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79 Comments
- barryiggins, on 12/16/2007, -2/+19hey, don't come into a discussion that is clearly marked "SPORTS" with a headline "Andy Pettitte Admits Using HGH During 2002", and start lamenting about Iraq, etc.
Obviously, the topics you mention merit discussion; but let us refrain from the bush league approach, and post such matters in the respective cattegories for which they were intended. - barryiggins, on 12/16/2007, -5/+21Well, at least he is actually admitting it. Pettitte's boy Roger has already painted himself into a corner by immediately denying everything. Now with Pettitte coming out, McNamee seems all the more credible and Roger all the more of an arrogant and increasingly desperate scum bag.
I just hope all of the media goons will stop being as stubborn as he is, and quit defending this loser with thinly veiled bias and double standards. ***** all over Roger's legacy the same way you did Bonds. A cheater is a cheater. - JFallon126, on 12/16/2007, -2/+11He's not saying it wasn't "wrong" that he used HGH he was just putting it into context. It wasn't an excuse it was just an explanation.
- Mononuclear, on 12/16/2007, -2/+8Does it have to be one or the other? Do we have to talk about government 24/7 365? I enjoy many hobbies and interests and I enjoy discussion of such things. Should everyone only take Political Science classes in school because music isn't applicable to the current state of affairs in our country? Should I not play catch with my kids but instead spend my time talking about domestic spying? There is a time and a place for everything.
- physphd, on 12/16/2007, -10/+15I was all set to praise Pettitte for owning up to his actions, albeit after he was caught. Then I saw the article's lead: "Pettitte said he tried HGH on two occasions, stressing he did it to heal faster and not enhance his performance."
Being able to play is quite an enhancement over being on the disabled list, Andy. That's the whole point of steroids and HGH. You heal from injuries faster, as well as recover from intense workouts (a type of controlled injury) faster to improve conditioning.
Further, Pettitte knew he was a cheat from the word go. If it was a legitimate medical issue, why wasn't he attended by a doctor or given a legal prescription for HGH? He knowingly had the club trainer inject him with an illegally obtained controlled substance against the trainer's recommendation. More info on that in http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/baseball/mlb ...
This is as much of a ***** explanation as "I didn't inhale." - zioxide, on 12/16/2007, -2/+7At least he admits it instead of denying it like Roidger Clemens.
- physphd, on 12/16/2007, -0/+4Nope. During the 4 year stretch before Clemens went to Toronto (where Mitchell reports he started using the drugs) he went 11-14, 9-7, 10-5, 10-13 and was stunningly average. There was even some talk of retirement. You have to go back to the early 90s to see him at the top of his game and drug free. So that's 8 above average pre-steroid years and 15 below average or juiced years. The Mitchell reports paints his career in whole different light doesn't it?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Clemens#Career_ ... - physphd, on 12/16/2007, -1/+5Current and former Red Sox players mentioned in the report (2nd most of any team):
Mo Vaughn
Roger Clemens
Jeremy Giambi
Steve Woodard
Brendn Donnelly
Eric Gagne
Mike Stanton
Kent Mercker
Mike Lansing
Chris Donnels
Josias Manzanillo
Paxton Crawford
Manny Alexander - inactive, on 12/16/2007, -1/+5im saying you cant go into the office or be a dr without dressing like a professional so why should the nba be any different? when you hire a bunch of highschool graduates with 8th grade educations you get what you deserve.
- HandsomeRuss, on 12/16/2007, -2/+5Actually it was banned in 1992, per a memo the then commissioner sent out to ALL teams.
- physphd, on 12/16/2007, -0/+3Bonds admitted to using in sealed grand jury testimony that was later leaked and published. By his own admission, he juiced. The only question is whether he knew what he was taking. He denied under oath that he knew, and is now facing multiple counts of federal perjury charges for lying about it.
Clemens will almost certainly never get to that point. He has never been questioned under oath and has certainly never admitted it under oath.
I hope Clemens gets eveything that's coming to him, but he didn't put himself in a corner like Bonds did. - marm0lade, on 12/16/2007, -0/+3I don't remember the president having anything meaningful to do with the steroid investigation. And the person assigned to this is a FORMER senator. No one currently serving in congress took part in this investigation, only George Mitchell, with I'm sure help from some of his aides, but no major gov't resources went into this, as Ceeman would lead us to believe.
- physphd, on 12/17/2007, -0/+321 USC ยง 333(e) prohibits the distribution or possession with intent to distribute HGH for any use in humans other than for recognized medical reasons and pursuant to a valid prescription. Violations may be punishable by imprisonment of up to 5 years (10 years if to a person under 18 years).
- mbonzo531, on 12/16/2007, -4/+7"HGH wasn't banned by baseball until January 2005."
Why is everyone crying, its not like he broke the rules. - Kaosu, on 12/16/2007, -0/+3HGH does not equal Steroids. But it is still banned. There really needs to be some education as to what HGH actually does.
- NotAChickenHawk, on 12/16/2007, -1/+4Sorry, but if Petit thought that this was al ok and on the up and up, he should have:
a) gotten a preseription for HGH from his Dr., surgeon, the team physician, etc. Not bought the stuff illegally from some clubhouse attendant.
b) come out in public at the time he was doing it, or come out in public when the whole steroids scandal first broke, or come out during the last 21 months while Mitchell was investigating, and at the very least he shouldn't have refused to speak with Mitchell when asked. Instead, he tried to hid this until he basically got caught. He tried to hide it, only revealed it because he got caught. That's not contrition or regret. That's getting caught with your hand in the cookie jar. No credit from me for "admitting" it only after all that happened.
Also, his explanation as to why he did it stinks. Injuries are part of the game. Recovering from injuries are part of the game. Why did he think that he and his team deserved the advantage of artificially speeding up his recovery when no other teams or players had that advantage?
And I am sick and tired of Petit apologists (or Bonds apologists, for that matter) saying that it was perfectly legal when he did it. No it was not. Taking HGH without a presecription was against federal law. Period and end of story. There are lots of things that are 'legal' in baseball that are illegal under the law, like murdering a player on the opposing team. is it ok to do that because its not explicitly disallowed in the baseball rulebook? - NSNick, on 12/16/2007, -3/+6Though, to be fair, it wasn't against any baseball rule to do so.
- jbrevik, on 12/16/2007, -1/+4Does anyone notice a trend here? Pettitte, Clemens, Gagne. All pitchers have been injured on more than one occasion throughout their career and for an extended period of time. I think in most cases, players use HGH to decrease recovery time not to become super players like Bonds or McGuire.
- CrackWilding, on 12/17/2007, -0/+2Some of us are capable of caring about more than one thing at a time, you know.
- physphd, on 12/16/2007, -0/+2That is certainly debatable. There has never been an FDA finding or indication legitimizing the use of hGH for neither athletic injury recovery nor anti-aging effects. Indeed, the FDA has blocked compounding pharmacies from packaging HGH, even with FDA approved bulk ingredients. The only treatment that has been vetted by substantial clinical research and is widely used is for treating hormonal imbalances in children. Does that mean it is useless? Of course not. It just means there is inadequate research and anyone who tells you differently is trying to sell you something.
http://www.drcranton.com/hrt/cautions_generic_HGH. ...
http://www.ajmc.com/files/articlefiles/A102_oct04I ... (PDF WARNING!!)
http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/ ...
http://grg51.typepad.com/steroid_nation/2007/09/il ... - ShugNinx21, on 12/17/2007, -0/+2Using HGH to decrease recovery time makes you into a super player as under normal circumstances they would have been hurt and not played thus not having the seasons that they did.
- catalysis, on 12/16/2007, -2/+3Are you saying people should be banned from sports because of their appearance? Thats retarded.
- dsiv, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1I've noticed a trend among "apologies" from public figures:
1) Admit to wrongdoing after said wrongdoing has been independently reported.
2) Claim that the wrongdoing was as minimal as possible.
3) Claim that there was some moderately defensible reason for said wrongdoing.
Lets's look at Pettitte:
1) Only admit to it after it's public anyway.
2) Claim to have only done it twice.
3) Claim that he only did it to aid in recovery from an injury.
Who knows what really happened, but if I were a betting man I'd bet that Pettitte's apology/explanation is total BS. - hyrate, on 12/17/2007, -1/+2HGH is safe and doesn't make you a better athlete. What's the big deal? All players should use it if it actually improves recovery time.
http://www.sabernomics.com/sabernomics/index.php/2 ... - krnldmp, on 12/16/2007, -1/+2This is a bunch of mind noise.
- ladalang, on 12/17/2007, -1/+2Isn't he the over the top religious bible thumper? What a joke.
- pardonmedoug, on 12/16/2007, -2/+3yeah, you can say that about pretty much anything right? genocide, etc. like, whatever.
durrrrrr - physphd, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1That is certainly debatable. There has never been an FDA finding or indication legitimizing the use of hGH for either athletic injury recovery or anti-aging effects. Indeed, the FDA has blocked compounding pharmacies from packaging HGH, even with FDA approved bulk ingredients. The only treatment that has been vetted by substantial clinical research and is widely used is for treating hormonal imbalances in children. Does that mean it is useless? Of course not. It just means there is inadequate research and anyone who tells you differently is trying to sell you something.
http://www.drcranton.com/hrt/cautions_generic_HGH. ...
http://www.ajmc.com/files/articlefiles/A102_oct04I ... (PDF WARNING!!)
http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/ ...
http://grg51.typepad.com/steroid_nation/2007/09/il ... - FDDIcent, on 12/16/2007, -4/+5I do believe it was still against federal law.
- s0lace, on 12/16/2007, -2/+3Still waiting on Rocket....
- hoovcluck, on 12/16/2007, -2/+3I think he was referring to the fact that during a time of war our congress and president have the time to comment on baseball player's shriveled balls and Bond's enormous head.
- krnldmp, on 12/16/2007, -0/+1This crap has been going on in sports for decades and Suddenly, during the most critical election season in US history, something needs to be done about it NOW!
- zioxide, on 12/16/2007, -1/+2"Where is David Ortiz? Dude was of average size and power in Minnesota and then becomes the best hitter in the AL. Only a complete moron or someone with selective vision would deny that Ortiz took steroids and HGH."
Go look at his numbers instead of making random accusations. He gradually got better over a period of 5 years. If he took roids, he would have had a huge power increase in one year, not a gradual increase over a few years. - Ghost_MH, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1When was the last time you looked at a picture of Ortiz during his rookie year???
http://www.sportscardfun.com/David-Ortiz-rookie-ca ...
...versus...
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b6 ... - physphd, on 12/16/2007, -0/+1So lying and cheating are fine if the payout is big enough?
"What sacrifices would you make for that much money?" What, exactly, did they sacrifice? They took the easy route and profited from cheating. These are cowardly people who were afraid they couldn't cut it on their own talent and decided the rules shouldn't apply to them. These are selfish, cheating, spineless little boys who never grew up. The love money so much they don't care about rendering baseball no more of a "sport" than wrestling.
Your response says more about your character than these players'. - winmywii, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1There should be more research done then.
- bxblox, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1pretty much
- theparttime, on 12/16/2007, -2/+3i'm happy that there are other people who don't care much about the whole steroids crap thing. everyone did it, everyone does it. there is no proof on who did/didn't do it. blah blah blah.
- hmmmok, on 12/27/2007, -0/+1yawn.
- jbrevik, on 12/16/2007, -0/+1Actually Grimsleys steroid use was linked when he played for the D-Backs. Not the Yankees.
- mesm0rized, on 12/16/2007, -1/+2no doubt!
- dsiv, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1And do you notice the other trend that these HGH users have managed to perform at a high level despite being well past the age at which most players start to experience a serious and irreversible decline in their athletic ability?
Sorry if I'm reading too much into your comment, but you appear to be suggesting that HGH is not really cheating. You think having extra years added onto your career is not a serious advantage? - inactive, on 12/16/2007, -1/+2That is what I was thinking when I read the title. HGH is like a miracle, it should be made available at a decent price. I would definitely be taking it if I could afford it. It's almost like injectable youth if you do it properly.
- martyogelvie, on 02/13/2008, -0/+0This story is getting uglier and uglier. I hate to hear this about Andy but am glad he fesses up. I just wish he would have spoken about it before he was named on the report. It doesn't look good for Roger Clemons now either..
http://www.nyyankeecards.com - CrackWilding, on 12/17/2007, -0/+0Lots of people care. You may think it's a silly thing to care about, but one thing that's definitely worse than caring about sports is caring about making sure everyone knows you don't.
- laksoy81, on 02/21/2008, -0/+0This is very complex situation, I think people should wait and see the results. Pettitte is a good sportsman.
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http://www.directorysniper.com/top/Downloads.html - zenmasher, on 12/17/2007, -1/+1Did you just compare genocide to using steroids? I think you need to check in to reality. Baseball is a game. Is using steroids cheating...okay. But I really don't care that much. I mean, I heard some Senators getting all riled up on the radio the other night. For Real? Doesn't the Senate have better things to worry about? Things like ***** genocide, for example.
- seoboy, on 04/18/2008, -0/+0i think hgh was banned in 2005, not in 2002. so i dont think anyone should be worrying about this.
Joe
http://www.fasthgh.net - winmywii, on 12/17/2007, -1/+1No it wasn't. It is now.
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