What is Digg?Sponsored by Activision
Band Hero view!
guitarhero.com - The biggest event music event of the year is now in your living room.
215 Comments
- Th3_anOmoLy, on 12/09/2007, -11/+151This is horrible. Perhaps, in protest, in the next Victoria's Secret catalog the models should refuse to wear these products in the photos.
I think it would, um, really help spread awareness... yea.... - jmpeagle, on 12/09/2007, -35/+119that is free trade. It is pareto efficient. If you took away their jobs they would go hungy or be forced into things such as prostitution.
3.3 minutes for 4 cents translates into 73 cents per hour which in purchasing power parity (because wages are paid at the exchange rate from dollars to Jordanian dinars) is about $1.72 per hour over (assume light sweatshop conditions of 10 hours per day, 5 days a week) translates into about $4600 per year, which is around the per capita income of the average Jordanian (in PPP it is $5100) - cococooky, on 12/09/2007, -0/+60What's the story with the thumbnail?
- Itazura, on 12/09/2007, -3/+51Don't worry, with the depreciation of the U.S. dollar they will soon be making our minimum wage.
- kublerross, on 12/09/2007, -5/+40"Workers who fall behind on their production goals, or who make even a minor error, can be slapped and beaten."
horray for being a callous prick who only thinks of wages - beck001, on 12/09/2007, -2/+33I think the wages are not the issue. The issue, since you are unable to "read for understanding", is the working conditions. They are forced essentially to work 90-100+ hours weekly, 7 days a week, and their employer is stealing from their checks. You should re-read this article, and try to understand it before you open your mouth to spew forth inaccuracies.
- WallyAnti, on 12/09/2007, -10/+36I disagree, just because someone is happy to be in an exploitative situation because they have escaped a more exploitative situation is not justification. Unless you just toss all ethics out the window, which a lot of you economists seem to be happy to do.
There never has been, nor will there ever be a "free market". It's just a buzz word to get lazy people to go "auuhh yeah I like freedom". It's controled by the government (which is ideally controlled by the people), or it's controlled by a few people who just continue to disproportionately become more influential than the average joe. I believe that even Adam Smith said that capitalism would require regulation.
"Write a letter" puuuhlease. Vote with your dollars people. Vote for ethics or vote for convenience. Your choice. - Autofac, on 12/09/2007, -1/+25I am never buying another bra from there again.
- killcops, on 12/09/2007, -18/+40That's progress. Capitalism. Free trade. What else are we supposed to do? Pay them fair wages? We can't see their faces, they're on the other side of the world, so we don't care that they're working near-slave labor. As long as we keep them super far away, no one will care that we completely rape them.
- cyborg, on 12/09/2007, -3/+19I guess slave labor was Victoria's Secret.....
- FishHammer, on 12/09/2007, -1/+17Oprah and John Edwards both shop at Victoria's Secret so they're promoting slave labor
- runesya, on 12/09/2007, -7/+22a long quote, but i think it is necessary, because many of you skip the fact that these people are forced to work long hours and not getting the right share of the profit they make possible.
We are all responsible for this if we do not work against the bad working conditons imposed or made possible by the US government.
"The workers begged management to free their unjustly imprisoned friends and co-workers. Management refused and the workers stopped working at 10:30 a.m. on November 12. The strike continues. The owner of the factory is now threatening to have all the guest workers forcibly deported back to Bangladesh and Sri Lanka. The owner says food and water will be cut off and following that, the workers will be forcibly removed from the dorms.
The workers paid anywhere from $1,500 to over $3,000 to purchase three-year work contracts in Jordan--an enormous amount of money in Bangladesh and Sri Lanka. Workers had to go deeply into debt, borrowing the money on the informal market, often at five to ten percent interest per month, If the workers are deported, they will never be able to pay off their debts, and they and their families will be ruined." - mihkeltt, on 12/09/2007, -0/+14nude victoria's secret models - GENIUS
- brstilson, on 12/09/2007, -0/+11Neither do we.
- kublerross, on 12/09/2007, -8/+19yeah because before the great benevolent victorias secret factory came to town no one could think of surviving
- beck001, on 12/09/2007, -2/+12Good job reading the article. 3rd grade "reading for understanding", you were sick that year?
- inactive, on 12/09/2007, -5/+15We should dump every free trade agreement that we have entered into. We should follow traditional American tax policy by basing the majority of Federal expenditure on tariffs.
Free trade agreements do not benefit the American worker. Ever. They benefit giant corporations that take their American capital and go to Jordan where they can suborn local officials to let them trick and then enslave Sri Lankans to produce goods that are shipped back here.
It is just like war. The power elites scare the populace into thinking we are in danger. They send the average guy's children off to bleed and die while they amass power and wealth at the expense of everyone else.
We need to stop being dupes. Get out of trade agreements. - kestrel1989, on 12/09/2007, -1/+11I understand the differences in the cost of living for Americans compared to those in the sweat shops. What I do not understand are many of the other points brought up in the article. Why are the workers not supplied with their residency permits? Were these permits part of the fee paid to D.K. Garments? Why are the workers forced to work overtime? Was this part of their contract with D.K. Garments? Does their contract also permit D.K. Garments to beat the employees, deny earned overtime wages and withhold food and water. If D.K Garments has broken their agreements with the "guest workers" then Victoria's Secret should take notice and act to correct this. Unless of course they would prefer the world to know they don't care how their subcontractors act.
- JonGalt, on 12/09/2007, -5/+14OMFG....can you people PLEASE stop referring to this as free trade? THE PRINCIPLE APPLICABLE TO THIS SITUATION is "free market" where goods and services are transacted openly, uncoerced, without force or fraud, in a free market economy governments CAN and are OBLIGATED to punish this type of behavior by criminals, make that distinction between what you may be referring to as business men carefully. There is a HUGE difference between the two.
Free trade is the principle that deals with removing all hindering effects on imports and exports on countries that have trade, AND the governments intervention, which only has one legitimate behavior in a free trade situation, protection of individuals from coercion, force, harm or fraud. Which is were the similarities between the two end, although they go hand-in-hand philosophically.
please read the difference between the two for yourself so you don't sound like an ignorant jackass:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_trade
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_market - WallyAnti, on 12/09/2007, -2/+10So why not favor the low paid factory workers over here? Where people aren't, you know, exploited because it's typical. I just don't understand. If you don't make it a priority for foreign companies to treat and pay their employees well, then they just won't do it. Your money has the power to persuade these bastards to clean up their act; more so than any regulation or government intervention.
- hmunkey, on 12/09/2007, -0/+7Playboy sure cares about the plight of the sweatshop workers.
- inactive, on 12/09/2007, -5/+12Here we see real globalism in action. We have found a loophole to use slave labor. So in effect, we're still slavers. The economy, the shrinking dollar, credit collapse, etc is all ultimately bad karma coming back on the US for employing slavery. It's not just about wages, BTW. Note that employees are being beaten, and aren't free to leave. This isn't free market labor, it's slavery.
- Myztry, on 12/09/2007, -3/+9Or the US workers will be getting 4 yen making lingerie for Chinese women
- CanceledCzech, on 12/09/2007, -0/+6You mean with Oprah and Edwards? It's presidential stuff, so... basically a crock of *****. Don't worry about it.
- mrsteveman1, on 12/09/2007, -0/+6That argument doesn't hold up well most of the time. If nearly everything on the market that could be considered competitive is produced by these same practices, should people just stop buying items in that product class entirely? Thats quite unreasonable in many cases, and typically doesn't ever work because a large number of people continue to buy because they don't care, or don't know about the situation. So in the end you get a mediocre number of people who refuse to buy something, sales decline slightly, sometimes the companies attribute this to something else and nothing changes.
The only way to effect change like this is to STOP buying entirely, which as I said rarely if ever happens unless the BUYER feels threatened by the product, like with the lead in toys scandal. Even in that situation, people are still buying the items, even though the companies are well aware of the problem, and even though most people are as well.
Regulation is in fact necessary in cases like this because the market DOES NOT correct problems automatically. - EvilAnimator, on 12/09/2007, -2/+8I can go into VS with my girlfriend whenever I want. Shut the hell up and go make me a sandwich!
- JonGalt, on 12/09/2007, -5/+11Your all morons. What he is referring to is not "free trade" its "free market" and what is occurring here is in no way a free market. Here's why.
"The key idea of a free market is voluntary exchange. If an exchange takes place under coercion or fraud, then that exchange is not considered a free market exchange. For example, if someone threatens someone with a gun to purchase what he is selling or exaggerates the item's quality, then that is a not a free market." ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_market ) This situation is also applicable becuase its individuals SELLING their services, which these people are doing.
Just so you know: Free trade: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_trade
The only restrictions on free trade are against government interference within business when no imposition, coercion or fraud is occurring. It is a governments PRIMARY concern to protect its citizens from EXACTLY what is occurring above.
The guy that posted this and every person that agreed with him needs to get there facts straight and stop being a lazy ignorant moron and read a little bit. Oh and also exercise their right in your country to NOT buy a bra from Vic-secrets. - mstoneburner, on 12/09/2007, -0/+6Not if you've ever done any sewing, no.
- EvilAnimator, on 12/09/2007, -4/+10Everyone, stop buying Wiis, DSes, iPods, Zunes, LCDs, everything made overseas! You are killing the world with your consumerism!!!!!!!!!
- Eryin, on 12/09/2007, -1/+6retail therapy just got a little less theraputic
- Cloudime, on 12/09/2007, -4/+9What? A Victoria's Secret story without light-pr0n?
Pfft..Buried as lame.
/sarcasm - ShugNinx21, on 12/09/2007, -3/+9If I don't voluntarily go to my job, I will die of starvation. Does that make all jobs slave labor?
- inactive, on 12/09/2007, -0/+5A lot of guys have problems with their bras and panties wearing out. It's normal.
- airwalkery2k, on 12/09/2007, -0/+5You obviously skipped the fact that they paid for work permits and never received them, so they are forced into a small compound. And I doubt 100-hour weeks or any of those conditions were what they were promised when they left for Jordan. Typically those "programs" are scams to trick people into being forced into those working conditions. They obviously traveled there to gain a better way of life, but obviously from their reaction and their treatment, it is not much better.
- enri, on 12/09/2007, -1/+6The great thing is we don't have to "assume light sweatshop conditions" because the article is very clear about them.
"The Victoria's Secret workers toil 14 to 15 hours a day, from 7:00 a.m. to 9:00 or 10:00 p.m., seven days a week, receiving on average one day off every three or four months. All overtime is mandatory, and workers are routinely at the factory 98 to 105 hours a week while toiling 89 to 96 hours."
And since the workers had to pay a minimum of $1500 for their contract it I find it interesting that when they decided to strike because six of their co-workers were arrested for protesting the working conditions the owner threatened to cut off food and water. Gee, I'm glad free trade provides them with such a great job or they might "go hungy". - keraneuology, on 12/09/2007, -3/+8"There never has been, nor will there ever be a "free market". It's just a buzz word to get lazy people to go "auuhh yeah I like freedom". It's controled by the government"
Incorrect. MASSIVELY incorrect. There absolutely IS a "free market" - a free market exists any time the government refuses to act. The only reason why the market isn't free is because the government repeatedly insists on either getting involved and taking control or running interference for the corporations that are screwing everything up. If you want a truly free market then eliminate minimum wage and hold company owners and managers -personally- liable or any injuries/deaths caused by the working conditions they create. Knowingly sign off on a dangerous and deficient product? Not nearly as likely when you personally are subject to prosecution for negligent homicide when your toaster blows up. Refuse to spend the money on air quality and safety equipment for the workers? No more hiding behind "just because I wouldn't sign the check doesn't mean that I wouldn't buy the equipment... the company didn't buy the equipment, not me". And, above all, punish to a severe extreme anybody who attempts to silence critics of your company. No more slander/libel lawsuits against consumers who were screwed over.
It really is that simple. - ScofflawVA, on 12/09/2007, -0/+4All of these sweatshops operate out of sigh out of mind. If these conditions existed in the U.S. like they did less than a hundred years ago, there would be an uproar.
Sending a letter to the labor board is like pissing into an ocean. - mrsteveman1, on 12/09/2007, -0/+4I agree with most of what you said, except for the vote with your dollars part. That rarely works because sales don't usually decline enough for the company to understand, much less care enough to change.
But yes, regulation is necessary even in a real free market, which this is not. - Singularitarian, on 12/09/2007, -3/+7What would be unethical is using force to make people behave the way you want them to behave. The morally right thing to do is insist that all human interaction be strictly voluntary, with free trade as a corollary. It is laissez-faire that has the moral high ground.
As a practical matter, laissez-faire does not create poverty; but sometimes it inherits it from a previous system. - brstilson, on 12/09/2007, -34/+38Horray for judging foreign peoples' wages based on our cost of living!
- darksydxx, on 12/09/2007, -1/+5don't forget to add the fact we eye rape you for every item you pickup
- SanTe, on 12/09/2007, -0/+3And only labor generates sales, for if there is no product to sell then even the owner can pack it up and go home.
- CanceledCzech, on 12/09/2007, -0/+3Wow, look at that. Seems as though you've found an alternative way to look at things that could possible punch a whole in the whole "anti-sweatshop" argument. Too bad the Victoria's Secret workers are still slaves.
- sx66gns, on 12/09/2007, -0/+3their monthly income is like 30 dollars a month, BFD.
- enri, on 12/09/2007, -1/+4It's a picture from the "More in Business" section of the page. The article should have been submitted without the pic as its only relevance is that John Edwards supported the trade agreement that permits the worker treatment as described in the article.
- drouk1556, on 12/09/2007, -0/+3It's not just American companies. Don't be an ass.
- saisumimen, on 12/09/2007, -6/+9"Voluntarily" as in "if you don't voluntarily get a job, you'll die of starvation".
- inactive, on 12/09/2007, -4/+7why is there a picture of oprah and john edwards next to this story? does john know victoria's secret?
- Hoxie, on 12/09/2007, -1/+4Buried as lying.
There are no girls on digg. - m4lomb, on 12/09/2007, -0/+34 Cents!!! We are paying too much! We need to send our militaty an steal EVERYTHING we want. Unlimited goods AND services. Yup, have them work at gunpoint too. That is American!
-
Show 51 - 100 of 219 discussions
© Digg Inc. 2009
— Content created and posted by Digg users is