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114 Comments
- Junkyarddawg, on 10/11/2007, -22/+70Inaccurate. We'll be here, just no longer increasing in numbers.
The Earth only has one environmental problem: too many humans. Everything else, from peak oil via pollution to deforestation, is a symptom of that fundamental problem. What is happening is that inevitably overuse of resources will degrade environment until human mortality matches human nativity, and our population is stabilized - the present best-guess is that this plateau will be reached when there's about 9 billion people on Earth.
There is no reason at all to think this process will wipe humanity out - I'm convinced there'll still be humans about in several thousand years time at least - but the process *will* wipe out countless other species.
So... Thinking that "mother earth" will "protect itself" and wipe out humans is just romantic crap - there is no consciuosness or plan behind what's happening, it's simply physics & biology. - yifes, on 10/11/2007, -3/+22Valid scientific issues are too polticized, and the American public is too undereducated and polarized to ever take the necessary steps to prevent evironmental disaster. Our efforts are going to be too little too late.
- filefly, on 10/11/2007, -1/+20"The planet is fine. The people are *****."
- smackhero, on 10/11/2007, -1/+19i think the article makes so fine and cogent points. however, the simple fact of the matter is we can't save the planet or ourselves if we don't learn to be more considerate. the problems we face today are the result of humanity being too shortsighted and inconsiderate in the past.
environmental responsibility is about caring beyond selfish needs and personal self-interests. the only way we can preserve a hospitable environment on this planet is to realize that our personal well-being is tied to the well-being of all human beings, and in fact the entire planetary ecosystem. we have to learn to consider how our actions directly or indirectly impact the environment.
while self-preservation is a natural instinct in all organisms, without developing more respect for nature and other living things our society will simply continue down the same self-destructive path. you can't scare people into becoming more environmentally friendly with vague threats of future annihilation. without breaking the myopic mentality and shortsightedness of our society, people will only look at the here and now; they won't care about the species around the world being threatened by our environmental impact or the quality of life of future generations being threatened by our industrial pollution. we have to learn to see the bigger picture to truly be able to preserve our species and our way of life, otherwise people will just continue to be environmentally irresponsible until it's too late.
the problem is ignorance, and that is something that requires a fundamental change in the way our society thinks. - Waiting2awake, on 10/11/2007, -1/+18 What we need is a video of bacterium in a petri dish. Watch it as it prospers, and expands, and expands, and eventually expands so much that the petri dish can no longer sustain it and watch as it all dies...
There is a lesson there that I hope we are smart enough to avoid. - modestmelody, on 10/11/2007, -1/+12I've been saying for quite some time-- it's our way of life, our civilization, that's in danger. Not the species, not the Earth.
- Nick22, on 10/11/2007, -2/+10I vote we go to mars :)
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -3/+10I find it amusing that the right wing doesn't believe that climate change on a global scale could harm all life on Earth but has no trouble believing that Muslims are somehow a threat to destroy our nation.
- masamunecyrus, on 10/11/2007, -3/+10The rainforest is a key player in global warming. Trees cool the earth and reflect a significant portion of sunlight that hits Earth.
- Samek, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7ok, this was said first by George Carlin - "The Planet is Fine. We are *****!" I think a little credit is due over here.
- RevEng, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7You've got a good point, but I think you've missed something. Assume we never take steps to avoid deforestation, consumption of non-renewable resources, the thinning of the ozone layer, or the pollution of air and water. Exactly how will we end up with a "balance" between ourselves and these effects? Unlike typical overpopulation, where a food source becomes scarce, the predatory species dwindles, and the food source grows again, these things will not (in any reasonable amount of time) be able to recover. Once they are broken, they are broken forever (essentially). If we have no clean air or water, no fossil fuels, no topsoil, and temperatures rise drastically, how exactly will we adapt? How will our main food sources (plants, animals) adapt? We're not going to ***** things up overnight, but these issues cause irrevocable damage. This isn't going to balance out: we'll have to find alternatives (to air, water, food -- our basic needs) or we won't be able to survive as a species.
- slicedoranges, on 10/11/2007, -2/+8Yeah, since compact fluorescent bulbs don't save you a crapload of money in the long run at all.
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -5/+10God will take care of everything people, so go outside and take a ***** on everything, while your at it, pour some anti-freeze whereever you can also
Jesus and God will take care of everything :)
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/sarcasm - littlebylittle, on 10/11/2007, -7/+11Good point, and one that I've been aware of for quite some time. It's not the Planet we need to save, it's Ourselves. In order to do that we're going to have to pay attention to the Planet's habitability for humans. This of course includes species and ecosystem preservation since most of life on Earth is interconnected.
That "mother earth" or "nature" have some sort of inherent grand consciousness is actually what the many practitioners of "witchcraft" believe. It's Bull-Pucky. - jaedn, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3The article is pretty bias.
Why do people always assume that because the planet is this way now, that this is the way it's always been? Ice age anyone?
When it comes down to risk management, of course developed nations are always going to do their level best to reduce emissions. But, I also believe that it's entirely possible that no matter now much we try, we are never going to be able to cause any long term damage to the planet.
Not surprising when you consider that even if we persist for another thousand years, that will be roughly 5000 years worth of human existence in the planet's 9 billion year history. And only 1500 of those years had the capacity for environmental harm.
Summary:
- I believe that it would be foolish for developed nations to not do their level best to limit emissions
- I believe even if we do, developing nations are going to be the main cause of the problem
- I believe the global warming debate is completely irrelevant, since there is no such thing as a scientific fact and risk management is clearly the only option since too much is at stake.
- I believe if you believe the melting icecaps and the hockey stick graphs, your a sheep. Global warming as a concept is a fad, nothing more. - Cebo, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4Yeah, George Carlin said this first.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IET1uKHPqc8 - zyl0x, on 10/11/2007, -2/+5Reminds me of the Carlin joke, "The Planet Is Fine".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IET1uKHPqc8
Good stuff. And mostly true. - UWake911, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Another LAME GLOBAL WARNING TRIPE STORY !!! People are wakening up the Global Warming is a farce, created by Globalists and UN to gain more power and destroy sovereignty of Nations.
- ronaldinho, on 10/11/2007, -3/+5I actually think that if we really could improve our alternative energy sources and technology, we will be fine. No need for coal and oil, no pollution. Technology could help to reduce our wastes. Overpopulation is not as much a factor of global warming (although that will be another discussion). At this point though, the author is spot on, we got to rein in ourselves until our technology is good enough to overcome our deficiencies. After all, we ARE the problem.
- ICSU, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Individual species are threatened indeed. Nature as a whole is not.
- somegeologist, on 10/11/2007, -2/+4Sorting your garbage will have minimal impact on global warming. What will have a future impact is for everyone to demand that we start pumping money into researching alternative forms of energy. The $400+ billion we wasted in Iraq would be better spent developing new energy sources for the future.
- mos6507, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3Not so easy. Peak oil will be followed by peak water, peak fish, peak agriculture. There are too many humans on this planet and you can only push the carrying capacity so high.
- Ysaric, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2You have a cynical, ***** up view of what motivates most scientists . . . if you want to look for scientists looking to cash in, I recommend looking to those funded by industry rather than grant monies. Perhaps that is where you see the attributes that you project onto all scientists. Or maybe you've sold out in the past, so you figure they must be like you, who knows. It's a pretty twisted thing to attribute to the significant majority of researchers in relevant disciplines that they would rather get paid to trump up a nonexistent problem rather than work on real problems. Maybe the simplest explanation is really the right one--a majority of the scientists are concerned about a problem that, from the available data, is a real one--at least to the best interpretation of our currently available data.
Besides, if trying to reverse the trend is not in our power to affect significantly, then it would seem similarly impossible for us to either harmed by misdirected efforts or significantly affect the environment, right? Ooopz. - Bamborzled, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3The Maya, not the Aztecs.
- mparker7410, on 10/11/2007, -2/+4I find polar bears more interesting than people.People are a dim a dozen, polar bears on the other hand are not. So, lets continue our efforts to keep them safe.
- panopticon, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2The ice caps are melting on Mars because the seasons are changing. It has no relevance to global warming whatsoever.
http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2003/07aug_southpole.htm - yournamehere, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3sounds like that one speech in the Matrix
- vastrightwing, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Wow! I actaully agree with the original post and many of the comments. This is a 1st!
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3This post is ***** amazing. How stupid can you be? The natural ***** world is what needs to be preserved. Selfish pieces of *****.
- JakeWalker, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1This made a lot of sense when George Carlin said it many years ago.
George Carlin, Back In Town, "The Planet Is Fine, The People are *****"
http://www.chaparyan.com/2005/04/george-carlins-planet-is-fine.php - norman619, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2The American public is too easily duped. DO IT FOR THE CHILDREN! Tack that stupid phrase onto almost anything and people will follow.
- norman619, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Maybe he meant Horse-Pucky?
- enigma2275, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3Agent Smith was right!
- landmonster, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2Yeah, we should all hug.
- TheCaterpillar, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2This is an incorrect metaphor, if the bacterium multiplied at a rate which equaled their death rate, they would still run out of food. If we kept adding food (ie energy) they would be fine, that is what the sun does.
- c0y0t3, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2Earth is NOT Venus. It's not Mars either. Yes the idea for the greenhouse effect was developed from observing Venus, but there are not many planetary similarities between the two, so its really a pathetic scare tactic to point to Venus and say, see? Venus used to be like Earth and now its become this inferno! Earth is going to become like that!
There is absolutely NO money to be made for a scientist in a related discipline to claim man made global warming ISN'T a problem, that it is a natural trend we probably can do nothing about except adapt.
There is ALOT of money available to research what we can do to fix, reverse, analyze, model, report on, and develop consumer products that help people prevent, reverse, or stop adding to global warming.
What is the problem then, with continuing to lean towards the alarmist direction?
1) Money that could be spent on other things is now being dumped onto global warming research - what was a niche science 2 decades ago is now a multi billion dollar a year industry sucking at the tax payer teat.
2) Rather than understanding climate change is inevitable and natural, we are in panic mode, trying to reverse something that probably is not in our power to affect significantly, and hence, and not preparing for the actual climate changes that are occuring, are not adapting to them, and will inevitably be harmed all the more for our misdirected efforts.
3) When the truth is finally realized by the majority of the population, the chicken little effect will have done its damage, and the environment will no doubt suffer all the more for it.
But who cares, at least I got my grant money this year, right? Or at least I got the the satisfaction of being on the right side of the argument - or did I? - DooDahMan, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2The environmental movement wants belief not action. They oppose many actions that would help the nation and help them reach their goals except that they don't agree with the ascetic "environmental" lifestyle. For example: opposition to nuclear power, opposition to the Cape Wind project, opposition to iron seeding experiments.
This is more like religion than science. - infra172, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1The world birthrate is 1.8. The human race is dieing.
- RevEng, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Not necessarily so. This analogy becomes clearer if you consider fish in a tank, but it applies for many types of bacterium as well. I'll stick with the aquarium metaphor for illustration. In the process of using resources (eating), the fish produce wastes which are toxic to themselves (mostly ammonia, which is eventually converted into nitrates and nitrites). Without plants, the nitrite levels will increase until the fish die. But what happens if the fish also eat (and kill) the plants? Eventually the water becomes toxic and all the fish die. Unless you change the water, but just like fish can't change their own water, we can't replace our water or atmosphere.
- NuclearBlast, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I'll stop worrying about the planet when Republicans start worrying about the War in Iraq.
- wigginz, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Bull-Pucky??
- FrameShift, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1George Carlin - The Planet is Fine.mp3
- norman619, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2AIDS is a slow killer. It really doesn't do much to reduce the population.
- craiggroshek, on 10/11/2007, -5/+6Global warming is natural, not caused by us. Ice caps are melting on Mars, people. Look it up.
- licoricewhip, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3If you believe the human race is over-populated, be the first to lead by example... if you know what I mean.
- smackhero, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1so i guess the lesson is that a petri dish is not a self-sustaining ecosystem?
- norman619, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3Who do you think is having overpopulation problems? Not the developed world. Try the poor nations. To curb our pop growth living conditions on other parts of the world need to be improved. It's been prooven that as a society becomes more prosperous they have less children and population growth comes under control. Pretty much what we have here in the US and many european nations.
- norman619, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2How stupid are YOU? The natural world survived an asteroid strike which wiped out the dinos WORLD WIDE and who knows what else. I have a feeling it will survive us as well.
- infra172, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1The world birthrate is 1.8. Pull your head out of your ass. The human race is dieing.
- slezzzter, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Actually, it sounds more like that episode of Futurama
"Nobody enjoys shooting penguins, but if you have to shoot penguins, you might as well enjoy it."
Also, "If rubbing frozen dirt in your crotch is wrong, hey I don't want to be right." -
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