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- EatingPie, on 10/11/2007, -2/+89The whole wind turbine thing has made me want to throw in the towel on the whole Environmental movement!
A clean, "renewable" energy source, that we have the technology to accomplish now. And they're an impressive, and dare I say, beautiful sight. No carbon emissions, no flooded valleys, no inefficient solar cells spread all over the place...
But, NO! It kills birds! So we environmentalists MUST fight against them... while in the same breath we decry said carbon emissions and flooded valleys.
In Palmdale, California, they raised a single (gigantic) windmill at about 200 feet. It had a 15 year payback rate... and guess what... environmentalists sued the damn project! ONE windmill! And it was in danger of killing birds! It was absolutely ludicrous, and a huge waste of resources to take this to court.
This is where Envoronmentalists are no longer fighting the Man, but have become the Man... The Man who is his own worse enemy. :-(
-Pie - hbweb500, on 10/11/2007, -4/+46If only it were possible for human civilization to last millions of years, that way we could see what birds evolve to counteract turbine blades.
Im hoping for explosive eggs, but it would probably just be the more logical thought process required to fly around the turbines. - Kohath, on 10/11/2007, -1/+27They got that way by playing Grand Theft Auto at night, pressing the buttons with their little paws.
- irvman21, on 10/11/2007, -11/+35Enviromentalists are the primary roadblock to almost all forms of green energy. They don't like wind because it hurts birds. They don't like hydro because it upsets the fish. They don't like tidal again because of the fish. Obviously they also hate anything that burns fossil fuels. And Nuclear, they hate nuclear too. Pretty much they want us back living in caves so the animals can do whatever they please.
- Makubex, on 10/11/2007, -3/+24They forgot to mention how many cats are killed yearly by these sinister wind turbines.
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -5/+25I say giant, turbine crushing birds with tough leathery skin and a taste for cats.
- Hindu_Wardrobe, on 10/11/2007, -2/+20Signatures are lame.
Cheers,
Johann Gambolputty-de-von-Ausfern-schplenden-schlitter-crass-
cren-bon-fried-digger-dingle-dangle-dongle-dungle-burstein-von-
knacker-thrasher-apple-banger-horowitz-ticolensic-grander-knotty-
spelltinkle-grandlich-grumblemeyer-spelter-wasser-kurstlich-himble-
eisenbahnwagen-gutenabend-bitte-einen-nürnburger-bratwürstel-
gespurten-mitz-weimache-luber-hundsfut-gumeraber-schönendanker-
kalbsfleisch-mittleraucher-von-Hautkopft of Ulm. - Cozmcphish, on 10/11/2007, -4/+21At least they die doing what they love...flying into turbines.
- OatmealBatman2, on 10/11/2007, -1/+18Hopefully this will change the minds of people who are against wind power because it kills a bird every once in a while. As if growing corn or sugar cane to make ethanol or drilling for oil never killed an animal or destroyed its habitat.
- skyfire1, on 10/11/2007, -11/+27im in ur turbinez, killing ur birdz.
- Hillsfar, on 10/11/2007, -5/+20Cats tend to kill songbirds and birds that eat garden-variety insects, fruit, and seeds.
Wind turbines have a major propensity to kill birds of prey - those higher up on the food chain. In Altamont Pass, California, 4,000 windmills have been chopping up tens of thousands of birds that fly into them: including golden eagles, red-tailed hawks, burrowing owls and other raptors.
It isn't just that an eagle or falcon or hawk killed means a larger rodent or pigeon population. It's that these top-level predators are already endangered and low in numbers due to habitat destruction, urban sprawl, and pesticides and mercury poisoning. The wind turbines are just an additional hazard.
I'm not against wind power. I'm just against ignorance. - abstraxion, on 10/11/2007, -2/+15Cats are sociopathic killers? Actually, killing birds is quite acceptable in cat society. And they are carnivores.
- tizz66, on 10/11/2007, -0/+11I guess I'm the only one that thinks wind turbines are actually quite attractive then? :/ Seriously, they could put one near me if they wanted. I already have electricity pylons around me, and wind turbines are a billion times more attractive. They aren't so different from windmills, and there was a time when everyone thought that they were beautiful.
What's so bad about wind turbines? - glmory, on 10/11/2007, -2/+13Irrevelant. Cats are cute. They therefore clearly leave the world with a net increase in cuteness even after they kill a few cute birds each. Wind Turbines are not cute. Therefore if they kill even one bird they have reduced the cuteness of the world. Clearly we should increase the numbers of feral cats, and decrease the number of turbines.
- MaynardJK, on 10/11/2007, -0/+9your comment hurts my brain
- LetsGoHawks, on 10/11/2007, -3/+12Hard core enviromentalists need to stop using electricity. Even solar generates pollution during manufacturing. Also stop driving. And buying food. They can grow their own.
No matter what we do, it will impact the planet. The trick is figuring out which impact is smaller.
I'm not saying we shouldn't work to make energy production cleaner and safer for the animals but c'mon..... being a nutjob about it doesn't help anybody. - bmartin, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10Bats kick ass. An adult bat can eat something like 500 mosquitoes in an hour, and everybody hates mosquitoes.
- theseventhyear, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10What the hell am i doing with a pet cat??? what i really need is a pet turbine! i'll take real good care of it
- Hetman, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10I agree. I dont like the idea of birds being killed off. But what about the smog and the pollution caused by coal plants and cars. Im sure those have negative affects on birds also.
- jstohler, on 10/11/2007, -7/+15Cats are sociopathic killers. Saying that something is less deadly than them isn't saying much.
- leoedin, on 10/11/2007, -1/+9@hillsfar
By far the most dangerous wind turbines are very old, high speed ones. The modern, low speed ones present very little danger to birds. - londubh, on 10/11/2007, -1/+9So if you strap a cat to each turbine blade you'll increase their lethality in killing birds.
I was visiting my dying grandmother and bird smacked right into her window. It laid on it's back till I touched it with a flyswatter. I was just going to flip it over, but it flipped right up by itself. It looks like it's lower beak was dislocated. It left some feathers on the big plate glass window. It just stood there for about four hours until it disappeared. I don't know if it got eaten by a cat or flew off or crawled off. I'm not sure it was going to survive . - tcquad, on 10/11/2007, -1/+9Maybe you should stop storing bird seed on your window sill.
- VillaStraylight, on 10/11/2007, -9/+17THE MORE YOU KNOW.
- jessdub99, on 10/11/2007, -2/+9Anyone on the birds side of this argument needs to be thrown into a turbine.
- griz, on 10/11/2007, -1/+8No, we need to harness the power of bird killing cats. Put them on little wheels with birds in front of them and let them go to town.
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -2/+9how the ***** can a bird die in one of those. they move sooooo slow. if you did get hit you would get ***** but still, wow.
- The_Wallbanger, on 10/11/2007, -0/+7This is an obvious plot by the sophisticated Cat Lobby.
Turbines kill large birds of prey and other raptors --> More mice and burrowing rodents surviving on wind farms --> Cats feast on population overgrowth of mice! CATS WIN EITHER WAY! - jokerthief, on 10/11/2007, -2/+8Ban cats!
- evil-doer, on 10/11/2007, -2/+8what about windows? theres 2-3 birds a year that seem to die running into my windows. id imagine that ends up being in the millions as well. should we stop putting windows in buildings too?
- bobonut, on 10/11/2007, -0/+6I just finished doing a research project on this oddly enough. Numerous behavioral studies in birds show that they do avoid wind turbines both in flight and when nesting. There are complicating factors such as fog but mortalities are still relatively rare. The threat posed to bird species by global warming, which turbines would help mitigate, easily outweighs the low mortality rate which is by itself dwarfed by domestic cat predation. And yes, domestic cats are a big problem for song birds. Millions were killed in the state of Wisconsin alone last year by domestic, not feral cats.
interesting NPR story on a law to allow the shooting of domestic cats to save birds
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5048861
Bird Flight Article (sorry if you can't read all but the first page comments on it)
http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0003-0031%28199801%29139%3A1%3C29%3ABFCNWT%3E2.0.CO%3B2-5&size=LARGE&origin=JSTOR-enlargePage - LLLSecretChimp, on 10/11/2007, -0/+6We shouldn't tear down the Washington Monument; we should attach turbines to it. I mean, if the birds are going to die anyway...
- knupso, on 10/11/2007, -3/+9The people who call themselves environmentalist that block forms of green energy are two types.
There are the ones who do have an agenda and think man should live in the stone age. I call those wackos.
Then there are the NIMBY fools.
If you are really for Green energy you should welcome a Nuke plant or wind turbines in your back yard.
Even it it blocks your view of whatever.
You can't have it both ways. - f4nt0m4s, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7every time you masturbate gods kills a kitten....
i know how i will help the birds - Hetman, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5Do you live in the country. Because I have seen cats catch birds. But more often than not i dont actually seem them catch birds. I just see the remains of the bird on my front porch because my cat loves me and is trying leave me a bird snack for later on.
- BigSax, on 10/11/2007, -3/+7I suppose we should all stop driving too. 50 - 100 million birds a year are killed by cars.
While we are at it lets stop building houses. Estimated 100 to 900 million + birds every year are killed by glass windows.
Perhaps the tiny brian of the common bird is to blame, or their unfathomable attraction to objects that could kill them. If only they could speed their evolution and all become like The Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past from the Future.
For more of these numbers and better perspective.
http://www.currykerlinger.com/birds.htm - inactive, on 10/11/2007, -3/+7"Enviromentalists are the primary roadblock to almost all forms of green energy. They don't like wind because it hurts birds. They don't like hydro because it upsets the fish. They don't like tidal again because of the fish. Obviously they also hate anything that burns fossil fuels. And Nuclear, they hate nuclear too. Pretty much they want us back living in caves so the animals can do whatever they please."
How was that taking anything out of context? It's a ridiculous statement, even in its entirety. - oxnyx, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5My understanding on deadly windmills was that songs bird yes but the really big animal they kill off is bats. I don't know about you but I like bats.
- WolfwoodX, on 10/11/2007, -4/+8IMHO, if a bird is stupid enough to fly into a big ass, totally avoidable, spinning mega structure of doom, then it deserves to die.
- TRScheel, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5 by tizz66
"I guess I'm the only one that thinks wind turbines are actually quite attractive then? :/ Seriously, they could put one near me if they wanted. I already have electricity pylons around me, and wind turbines are a billion times more attractive. They aren't so different from windmills, and there was a time when everyone thought that they were beautiful.
What's so bad about wind turbines?"
I agree, they look friggin awesome.
Especially those humongous ones they have off the coast. - Hetman, on 10/11/2007, -3/+7OH oh hippies you have a choice to make your cuddly ass kittens or beatiful endangered birds or a pollution free wind turbine. Who will win. Will this finally divide peta into two equally outraged groups. Bird lovers vs Cat lovers.
- ylikone, on 10/11/2007, -9/+12It's not the environmentalists that are against windmills... it's the rich folk who don't want an "ugly" windmill near their lovely house... so they make up ***** like "omg, it will kill all the birds"... like they really care anway. Environmentalists WANT wind energy... because you think of this all wrong, it shows the right-wing propaganda has affected your brain.
- LLLSecretChimp, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Cats are an alternative energy source, when combined with butter:
http://www.flippyscatpage.com/butteredcat.html - macaca, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4I think everyone is missing one point here. I would go with environmentalists only if the wind turbine was right on the birds migration route, which could change lots of ecological factors. Other wise they should shut there mouth. Even airplanes, sky -scrapers and Dick Cheney's hunting habit kill more birds then wind turbines.
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3 Having worked as a wildlife rehabber for a number of years i can vouch to the damage cats do to wildlife,especially birds.
The smallest nick from a cat claw or tooth that you may
not even see can introduce toxic pasturella.bacteria which will
kill a bird within 45 hours without medical
treatment at a Vet's office or wildlife shelter.
Still.people let them run free and even if you don't see your cat killing things,they live to kill.
http://www.squirrel-rehab.org/faq.html#eight
" Cats carry a bacteria in their saliva called pasturella.
If any wild animal is exposed to the saliva from a cat, the
bacteria affects their central nervous system. Unless the
proper antibiotics are administered in the first 12-24
hours, the animal will eventually die."
What I would love to see happen is birds develop a neuro-toxen on their feathers that sends a cat into seizures if it so much as grabs a bird.
Anyway, here are more links for those who think wildlife is important:
http://www.umext.maine.edu/onlinepubs/htmpubs/7148.htm
http://wildlife.wisc.edu/extension/catfly3.htm
http://www.owra.org/cateffect.htm - NitroNeo, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4Well no *****!
I've got even more amazing news for you. "Domestic" cats affect more than just the bird population every year. They kill a lot of rodents which affect the population of Owls, Hawks, Foxes, and Coyotes (well Coyotes substitute field mice for cats in some instances), and many other species, which affect the species which prey on them. For every free roaming domestic feline, there should be one owner who gets heavily fined on a daily basis.
Besides Leash laws don't just pertain to dogs. - nodong, on 10/11/2007, -4/+7We need to develop an alternative energy source that kills cats!
- johnhummel, on 10/11/2007, -6/+9For those that are "Oh, cats eat birds", it's in the scale: 30 wind turbines to kill 1 bird in a *year*. A car probably kills an average of a dog per year. Heck, I know my car once took out a seagull in a blizzard.
This article is for the hand wringers who are screaming "Won't someone think of the birds!" We did. If the 1 bird a year are so stupid they'll fly into a big spinning object, then they deserve to die. But it is a lot less harmful to birds than, say, pollution and oil spills. Or, in this case, a cat. - StephenCIreland, on 10/11/2007, -2/+5what if we attached cats to turbines
- bobonut, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3@Stevethegreat
What are you getting upset about? Although I didn't dig you down, I could see why others would. Your statement about evolution and natural selection was simply inaccurate. Evolution can happen much more rapidly than "hundreds of millenia". For instance Darwin's finches have been found to rapidly shift body size and beak size in response to El Nino and drought conditions. Speciation may take much longer, but adapting existing behavioral or morphological traits does not. As I mentioned before, many bird species appear to avoid the turbine so the existing variation is there. -
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