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147 Comments
- BullHunter, on 01/02/2009, -3/+40Creating jobs is always good, as long as the industries are owned by your own country. We Aussies are good at selling out to foreign owned companies.
- brad3378, on 01/03/2009, -0/+30I'm an engineer.
Show me a cost effective buckypaper and I'll show you a cost effective buckypaper bridge.
Until then, I'll stick with cost effective materials such as Aluminum and Steel.
Furthermore, as a taxpayer, I want to see the most bang for my buck. I don't want my tax dollars being spent on carbon fiber toilet seats when a plastic seat performs just as well for a fraction of the price. - zacharytelschow, on 01/02/2009, -4/+31"Industry executives are 'adding their voices to pleas for a huge public investment program of up to $1 trillion over two years,' the Times reported."
Propping up an industry using taxpayer money is not an "investment," its transferring wealth from productive members of society to industries that produce too much product (see: Agriculture, Automobiles). Somehow, an idiotic waste of taxpayer money going to special interests isn't very surprising. Where's this change I keep hearing about? - sjbdallas, on 01/02/2009, -4/+28No problem as long as it doesn't include buying from an American company who's manufacturing is in another country. That would include all the car companies with factories in Mexico, or Apple's iPod coming from China, or any store stocking their shelves with products from overseas.
- inactive, on 01/03/2009, -6/+30I am sorry I can't buy American... I've tried buy everything I need to buy on a regular basis is either MADE IN CHINA, MALAYSIA, SINGAPORE, TAIWAN or INDONESIA.
(clothes, electronic devices, iPods, memory cards, etc...) - zacharytelschow, on 01/02/2009, -4/+27"This is exactly why the government should stay out of business and special interests. Put the money in what will make better lives, transfer the jobs over to newer industries."
I was with you for a second there, then I wasn't. Government has no business deciding which industries are "new" or "transferring" jobs. The free market can do that just fine on its own. Government needs to get out of the way. - jasdf, on 01/03/2009, -4/+27FTA: a recovery program that has in every provision a 'buy America' clause."
Absolutely! This must be the cornerstone of any plan. It is similar to the Apollo program (which cost ~$135B in 2005 dollars); even though the price tag is shocking if the money stays in the country the wheels will keep turning. The only thing "wasted" in the Apollo program was a couple million pounds of raw materials, the money stays on Earth and in the US economy. - fauxbro, on 01/03/2009, -1/+22The "Steel Industry" is a very vaugue and encompassing term. Generally it means manufactures of steel, aluminum, and iron, etc. we'll be needing these products for a while
- maxpower2911, on 01/03/2009, -0/+17I wouldn't go so far as calling steel old fashioned. It's quite good at doing the things it's designed for.
- inactive, on 01/03/2009, -3/+20The United States needs a reboot. It seems like everything is failing.
- darkened, on 01/03/2009, -3/+20As much as I hate the government in general for doing stuff it shouldn't and spending my money in ways it shouldn't this is atleast one provision I fully agree with. If they're going to spend my money no matter what atleast spend it on American made products and not allow any company that outsources or half produces foreignly to get the American Government's money.
- BrainInAJar, on 01/03/2009, -4/+19Protectionism worked so well at the beginning of the Great Depression
Don't see why it wouldn't work as well this time... - pyra5, on 01/02/2009, -1/+15I'm not sure this is about creating jobs as much as it is about saving jobs. Coming from a non-union American steel mill, I have to say the it is a hairy situation when you have layed off 25% of your work force.
- badqat, on 01/02/2009, -3/+16So, is protectionism no longer going to be the hallmark of the US steel industry, or will that be the next battle cry?
- Akairenn, on 01/03/2009, -0/+13Buckypaper? You're serious? Odin's testicles, you are, aren't you?
Uh, yeah, call me when you can get a skyscraper made out of "buckypaper" - rofl.
There are no better alternatives to steel at present. Just a lot of promising things which in the distant future, could be a damned sight better. So, should we have a halt on all building until these "better alternatives" can actually be utilized? - theviceroy, on 01/03/2009, -2/+11Stop buying "ipods" on a regular basis! good lord!
- icexe, on 01/04/2009, -0/+9i kinda miss the days of chrome covered steel bumpers on cars.
- jmo14, on 01/04/2009, -0/+8am i the only one that doesn't see a problem with this as long as its a good product? i mean u.s. steel and nucor have a good rep worldwide, so what is the problem? or does everything have to be anti-every government decision?
- FlyingCaveman, on 01/04/2009, -0/+8How about, The steel industry puts some pressure on the manufactures to "Build American" instead of building cheap plastic crap.
- maxpower2911, on 01/04/2009, -0/+7LordAddius sounds a lot like a civil engineer, all concrete - all the time.
- moulin1, on 01/03/2009, -2/+9"US Gov should buy the cheapest steel available". And will you be crying when what they build falls on your head?
- Dumbledorito, on 01/03/2009, -0/+7Government infrastructure and similar "re-investment" is fine. The trouble is the congresscritters and the industries involved have realized that they can both make off with billions and never get caught, and the taxpayer winds up screwed with no actual improvement in the quality of infrastructure.
We need an ethics enforcement agency in DC that can't be legislated into toothless ineffectiveness by those they're meant to police. - DarkStar3333, on 01/04/2009, -3/+10Its a truely sad state of affairs when you have to resort to drinking American beers.
- moulin1, on 01/03/2009, -3/+10US industries are in decline because they are beaten down by the anti-free market, protectionsist, predatory policies of competing countries. While our steel industry was floundering in the seventies and eighties, hamstrung by the inability to borrow to upgrade their infrastructure and drowning in high interest debt, the Japanese government was funding our competitors with 0% interest rates. It is protectionism and government interference by other nations, without any defence from our own that brought down our industrial power. Not any lack of foresight or capability on the part of our industries or workers.
- jmark13, on 01/02/2009, -21/+28Why should the government pay for the steel industry when there are better alternatives being created all the time- like "buckypaper"? steel is a 100 year old antiquated product. This is exactly why the government should stay out of business and special interests. Put the money in what will make better lives, transfer the jobs over to newer industries.
- jtm26, on 01/04/2009, -0/+7as a materials scientist, im all for buckypaper, but it's not going to happen for like a 100 years and $200 billion of research. so for now, i'm a metallurgical engineer, I work for ArcelorMittal, and the steel we come up with everyday, research, develop, mass produce, is orders and orders of magnitude stronger, tougher, more wear resistant, less corrosive, and more cost effective than any steel in the past. articles like this are so encouraging to read because i really believe in steel, how it's transformed our nation and the world, and what we can utilize it for in the future, it's really limitless. and if we could even get a fraction of that $1 trillion invested in public works projects in the US, not only would our industry be able to continue to support a lot of high-paying, very high-skilled jobs in the United States, but this country could have some really nice stuff, high speed rail, lighter, stronger, safer cars, nuclear energy also takes a lot of steel....bridges, buildings, energy, etc... so if you really think steel is useless, archaic, and outdated, look around you and see how much steel you use everyday, it's incredible to think about.
- NoLibertarians, on 01/04/2009, -0/+7If American companies can compete price wise and quality wise, I agree we should buy from them first !
- britishman, on 01/03/2009, -2/+8the only way the US became a super power after the the great depression was because its manufacturing rivals in Europe were bombed out of existence during WWII so unless we have WWIII (I hope we don't) in Asia I don't see a way out!
- hfactor, on 01/04/2009, -0/+6But if government interference is bad - why did they succeed with it? If it is good - why don't Americans support it?
- JasPruett, on 01/04/2009, -1/+7An investment in infrastructure is far better for boosting our failing economy than just giving away billions of dollars of taxpayer money so that executives can get huge bonuses and companies can fund large corporate parties. If the government spends money to upgrade public works, specifically transportation such as mass transit and interstate highways, the amount of money used and the number of jobs created would do a great deal of work toward boosting our economy. The "buy American" clause is just something that would keep them money here in the US instead of shipping it overseas to boost the economy of other countries instead of our own.
- DarkStar3333, on 01/04/2009, -0/+6If many need a solution then isn't mass transit that solution? If you havent noticed, building more roads and continuous sprawl isn't working either.
From a budgetary perspective, mass transit simply scales better then constatly trying to patch up an ever growing number of streets. - cubicledrone, on 01/04/2009, -0/+6Real wages have been stagnant in the U.S. for 38 years. That not enough of a pay cut for you?
- PoizonFrog, on 01/03/2009, -2/+8I'd like to see more employee owned businesses. That would stop a lot of the nonsense and ripoffs.
- zacharytelschow, on 01/02/2009, -6/+12"Saving" jobs costs jobs elsewhere. If demand for steel is down and it can't be produced at a profit, less steel should be produced. Its that simple. What advantage is gained by taxpayers to prop up an overproducing industry?
- alpharaptor, on 01/03/2009, -0/+5the first priority in any union is prevention of loss of life. there have been some unions and associations that abused their power and succeeded in obtaining unrealistic demands, UAW i'm looking in your direction. if they indeed stuck by the mantra 'safe working conditions and a fair day's pay for a fair day's work', there not be the 'No more unions.' guys putting a foot in their mouths.
- darkened, on 01/03/2009, -2/+7I fully agree poidh.
- brad3378, on 01/04/2009, -0/+5+1 to hotkarl for being correct (assuming he is implying tensile strength)
+1 to Lord Addius for being absolutely correct about concrete being a superior material in compression per unit of cost.
It performs even better when it is poured with steel reinforcement rods and/or fiber mesh.
Concrete & re-rods go together like peanut butter and chocolate. The concrete provides the compression strength while the re-rods provide the tensile strength. - Smuikas, on 01/04/2009, -0/+5Non-intervention does not mean isolationist. It means we stay out of foreign wars, while maintaining free trade.
- jec68, on 01/03/2009, -1/+6Completely agree with this sentiment. Perfectly articulated.
- jbmcb, on 01/03/2009, -2/+7> Put the money in what will make better lives, transfer the jobs over to newer industries.
Let me see Uncle Sam's degree in materials science and metallurgy and I'll be all for him investing in high tech steel. - poidh, on 01/03/2009, -4/+9There isn't going to be a change. That was just a slogan to sucker you guys into voting for one candidate over another.
- theviceroy, on 01/03/2009, -1/+5So what's your solution? The flying car?
- bekindin09, on 01/03/2009, -1/+5Did you read in the article that taxpayers could benefit from new mass transit systems, "All the big cities have these projects ready to go." This economic impact is exactly what Obama hinted at in his election speeches; an independent, semi-isolationist USA
- inactive, on 01/04/2009, -0/+4They have been doing it for landholders, er farmers for years. Got land? you must be a primary producer. here have a million dollars. How are those race horses going? Its the major reason Brazil and Australia cannot access the US sugar trade and why the Sugar in the US cost 3 times more pound for pound.
- texas85, on 01/04/2009, -1/+5ya, looks like they upgraded to vista without upgrading the hardware.
- devilclown, on 01/04/2009, -0/+4"I don't want my tax dollars being spent on carbon fiber toilet seats when a plastic seat performs just as well for a fraction of the price."
I had to laugh when i read this, I pictured a high performance racing toilet. - inactive, on 01/04/2009, -0/+4Sounds like Macquarie venture capital.
http://www.macquarie.com.au/au/index.html
They buy roads as a rule. Its also known as the Millionaire factory. - inactive, on 01/04/2009, -0/+4Steel has the highest strength per weight per cost than any other material.
- inactive, on 01/04/2009, -0/+4Nah, The US is to Fascist (Corporatist) to be Communist. Which is why its doing this.
- Smuikas, on 01/04/2009, -0/+4NYC is the only city in North America where a majority of the people living in it use mass transit.
The problem comes from sprawled cities like LA. Mass transit in those situations is impossible. If we retrofit our towns and cities to be more dense, mass transit would work.
In the meantime, our rail infrastructure could really use some work. We're well behind every other developed (and some developing - like China) nations in terms of rail infrastructure. If we had a decent national rail system (and don't even attempt to tell me that Amtrak is decent -- on average, it's about 25% less efficient than driving: an 8 hour drive from Raleigh, NC to NYC turns into 10+ hours on the train. And all you get to eat is ***** microwave pizza) things would go a really long way to making things better. Imagine riding a 200mph train from NYC to LA: that's 14 hours. If you aren't taking a direct flight, you would typically spend about 9 hours in airplanes and airports. Five more hours for a more luxurious trip seems well worth it. The only time people would opt for flying is when they need to be there ASAP - business, emergency occasions, and so forth.
Our airline infrastructure is crumbling under its own weight. We need a viable alternative. -
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