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42 Comments
- commasplices, on 10/26/2009, -0/+24When I was in Europe earlier this month, definitely noticed more solar panels/windmills/etc. than in the U.S. Nice to see companies trying to find a way to power Europe more cleanly.
- reptarman, on 10/27/2009, -1/+16Again, the US is lagging. Either ping is high, or the US just doesn't care.
- dyslexicsUNTIED, on 10/27/2009, -9/+17Europe? Why not give power to those people who need it in sub-saharan Africa? ***** imperialism.
- Countess666, on 10/27/2009, -0/+8who says they cant use the power as well?
and the excess solar power can be used to desalinate seawater.(they need water much more then they need power for the moment)
and they get money for the power Europe buys.
all of that is a positive for the nations that host these solar power plants, but in this case without the drawbacks of oil. oil can be stored, solar power only for a day or so, they sell the power or loss is.
and the sun wont run out any time soon unlike oil
all of that makes for a much more balanced and healthy buyer/seller relation. - RudeTurnip, on 10/27/2009, -1/+8Come on, it's only fair. Europe projected its power onto Africa for hundreds of years. It's only fair that they do the same in return!
- erhanaltay, on 10/27/2009, -1/+8Do you think EU politicians care about 'clean energy' or global warming? They're just pushing this stuff to try and get away from being entirely dependent on Russia for their energy supply.
Of course I don't blame them, it makes sense. Let's just not kid ourselves. - twoblueday, on 10/27/2009, -0/+6Stealing 3d world resources once again.
Hey, it's been proven that real energy conservation will solve most of the world's energy woes, or at least is a much better first step than hair-brained schemes.
How much of the power would be lost in the incredibly long transmission lines anyway? - 3nder99, on 10/27/2009, -0/+5I wonder what the power transmission system will be like for that long of a trip, and what the power loss will be.
- altgeeky1, on 10/27/2009, -0/+5That TOO is imperialist thinking, which you are now guilty of.
Your comments suggest Africa should do this themselves, and build a grid to deliver this energy? Or were you suggesting Africa should continue running off dirty diesel generators?
Imperialism is often about suppressing economic growth of your trading 'partners'. You may not have intended the effect that way, but it does not matter.
The whole world grows off development and resources and innovation which originated somewhere else. Every giant stands on the shoulders of another giant who came before.
A project like this will help Africa by providing an alternative to their existing dirty oil economies. Even with most of the clean electric power heading north, there will be tie in with the local grid... which will need to be beefed up and expanded. As local demand grows, there will be less incentive to sell the power to outside markets. - altgeeky1, on 10/27/2009, -0/+3Exactly! Clean, locally produced energy is both a national security issue AND an issue of self-reliance and responsibility.
These are alleged tenets of conservatism, but in the US at least, all they're willing to subsidize is *another* centrally-managed power cartel such as hydrogen fuel cell, natural gas, etc. We could solve the grid issue by (for some) removing the need for it.
Germany has it right... they're promoting solar-cell installation on every home, and they're THE world leader in solar. That's pretty sad for other nations, when you consider what a sunlight disadvantage Germany have, and yet they beat all the world's superpowers for solar installations and power. - VitriolAndAngst, on 10/27/2009, -3/+6Apparently Europe doesn't have people around who are paid to tell them how this will never work.
- Portezbie, on 10/27/2009, -2/+5Finally. The U.S. really has to start doing this in our deserts as well.
- Mujokan, on 10/27/2009, -0/+3Our oil is under their sand, and our sun is over their sand. >:(
- kjepsen, on 10/27/2009, -3/+6Africa? Ha! Mud huts don't need power.
/s - Barackalypse, on 10/27/2009, -1/+3Hasn't the West learned anything about depending upon unstable regions of the World for energy resources? Europe has sun too. Put the plants in Spain and Italy, save large amounts of expensive high voltage transfer lines, and not worry about ethnic cleansing or civil war.
- VitriolAndAngst, on 10/27/2009, -0/+2Why would a company hire a professional "naysayer?" Um, to watch blogs and find things that are negative, and minimize the impacts, to promote and demote ideas that help/hurt the company. Don't tell me they don't do it, because I've sat in on SEO meetings.
The fact that EXXON was caught backing some of these astroturf bloggers is only a small tip of the melting ice burg.
But how else to you explain the stupidity behind someone saying "we should keep backing coal plants because the environmental impacts of solar cells are enormous"?
No, we are manipulated to have wrong information. An energy economy on solar could happen in a few years for much less than it costs to subsidize our carbon based energy magnates and to invade the countries in the middle east necessary to get them their cheap resources and profits. - Countess666, on 10/27/2009, -1/+33 nuck plants could power all of europe?
really?!?
quick! contact France and Germany they are doing something wrong! all their plants could power the world no problem instead of just a small part of their nation!!! - SniTT, on 10/27/2009, -0/+2@ cplusplus : I'm sure all these large companies have calculated the cost, if it's a bad investment, they would not be doing it.
- hereticoftruth, on 10/27/2009, -0/+2The Sahara needs a lot more shade, so I am all for it.
- sleestakslayer, on 10/27/2009, -0/+2Glad someone can lead the world with this.
We'll be arguing minutia here in the US until peak oil throws us into a new dark age. - govsucks, on 10/27/2009, -9/+10Hey Africa, don't create any carbon and bring your nations out of the dark ages with electricity and modern production, Don't use any DDT to prevent malaria, use a ***** net. Oh and we'll be using whatever we want from africa for our own aspirations.
Hey everyone, look at how green and progressive we are! Oh, Oh, Oh, ahhhhhhhh, thats good ego gratification. - bollyuk, on 10/27/2009, -0/+1Hey we need it for the LHC :D
- cplusplus, on 10/27/2009, -2/+3Also, each mile of transmission line will require millions of dollars of ongoing maintenance.
- mksmothers, on 10/28/2009, -0/+1Why do both, nuclear power is more efficient than solar.
- SniTT, on 10/27/2009, -1/+2only (max) 10% loss, that sounds owkay
- 3nder99, on 10/27/2009, -0/+1Umm, you do understand what 50% power loss would make it damned expensive right?
- altgeeky1, on 10/27/2009, -0/+1I couldn't answer that, but even 50% loss is acceptable if the power is cheap and clean enough... it's untapped power!
- katana0182, on 10/28/2009, -0/+1Since solar power plants only have a 33% capacity factor (they only work 33% of the time) and they all tend to stop working at once when they stop working, I would think that the Europeans would get a bit more bang for their Euro if they built nuclear plants as well as solar plants.
Remember that batteries might work for a car, but not for a nation. You can't store large quantities of energy efficiently, except using pumped hydro, which requires mountains and vast reservoirs (and how much of the Alps do you want to flood under a reservoir?) Instead, you have to produce electricity it at the same instant it's used, unless you want to multiply your cost of power by 4x to 8x.
Nuclear plants work at least 90% of the time, unlike solar, aren't dependent on the weather, unlike solar, and don't produce carbon emissions or air pollution, unlike coal, gas, or oil. So you get the best of both worlds - reliability and freedom from carbon. And even the used fuel can be recycled - it still has 99% of it's energy.
Ask the French how they do it. 80% of their energy is nuclear. And their electric bills are incredibly low, too. - nepidae, on 10/27/2009, -0/+1So how long do you let a natural resource languish before its used? Clearly the africans have no interest in using it.
- Countess666, on 10/27/2009, -0/+1maintenance? not really, most are undersea cables and once in place will be fine for decades.
and there are 9 connections in total in the plan, losing one for a while is not a problem. - nepidae, on 10/27/2009, -0/+1Yep, because you can't do both.
- Countess666, on 10/28/2009, -0/+1and they'd produce dangerous wast material we have no solution for, be more expensive to construct, can't be mass produced, use fuel not found in Europe, and use a fuel that wont last a 100 years if used to power most of the world electricity needs.
factoring all that in, I doubt they will be cheaper to run actually. - ChimeraHero, on 10/28/2009, -0/+1Wait a second, I bet its actually a front to dispose of hazardous waste materials ultimately leading to the poisoning of the local water supply.
Quick, someone call Matthew Maconahay, only his shirtless barrel-chest can save the day. - mksmothers, on 10/28/2009, -0/+1No, three nuclear power plants that can fit in most school campuses will produce roughly the same amount of energy produced by solar power. And they would do it more efficiently and require less maintenance than miles of solar power plants and thousands of miles of power cable.
- govsucks, on 10/27/2009, -1/+1USA, guilty as charged.
- sipsyrup, on 10/27/2009, -1/+1Why would you hire a professional naysayer, for any reason? I would think they would get annoying after a while.
- Alfa989, on 10/27/2009, -1/+1Care to elaborate WHY do you think so?
- mksmothers, on 10/27/2009, -6/+5Or build three nuclear plants.
- commenter01, on 10/27/2009, -8/+6awesome. glad to hear imperialism is still alive and kicking :P
- erhanaltay, on 10/27/2009, -8/+5Nothing is stopping the Africans from building their own solar arrays for their own use... if they're too backward to provide for themselves, that's their problem not ours.
- erhanaltay, on 10/27/2009, -4/+1Who is the fool? The one recommending these things to Africa or the Africans for following this advise? Any nation that bans DDT or makes coal-burning burdensome is 100% moronic.
- cplusplus, on 10/27/2009, -9/+4Transmitting power all the way from Africa to Europe is not a sensible idea.
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