What is Digg?113 Comments
- houndeyex, on 04/28/2008, -2/+65"Ilana Arazie, 32, believes in more openness in discussing personal finances."
That's because Ilana Arazie, 32, is probably a total gold-digger. - CTK14A, on 04/28/2008, -3/+54Employers want you to be in the dark as to your real value as an employee; a certain amount of secrecy is key to maintaining the status-quo in the workplace. It reminds me of a video I saw once, of an interviewer asking a group of older female sweatshop laborers what they think the shirt they'd just made (real cost about 17 cents) sells for in the West; the highest estimate was something like a dollar. It sold for twenty. The sweatshop ladies threw their arms up in the air in outrage and refused to go back to work...
- ajaxqueen, on 04/28/2008, -0/+49This will probably provoke someone to knock together a crappy 'compare your salary to friends' app, I can picture it now - 'you earn less than 80% of your friends' ;)
- piratearggghhh, on 04/28/2008, -2/+29With colleagues, it can create tension, bickering and jealousy over uneven salaries, which is a reality - especially when some people you know who don't deserve high pay have just been there longest or even vice versa, where the young guy/gal comes in and makes more than a more senior person. I can see this as an ugly can of worms for management.
- robotto, on 04/28/2008, -1/+26"Ilana Arazie, 32, believes in more openness in discussing personal finances." She also believes it makes it easier looking for a man.
- inactive, on 04/28/2008, -2/+25Nothing is stopping me from telling Facebook that I made eleventy billion dollars a fortnight on the hogshead. Everyone lies.
- aschepis, on 04/28/2008, -0/+16The problem with demanding "fair pay for everyone" is that fair pay does not mean equal pay. Furthermore, everybody has a different idea of what fair pay is for a particular organization. You might think that you are more (or less) valuable than you really are to an organizations. Your colleagues all have a different idea of how much you should make compared to them as well.
Some people may be motivated by the disparity in salaries. Others will be jealous or angry. - kingo123, on 04/28/2008, -1/+17"As Ilana Arazie, 32, an online video producer for a media company in Manhattan, said, “If we can talk about how many orgasms we have with our mate, why can’t we discuss how much we make?" --- the rest of the article is lost to me... I now want to know how many orgasms she has.
- lordtyros, on 04/28/2008, -0/+15It's a problem that can be solved by firing the troublemaker.
- inactive, on 04/28/2008, -0/+14By telling people that you earn less that you actually do, you can keep your competitive edge.
- inactive, on 04/28/2008, -0/+12lol @ blatant gold digger
- weaselfingers, on 04/28/2008, -1/+13Buried for sentence containing the words "diggs", "comments", and "frontpage".
- ryanhayn, on 04/28/2008, -5/+15What's the problem with talking about salary? I never understood that. I'm 25, some college, and I make $15/hr. Big ***** deal.
- Canadian0207, on 04/28/2008, -2/+12that's the last taboo in America?? I think not buddy
- jaytek13, on 04/28/2008, -0/+9I wouldn't discuss my salary with friends unless I knew with certainty that I was making about the same as they were. Otherwise if I'm making quite a bit more, not gonna happen. With co-workers? Can lead to a bad situation if you are doing equivalent work but not getting equivalent pay.
I wouldn't consider it "taboo" as much as I would just an intelligent way to avoid problems. - cdigioia, on 04/28/2008, -1/+10And so can you! Just send fill out your credit card information to receive my seminar. If you don't like it, it's FREE!
- SpaceMonkeyZero, on 04/28/2008, -0/+8A $2 an hour raise is approximately $4000 a year raise. To someone making $40,000 a year, that's a 10% raise. You sound like you're right out of school with that sort of mentality.
- insomniac8400, on 04/28/2008, -2/+10I was about to say good article until this came up, "Many professionals interviewed said that they believe salary talk is best confined to friends within the same tax bracket, to spare feelings."
People aren't stupid. And that is what this quote suggests. Especially people who have been to college. They know full well what the average salary of their profession is and the average of other professions. It's not embarrassing when you become a teacher and make 30k a year. It's not bragging or elitism to become a lawyer and make 130k a year. Or a computer programmer and make 80k a year. And it's a good thing to let each other know what you make. Why make it such a secret? There is no reason for that. The only people who want salaries to be a secret are companies that don't want that employee they just gave a raise to, to know his raise was half what most get. Because if that employee knows that, in his next review, he can demand more money and will get it. Companies naturally are going to want to minimize salaries. - WoollyMittens, on 04/28/2008, -1/+9Salaries are taboo, because it is convenient for employers. It's easier to stiff the nice guy in favour of the loud mouth, that way. So... I'm a Web-interface developer and I make 3200 euros per month before taxes. Did I just break a taboo?
- SpaceMonkeyZero, on 04/28/2008, -0/+7http://ilanadonna.com/
She has a website... (From googling her name)
Now I ain't saying she a gold digger... - lordtyros, on 04/28/2008, -1/+8I'm ashamed that I understood that emoticon.
- kamikaze87, on 04/28/2008, -0/+6Chris, 21, believes IIana Arazie posting this information makes it easier to single her out for a one night stand sport ***** then to get emotionally attached to a gold digger of this magnitude.
- welshie, on 04/28/2008, -0/+6Is that Zimbabwean dollars?
- KyleGoetz, on 04/28/2008, -1/+7-$20,000/yr, student :(
- p0tent1al, on 04/28/2008, -0/+6Salary is a very touchy subject. It's one of those things that I personally don't want to know, because it will end up pissing me off anyway. I do more, or as much work as anyone in my company, and even though I know it's probably the case, I don't want to know that someone is making more than double what I make, because it's going to hurt my quality of work, and create unwanted tension.
I'd rather do my job, get more education, and graduate to a higher paying job, then really relish on what my associates make. And it's worked for me so far, 1 year ago I would have never imagined working at a job like this. I make a fair amount of money (even without a degree) and I work at a great company. - DeathJux, on 04/28/2008, -0/+6Do you... do you have a r-rusty spoon to share? Perhaps a r-rusty kettle? Oooooooooaaaahhhhhh...
- litfsh, on 04/28/2008, -4/+9But management is the only group that actually *does* benefit from not sharing salary information. The labor market must be viewed like any other market, and a one-sided lack of information will only hurt the group that is missing that information.
tl;dr
You're hurting yourself and your co-workers by *not* openly discussing your salaries. - koswix, on 04/28/2008, -9/+14Screw the man! Share your salary details with your colleagues and demand fair pay for everyone!
Ugly can of worms for management? That's their problem, not ours. - yellowfish04, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4back when random was funny..
- mikephimikephi, on 04/28/2008, -2/+6I noticed that the majority of careers referenced were creative/media/i.t.
It is possible that this is skewing the data because these people (I am one of them)
are predisposed to a more collaborative workplace, as well as have more outwardly
focussed personality traits. - tapeworm77, on 04/28/2008, -1/+5This one is already dead... go download a newer episode.
- diggopolous, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4And if I am correct about the picture she appears in, the backdrop behind her is a rooftop bar near the flat iron district in manhattan. It is Gold Digger central - Home of $9 10 oz drafts and a total blatant gold digger scene.
- Aensland, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4I'm glad I didn't even realise it was supposed to be some kind of emote.
- oldgal, on 04/28/2008, -1/+5I like the way the younger folks use the information to strategize. These kids are different, they are naturally collaborative and make collaboration a powerful tool. Good for them!
- kodek, on 04/28/2008, -2/+6Over $9000 can still beat $9001
- chancesarent, on 04/28/2008, -1/+4$45,000.00/yr, Nuclear Reactor Refuel Tech.
- p0tent1al, on 04/28/2008, -1/+4Ok, I'm curious as to the though process that you reached this conclusion.
First of all, how exactly do you plan to initiate this discussion? "Hey I make 10/hr what do you guys make"? Without a co-worker saying something first, or you knowing an associate on an extremely close personal level, there is absolutely no way you could know that they would be comfortable with this premise. Ask the question, and they might say "I am not comfortable sharing that information". Instant tension. Come on a little too hard, and you might even be reprimanded or fired by management.
Second off, how is discussing your salary necessarily beneficial to you? What if you don't know, that you actually make more than everyone else, or get a rate that was/is much higher than when other people who started received? If you discuss your salary, how does that put you in a better position to ask for a raise?
Let me give you an example. If everyone THINKS I receive an extremely low amount of money, and I either tell them or they find out I received a 2 dollar raise, they still don't really know how much I make! And if they found out by your "open discussions", this might lead to firings, or employees quitting, and in most cases, until they find replacements, the responsibilities of those employees get spread out to the rest of the existing employees, meaning more work and stress for you!
I am happy not discussing salary, because I am a hardworker and while the wage I make might not be as high as others, I move up in wage incredibly fast, so I'm always in a good position to get more wage.
So I guess my point is, studying your craft and getting better is going to do more for your wage in the long run than discussing and bickering about current salaries with your current company. Exactly the reason why each year I significantly raise the bar (no pun intended). - lordtyros, on 04/28/2008, -4/+7Amen. Post salaries in here, courageous internetters.
$25/hr, Software Engineering Intern. - Farmer77, on 04/28/2008, -3/+6Nothing good can come out of it.
- insomniac8400, on 04/28/2008, -1/+4Well considering everyone graduating college today freely discusses salaries to find out if they are getting a good offer, age is kinda related. And once your making over 200k I bet that is when salaries become hush hush. Because people know they are getting paid way more than they should be. And you probably get higher salaries when you are older. So again, age seems to be related.
- lisaawesome, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3As a low level manager in a retail store, I had no qualms about asking some of the people I supervised what they made (I was low enough I didn't have access to salary info). If I didn't have the balls to find out what typical wages were for those working under me I never would've found out how I was being royally screwed over by my managers. I weighed factors like time with the company, prior experience, workload, etc. and was without any doubt being severely underpaid. My managers wouldn't give me a merit raise to bring me up to par with the people I supervised so I walked. If we as employees allow ourselves to stay in the dark about what's really going on we will always be at a disadvantage. Don't get bitter or jealous and ruin morale and don't jump to conclusions about the numbers you hear though. You have to process and use the information wisely or you will just shoot yourself in the foot. Cliche as it may be, knowledge is power.
- liquidpele, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3If they are paying a moron more than me, that is my queue to look elsewhere because I could obviously do better! Sharing salary can be a bit touchy, but you can still do it with coworkers as long as they person isn't one of those annoying/jerk/phb types. I work for IBM, and sharing our salary is actually a fireable offense according to the company handbook. If you've ever read the employee's anonymous forum, you'll see why too. Most new hires make much more than older employees because large companies don't give raises enough, and when they do it's only a little and only if the company did well that year. That means basically that they don't keep up with inflation most of the time.
- insomniac8400, on 04/28/2008, -3/+6I'm not your buddy, friend!
- inactive, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2It is a emoticon based on a new logo design that got a lot of laughs, when turned sideways.
- xutopia, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2I hate sharing my salary with others. Too many of my friends are jealous of how much I make and I prefer living with them thinking that they're making really great salaries to avoid tension.
- SpaceMonkeyZero, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2That was perhaps the most useless comment ever on Digg.
- fokov, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2Religion, politics, and money are all things that can cause bad things between people. However, in my opinion, those three are the most important conversations to have because what was on TV doesn't matter, these other things do. Personnel, only ask if YOU are able to handle the response. Just like others have put it, people that you might look down on as incapable, or only there because they are connected, etc, might have a better salary than you. If you can't handle it, then do not ask the question. The same applies for politics and religion.
I've asked coworkers what they made, but I always asked it as "How much do you make? If you do not mind me asking." Always leave the decision up to them, and only tell them your salary if you want them to know. If you ask and then they ask, don't hold back.
You need to remember, in a capitalist world, you co-workers are competition, however, both of you have a common enemy in MGMT and owners. However, if you need a raise because inflation, or just being under paid, the best way to do it is look for another job (get a backup plan because if you can be replaced they will do it right away, so be weary of the consequences of your action), then come up with real reasons why you deserve this new amount of money. Base it on performance vs other employees, but don't try to make them out to be horrible workers. I did this after I got a 12.5% raise (was at 40k and got 5k raise after one year). I put a benchmark with my work compared to my coworkers, and also noted the average wage for my skill. After all this was said and done I double my initial salary in about 2.5 years.
If you are an employee, you are being exploited by default. Therefore, in my opinion, make sure you are getting your fair cut of the pie, and if you so desire, make sure your co-workers get theirs too. I'm not a union guy, but they have their place in forcing owners to pay up.
sorry for the rant. - SpaceMonkeyZero, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2Google Ilana Arazie and ask her yourself.
She's missing the point. Discussing how much you make with a DATE or a potential spouse is ok. Discussing with Bob over the watercooler at work is not. - jussipupu, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2Check this out. In Finland what people pay in taxes (and what they pay the taxes on, in other words their total income) is public information. You just go to the tax office and there is a bookshelf filled with binders. You find the name of the person and you can see exactly how much they made last year.
I know this is true for a fact because I went last week and looked up all my work colleagues. -
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