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Audubon Society "Strongly Supports Wind Power"

treehugger.com — One of the US' oldest conservation organizations, the National Audubon Society, has publicly declared its support for continued wind development, and its belief that the climate crisis poses a much bigger risk to our feathered friends:

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MrBound, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6As it was once explained to me, modern windmills can't do much damage to flocks of flying fowl. The blades rotate at a slow speed but drive a high-energy turbine. It's the older models where the blades were going at a million miles an hour that shredded up birds. Windmills: now bird safe thanks to the miracle of engineering.
- Junkyarddawg, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2That is not true - the tips of the rotor can reach speeds of up to 300 mph (!!!). Wind turbines can and do kill significant numbers of birds, and allegedly even more bats.
  If you walk around the base of a wind turbine, you're highly likely to find dead birds & bats (I tried this myself, and in a few minutes I'd found three dead birds).
  
  However, there's been studies on this, and even though an average wind power plant might kill, say, a thousand birds & bats per year, that is presumably negligible compared to what a largish shift in climate would do to them.
  
  Hence I would agree with Audubon that wind power plants are probably kinder to birds & bats than climate change will be.
- kremvax, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"though an average wind power plant might kill, say, a thousand birds"
  
  Thats a ridiculous number you've pulled out of your ear, wrong by more than an order of magnitude.
  See: http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=mg18625045.500&feedId=earth_rss20
  
  BTW: The number one killer of birds: Cars. By far. A large, plainly visible, not-exactly-silent-close-up wind farm won't kill nearly as many birds as the highway that leads to it. And frankly less than a comparably tall stationary glass-walled building.
- Junkyarddawg, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@kremvax: No, I extrapolated from my one visit to one wind turbine. 3 birds dead one day = 1095 over a year. That may well be an unrealistically high estimate, but given my one single datapoint....
  Ahlén (2002) found 33 dead birds of 17 species, and 17 dead bats of 6 species, after visiting 160 wind turbines, suggesting a much lower kill rate than my guesstimate, although he states that due to scavengers removing bodies his study should be considered qualitative, not quantitative. Regarding ecological effects he notes that the bat fauna was impoverished in the vicinity of a plant with 80 turbines.
  
  Also, while a tall all-glass building is no doubt much worse, yes, but tall all-glass buildings generally aren't built by the tens of thousands all along the coast, as is suggested for wind turbines.
  
  Ahlén, I. 2002. Fladdermöss och fåglar dödade av vindkraftverk. Fauna och flora 97:3: 14-22. [Bats and birds killed by wind power turbines.] http://publikationer.slu.se/filer/ACF2551.pdf (there's an English summary)
- Junkyarddawg, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I think I should make my position clear: I do not really trying to make the point that wind turbines are massive bird-mass-murderers who'll wreak havoc on nature, my point is simply that yes they DO kill some birds.
- Scruffydan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"my point is simply that yes they DO kill some birds"
  
  and don't forget Bats. The important thing to remember is that the deaths of wildlife (be it birds, bats, or some thing else) are costs that need to be considered. When dealing with 'green' technology policy makers tend to forget that even 'green' tech has costs that must be weighed against the potential benefits.
  
  It is likely that while wind power will be a good solution in many areas, there will be certain spots where the costs out weigh the benefits.
- baxtermaddux, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1http://www.improvementscatalog.com/product.asp?product=227895zz&dept_id=12230&cm_ven=Froogle&cm_cat=Outdoor_Comfort&cm_pla=WindChill153_Misting&cm_ite=227895zz&code=macs=MP6WFGL
  
  why the hell cant they put a grill on the windmills? and it the thing got ditry or blocked, coulnd there juts be a dude that kept them clean. problem solved
isemism, on 10/12/2007, -0/+11Next hurdle to overcome for wind power NIMBY (Not In My Back Yard) Syndrome.

I personally think huge wind farms are a hell of a lot nicer on the eyes than huge coal and nuclear plants.

if your interested in personal wind power check out the resources of http://www.gotwind.org , http://www.otherpower.com/ , and http://www.velacreations.com/chispito.html . I'm building the Chispito now and gotta say its a lot of bang for the buck. (I'm not affiliated with any of these sites, i just like them a lot)
- PabloMac, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3The windmill NIMBY issue reminds me of a couple of my least-favorite Kennedys...
  
  @ isemism: "...wind farms are a hell of a lot nicer on the eyes than huge coal and nuclear plants."
  
  Ditto!
- rtbenson, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2It will be up to the companies that make the wind-powered generators to market them in a positive way. I don't think people realize the beauty and gracefulness of a wind turbine. The sound, while extremely quiet, is really soothing like waves on a beach. I think most people with the "NIMBY" syndrome don't realize how beautiful wind turbines are. Personally, I would love to have a wind farm near me.
- kremvax, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Ah, they're nothing compared to the quiet beauty of a pennsylvania strip mine. Lovely coal torn from the earths loving bosom, killing everything for miles around, leaving a barren muddy hole. That's the way to bring power to the masses...
chriskzoo, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2Will stealing all the environment's wind affect the climate in any way? I don't want to be robbed of my cool breezes on a hot summer night.
Toast1185, on 10/12/2007, -5/+1Conservation organization supports wind power...Wow, how implicit.
- Junkyarddawg, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Perhaps not as much as you think. Audubon is mainly concerned with birds, and wind turbines kill a lot of birds.
  It just seems Audubon think climate shift would be even worse.
adrox, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5As a disclaimer to my comment I work as an electricity trader and my company owns a large number of polluting coal and natural gas powered power plants.

While wind power is environmentally friendly and highly touted these days, it still suffers from several large problems:
- It's unreliable for periods of peak consumption. Electricity demand is highly correlated to temperatures and extreme temperatures (either hot or cold) mean that wind power is usually unreliable.
- Related to the above point, when wind speeds get too high, wind turbines have a habit of simply tripping offline. If a control area has several hundred megawatts of wind power trip offline in a few minutes its extremelly difficult to manage. This means that the more wind power you have, the more (expensive) reserve capabilities must be built into the system.
- Wind generation is also extremelly difficult to forecast and very volatile. Even without any wind farms going offline I've seen wind generation change over 200% in an hour.

Basically, the counterargument against wind power is that while it's very environmentally friendly and trendy, a power grid cannot rely too extensively on wind power since it's notoriously unreliable. It's definitely good to supplement the grid but you need stable and reliable sources of power as a base. These can include hydro, coal and gas plants.

There are also new technologies already in place that reduce much of the polution of coal and gas power plants. There are new coal plants already built that pollute only as much as combined cycle natural gas plants and there is a great deal of investment in clean coal technology in the power industry.
- wjglenn, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Personal windmills are fairly sophisticated these days. A single unit that attaches to your current electrical system is used when wind power is available, significantly cutting your energy uses. At some times, surplus power is generated which is essentially sold to the power company and shows up as a credit on your power bill. When there's not enough wind power, your regular energy source provides it. And it all switches over seamlessly with no interaction required by the homeowner. Depending on your location, a single unit can cut your overall energy usage by 40-90%.
taotehue, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4569577556800822039&q=rocky+mountain+institute

wind power really is more robust than what the average joe believes.
Farticus, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1So do these guys, http://www.americanbean.org
nickaster, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3This is a very significant endorsement!
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Audubon Society "Strongly Supports Wind Power"

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