C3 been released even a year ago, I might've been impressed. But with Company of Heroes and Supreme Commander under my belt, I can't help but view C&C3 as a relic of the past. You're basically paying $40 to see fancy cutscenes with Michael Ironside and Billy Dee. The units are fairly boring -- the opposite of what you expect in a C&C game. - jacenat, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4"No offense chingy1788, but your statistics are somewhat flawed. "Actions" on the PC are measured by movements of the mouse from start to rest and by depressing any button."
thats not accurate.
starcraft-broodwar and warcraft3-the frozen throne BOTH define an action as:
a mouse- or keyboard-button pressed. just 1 action per key/buttonpress. still, many experienced players have around 200 actions per minute average over the whole game.
have you ever watched a first person starcraft scene? i'd recommend to watch this
http://youtube.com/watch?v=0OXypreRnZQ
and say again that this are flawed statistics. and NO this is not sped up ... this is actual, live gameplay.
on consoles, this surely is unthinkable ... - ShiftingSilence, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4It ought to be interesting if anything at all...Command and Conquer 3 is good enough that whatever system it came out on, I would look into getting it
- Lennalf, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@ Allanon:
That keyboard/mouse is $90 and third-party, and I *highly* doubt it will give people access to things like hotkeys for unit building or hotkeys for group selection, since there would be no equivalent on the controller.
If you want to play C&C3 on keyboard/mouse, just play it on PC. It's not like it requires the latest and greatest hardware. I will be interested to see how people react to this game... consolers might like it since they won't have anything for comparison, but I bet PC gamers will be just abhorred by it. - wageslaven, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Hardly. PC Gaming is not dying at all. It is still the largest gaming platform on earth, but, it _is_ not growing at the same rate as consoles.
MS is bringing the two communites closer together with Games for Windows and Games for Windows Live!
Ive heard the same tired canard regarding the state of PC gaming for 25 years. As long as PCs are the most powerfull computing devices -- and the most numerous, people are going to play games on them. Games were to PCs as Porn was to VCRs -- PC gaming isnt going anywhere. - wageslaven, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3FUD Much?
Command and Conquer gets a 85/100 from Meta Critic -- thats a damn solid score based on 33 reviews.
A half a dozen scores over 90, including a 100/100 score.
http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/pc/commandandconquer3tiberiumwars?q=command%20and%20conquer
XBox 360 owners are going to see a damn solid RTS. The best reviewed RTS on a 7th Gen Console to date. - tendonut, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5Now you also have to remember the majority of the console users will not have HDTVs. Playing an RTS on a low resolution standard def TV will be a task all in it's own. Too many small objects on screen just doesn't work on a standard TV
- SimianSamurai, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1I play this game online, which is strange because I usually don't like playing any games on Live. This one, however, is a blast because there's all sorts of players out there that use different strategies. I've gotten pretty decent at NOD and GDI, and use different strategies depending on whether I want to trounce their base right away or have time to build a massive army of Mammies or Avatars.
- cannonstar, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3The news article was posted yesterday, so the demo should be out today, right?
- Allanon, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5@ chingy1788
There are mouse and keyboard attachment for the 360:
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/gadgets/xcm-brings-pc+style-gaming-to-your-360-217332.php
edit: Cybergy1799 was faster :( - ElectroBot, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1replying to beepsy and MSX2:
1) by changing most of the defaults to "Ctrl+ " they're making everybody either adapt or change the keys - there's no reason why the should've been changed (I haven't tryed all the keys but I think they also got rid of the "e" key (select all of type across screen, accross map) - the q key sucks - i don't want to send orcas when i'm being attacked by good anti-air vehicles.
2) ever played a game with 100 marines rushing at your base - sometimes fun (especially with the commando or attack dogs guarding the base)
3) map editor isn't going to be able to change map size limits.
4) i agree with not being able to transport the mammoth (would've been fun though to ambush a network player with 2 or 3 mammoths from behind his base. But not being able to transport a commando, a rocketeer, and an enginner in one transport sucks (one is less visible)
5) the mammoth is too powerful (almost-maybe) with it being anti-tank, anti-air and good anti-infrantry (after promotion)
6) i like them (more things to control/worry about/use as potential attack vectors
7) it would be cool for network play though - i agree that you'd have to have the ability to disable viewing/broadcasting to/from certain/all players. - cannonstar, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3I didn't say anything about webhosting, transcoding, or anything. I'm referring to the gaming capabilities. Maybe the number is outdated but at the time when x360 launched a year and half ago, I'm sure the price figure was around $2000. I'm not denying that PC can do better than x360, I'm just saying that for the matter of convienence, most people would rather go and buy a console to play ports than buying all the custom parts and build a gaming rig that can give x360 a run for its money. Also not many people have the technical experience nor the time to get best parts for the buck.
- Wytefang, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Nope, not nuts. Played it on a 7900GTX 512mb with 2 gig RAM and a sweet proc and yep, still fugly and average-looking. Maybe the problem is that you and several reviewers out there I can think of, are 1). Just used to average graphics or haven't played Company of Heroes or SupCom on high. C&C 3 easily looks like a game from 4 years ago, which it basically is since they use only a slightly modified version of the C&C Generals engine. or 2). Fans of the series can't bear to separate themselves from their love of the series long enough to acknowledge the truth.
I've spoken to a good random chunk of gamers at several LANs recently, all of whom admit that C&C 3 features so-so graphics. Sure, some liked it anyway but at least they were honest enough to admit that it's a throwback game offering no modern features (other than the gamecast thing) and extremely simplistic strategic gameplay. Just a yawner all around, really. - SimianSamurai, on 10/10/2007, -0/+1the 360 has an awesome control scheme, and once you get the hang of it, it becomes very functional. Click A on a unit to select it. Holding Left Trigger while clicking A selects all units on the screen at the time. Hold Right Bumper and clicking A selects all units of those types.
Single click A on a destination and they travel straight there. Double click A on the destination and they will fight their way there.
And the best part... you don't have to travel all the way back to your base just to build stuff, you can hold Right Trigger and just press up, down, left, and right on the D-pad in the on-screen menu. Or just click the Left Thumbstick to take you right to your construction yard (or barracks if you don't have one).
Finding special units like Engineers or Commandos is as easy and just pressing Right on the D-Pad at any time.
I LOVE THIS GAME - Wytefang, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@ RichPowers: Very well said. Couldn't agree with you more. It seems that casual RTS fans or diehard C&C fans are the only ones really impressed by this mediocre game, most solid RTS fans have already written it off for being clunky and average-looking at best.
To Jacenet, were you playing the same game we all were? Because the UI was anything BUT slick. Take building a structure for example - first you have to click on an icon to first research the building you want, then when that's done, you have to go back and click on it to buy it (again there's a timer to wait for), THEN you have to click on the icon to actually place the building. That's slick? Don't think so. - ElectroBot, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1C&C 3 is a really great game, but EA did screw up in some areas.
1) (MOST ANNOYING) totally changed the keyboard/mouse shortcuts (right click to attack, left click to deselect?, "Ctrl-A" to attack/perform action instead of the standard C&C/RA "A"?, etc.)
2) no ability to select tech level in skirmish/network mode (I'd like to be able to play a tank war game for instance)
3) the large skirmish/network maps are barely bigger (if not smaller) than Red Alert's (from 1998) - come on! give me a map that I can get lost on and one where it takes 2-5 minutes to move from opposing corners. Today's computers can handle it.
4) transports (APC and the Call-for-transport aircraft) can only carry 1 unit and can't carry the mammoth tank
5) 5 non-promoted mammoth tanks can wipe out an computer enemy base (with most surviving) [lack of unit balance]
6) still no sea units except support/mission objective units in campaign mode
7) including VOIP was cool, but VideoOIP would've been cooler (quite a few notebooks are now coming with integrated cameras and quite a lot of people have webcams - 320x240 or even 160x120 in that small video/map window would've been really cool.
I miss Westwood. EA sucks. - maaddmax, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Its not a playable demo. I was all excited. All that was released was a video of a demo...
- beepsy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@jacenat
First I want to agree that I can't imagine a console player being equally effective as a computer player at the same RTS unless there were some additional benefits giving to the console, or a gimped UI.
With that said, APM (actions per minute) are horrible indicators, I use to be fairly descent at both SC and WC3 and if you watch any replays you'll see the players selecting and unselecting units simply to boost these numbers (back when people were impressed by that). - beepsy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@ElectroBot - no ill will just clarifying on some of your points.
1) keys are remapable, I haven't found any that aren't, if there are some then I apologize and point given.
2) point given, however its not a feature I'd personally want.
3) point given, RTS games now a days should come with a map editor for just this sort of thing.
4) I'm sure the mammoth tank thing was done for balance purposes, with that said it doesn't bother me that much on the 1 per limit.
5) I'm not sure how much lack of balance it is rather than just poor AI scripting, very few RTS AIs are any good. I remember being able to beat the computer in SC with 1 SCV and 1 marine doesn't mean they are imbalanced. With that said if they imbalanced it will hopefully be addressed.
6) I hated sea units in WC2, I was relieved when they were removed in WC3, personal preference I guess.
7) I understand what your saying, but I don't see it adding much to the game, and I can only imagine the issues EA would have when large hairy fat men start exposing themselves on the camera. - wageslaven, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1bury
- wageslaven, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2Supreme Commander being a great game doesnt mean C&C3 wont be. Dont be a sync, not everyone wants to exclusively play games on their PC (nor on their console).
There are different games for different platoforms, the "Peak Expereince in each Genre" (Supreme Commander for instance) doesnt mean someone cant enjoy another Very Good game of the same genre elsewhere.
Do we need to buy every platoform and only buy The Single Top Game of each genre to be sufficiently entertained? No... i dont think so. - Corinthos, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I used to love playing the Red Alert games on PS1 with the link cable back in the day. I don't like the post Westwood Command and Conquers though so i won't be getting this.
- TRUEPATRIOT, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2well its not out yet all that other stuff is but not the demo
- xymor, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2Right now RTS in consoles is pathetic.
Sure BfME had somewhat good controls, but playing RTS with thumb sticks just sucks.
They might work in Wii with the point thing, but then we'll stumble another technical dificulty, army sizes.
PC have massive amounts of ram, and that allows massive amounts of units(massive being 500+). I remember you barely could play BfME on 360 with 4 players, Wii would have trouble with 2 players. - xerus, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1RUBBER SHOES IN MOTION..
***** wrong game. :I - diggernaught, on 10/12/2007, -5/+4Will it come with a simple mouse? if not then is trash.
- cannonstar, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1That isn't really what we're talking about... I'm talking about why people prefers getting consoles over custom built PCs due to convenience, though I really question your claim of $350 PC.
1) I was speaking in terms of all ports, I never said they were better than PC.
2&3) CnC3 will be avaliable for x360 in May, I don't see a huge price drop for PC coming before that.
I'm not arguing about the graphical capabilities, I'm arguing about the cost and convenience, not all of us are computer geeks who put some time aside to devote to building and optimizing gaming rigs and then upgrading the rig every 6 months or so.
Can I have a list of your specs so I can believe your claim of $350 PC? - cannonstar, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1sorry wrong post.
- jacenat, on 10/12/2007, -4/+2thing is:
-) cnc3 is the game we are talking here
-) cnc3 wasn't (and isn't) out for the x360.
-) so wen cnc3 will be availible on both plattforms, pcs that can "outperform" the x360 in the game, will be cheaper than the x360.
if you want to play cnc3, getting a x360 would be a stupid idea. as well as for playing all the other half-assed ports.
noone can deny that in terms of visual fidelity versus cost, the pc will be on top of things almost all the time. just around the new release of consoles, they are significantly cheaper than pcs that are capable of the same ... - OUberLord, on 10/12/2007, -5/+3No offense chingy1788, but your statistics are somewhat flawed. "Actions" on the PC are measured by movements of the mouse from start to rest and by depressing any button.
To move around the map, you use the joystick on the 360 controller, the entire move of which is one action even if the direction is changed. On a keyboard you would be using two or three keys, some of which pressed multiple times, to achieve the same result. It's not unforeseeable that the same "action" on a 360 controller to pan the view could take 8 "actions" on a PC keyboard.
Either way, Battle for Middle Earth II worked pretty decently on the 360, so who knows. - MSX2, on 10/12/2007, -3/+11. Bind your own keys lazy ass
2. and?
3. wait for map editor
4. I'd like to see you carry a mammoth tank
5. Stop crying, go play mammoth tanks then
6. ever heard of future expansion packs?
7. VideoOverIP? Err you want to see videos of other dudes...I prefer VOIP or not knowing what my opponent looks like. - Hoffer, on 10/12/2007, -4/+2I thought BFME2 played fine on the 360. I'm definitely interested in trying C&C.
- LogicBomB, on 10/12/2007, -4/+2The reason there are no KB/M's on the 360 isn't because it will take away from PC operation but because it will unbalance the playing field.
Battle For Middle Earth 2 had the best control scheme for a console to date and it was pretty damn good. Too bad the game ran to a crawl with 4 players if you had half-decent sized armies but that's another issue.
Absolutely the PC version will be more robust for strategy - trying to organize a flank manuver on the consol is utter hell - but if everyone's using the same scheme then it can be fun for all without having to worry about how the other play has hotkeys while you don't. - wageslaven, on 10/12/2007, -8/+6Ive got a group of Real Life Friends and Family with XBox 360s we've all got the Live Camera as well (who doesnt like a little living room to living room Video Calling?) -- anywho, Command and Conquer 3 is tops on our list.
Who doesnt want to _see_ the surprise on the faces of your opponents when you out-flank them in C&C! Sweet. -
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