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37 Comments
- noah45, on 10/12/2007, -0/+11I need to start charging more.
- eric0213, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8can't? cent?
- dogshaft, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Yes, but what do you do when your client demands a SPLASH PAGE and won't take no for an answer?
- b05q, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7i like to hire a PI to check my clients out, right at the beginning of the project. usually, i'm able to find some dirt. then, when we're reviewing my designs, i'll casually reveal a picture of the dead hooker, or a crack rock, or whatever else helps the client remember what's in their best interest.
i've found using this method makes less work for me and a more grateful, satisfied client. - fearofcorners, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Looks like stupidppl got banned finally and now is posting as mirrorfan, great.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4You can always tell the noob websdesigners from the real pros. Noobs are always spouting off motivational cliches like "The Client is always right" or "Just keep your clients happy. Its as simple as that. They will use you more and refer you more." or "If your ideas aren't working, you shouldn't be a designer".
These are just some of the few hobbyist and dabblers who think that a couple of projects make them a professional designer.
Professional freelancers are collection agencies first, designers, developers last. The number one goal of any freelance professional is to STAY in business. Quotes like the ones above driveled out by inexperienced layman will put you out of business before you can even get started. "The client is always right"?!! The clients should have the last say?!! You might as well set fire to your office now.
Most "prospective clients" nowadays want the designer/developer to layout a perfect solution in a specification for the mere request of an RFP. Pros would be out of business if they did this for free. The problem is struggling, amateur designers will do this "needs assessment" free of charge for companies. As a pro, you can't compete with this so get at least 50% payment up front for every project, then work the specification. If you feel the specification/latest demand(s) is not worth your time about halfway, re-evaluate the project and the estimate and demand the extra money up front before continuing. If the client will not cooperate, drop the project by charging a kill fee which is usually half the amount of the final estimate(should be in your contract) and move on to the next paying gig. Use only references for Clients who keep you in business. If ALL your clients are happy, you are doing something wrong. 33% of all design projects go unfinished, not because of the designer's incompetence, but because the client didn't truly educate themselves on the industry, markets, demographics, or the cost of professional design application. That's NOT the designers' fault. If the client wants professional consulting, this is NOT part of webdesign or development and has a separate fee.
Make sure a third of your projects go unfinished, walk away from clients who demand more work but won't pay and you will be surprised how much extra time you can spend on "paying" projects to stay in business. I consider it my duty to the industry to educate the client population by showing them where pennies on the dollar gets them. They WILL come back with more money next time or they won't come back, either way the designer/developer stays in business. One client/project can put a freelancer out of business. Don't work for promises and get the promised payment up front. Forget everything else. - jaems, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4While some of those points are valid, realistically, it goes beyond whether or not your contact likes your work. If stakeholders want something done in a specific way, no matter how valid your argument is, it doesn't matter. For money, power, and a superior breathing down your contacts neck, outweigh logic.
Just my experience. - daschew, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4There are MANY cheap clients out there, i've been making 100 dollar sites for a while now, they don't realize that the fruit of your labour is worth more than 100 dollars, us designers have to eat too.
Great article! - maestroh, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4@ dogshaft.. make a splash page.
@ KSUDesigner
"If your ideas aren't working, you shouldn't be a designer."
Unfortunately we can't just tell people they suck at what they do and should change professions. There are literally hundreds of thousands of hacks out there, especially in the design field. I see commercials everyday like "color in this pirate face and you might have what it takes to design album covers! get your certificate from ***** tech today!" The whole field is watered down. Sucks for me because I actually have a BS in graphic design communication - KSUdesigner, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4If your ideas aren't working, you shouldn't be a designer. A good designer will always have a reason for and defend every decision he/she makes. Remember though, no matter what your reason, it is the client's project and they have the final say, no matter how much you like it. One thing I quickly learned in the design world...if you don't like something that you've done, DON'T show it to the client. If you present your client with 3 options, 9 times out of 10 they will pick the one you dislike the most.
- Barman, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Just keep your clients happy. Its as simple as that. They will use you more and refer you more. Even if you're charging under market prices, if you keep them happy, soon enough there will be enough work where you have the ability to weed out your bad prospects or clients by raising your prices.
- o2o2o2o2, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2This is what I do:
EASY CLIENT
(likes whatever you design, never complains)
Charge - Per Job Flat rate (like $2,000 per web site)
DIFFICULT CLIENT
(always changes mind, doesnt know what he/she wants)
Charge - By hour ($100 hour, change whatever you like, even though you as the designer knows whats best, agrivating but you still paid for your time) - julesverne, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2a client greater-than designer relationship?
- SwabTheDeck, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I'm having trouble reading the title. Is it "better client is greater than designer relationship" or "dump output of better client to the file designer relationship"?
- IrwinFletcher, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@ maestroh
I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with your statement "Unfortunately we can't just tell people they suck at what they do and should change professions." However you're right that there are too many graphic designers out there and more are coming down the pipeline.
Culling of the herd should start in the schools. When I went to school (graduated 10 years ago), if your layout sucked there was no misunderstanding. I had a professor who could make people cry during critiques. I signed up for every one of his classes, worked hard, got good grades and reviews and to this day I'm still doing well in the profession. Nowadays, students are being coddled too much with the "everyone's a winner" attitude. My agency has had a lot of problems with interns who just don't want to do anything and I was recently involved in an inter-agency project where I had to hold the hands of so-called professionals (half-baked ideas, they weren't following though with their assignments & they would repeatedly ignore change orders from the client, sometimes up to three times in a row without any explanation). They got that way because the university didn't teach them anything aside from design *theory.* Their projects were not set up in a way that students are being exposed to and prepared for real-world situations.
On a professional level, we can trim the fat too. First step is simple - don't hire these people. Look at their portfolios and we need to *check their references.* I've seen Creative Directors completely skip that, going only on their gut feeling. Hire a person on as a freelancer for a while to see how things work out; if you're happy with their work, hire 'em on full time and treat them well. If you're not happy with their work, cut 'em loose. - Julek, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Site is up guys :)
- KSUdesigner, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Actually, it IS the client's project and they need to be happy with the final result, no matter what you, the designer, thinks. Typically when I start a project I will present 3 ideas on average to my client. The first being EXACTLY what they asked me to do. The other two being my vision of the perfect solution to their problem (I often view design as visual problem solving). Usually, with plenty of explanation, the client will tend to pick my original designs over what they asked me to do. However, if they choose to go with the one that I don't like, I will certainly try to steer them away from that, but in the end it is their project and their money and they must be happy with the final result. Designers have to walk a fine line between good design and following the client's orders. After all, they pay you for what you are doing, you can't just say "***** off that looks ugly." Not everybody's visions are pretty, but it's your job to make it look the best it can be. "A lot of these designers and agencies are so eager to please that they don't try to do anything else." It's their job to please, most do try other options but the final call is in the client's hands.
- heavybackpack, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'd previously written this which you might also find helpful: http://www.heavy-backpack.com/archives/articles/10-ways-to-get-your-client-to-love-you
- spin, on 10/12/2007, -5/+6wow, that guys site went down faster than a drunken cheerleader om prom night.
- simosu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I liked this article. It made me rethink my pricing schemes. I realized that I am about a level 2 designer but charging lower level prices. I really need to stop making web sites for friends and family, I could be making bank.
- KSUdesigner, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2@ maestroh
I agree the field is very watered down. I also have a BFA in graphic design and find it VERY difficult to compete with the guys who never got a formal education in the field and charge pennies compared to what we "professionals" charge. Clients really should check their designers' qualifications before even thinking about hiring that person. You wouldn't go to a doctor who just has a "certificate" in medicine, you want the best there is. Unfortunately all people ever see is dollar signs. Sucks for them, you get what you pay for most of the time. At least we'll get to work for the clients that really know what they are after and are willing to hire and pay for someone experienced enough to deliver what they are looking for. - IrwinFletcher, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1@ KSUdesigner
_"The point is that when it comes to design, it is THE CLIENT'S MONEY. If you tell them "hey I'm the expert, I know what's best, it must be done this way" you are running the risk of your client pulling the job out from under your feet and they will in turn spread the word that you weren't the best person to work with."
After nearly 15 years in the design and advertising industry, I'm well aware of who's money it is. I also know that it's OUR time. That's what you're selling. Your talent is the commodity, not the client's. But you still haven't seemed to grasp my basic point - confidence always wins. If you go into a meeting acting and dressed in a professional, hang on to their every word, display the correct body language, and can articulate your reasoning behind your decisions, "hey I'm the expert, I know what's best, it must be done this way" aren't necessary. They'll figure that out for themselves and that's the best way for them to understand it. Nine times out of ten, the only design element "constraints" (and I use that term very loosely) are the client's branding guidelines.
VERY rarely has a client ever said "this is the way I want it" and on some of those occasions, I have said, "Okay, whatever" because it's the fastest way to get them out the door. Any client who takes that attitude with an agency or a freelancer won't be loyal to them anyway, not in any real way that matters. Sure, they may send them more work, but it's only because they know they can get it cheap and get it their way, just like at Burger King. If you examine those client/agency (or freelancer) relationships, you'll see that it is an abusive one, with the client/agency being the victim.
_There are many clients who will fully trust your judgement and understand that they do not know everything when it comes to design, those are the real gems to work for. However, at the end of the day, the success of a designer is not based entirely upon whether or not their work is "pretty." Your job is to please the client, plain and simple. You have the right to refuse to continue working for any client if you choose to do so, and vice versa. Ask just about any professional designer and you will find that not every project is a dream come true, in fact the good ones are usually few and far between.
I AM a professional designer, I'm a long time ACTIVE member of the AIGA so don't confuse me with one of those pirate/turtle drawing hacks or tell me what my job is. I have never used simple aesthetics as a basis for determining success - or to use your words, "whether or not their work is 'pretty' " (Frankly, I'm disappointed you even used that adjective, it's common, oversimplified, subjective and something I would hear from a client, not a designer). Aesthetics alone do not determine the success of a project. Does the project convey the message the client wants it to? Does it speak to the audience the client is needing to reach? Was the project completed on time and on budget? That creative director I mentioned who told a client to stop dicking around with the proofs? That's what he was talking about; the client had no understanding of the time it took for his changes - not edits or corrections - to be made to his print collateral and what that would do to his deadline. Basically the guy was trying to make changes to the press proofs and it was going to ***** up his deadline. The CD told him to stop dicking around and told him *why* what he was doing was ***** things up. We continued to get plenty of work from that client after that because he realized we weren't being arrogant pricks. He had a budget and a deadline he had to answer to for someone higher up the food chain, he understood that we really were looking out for his best interests. If your client says "I want it done such-and-such way" and you maintain an appeasement mentality (You(r) (the designer) job is to please the client, plain and simple); what if what they want isn't in the budget? What then? Are you going to eat the extra cost yourself just to keep that client happy? If you approach client relations from the standpoint of do anything to keep them happy, you put yourself in a position where you're going to lose both time and money in the long run.
_I fully believe that it is your job as a designer to convince your client that you know what is best in this area. If a designer is just sitting there spitting back out exactly what the customer wants, without any creative input whatsoever, well that's just not the way to run a successful creative business IMO. But what do you do when your client basically says "it's my way or the highway"? Do you tell them to just go ***** themselves? No._
I NEVER said to tell a client to go ***** themselves; if you want to debate something I say, fine, but if you're going to base your argument on something I didn't, if you're going to put words in my mouth to justify your position, then you've got nothing to fall back on and you're wasting everyone's time.
When a client takes on that "my way or the highway" attitude (and we have heard those words before), you fire them. It doesn't happen right at that moment. Some agencies or freelancers start with what some call an "***** tax", others call it "headache billing." Jack up your normal billing rate on those clients so that they either make it worth your time to put up with them or they decide to go elsewhere. If they go elsewhere, you haven't lost anything because they're not going to badmouth you. Sure, they may complain about your rates but that's actually good promotion for you (people will think "Wow, if they can charge that much, they must be good"). Those "highway" clients are also the ones who usually drop off projects at the last minute, not because that's the hand they've been dealt, just because they are very poorly organized. They're also usually slow to pay their bills and nickel and dime you to death (even before the increased billing), so you really weren't getting that big paycheck. The worst part about all of that is, they are time murderers, pulling your time away from your good clients.
_You do what they want because in the end you need that paycheck.
So their project doesn't end up in your portfolio, big deal. Maybe some day I'll be successful enough to tell those hard-headed clients to go ***** themselves, but until then I'm going to make my clients happy and get paid, whether I like the final result of the project or not._
I make my clients happy, I'm paid very well and my portfolio is current. On the one hand, attitudes like yours that make life difficult for the rest of us. On the other hand, we should probably thank you for taking on those difficult, cheap clients while the rest of us enjoy working for better ones.
_Make your client happy and they will spread the word. One happy client equals many referrals for new business._
You have no idea what really makes a client happy. At the end of the day, what makes a client happy are sales figures. You do something that boosts sales, brand positioning and visibility and that's what keeps the good clients coming back, not simple appeasement. - maestroh, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1"Designers! If your client dislikes something you’ve made, though you truly feel your revision, or conceptual idea thereof, is a far more logical and better way to go, then be honest to your client about it! Explain to them thoroughly why you believe your concept is ‘better’ then their perspective of something. It may work, and chances are if your perspective is logical and your client sees the light, he/she’ll take it."
I agree to an extent, but this is a very slippery slope. The LAST thing you want to be is one of those designers that defends their ideas even when they aren't working. It's the mark of an uneducated/unprofessional designer (of which, in this day and age, there are many). - IrwinFletcher, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1@ KSUdesigner
This isn't Burger King. We are in a *results* industry, not a service industry. What you have described is a sales environment, not a creative one. Those results clients are needing are unique yet effective tools (print, broadcast or web media) to communicate their message and they do not have the training, the skills or experience to do that themselves, which is why they need to hire us in the first place.
Dick Morris was hired by an ad agency that was working on a state political campaign. Morris, the agency and the Lt. Governor of that sate were in a meeting and the Lt. Gov. was sitting at the table describing what the thought his election ads should look like when Morris unceremoniously interrupted. "Look, here's the deal," he told the client, the second most powerful man in the state. "You guys write the ***** checks, we'll write the ***** ads." That's a man with confidence in his abilities. He knew better than anyone what his strengths are and how they can best be utilized.
Just last week Art Chantry was speaking and he asked the audience a very simple questions: "Why do we do the three-layout option?" When did we stop acting like we knew what we were doing? It wasn't long ago that we'd walk into a meeting and show a client a campaign. Notice I said "a" campaign, with maybe a backup in the briefcase on the off chance they didn't buy the first one. We believed in that campaign and sold it as hard as we could. And we usually walked out with agreement on everything but the size of the logo. Today, we wouldn't dream of that. A typical presentation is 3-6 concepts a couple of layers deep each. Or we wallpaper the office with sketches filled with every half-baked idea.
Now, imagine you're arrested, and your highly-paid lawyer came to visit you in jail and he handed you five different closing arguments and asked you to pick one. You'd sue him on grounds of incompetence and hire someone else. Same thing in medicine. If you come down with an illness, a physician will exam you, diagnose the ailment and prescribe a treatment based on his or her training and experience, not ask you how to solve the problem.
I blame bad AEs. I've worked with too many who are under-qualified and overwhelmed (usually as a result of the former). Their idea of customer service is not to do things in the client's best interests, but to jump through hoops in hopes the client will respect them. A good AE, I can had over a concept and they'll not only sell it, but the client will be stoked about it. It's been my experience that the AEs who'll agree to a client's 5:00 demand for a 15-shot photo shoot and photoshop re-branding of the products and all on boards by noon the next day, even after said client refused to pay the rush fees from the previous last minutes jobs he had agreed to - those are the same AEs who insist on three to six layouts to show a client because frankly they don't have the brains and the balls to stand up for anything.
I once worked with a creative director who wasn't afraid to look a client square in the eye and tell him "If you want your brochure printed on time, you'll stop dicking around with the proofs." And that was that; any ruffled feathers were smoothed out later with bourbon or gin and vermouth. The previous generation were gutsy guys who raised us. Today, we're raising sheep.
Shops are running scared. We're losing our confidence and turning more and more control over to the clients. This is not only bad for us, it's bad for them. It turns us into vendors and them into creative directors, a job they aren't trained to do. It puts left brains to work solving right brain problems and it turns the business upside down. - andrewry, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Great article Julek. Zane's is better though.
- KSUdesigner, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1@ IrwinFletcher
The point is that when it comes to design, it is THE CLIENT'S MONEY. If you tell them "hey I'm the expert, I know what's best, it must be done this way" you are running the risk of your client pulling the job out from under your feet and they will in turn spread the word that you weren't the best person to work with. There are many clients who will fully trust your judgement and understand that they do not know everything when it comes to design, those are the real gems to work for. However, at the end of the day, the success of a designer is not based entirely upon whether or not their work is "pretty." Your job is to please the client, plain and simple. You have the right to refuse to continue working for any client if you choose to do so, and vice versa. Ask just about any professional designer and you will find that not every project is a dream come true, in fact the good ones are usually few and far between.
I fully believe that it is your job as a designer to convince your client that you know what is best in this area. If a designer is just sitting there spitting back out exactly what the customer wants, without any creative input whatsoever, well that's just not the way to run a successful creative business IMO. But what do you do when your client basically says "it's my way or the highway"? Do you tell them to just go ***** themselves? No. You do what they want because in the end you need that paycheck. So their project doesn't end up in your portfolio, big deal. Maybe some day I'll be successful enough to tell those hard-headed clients to go ***** themselves, but until then I'm going to make my clients happy and get paid, whether I like the final result of the project or not. Make your client happy and they will spread the word. One happy client equals many referrals for new business. - IrwinFletcher, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Not just the fact that those guys charge so little, but they will do anything and everything the client asks of them, regardless of what it ends up looking like. A lot of marketing directors are really salespeople who cannot divorce there own personal aesthetic from what the needs of the project really are. It's "their" project (even they answer to a higher fiscal power in their company) and they view designers as a vendor, someone to execute their vision. A lot of these designers and agencies are so eager to please that they don't try to do anything else. The client base has come to view design as a trade, not as a profession as a result of this.
- zanejamal, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0you owe me big time julek :)
- shiftless, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1http://duggmirror.com/design/How_to_achieve_a_better_client_designer_relationship/
- shaungw, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0Nice article Julek
- CarolynMittens, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0That article has plenty of valid points, but, for the most part, I don't think there's anything wrong with a dispassionate client. That can be a great opportunity for a designer to create something really cool. While that does open up the possibility for a lot of hard work down the drain when the client sees your innovative creation and decides they don't like it, It seems to me that doesn't happen all that often. For the most part, non-designers will be happy with anything you give them (assuming you have talent).
- vbsurfer, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1If you're a actual working web designer / interactive designer professional and working for a design studio/advertising ag/est. freelancer, this should be second nature.
- tbeseda, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1don't abuse it.
http://duggmirror.com
interesting article, but "closerness"??? :-p - bootedcat, on 10/12/2007, -5/+0I recommend this short movie mocking Kim Jong Il and his secret agent buying Hennessy XO wine from Chinese black market :=)
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=EE52D9ED01495685 - TenebrousX, on 10/12/2007, -9/+4Site's down
================================================
So today’s post will be a post from a designer’s point-of-view on how the perfect client > designer relationship should be. Just a head’s up, you may not agree with my opinions but they are after all just my opinions. I’ve worked with hundreds of clients in my career and this is my own personal observation. Feel free to debate by commenting on this post!
Okay, I’ll start out with listing some things designers dislike. I mean, some of these things can and will entirely de-motivate a designer to the extent that he/she doesn’t care about the paycheck as much as leaving the client.
Beating around the bush. Putzing around. Being broad, indirect, general - whatever you want to call it. Many designers simply can’t tolerate this. When a designer creates a work - a revision or mockup - to present to the client, he wants the direct truth. I’ve been with many clients in the past that won’t pinpoint or critique the mockup, rather, they’ll say things such as “Okay… alright.” or “Cool.” … et cetera. When I create a mockup, at least, I want to know whether my client hates it, loves it, or likes it *BUT! (*common mistake: skipping the following step) providing specific critique about what is wrong with the new revision. Clients: Do not be afraid to BE DIRECT! If you don’t like something created for you, unless you’ve signed a crazy contract, you are under no obligation to make your designer feel good about producing utter ugliness.
Being honest with each other. Designers! If your client dislikes something you’ve made, though you truly feel your revision, or conceptual idea thereof, is a far more logical and better way to go, then be honest to your client about it! Explain to them thoroughly why you believe your concept is ‘better’ then their perspective of something. It may work, and chances are if your perspective is logical and your client sees the light, he/she’ll take it. (Which means your client’s success, and less work for you :p)
Ensure happiness. This goes for both parties of the system. Designers: Make sure you ask for a very specific description of what the client is after. Ask them about everything of the project’s everything (if you understand the phrase). Clients: Make sure you PROVIDE a full, descriptive, and specific brief of what you’re after. Make sure to take advantage of your designer’s unique skills, if you see something you like. Ask for everything and anything you want. And like I keep saying, DON’T BE TOO BROAD! Success never comes from “Oh, I don’t know. Just make something cool and if I like it we’ll go from there.” - NO!
Lastly, be cheap and expect cheap. The quality of your price determines the quality of your design. Don’t pay someone $300 for a three page blog design and expect to get something incredible. Sure, depending on who you hired, it may not be bad. BUT, paying $100 for anything is just absolutely ridiculous. Designers: If you’re still charging $100/logo or $100/template - you’re ruining the market. I have to be honest with a controversial observation I’ve carefully made. Clients like to pay for quality. Most clients don’t even look for designers for under $500, some don’t even look for under $5,000. (One of my favorite blog posts was made by Tyler Cruz on design prices.) Basically what point #4 is saying, is… The cheaper the price (VARIES!!!), the cheaper the quality. Don’t pay pennies and expect a dream come true back.
Just a few little tips on how to achieve good client > designer relationships. - j0shk, on 10/12/2007, -6/+1Nice entry man.
- noah45, on 10/12/2007, -7/+1bravo...(claps sarcastically).
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