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70 Comments
- BlindDefender, on 11/07/2008, -0/+25In My Opinion...Humanity should do the logical thing and develop healthy long range, sustainable energy sources that do not pollute their living space...period!
They should do this as soon as possible...period!
Prices should be secondary to promoting a healthy place to live!
Lets take care of the Earth so she can take care of us! - gridbread, on 11/08/2008, -0/+19FTA
“If I were Saudi Arabia and I wanted to undermine alternative energy,” says Robert Wescott, former chief economist for the Pres ident’s Council of Economic Advisers, “my optimal pricing strategy would be $100 per barrel for the first year, second year, third year, and fourth – and drop it to $10 on the fifth year.” Why?
“You would capture lots of revenue, but flatten the alternative-energy sector every fifth year – at least enough to scare off investors and ensure that alternatives don’t get a foothold.”
Pretty much sounds like what they're doing, it's a good formula to stop us from fixing the problem. - BigManOnCampus, on 11/07/2008, -1/+15It's already under $2.00 a gallon in AZ, or so a friend told me anyway.
And yes, low gas prices make premiums on new technology look economically silly, but when the global recession is over, oil should shoot up again, possibly not as high as last time, but higher than it is now.
I will still be purchasing a motorcycle and using it for daily commutes, despite the dramatic drop in the cost of fuel. There's no reason not to save even more money in this economy. I have to believe that most other Americans/people-of-the-developed-world are not going to so quickly abandon their newly adopted conservative ways. - inactive, on 11/08/2008, -1/+10The only thing environmentalists and OPEC have in common is that they both benefit from high gas prices.
- inactive, on 11/08/2008, -0/+8Of course, we'd be idiots to go back to our gas-guzzling and ignore the need to develop alternative fuel sources simply because the prices went down. After all, they're almost certainly going to go back up eventually. But then again, hey, that's free-market capitalism - always putting short-term profits ahead of long-term planning. I'm not saying capitalism is wrong or anything, just pointing out one of its major faults - time and time again, we see companies fail to plan for and adapt to the future. Just look at the RIAA - going on a rampage simply because they refuse to adapt to new technology.
- TheMachine1, on 11/07/2008, -0/+7"But in 1985, just as his technology was starting to produce results, oil plummeted. In today’s inflation-adjusted dollars, oil went from $53 a barrel to $28"
http://inflationdata.com/inflation/inflation_Rate/ ...
Its worth mentioning that the price has been inflation-adjusted over $53 a barrel since 2005. And even today its $61.38. - vizeroth, on 11/07/2008, -0/+6Since most goods have already had their prices adjusted for the higher fuel costs, the only relief we're really seeing with the drop of gas below $2/gallon is at the pump. I'd much rather stretch the $20 I'm putting in the fuel tank then just burn it up as fast as I can and wait for the price to go back up before doing something about it. I'm trying to put the $20-40 a week I'm saving in gas aside (along with some other savings cutting back on some non-essentials) so that the next time gas prices go up I can afford to get a more fuel efficient vehicle. Or maybe I'll just buy a nice bicycle and ride to work (and get some much needed exercise at the same time).
- inactive, on 11/08/2008, -0/+5the real question is will GM still do the volt now that they have publicly announced they are broke as *****
- altgeeky1, on 11/08/2008, -2/+6Yes, he did say that, during the same speech where Obama said he was going to enslave all the white people.
I know it is true because I was forwarded the speech transcript from everyone I know...
You should go to the Obama website and actually read what he's put there, instead of spreading heresay. - juscallmedobby, on 11/07/2008, -0/+4I started to agree with this comment except I noticed a couple of inane phrases. "Ford pushing gay agenda?" "Noah's day?" Did your comment get somehow merged in cyberspace with Palin's talking points?
- mfc5200, on 11/08/2008, -0/+4...I'm pretty sure I work for a multi-bllion dollar company that doesn't see profits from ANY new projects for at least 10-15 years. The project I'm currently working on, is expected to be in the red for the next 10 years...
What you are blaming isn't capitalism, it's stupid management, and stupid owners who hire short-sighted managers. Its the companies that can see long term that will win in the long run. But please don't equate short sightedness with capitalism. - Richandler, on 11/08/2008, -0/+4Um ethanol will never be the answer anyway. Simply put the entire economy can't afford alt. energy vehicles. Hell the mere fact that consumption is down means CO2 emission is down too. Hell 20% of the shipping fleet is not even moving right now.
- redwolfwalker, on 11/07/2008, -5/+9With OPEC and other less than friendly producers holding the keys to the gas pump, to ignore domestic drilling and not add some newer cleaner efficient refineries would be a short and long term mistake.
- inactive, on 11/07/2008, -4/+7It's already well under the $2 mark here in GA Low Country. The only difference I have observed betw/higher fuel price driving & lower fuel price driving is bitching & whining, which has nearly disappeared now that we're under two bux. Large, empty vehicles, being driven at well above speed limits, jackrabbit starts, tailgating & gen'l impatience ruled both the high- AND low-priced day. I suspect that most "green" drivers* are in the same camp as Obamaniacs: Lotsa chanting, cheering, celebrating, partying, & slogan-slinging but scant little substance. IMAO & barring an OPEC-engineered paucity, only a gov't mandated "green" prgrm will convince the masses, who SPEAK to high intent but, left to their own devices, generally fail to measure up.
*standard disclaimer: There can be NO such entity as a "green driver." Whether one navigates a stretched Hummer or a Messerschmitt KR-175, "greenhouse gases" still emanate. Electric vehicles get most of their power fr/coal. While I'm a believer in neither AGW nor its supposed "evil mankind" progenitors, my point is that, while alternative energy pursuance & responsible stewardship are good things, ANY petroleum-fueled, internal combustion vehicle & currently any electric vehicle "contributes" . . . so Prius a/o electric owners are hereby invited to STFU. - smrdka, on 11/08/2008, -0/+3That's why we need to put a tax on gasoline to make it $6 or $8 a gallon like they did in Denmark and other places in Europe. That way we have a direct stream of revenue for the development of sustainable, non-combustion energy and the vehicles that will run on it.
- schnikies79, on 11/08/2008, -0/+3@smrdka
I have a few problems with your proposal. First, it gives the government monr tax money. They can't manage what they currently get and they should get additional revenue.
Second, if you think the Americans are broke now, wait until gas is 6 to 8 $/gal. It would push us over the tipping point.
Third, we are not denmark and we are not Europe. Quit trying to make us so. - diulei, on 11/08/2008, -0/+3Sadly, most people can't see past their wallets and immediate futures, and I'm not going to lie and say I'm not one of them.
- cazbar, on 11/08/2008, -0/+3I think the clear answer to this is no. The price will not drop much more than it already has, which is still not back to the level it was at in 2000. Come next summer, it will likely go back up to at least $3 per gallon and continue this cycle. If we're lucky, we won't see $4 again for a few years but there's no way of really knowing.
- hangglide, on 11/08/2008, -2/+4Why do people think that converting farmland from food production to fuel for vehicles is a good idea? It is a horrible idea. Food prices have already increased as corn prices have risen.
Here is a solution: Double fuel prices (through taxes) and double the average car miles per gallon (through regulation). The cost and savings will offset. Both of these are easily attainable in the US (as demonstrated by other countries having cars with 50 to 60 MPG that are not available in the US). The result is lower emissions (improved environment), less demand for oil (decreased reliance on foreign oil), consumers are not out of pocket for gas (after the painful transition in the fleet. ha), people will buy new more economical cars (the car companies win), government can lower other taxes to offset the gas tax windfall (yeah right), and fuel companies get screwed (finally).
Its time the US government makes some tough and unpopular choices for the good of the country. - kesin, on 11/08/2008, -1/+3no not heavy taxes, price caps.
- geneusutwerk, on 11/07/2008, -1/+3Epic Troll Award!
- inactive, on 11/08/2008, -0/+2Kudos man! And I agree - it is short-sighted management that's really the problem. But hey, as far as they're concerned, as long as they make a few bucks, who cares? Never mind they set the company up for eventual doom with that kind of reckless behavior.
- dwrecktion, on 11/08/2008, -0/+2What? i just said develop cheaper alternative fuel vehicles.
- JanK1, on 11/08/2008, -0/+2Gas here in Houston is around $1.70
- publiclurker, on 11/08/2008, -1/+3Considering your homophobic bible banging post, I'm surprised you wouldn't go for 100 year old tech. After all, your attitude is from the appropriate era.
- IAmTheGuy, on 11/08/2008, -0/+2This really isn't the story for that comment. Although I do agree that it is insane to bailout the big three while they have had the opportunity to invest in green technology which has become more attractive over the past 5 years or so.
- inactive, on 11/08/2008, -0/+2One day us AGW skeptics will be vindicated. One day. And until that day comes we must passively submit.
- BoneheadFarker, on 11/08/2008, -0/+2Actually, if you look at percentages, the recent drop was bigger then the 80's drop. While there's no real way to connect the 2 events, it's extremely convenient for oil companies that the oil prices would drop by more then half just as viable alternatives start showing up. Though some good things have come about. While pure electric vehicles may die off again, I think that hybrids are here to stay. And a lot of research has gone into biofuels, which the smart oil companies are investing heavily since fossil fuels will become too costly to retrieve. They may have our balls in a vice, but it's not all bad...
- Madsen, on 11/08/2008, -2/+4I believe GM presented their record quaterly deficit today to the public...car sales are down...people buy smaller cars...japanese cars.
- Wargala, on 11/08/2008, -0/+2I bought a Honda Insight when gas was $1.80. It simply is the best fuel efficient car, period. You can get EASILY 100mpg if driven correctly. My "worst" mileage on that thing was 45mpg, and that was for a mountainous region with lots of start and stopping.
Unfortunately, it can't take a 1985 Chevy Blazer to the driver's side door at 50mph, so it was totalled. I however, managed to get out of it with relatively minor injuries.
Why did I buy it? I got tired of the anti-American rallies I saw in the Middle East. Simply put, you don't treat a customer that way, and if you do, I'll see to it that I don't shop with you, or do significantly less business with you until you get the message.
Why do you think that Saudi Arabia sent in a delegation to see Obama so quickly? It couldn't POSSIBLY be because Obama calls for us to be energy independent within 10 years could it?
http://www.rightwinglunatic.com/wp/?p=3738 - adc86, on 11/08/2008, -0/+2And even the Accord and Civic have ballooned in size over the years... Some aspects of United States culture are not good.
- chourobin, on 11/08/2008, -0/+2max production is at 10 million barrels a day, and will start to decline in 3-5 years. if this problem is not solved, if demand continues to grow, oil will be at 300 dollars. there is a reason oil was at 150 dollars earlier this quarter, people see that oil production has reached its limits while other countries have just begun to use oil.
- Amazetbm, on 11/09/2008, -0/+2Dude, if you compare the entire life cycle of the Prius vs a Hummer, you will kick yourself. The manufacturing and end of life of a Prius uses more energy and does more environmental damage to the planet than a Hummer. LOL. The Prius has given you a false sense of living green.
- Amazetbm, on 11/09/2008, -0/+2Develop? Honda already has a Civic that runs on compressed natural gas on the road right now. In Utah, the going rate at a CNG fueling station was around $0.85 a gallon at one point. Or you could just get a diesel (100+ year old tech) and convert it to run on waste cooking oil. Quite a few restaurants will give you their waste oil for free or dirt cheap.
- mal1964, on 11/08/2008, -1/+3The price will start to go up, The election is over never fails.
- sodade, on 11/08/2008, -1/+3Domestic drilling puts more oil on the market which makes gas cheaper. The whole point of this story is that cheap gas kills innovation.
- coreman, on 11/08/2008, -0/+1IF only. OPEC regulates the price for the wholesale product. There aren't any significant non-OPEC oil producers. Nice try, though.
- paulmer2003, on 11/08/2008, -1/+2I doubt it....as I've said before, I think it's become socially unacceptable to drive gas guzzlers and needlessly consume finite resorces...The trend now is green.
- paulmer2003, on 11/08/2008, -1/+2Meh @ you. US automakers are adjusting to the demand and are producing a lot of small, fuel efficient vehicles that can more than compete with JDM imports.
- cruik, on 11/08/2008, -0/+1without A Flock of Seagulls, no.
- linagee, on 11/08/2008, -0/+1Sorry, there will always be stupid people that defy logic. SUVs will be back on the road when it hits $1.50/gal.
- sodade, on 11/08/2008, -0/+1When the world is running down, you make the best of what's still around
- dwrecktion, on 11/08/2008, -1/+2Simple. Develop cheaper alternative fuel vehicles and create regulations and taxes on gasoline fueled vehicles.
- ChayD, on 11/08/2008, -0/+1[spoof ad]
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[/spoof ad] - inactive, on 11/10/2008, -0/+1I would say what is apparent to you is neither apparent to me nor even generally true, to wit: I applaud your riding your bike as I suspect anyone w/any sense probably would. As a multiple-m/c and several-bike owner, I can say there are darned few downsides to two-wheeled travel of either sort. No one—meaning "I"—intends to demean putting fewer hydrocarbons into the atmosphere or pursuing better fuel economy. Even households above $200K—again, meaning "mine"—have budgets, and I don't intend to spend any more on fuel than I have to. Despite being a cigar smoker, I'm still a mbr-in-good-standing of the club that thinks exhaust stinks. {Altho, there IS something about nitro fumes at the drags, but that's another story....} I pray I NEVER achieve financial success such that these issues are no longer a consideration. If one wants to own a small car that has distinct advantages & disadvantages vice a large one that has different advantages & disadvantages, certainly a country like the good ol' USA—a nation of "choice"—is the place to exercise that freedom. Lest we forget, the original thrust was "ALL internal combustion engine-driven vehicles & ALL electric-powered vehicles contribute to smog, some more than others, but none contributes nothing." The issue, therefore, is one of degree, w/no one except bike-riders & their ilk getting a "pass." Of course, one might do well to wonder how much longer these freedoms of choice will remain available, but again, that's another story....
The "greenness" of Prius mfr/ownership☞
"Memo to the Village Glitterati who find pride & self-worth by driving hybrids: You would do better in a Hummer! Mfr’g the Toyota Prius involves a shocking amt of pollution.
"A plant in Ontario, dubbed the ‘Superstack,’ mines and smelts the nickel f/the Prius’s battery, ea of which then travels to Europe, China, Japan, and the US. How many Prius miles would it take to offset those trips? Canadian Greenpeace energy co-ordinator David Martin says the vast amounts of sulfur dioxide released over N Ontario cause acid rain, which in turn destroys plants in the area, resulting in mudslides. In fact, the surrounding environment is so damaged that NASA uses this 'dead zone' f/testing moon rovers!
"And, now f/the bad news: The Prius’s EPA mileage est has dropped f/2008 by 25% on acct of modified standards. The hybrid now avgs a puny 45 mpg—not much better than cars at ½ that price. The Prius also costs more to operate and has a shorter life span than the Hummer, prob the most hated of all vehicles among enviro-whacks. The Prius has a life expectancy of only 100K mi, and it costs an avg of $3.25/mi to operate. By contrast, the Hummer costs $1.95/mi f/a 300K-mile lifetime. Of course, the Left rarely lets facts influence their pet causes, so don’t look f/Leo DiCaprio to drive up to the next award ceremony in an H2." — Mark Alexander
[This fr/2007MAR PatriotPost, the link f/the info contained therein f/which I don't have any longer. You can probably find it at http://patriotpost.us/ or perhaps even Wiki.] - hymneforthedead, on 11/11/2008, -0/+1I don't care if gas hits ONE dollar, after the simple fact that the oil industry Lied; and continues to lie to the average consumer and the united states government. makes me want the Chevy volt now more then ever...screw Exxon.
- spectre_25gt, on 11/08/2008, -0/+1If done well, that could potentially be a good thing. If we could come up with a standard price per gallon for fossil fuels and divert any margins to funding for alternative fuel research, mass transit and subsidies for life's necessities (food, water, etc.) we'd keep driving innovation and keep the prices for food down. This would, of course, take a non-corrupt government to pull off, but it would be cool to see.
- Amazetbm, on 11/09/2008, -0/+1Yeah but you guys have oil fields down the street and refineries behind every other gas station.
- diulei, on 11/08/2008, -0/+1While I agree something needs to be done about our dependence on gas, taxing it like Europe is not the answer. Most European countries are densely packed - even in some of their suburbs you can easily get around walking or on a bicycle. In the States, a car (and therefore gas) is almost a complete necessity as long as you live more than a few miles away from an urban center.
A few neighborhoods I have lived in would take over 5 minutes just to get out of.. - dusanmal, on 11/08/2008, -0/+1@ original poster, kesin and altgeeky1: No, no actual taxes but he wants to create "Carbon Market". Fake marketplace where you trade estimated carbon emissions with scammers who sell snake-carbon-credits. Who pays - we through higher energy prices (from any source, overall energy price always reflects all sources)... Who benefits: scammers who will find easy way to exploit Govt. regulations (like all scammers do). Who Obama claims would benefit: "The Planet". Obamamainacs usually forget first two answers. And just wait for deficit numbers to rise to hear how even direct taxes, although unplanned would also benefit The Planet and help reduce deficit. From your pocket again.
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