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251 Comments
- sanderson325i, on 08/17/2008, -32/+115real price of oil= thousands of lives
- inactive, on 08/17/2008, -13/+61Too bad oil has spiked relative to every other major currency as well: http://europe.theoildrum.com/node/3106
- elektronjunge, on 08/17/2008, -13/+59Ya and the price of gold is completely stable. /sarcasm
Oil, gold, and the dollars value are all determined by the same thing speculation in the market. So this argument is totally moot, especially if you show how the value of gold has been fluctuating rapidly for the past 100 years (actually more, but not the point) - Stormwern, on 08/17/2008, -4/+42The dollar has dropped ~25% the last deccade, but the price of oil has gone up by ~200%, so it's not the only factor.
- bashar2, on 08/17/2008, -7/+34Gold sold for $260 per ounce in August of 2001 and over $900 dollars in August of 2008. So the only reason the price of oil looks steady when comparing to the price of gold is because they've both increased dramatically.
- badvegan, on 08/17/2008, -9/+32There's no story here, sorry.
The price of gold has shot up at the same time the dollar has tanked and while oil has shot up. Investors put their money in commodities (i.e. oil and gold) when the economy is weak, to avoid further losses in stocks and currency.
So if you compare the price of gold with their oil chart, you'll see a similar rise in the price of gold as you see with the rise in the price of oil.
That's the missing (and key) data.
This means that the "price" of oil in gold has gone up (contrary to the article), since the price of gold has gone up at the same basic pace as the price of oil.
You could very well do the reverse chart and show how gold has shot up in dollars/euros, while the price of gold if paid in oil would be the same -- proving that we should be basing our currency on oil, not gold nor letting it float (as we do now).
Sloppy logic from the Dept. of Lies, Damned Lies and Statistics.
Please resume the economic crisis and global financial panic already in progress... - foxhound009, on 08/17/2008, -0/+18not really, just superficial bitches and pimps.
- lordmetroid, on 08/17/2008, -1/+16Backed by a police force that will imprison you if you choose to decline it for payments.
- inactive, on 08/17/2008, -2/+15Gold cannot be easily inflated.
- elwoodblues, on 08/17/2008, -8/+21Crap. That means every county in the world has a falling dollar by his warped logic.
The author needs to realise that the world is more than just the US.
Oil price is based on a finite resource and speculation on that resource. Economics 101. - Aldanga, on 08/17/2008, -2/+15The value of gold in relation to the dollar has been changing, but gold itself is stable.
- inactive, on 08/17/2008, -5/+18Gold has kept its value throughout known history. Even though at present the supply of gold is totally controlled by the Rothschild banking cabal they still cannot destroy the value of gold. 1 gold coin in roman times can get a nice toga, a good meal at the tavern and a night at a nice inn. 1 gold coin today can afford you a nice suit, a good meal at a restaurant, and a night at a nice hotel.
- inactive, on 08/17/2008, -19/+32Exactly. The Federal Reserve Note is Monopoly paper.
- theHman, on 08/17/2008, -22/+34This article seems to subversively be supporting the gold standard, which is totally retarded. There are a whole host of problems surrounding that system, but the most retardedly obvious one is the fact that it makes people go and search for gold, which is otherwise nearly totally worthless.
- pilobilus, on 08/17/2008, -3/+15Unless you count gold as a "major currency". Oil has been stable against gold (plus or minus 5%) for over a decade. The main driver in fluctuations of the price of gold vs. oil have been driven by market surges in demand for gold when major currencies have plunged in value (measured against these two stable commodities). In short, petroleum exporting nations have pegged the price of oil against gold.
The Bush administration has dumped 8.5 trillion USD in counterfeit dollars (deficit spending, so called) into the national and world economy. Funny, that's rarely mentioned in broadcast or print news media, and never in context as the main driver in the collapse of the dollar. (Yes, balance of trade is also a factor... shipping U.S. jobs and creation of real wealth offshore to wherever U.S. based tax haven registered corporations can get the highest margins.) - blackdrivel, on 08/17/2008, -6/+18Classic quote: "This complex system bears watching by all geoscientists."
In other words, until resource harvesting moves away from war and drilling, the biggest events in geoscience history will be those associated with humans and their harvesting of energy resources. - Patori, on 08/17/2008, -3/+15There's this button between Tab and Shift usually.
- arunforce, on 08/17/2008, -4/+15Gold doesn't hold much more value than the dollar does. Gold is just another form of trading. What if no one wants Gold anymore? If the reason why Gold and Oil increased is because of the USD, then it would be cheap in other countries, and everything else would cost 100%+ more.
That's called Hyperinflation, and no it hasn't happened. - phrstbrn, on 08/17/2008, -0/+11ITT: People who pretend to be economists.
- FairDinkumMate, on 08/17/2008, -1/+11@stagmire - Can you not read a graph?
The gold vs oil priceline was virtually straight(certainly within 5%!) so according to this graph oil has NOT spiked relative to gold!
Please try to be less absurd in your next post. - BoneheadFarker, on 08/17/2008, -4/+14Mostly due to oil being tied to the US dollar in most places. These places are now looking to switch to the Euro. Which is partially why the current Iraq war is happening, and why the future Iran war will happen if certain people get their way. It's not the only reason, but it's definitely in the mix...
- VirgilNilson, on 08/17/2008, -0/+10Oil and gold are both finite resources, meanwhile world economies are expanding. If we were to split the resources among all live people on Earth, every year we would each get a smaller and smaller share. This is why our representative currency shows their prices going up, while production/reserves of the two are arguably stable.
In short: this article makes some pretty stupid insinuations. - elshizzo, on 08/17/2008, -3/+12Interesting link, but just because old didn't go up in relation to gold doesn't mean oil didn't go up - it more likely just means that oil and gold both went up. However, the drop of the US dollar definitely isn't helping oil get cheaper.
- inactive, on 08/17/2008, -0/+9So your argument is that the price of oil is affected by different forces in 2008 than in 2007? Interesting.
I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that you don't have the slightest piece of data to back your cute little theory. - inactive, on 08/17/2008, -2/+10@drew52686
Gold has universally been sought after for thousands of years as a form of money because it is relatively portable, easy to divide, hard to counterfeit, durable and generally pleasant to be around. Royalty wanted to decorate crowns, plates homes with gold because they wanted to flaunt how much money they have but that still does not take the properties away from gold that make it a good currency. If you have a conceived aversion to gold because of your notion of its association with royalty then a currency based on a mix set of shared value commodities such as gold and silver, oil whatever is infinitely better than trusting an unaccountable cabal of bankers to be the arbiter of our nation's currency. Especially since the federal reserve central bank they set up is a FOR PROFIT PRIVATE CORPORATION! - arunforce, on 08/17/2008, -5/+13That's *****. We haven't been the only ones with price increases. And before you say OPEC uses USD, that doesn't change the fact that prices have risen in countries that aren't dependent on OPEC.
- Spuy767, on 08/17/2008, -0/+8Once we move to a non-etroleum economy, they can turn their countries into glass, and no one will bat an eye. But a more sobering thought is, what happens when the stabilizing factor, oil money, dries up? What happens when you throw extreme economic pressure into a region that is already a powder keg?
- ipek, on 08/17/2008, -4/+11Because the oil's price is so important (it changes, we feel it immediately), I don't think war and drilling will be neglected anytime soon, unfortunately.
- DeathfireD, on 08/18/2008, -0/+7I filled up with 7,000 lives today what about you? ....After typing that, it kind of makes me not want to get gas again.
- inactive, on 08/18/2008, -0/+7Not really, considering that the world isn't moved by diamonds. I imagine to the world's population, transportation of goods is more valuable than a few thousand lives when there are billions on this planet.
/disclaimer: this isn't my opinion, just making a point - strafefire, on 08/18/2008, -0/+7Second, ALL fiat currencies have been dropping in value compared to gold...
- LilRabbitFooFoo, on 08/17/2008, -2/+8In the long picture of human history, the "oil age" will be a blip along with the soon to be insignificant Middle East. If it wasn't for oil, we wouldn't care, now would we?
- inactive, on 08/17/2008, -1/+7"So you are saying that gold is meant for short - term investing?"
At best, that's all it's good for. Gold prices in real dollars are still far below early 1980s levels. Gold might make sense for speculators and market timers, but large cap emerging market index funds whip the ***** out of it otherwise. - regeya, on 08/17/2008, -3/+9Also, looking at history, darn near every empire which relied on gold for the value of its money became a military target for those other empires which also relied on gold.
And the gold bugs try to claim that there's no such thing as inflation under gold. Um...no. Just no. Spain experienced fairly serious inflation after the New World plunder was brought back to Spain.
Gold is like anything else: It has a value assigned to it based on practical worth, scarcity, and volatility. It's perceived to be fairly scarce and very stable, therefore it's seen as valuable; someday, though, just wait and see, something will happen. It may not be in our lifetime but SOMETHING will come about which makes gold worthless. - andyduncan, on 08/18/2008, -0/+6oil vs gold is the more or less flat purple line at the bottom. The other two are oil in dollars and euros.
- jjmckay, on 08/18/2008, -1/+7@regeya,
Maybe, but until that happens, gold is a physical tangible object with intrinsic value and it has been that way for thousands of years. Paper currency's value is, basically, trust. People are capable of being untrustworthy, a metal like gold or silver is not.
Some kind of real physical thing that backs a currency is a really good thing. If not gold, then land or water or software licenses, or something. Anything is better than a paper/digital currency, unless you want a currency which is easy to counterfeit.
We The People are being stolen from when our currency is being devalued to pay for an insane war which seems to have no end in sight. If this currency system ends, then their ability to do such things will be curtailed. Curtailing the powers of authority is one of the central ideals of the US Constitution and the Bill of Rights. - yaddayaddayoda, on 08/17/2008, -1/+7Mmmm, no... all the "Ron Paul *****" bought gold years ago before the price went up. Buy low, sell high. I have silver coins that went for $5 an ounce a few years ago. I sold at $20 when the price peaked. The real "*****" are the ones that buy when the price is already high.
- Number23, on 08/17/2008, -7/+13Species currency has so many problems but not the least of which is it greatly limits the growth in the money supply. Growing economies need a growing money supply.
Of course sensible people know this which is why species currency no longer exists, anywhere - drew52686, on 08/17/2008, -3/+9I will probably be dugg down for this, but I must side with macweirdo. I definitely understand why gold was used for so long as the basis of money (as godseyeview says: it cannot be easily inflated), but doesn't the value of gold simply boil down to pure obsession with shiny metal. Gold has universally been sought after for thousands of years. The primary cause of this obsession for a long time was due to the fact that people (typically royalty) wanted it to decorate crowns, plates, homes, etc.
I am not saying that we should abandon gold as a basis of wealth but I feel so many people shout for the "gold standard" without giving much thought to why we value gold so much. Maybe I should shift my perception of gold -- especially considering the staggering inflation we may soon face -- but I cannot get around the history of the situation. - inactive, on 08/18/2008, -0/+6Rendering this article utter *****. Ok, maybe not UTTER *****, but still, they got it wrong.
Even in the graph they displayed you can clearly see the fallacy they are presenting. Are we supposed to believe the dollar and the Euro are depreciating at the exact same rate? - inactive, on 08/17/2008, -4/+10Oh God, here we go. You freaks almost had me on this gold standard business, but then I came to my senses. The value of gold is just as transitory as the value of any paper currency. So you substitute one material with another? Big stink. Gold is a worthless shiny metal, ignoring the artificial value to which we ascribe it.
- aterimperator, on 08/18/2008, -0/+6As someone already mentioned, oil is what keeps those places semi-stable right now. Also, it seems that many of those lives would be lost anyways in such a religiously charged region of the planet. When it comes down to it, it's possible that the stability we add actually outweighs how much killing would happen there if we didn't want the oil.
- inactive, on 08/18/2008, -1/+6This article is BS, the price of oil HAS been changing in real terms. The Euro is relatively stable and has been beating the dollar's ass for a while, yet they still have to pay more for oil. Is this article claiming that both the dollar and the Euro are depreciating at the exact same rate?
- inactive, on 08/18/2008, -1/+6@Spuy767: As long as the Jews choose to live in a bad neighborhood and AIPAC holds the reigns of the US, there will always be a significant amount of caring about the Middle East, oil or not.
- KOSmurfy, on 08/17/2008, -1/+6"Biased and inaccurate"
Why? Because it doesn't support your belief? It pretty clearly shows that the price fluctuations in oil prices aren't limited to the U.S. dollar. - Seraph, on 08/18/2008, -0/+5"Way of looking at it?"
That's not "one way of looking at it." That's how it is. Our country has been irresponsible for far too long with it's economic policies, and now we're paying for it. We need to focus on strengthening the dollar, and no one in the administration or the Fed seems to be interested in that right now. Until that changes, things will continue to get worse. - gemlarin, on 08/17/2008, -2/+7Interesting that only diamonds carried the "blood" stigma isn't it.
- Relaxin22, on 08/17/2008, -1/+6I'm a bit ashamed to say this but I was thinking about a comment such as sanderson's just the other day and would like to hear what some digger's have to say on this...
Considering the way our world CURRENTLY meets energy demands for automobiles and electric power, is it that unbelievable/unjust that thousands of lives are part of the cost of a resource so valuable. I agree 100% that oil-free alternative energy sources are needed. Maybe I am just being cynical and I'm sure many disagree, but dieing to protect a resources our nation needs so desperately seems more appropriate than dieing to spread democracy to nations that don't want it.
What are your thoughts? By the way, I dugg sanderson's comment. - Squires, on 08/18/2008, -1/+6According to the official story most of the hijackers were Saudi. We haven't bomb Saudi Arabia yet. Your argument is flawed. The empire needs to end, BUT TYPING IN CAPS WON'T HELP.
- FairDinkumMate, on 08/17/2008, -2/+7Your comment regarding the price of oil not rising 4x in other countries is disingenuous at best. Virtually every other developed country has since the 70's oil shock been taxing oil at high rates to artificially inflate prices & create demand for fuel efficient vehicles. It has worked a treat.
But that also means that the retail price of gasoline in those countries was, for example, $2 tax & $2 product cost = $4 total. Increasing the product cost by 3x and leaving the tax at the set $2 amount, means retail prices then go to $2 tax & $6 product cost = $8 total, so they only see a doubling in retail prices.
The US on the other hand, has had very little tax on its oil so when the product cost increases 3x the retail cost goes with it!
I agree that the solution to the US oil crisis is to reduce demand rather than increase supply & am not a Bush supporter by a long shot, but I don't support blatantly misleading statements that look like they belong on a Fox Network analysis! -
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