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422 Comments
- jmkiii, on 03/31/2008, -11/+150Pennies are stupid.
- ostracize, on 03/31/2008, -1/+9Hijack:
On a single page (why even make it an option?)
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2008/03/31/0803 ... - zerhynn, on 03/31/2008, -7/+2Amen.
- xXIrsotehkewlXx, on 03/31/2008, -7/+4Indeed and this whole discussion makes me kinda twitchy.
I have an OCD thing where pennies make me want to wash my hands repeatedly.
I guess they look dirty. - LightSpeed4, on 03/31/2008, -17/+5pennies arent stupid. the penny is used more than once, therefore it doesnt matter what it costs to make http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velocity_of_money
- shortyjacobs, on 03/31/2008, -4/+20That's a stupid argument. Velocity of money has nothing to do with it. They mint a penny for 1.7 cents, and sell it for 1 cent. That is a -0.7 cent profit, (or a 0.7 cent deficit).
If a drill costs me 50 bucks, and I use it more than once, the damn drill still cost 50 bucks!- PhilLesh69, on 04/01/2008, -0/+4It is not a stupid argument at all.
"selling a penny" is not exactly what goes on. Well, of course, with a private entity regulating our money supply by loaning money to the Federal government, in a way, maybe it is. However, providing an object to represent a value is a service, not a retail operation.
Imagine the cost to our economy if the lowest denominator of coin was a nickel. That would impact prices, transactions, etc.
The fact that a penny is used several thousand times, and lasts 30, 40 or 50 or more years representing a value makes it cost effective to spend 1.7 cents to produce a penny. The cost of the object has nothing to do with the value of the object. Nixon did away with that much better way when he decoupled the dollar from gold. - PhilLesh69, on 04/01/2008, -0/+1In fact, shortyjacobs, according to your logic, if you buy a drill for $50 and only use it once on a project that earns you less than $50, then of course the value is out of whack.
However, if you use that $50 drill for 10 jobs that each net you $45 in pay, then of course the value proposition changes, and it is worth spending more on the tool than the income you can get from it per job (or in other words, per transaction.) But by your logic, you would not buy that drill because it costs more than the value of each job it will allow you undertake.
- PhilLesh69, on 04/01/2008, -0/+4It is not a stupid argument at all.
- shortyjacobs, on 03/31/2008, -4/+20That's a stupid argument. Velocity of money has nothing to do with it. They mint a penny for 1.7 cents, and sell it for 1 cent. That is a -0.7 cent profit, (or a 0.7 cent deficit).
- 31213121, on 03/31/2008, -1/+42I'm selling pennies for 1.6 cents!!!!
PM for more info - etandrib, on 03/31/2008, -4/+10I don't like pennies but it isn't a good idea to get rid of the currency. An easy example is the stamp. You have to have 1 cent increments to make the currency work correctly. A better solution would be to find a way to create pennies for less than they are worth - right?
- inactive, on 03/31/2008, -1/+7LOL when is the last time you bought ONE STAMP with cash?
- ShadyG, on 03/31/2008, -0/+5I'm trying to remember the last time I sent anything via USPS.
- Adrianne, on 03/31/2008, -2/+7This conversation just never dies.
It isn't necessary to make a penny cost less. The mint sells coins to the government. They take a loss on the penny because other coins like the quarter are worth so much more than they cost to make.
I can't find recent information on it, but in 2004 a quarter cost a little over 7 cents to make.
In the end the mint profits immensely.- shortyjacobs, on 03/31/2008, -4/+1The mint IS the government. You can't profit if you sell something to YOURSELF. Therefore, they don't make a "profit" on the quarter. BUT, the mint buys the raw materials, (the metal), from an outside vendor, so it loses money on the penny.
- Adrianne, on 03/31/2008, -0/+4Just because it is a government office doesn't mean it doesn't make a profit. Why do you think they make commemorative coins?
From the mints website.
"The cost to manufacture a quarter is about 5 cents, providing a profit of approximately 20 cents per coin. United States Mint profits go to the general fund of the U.S. Treasury to help fund U.S. Government operations, reduce the need for new or higher taxes, and reduce the Federal Government's debt." - PhilLesh69, on 04/01/2008, -0/+2It doesn't lose money on anything, shortyjacobs.
You have to stop thinking in the simple terms of making something and selling it.
The Government provides a service, the printing and minting of currency, in order to provide a representation of value which can be traded for goods and services.
Yes, if it cost General Motors $20,000 to make a car they could sell for $15,000, they would be out of business. However, the government isn't in the business of making currency for a profit. They are in the business of making currency in order to tax the exchange of that currency for goods and services.
THE GOVERNMENT WILL SPEND WHATEVER IT TAKES TO PRODUCE A MARKER OF VALUE, IN ORDER TO TAX THE EXCHANGE OF THAT MARKER.
What if you found out that the $10 chip at a casino cost more than the chip was worth? Would that just blow your mind? (I'm not saying they do, but could you at least understand that if the casinos, in order to protect against counterfeiting, were willing to spend $15 to produce one $10 chip? Each chip is worth more to them than what it costs!!!) - shortyjacobs, on 04/01/2008, -0/+1Never thought of it that way. Thanks Phil.
- shortyjacobs, on 04/01/2008, -0/+1The argument still stands though. Just eliminating the penny doesn't mean there will be fewer exchanges of money, (and therefore fewer chances for the government to tax the exchange of said money). The same amounts of money will still change hands, so the government will still get to tax all that....they just won't have to spend 50 million on pennies each year. (They still have to buy that raw material from a private company).
- Adrianne, on 03/31/2008, -0/+4Just because it is a government office doesn't mean it doesn't make a profit. Why do you think they make commemorative coins?
- shortyjacobs, on 03/31/2008, -4/+1The mint IS the government. You can't profit if you sell something to YOURSELF. Therefore, they don't make a "profit" on the quarter. BUT, the mint buys the raw materials, (the metal), from an outside vendor, so it loses money on the penny.
- inactive, on 03/31/2008, -1/+7LOL when is the last time you bought ONE STAMP with cash?
- rmxz, on 03/31/2008, -2/+8Pennies could give us a Zinc Standard which is in some ways better than a Gold Standard.
Gold's rare enough that it's price can be manipulated - which is a bad thing for a currency.
IMHO the best monetary system ever was the Silver Certificates the US used to do -- both based on something valuable, and hard to manipulate.
But a Zinc standard based on Pennies would be a heck of a lot better than what we have today.- dafragsta, on 03/31/2008, -2/+1Yeah, and where are you going to store your $50,000 live saving at, while it's natural value grows? Any idea how unwieldy a large sum in pennies is? The penny is utterly useless. Call me when the half dollar is worth more than fiddy cent.
- PhilLesh69, on 04/01/2008, -0/+1We had a Gold AND silver backed currency.
- nixfu, on 03/31/2008, -3/+14A coin is only useful if it can BUY SOMETING.
Back when the USA was started you could actually purchase something for a penny...like say a handful of candy for 1C or maybe a pop for 2C....now they are USELESS.
Unless you can use ONE of them for purchases, then there is no need for them. The only reason they exist today is so we can be fooled into paying $3.99 for something instead of $4.
I say eliminate ALL CURRENT COINS AND JUST USE DOLLARS...and make 1, 2, and 5 dollar coins...then we can get back to the good ole days when things were easy to pay for...you want a candy bar, then you get 2 for a 1 dollar coin, want a sandwich? thats a 2 dollar coin, etc.- aidave, on 03/31/2008, -2/+7Fooled into paying less?
- mciampa1214, on 03/31/2008, -1/+7I don't even know where to begin annihilating that argument. But suffice it to say it's the dumbest thing I've read all evening.
- GliTCH82, on 04/01/2008, -1/+4You know what else is pretty stupid? Shooting someone's idea down without explaining why.
- yugiohdan6, on 03/31/2008, -1/+3Baldinger's Penny Candy in Zelienople, PA sells candy for 1¢ a piece
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=B ... - EtherGnat, on 03/31/2008, -0/+6I wouldn't go so far as to eliminate all current coins, but I would advocate getting rid of the penny, nickel, and quarter. Keep, the dime, ramp up production on the fifty cent piece, and replace the $1 and $2 bills with coins. Regardless, the penny has got to go. The penny has been our lowest denomination of currency since 1857, when it was worth the equivalent of a quarter today.
- PhilLesh69, on 04/01/2008, -0/+1So you are saying, we should all be paying for products all rounded up to the nearest dollar??
Are you ***** retarded?
Sales taxes in many states are 5%, 6%, etc. Products that are worth 50 cents or even a dollar would need to be rounded up to the nearest dollar. So are you advocating that instead of paying $1.06 for a bottle of water, we should pay $2.00?
Or the $4 latte you probably are stupid enough to buy should now cost $5, instead of $4.26 (at 6% sales tax)- EtherGnat, on 04/01/2008, -0/+1Nobody's going to do away with all our change, but people need to stop perpetuating the idea that if coins are eliminated everything will be rounded up. Every piece of legislation that has been introduced to eliminate coinage requires that purchases be rounded to the nearest denomination, specifically to the nearest nickel (as I haven't seen any legislation that would eliminate the nickel). Sometimes you'll pay a penny or two more with cash, sometimes a penny or two less. It's not a big deal.
- diggimator, on 04/01/2008, -0/+1I don't think we had pop when our country started...
- HealthyElijah, on 03/31/2008, -6/+5The Federal Reserve is a Privately Held company. Fact. The Federal Reserve is NOT a government organization. Fact.
Google it yourself.- ProjectGSX, on 03/31/2008, -1/+5Done, and youre only partly right: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fed
"a quasi-public (part private, part government) banking system[1] composed of (1) the presidentially-appointed Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System in Washington, D.C.; (2) the Federal Open Market Committee; (3) 12 regional Federal Reserve Banks located in major cities throughout the nation acting as fiscal agents for the U.S. Treasury, each with its own nine-member board of directors; (4) numerous private U.S. member banks, which subscribe to required amounts of non-transferable stock in their regional Federal Reserve Banks; and (5) various advisory councils."
So its not a 100% "private" institution.- GliTCH82, on 04/01/2008, -0/+3Basically, it's where government and private business meet in an orgy of rape and pillaging of middle and lower class America's meager profits.
I'm just kidding. But seriously though. Orgy. - PhilLesh69, on 04/01/2008, -0/+1When I hear about a bank with it's own board of directors, like in say the 12 regional federal reserve banks, I think of a private corporation.
Who are the shareholders of those regional banks? NOT THE US TAXPAYER.
- GliTCH82, on 04/01/2008, -0/+3Basically, it's where government and private business meet in an orgy of rape and pillaging of middle and lower class America's meager profits.
- ProjectGSX, on 03/31/2008, -1/+5Done, and youre only partly right: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fed
- loopis, on 03/31/2008, -1/+2Agreed. I thrown mine away.
- springboks, on 03/31/2008, -1/+3Pennies (cents) make dollars!
- fireburner23, on 03/31/2008, -1/+3The better thing to do is deflate our currency. As inflation continues the penny becomes less and less of a usable part of our currency. I believe the reason why the penny is so hated is exactly because of inflation.
- diggimator, on 04/01/2008, -0/+2Bad for the economy. When there's a deflation, people spend less and keep their money to themselves because the longer it stays in the bank the more it rises in value.
- ostracize, on 03/31/2008, -1/+9Hijack:
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