What is Digg?46 Comments
- dienaked, on 02/05/2009, -0/+12The Feds don't care about overturning Barry's record, they care about putting him in a cell for perjury.
- Number23, on 02/05/2009, -1/+11Remove their records, all of them. Bonds, Clemens, Sosa, McGwire, but espeically Bonds and Clemens. Baseball is the only sport where the stats really matter and are comparable across eras.
- macfan93, on 02/05/2009, -2/+10Saying Barry Bonds is the homeun king is like saying mrbabyman is the king of digg.
- chesterogilvie, on 02/05/2009, -1/+8Stop defending this goon. There is absolutely no way that he was given steroids/HGH/whatever unknowingly. It doesn't matter if other players were also juicing, it's still wrong and unethical.
- welestgw, on 02/05/2009, -0/+3Why is the government wasting money continuing to investigate this? I hope it's just to nail him for perjury and not some crusade to save MLB.
- tylersciacqua, on 02/05/2009, -1/+3whatever barry bonds did, he's still one of the best technical players of ALL TIME. he's got the best swing anyone has ever seen, ask a baseball player and they should know that. In the last few years of his career, he obviously wasn't on anything when they tested him so much, and he if anything hit MORE home-runs.
Barry did something wrong and should get punished if he did do something knowingly, but i don't think his reputation deserves to die. And that record is totally legit. - wolfing, on 02/05/2009, -0/+2the government could care less about MLB. He said something under oath and if it turns out he lied, he goes to jail
- onwardknave, on 02/05/2009, -0/+2Actually, stats are not comparable across eras. The sabermetrics explosion showed teams which individual statistics were the greatest influences on the ultimate statistic, i.e. the win column. Teams now draft and build around dominant starting pitching, on-base percentage, and quality fielding up the middle. That's why Wade Boggs never got much credit until his career was nearly over, and since then. Sandy Koufax ended his career with "only" 165 wins, but nobody will argue he wasn't far more dominant than pitchers today with win totals over 200. I hope you really just meant that stats are useful for comparing players against others in their own era.
- Warren803, on 02/05/2009, -0/+2Even though he probably did juice, those two pics you linked do not show proof. They were probably taken 20 years apart. I don't think it's hard to imagine putting on 30 or 40 pounds of muscle in 20 years if you trained religiously. The hat size theory (larger head because of roids) could be true, but you really can't tell the size of his head from those pics can you?
- MRintheKeys, on 02/05/2009, -0/+2MLB didn't start testing for steroids seriously until 2005. This is the mess that MLB created, not the players. Give accountability to those who earned it.
- Tegurit34, on 02/05/2009, -0/+2THIS.
If there's any sport that ISN'T comparable against different eras, it's baseball. The amount of factors outside a player's ability vastly, vastly trumps those found in goal sports -- and they've gone through changes an assload of times over different decades.
Bats have gotten harder, gloves have gotten bigger, park dimensions have gotten smaller, the hight of the mound has gotten shorter, different decades had an influx of offense or defense or pitching that suppressed each other, analysis has gotten better and thus the talent selection has gotten better -- Hell, they only let whites play in the modern era until the 1940s, which severely limited the talent pool and probably made good players from that era look much greater than they actually were. Jebus Christ this game has evolved.
A hundred years ago they had 3-man pitching rotations, which is why Cy Young's Win record will never be touched (same with his Loss record). Forty years ago they had 4-man rotations. Since then they've gone to 5-man rotations and the Relief Ace has emerged as a crucial piece to a winning team, and then he has to be supported by several other relievers that are brought into the game to just face one batter! You never would have seen a roster space used to face 1 hitter in a game by Casey Stengel.
Saying stats are comparable across eras in baseball is one of the most baffling things anyone who considers themselves a true fan can say. Seriously dude, know what the grand daddies of the most wonderful game in the world did for it. - Tegurit34, on 02/05/2009, -0/+2You're probably gonna get dugg down but I'm gonna digg you up.
I said this in another thread, but it bears repeating: It's totally fine to discriminate cheaters from those who didn't cheat. However, it's not OK to discriminate cheaters from each other. That means if you toss out Barry's record, you have to toss out a lot of Hall of Famers who were KNOWN to have cheated, even BRAGGED about it, and were elected anyway.
If Barry has to live through the nightmare, then the media and the public it speaks to should be treating every caught roider the same. Not just the high profile cheaters.
That or start treating Barry like the other cheaters -- let him in the Hall of Fame, keep his records, and do better in the future about catching and punishing cheating. Honestly, either way is fine with me.
I'm just sick of some cheaters getting preferential treatment when they clearly don't deserve any. - vaeldas, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1Hmm...this seems to be a running trend in sports, what with drugs and stuff. American heroes? Rolemodels? Why are we paying these people so much money again?
- babar77, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1His swing was mechanically assisted. And he's the only one that was allowed to use his arm protection because it was grandfathered in.
http://insidesportsgeek.wordpress.com/2007/08/07/b ... - vaeldas, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1Nope, no depression going on in baseball. I'm sure all the players are happy to report they are making millions.
Those of us who work hard for a living are in the wrong profession. Obviously sports, drugs and making rap music is the way to riches. - inactive, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1Most of his teammates would probably agree with you.
- inactive, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1"Obliterating 3rd world countries?"
Last I checked Iraq had another stunningly successful election and where once in Afghanistan it was illegal for little girls to learn how to read and write, the little girls are now going to school and can dream of having a career. - agentinfinite, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1Bonds is screwed
- IphtashuFitz, on 02/05/2009, -1/+2@jp12380: In the communist Soviet Union, the German Democratic Republic (East Germany), etc. if your job was to compete in the Olympics you did what you were told. If that meant taking steroids and other performance enhancing drugs then you took them. If you refused you'd likely end up in jail. You certainly wouldn't compete in the Olympics, and your career would be over.
There's a HUGE difference between these dictatorial countries and professional sports here in the US. In those countries, if a doctor came to give you an injection you just accepted it without any questions. In professional sports you can damn well bet that athletes would question ANY injection they receive. Their bodies are their livelihoods, so they're going to want to know everything injected into them. In the USSR, GDR, etc. an athlete was paid by the government. They didn't get huge contracts based on their performance. Here in the US athletes get whatever a team is willing to pay them, so their health is critically important to their livelihood. I find it virtually impossible to accept the fact that a trainer, doctor, etc. would lie about an injection being given and that an athlete wouldn't want to know what they're being injected with.
What do you suppose would happen if a trainer injected an athlete with a steroid but told the athlete it was just a vitamin shot, and the athlete was severely allergic to whatever steroid the trainer used? The injection could kill the athlete if it's a severe enough allergic reaction, and even if the reaction is relatively minor the trainer could easily be arrested for assault and likely many other charges. Not to mention that the athlete would sue the hell out of the trainer for possibly ruining his career. - Warren803, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1Because they have a specific skill set that very few people have and can be used to generate revenue. If you can hit a baseball 450ft consistenly and run a 4 second 40 yard dash, then you too can be paid like that. It's not that different than any other job. Why does a computer programmer get paid 100k when a waiter gets paid 25k. Computer programmer has a specific skill set that few people can do (fewer than waiters but not fewer than baseball players) which can be used to generate revenue. If you were the best computer programmer in the world, I bet you could be making millions too.
- inactive, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1I think you can tell from those pictures exactly how much his head has grown and that doesn't happen by working out. Look at the fact that his head seems the same size as his helmet and his head put together from his rookie days.
The transformation happened pretty much in one or two seasons, however. He was on a pace to hit maybe 500 homers for his career and then suddenly - BOOM - dude just completely went from a bean pole to a hulk. - captaindigger, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1While his home runs were getting bigger... something else was not...testicle shrinkage
- Sertis, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1I believe that some NBA players are still taking some kind of steroids and the higher heads will not do anything because it will ruin their money making system...
- Nintendesert, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1Sosa has never tested positive for steroids. And corked bats have been a part of baaseball for as long as they've used wooden bats. Unless you want to excommunicate pitchers who used spitballs too...
- Tegurit34, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1While this could use some more investigation and I give kudos to the person who wrote the article for bringing something new to the table, there is absolutely no way you can quantify how may home runs that elbow armor hit.
- inactive, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1It's a free market, the guys get paid what the market will bear. Obviously, there's no lack of revenues in American professional sports.
- Sertis, on 02/07/2009, -0/+1oh look...A-Rod took steroids sometime in '03, names are coming out now
- Ajajadude, on 02/06/2009, -0/+1Bonds is a health freak. He's very particular about what he puts in his body. Do you think he's going to use anything when he doesn't know what it is?
- MRintheKeys, on 02/05/2009, -0/+1It's hard to compare stats in any sport. Athletes today take care of themselves 24/7 and have a lot more technology on their side. Only way to accurately do it is to compare players of that era to their contemporaries.
- RawkusVoid, on 02/06/2009, -0/+1Can some one tell me why my comment is buried. It's all good. But I'm sincerely curious in what people think about the situation.
- jp12380, on 02/05/2009, -2/+2You don't know that, Olympians were given steroids without really knowing what they were taking in Germany. It is possibly they were giving him these things without him knowing what it was.
- Boyce, on 02/05/2009, -0/+0It is a valid question that most Americans have, but do not realize the underlying (legal) reasons why until they are better informed of the details involved. Now there are other/better, well-written articles on this subject...but here are some snippets from this one (quick find) that may help: http://hnn.us/articles/12127.html
"It's true that Congress has many more important things to worry about. But systematic drug abuse by prominent athletes is a legitimate issue for it to consider. One function of Congress has always been to hold hearings about issues that worry the public."
"...the sports industry (cannot) claim immunity from government scrutiny. Sports have received extensive government assistance at the national, state and local levels. It's dishonest for baseball officials to claim that a steroid abuse scandal among players and league officials is "private business." The reality is that the sports industry has greatly benefited from exemptions to the anti-trust laws, subsidies for stadium construction and an assortment of federal tax breaks.
Legislators who live and work in Washington are well aware of the connection. The price of obtaining a new baseball team was hundreds of millions of dollars for Washington's new state-of-the-art stadium. If baseball wants to continue to benefit from government support, the leagues must understand that some politicians will demand greater public scrutiny in response to a scandal such as steroid abuse.
The fact that professional baseball has benefited from an exemption from the anti-trust laws since 1922 was the subject of congressional hearings in 1958. The exemption allowed baseball owners to ward off threats from new leagues and control the costs of players. The Senate subcommittee on monopoly and antitrust brought the New York Yankees manager, Casey Stengel, and other stars, including Mickey Mantle, Ted Williams, Stan Musial and Jackie Robinson, to appear to testify about the "reserve clause" that limited the labor rights of players. Stengel frustrated and amused hearing participants when he used his famous double talk to baffle legislators.
As it always had, Congress refused to take action against the owners. It was not until the late 1980s that players started to enjoy free agency, six decades after the Supreme Court ruled that baseball was not subject to federal regulations.
Congress also can legitimate its current steroid investigation on the basis of a solid precedent of looking into sports corruption. The Senate conducted hearings in 1960, for instance, into the role of organized crime in professional boxing. Former middleweight boxing champion Jake LaMotta made a stunning appearance when he admitted that he had thrown a fight in 1947. LaMotta went through with the testimony even though mobsters had threatened to kill him.
If we discover that our national pastimes are filled with doped-up players, athletes and owners should not be so surprised when Congress comes knocking at their door. - psyner, on 02/05/2009, -2/+2IF??? other players were juicing? Are you serious?
- dannythepan, on 02/06/2009, -0/+0barrybonds.com haha
- dannythepan, on 02/06/2009, -0/+0I'm not a big fan of stats in Baseball. It's a pretty unpredictable sport.
but what an *****..his name should definitely not be above Hank Aaron and Babe Ruth. - inactive, on 02/05/2009, -1/+1FTA: The documents said that Steve Hoskins, Bonds' childhood friend and personal assistant, secretly tape-recorded a 2003 conversation with Anderson in the Giants' clubhouse because Hoskins wanted to prove to Bonds' father, Bobby Bonds, that his son was using steroids.
Bobby, come on and wake up out of your denial. Your son's head is twice as big (in size, literally) than it was when he first entered the league. Surely you remember how your son looked in his first few years in the league:
http://www.defrancotraining.com/ask_joe/images/pic ...
Need we post the way the guy looks now?
http://www.defrancotraining.com/ask_joe/images/pic ... - johnwoo32, on 02/05/2009, -2/+2If somebody tests positive all the time, there is no questioning his abuse. That does put the MLB in a strange perspective. They generate a huge buzz around these players, who are actually hurting themselves in the process.
- inactive, on 02/05/2009, -2/+1And all of the sports nuts that actually pay money to see these freaks hit a little white ball with a stick and then call them a "hero" when they do it really well are responsible.
- ZestyNinja, on 02/05/2009, -5/+4Go Giants!
- NellyG, on 02/05/2009, -1/+0I'm baffled that we still need proof that he was pumping juice. Look at the man, he's swollen.
- Goochman, on 02/05/2009, -4/+1Karma for one of the poorest excuses of a human being ever..........
- inactive, on 02/05/2009, -6/+2who gives a *****. this has no relevance to my life.
america is going into a full scale economic depression. let's find out how we can live through this instead of focusing on some juiced-up lummox who swings a stick for a living. - buggles, on 02/05/2009, -5/+1The American Government has nothing better to spend our money on than ***** like this.... Oh and obliterating 3rd world countries that haven't done anything to us.
We're ***** doomed. - Updesh, on 02/05/2009, -8/+3My only problem with this is the different treatment of Bonds to say Mark Mcgwire and Petitte, plus whether he was injected or positive is not the issue - its whether he KNOWINGLY took the drugs and if its a he said - he said argument then this is circumstantial but not proof of perjury - finally how many pitchers did he face that were juicing - he's either the greatest hitter or pretty close and the drugs don't make the difference, probably more like even the field
- GangsterCompute, on 02/05/2009, -9/+337 Diggs and 1 comment will get you to the front page at 3:20 am? This place actually does come to a crawl sometimes...
- RawkusVoid, on 02/05/2009, -10/+2I like the part where he tested positive for performance-enhancing drugs FIVE TIMES!!!!!
They should leave the players alone and hold Major League Baseball accountable. They did, after all, profit immensely from the player's use of these drugs.
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