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239 Comments
- swaddict, on 02/19/2008, -6/+110As the American auto companies cry, "More than 35 mpg can't be done, wahhhhh"
- Topher06, on 02/19/2008, -4/+59Its amazing what can happen when you invest in research and development.
- Satanael, on 02/19/2008, -3/+36They know it can be done. They just openly claim that it is unnecessary and that global warming doesn't exist.
- rancemo, on 02/19/2008, -2/+30Why not put this tech on an already efficient diesel?
- brentinkc, on 02/19/2008, -20/+45Or we could all just start using more efficient diesel engines
- theworldisflat, on 02/19/2008, -3/+18404 Funny not found
- tb0r, on 02/19/2008, -1/+15 Honda Re-Captures Lost Heat, Blows Highway Hybrids Away
Written by Hank Green
Monday, 18 February 2008
Honda just dropped a bit of a bombshell on the world with it's announcement that their heat-harnessing hybrids recapture more lost energy than even Toyota's hybrid drive during highway driving. This is fantastic news, since about half of American passenger vehicle driving happens at 65 MPH or faster and mileage at those speeds has been almost completely unaffected by hybrid engines thus far.
The project uses Rankine cycle engine to capture waste heat from the car's exhaust and turn it into work. The system is fairly simple, though the thermodynamics are not. Basically water is heated, converted to steam, and the steam's expansion is used to turn a generator. Of course, that's a very basic explanation. For a more technical analysis, Green Car Congress always has the scoop.
The system was installed in a hybridized Honda Stream (only available in Japan.) It is currently about 13% efficient, and generates 3 times as much energy as a regenerative braking system in the EPA highway cycle. While highway mileages have been largely unaffected by regenerative braking, heat capture could assist in mileage increases in both highway and city driving.
Honda has decided that, at current efficiencies (and gas prices) it will not be cost-effective to include heat-capturing devices in production cars. Similar projects have come to the same conclusion. But with rising energy costs, and better engine designs, this could be a huge possible source of energy as more than 30% of a fuel's energy is immediately lost as heat in an internal combustion engine.
It's a promising new frontier, one with applications beyond vehicles everywhere from large-scale power generation to microprocessor cooling. Way to go Honda. - bbart3d, on 02/19/2008, -0/+13"Recapturing the heat" sounds like relationship advice.
- mrASSMAN, on 02/19/2008, -1/+14They'll do it if we force them to, our congress is just pathetically useless. Wow, 35mpg by 2020, very ambitious guys!
Innovation is what prepares the economy for the future, we are falling far behind now. - megaton, on 02/19/2008, -8/+19So they invented a...steam engine?
- Lynxpro, on 02/19/2008, -0/+10It was the environmental movement that put the screws to diesel cars, especially here in California. They of course did not think about "clean diesel" (low/no sulfur) or even "bio diesel"; they just wanted diesel banned and busses switched to natural gas. So don't blame Mr. Bush for it, Shortyjacobs, blame the same NIMBY crowd that reflexively opposes nuclear fission reactors based upon gut feelings and not actual science.
- coit, on 02/19/2008, -7/+15Just say no to stupid messages.
- dfranks, on 02/19/2008, -3/+11That always kills me when I know my Ford Festiva manual got around 52 mpg in 1996. Not a cool car but damn cheap to drive.
- inactive, on 02/19/2008, -1/+8Oh hai digg sheep! Let's take a look at what our old buddy and pal msaleem did here, shall we?
First we have to go back to this digg submission http://digg.com/gadgets/Honda_looking_at_engine_he ... which is basically the same article referencing the same source as this article (http://www.greencarcongress.com/2008/02/honda-rese ... in case you care).
Next we have to look at how many diggs that original submission had, 102 and never made the front page...oh so sowwy! But, also so close...I wonder who was keeping that article from making the tipping point. I've shaped my tinfoil hat into a shark shape but I guess it isn't working.
Of course the real poor slob here is the deft submitter who beat them all but only got 4 ronrey diggs http://digg.com/environment/Honda_looking_at_engin ...
Anyone care to guess how ecogeek's revenue sharing model works? I'd love to tell you but the server is currently a soupy pile of fail. Again, with my tinfoil hat failing me miserably I suspect that they have a very generous revenue sharing policy with eccentric definitions for referring agent.
But ya'll go ahead and digg away and keep this the msaleem and mrbabyman show. I for one do NOT welcome our FP overlords and will use the X button liberally. I suggest you do the same. - ApokalypseNow, on 02/19/2008, -1/+7Or, you know, we could make it with hydro-electric plants, wind farms, geothermal plants, tidal generators, solar panels, or nuclear fission.
- krnldmp, on 02/19/2008, -2/+8Needs a lower latent heat working fluid than water, but otherwise braindead technology that should have been widespread fifty years ago.
- neodorian, on 02/19/2008, -0/+6I guess if you read the article you would know this isn't anything about plugging in a car. It's about making gasoline engines more efficient by reclaiming energy lost to heat in this case or to friction in the case of the Prius (which I guess is kind of similar since it ends up as heat).
- Lari, on 02/19/2008, -0/+6Face, this article is not about plugging cars in at night. BUT... Plug in hybrids will in fact be charged off of our power grid. While that grid is majority coal, the efficiency of a major power plant is much grater than the extremely inefficient internal combustion engine. In addition, our power grid is constantly being expanded to include wind, solar, nuclear, geothermal, hydroelectric, etc. So, once our cars move to the more efficient grid we can focus our attention on how to make the grid itself cleaner.
- Markpdotcom, on 02/19/2008, -0/+5Thank ***** you posted! Changing the algorithm hasn't changed a thing. Digg is still infested. Down with the paid submitters making money off the good users of digg!
- peestandingup, on 02/19/2008, -1/+6Just so you know, Europeans use Imperial Gallons for heir MPG measurements. Not the same as what we use here in the US.
- bigtrouble777, on 02/19/2008, -0/+5Funny thing is I bought my Honda Insight hybrid in 2001. It was the most fuel efficient mas prod. car then and it still is today. I have a 150k mile on it and my battery is still going very strong. I have a lifetime efficiency of 56mpg- and that's taking traffic, storms and other crap into account. The only mechanical part that needed to be fixed was the CVT after 130k miles. Hybrids do work and Honda's tech is still pretty good.
- inactive, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4I'm preloading it now.
- Buelldozer, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4I'll tell you why we don't. Because in THIS universe we obey the laws of thermodynamics!
- inactive, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4The Fit is known as the Jazz elsewhere.
- inactive, on 02/19/2008, -2/+6Do you have any evidence of this?
- gstep, on 02/19/2008, -2/+6Why not just focus on electric? This doesn't eliminate the fossil fuel dependency.
- Lynxpro, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4...don't forget the executive stock options and other lavish bennies, since you felt the need to pick on the laborers. I can guarantee you that Ford and GM management have better executive compensation packages than their Japanese counterparts. Let's also not forget that the German auto industry is far more unionized than here in the States and they make better cars than us and their employees have more vacation time and higher pay too.
- DiggzDE, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4Damn you Digg and your retarded comment functionality. If I could, I'd digg my own comment down.
- aegis9975, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4The use of the rankine cycle has been around before BMW or Honda. The use of exhaust heat to recapture power has also been studied by the Dept of Energy for decades. What is new about the Honda system is the use in generating electricity to charge batteries for Hybrids, which makes a lot more sense then trying to directly convert the captured energy into mechanical energy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rankine_cycle - inactive, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4You do it.
- FredFredrickson, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4Aptera isn't going to take off until it looks like a normal car, and not something you'd find in the Jetsons' garage.
- TheSwagger, on 02/19/2008, -13/+17BMW has similar technology using Steam. Check it out, its really cool.
http://www.popsci.com/cars/article/2006-02/bmwacut ... - zephc, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4Really? You HAVE to?
- otakushark, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4You can't get something for nothing. A turbine would increase drag and reduce mileage more than it would recoup.
- MacEnvy, on 02/19/2008, -1/+5That isn't spam. It's a link to another related article on another site. And it's a good article, too.
- lucutus, on 02/19/2008, -0/+4Think maybe the American can companies are going in the wrong direction?
"the EPA found that "model year 2006 cars and light trucks are the fastest and heaviest since 1975" and, at 21.0 miles-per-gallon, are about 5 percent less fuel efficient than the fleet-average fuel economy peak value of 22.1 mpg achieved in 1987-1988" - shoover, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3Since when was Popular Science spam???
- CharlesSaint, on 02/19/2008, -1/+4And was killed in the US by the people who made it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7Mpe7XfODk - inactive, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3Oddly enough Honda and Toyota are both able to manage their American plants on a super efficient and profitable way, while building a vehicle exponentially better in quality than anything ever rolled out by the big three.
You blame labor for doing exactly what management tells them to do. Typical egotistical American attitude. Maybe you should do a little research on W. Edwards Deming if you want to find out the REAL reason American car companies suck ass when compared to the Japanese.
The problem is the people running businesses in America are far too egotistical to ever listen to anyone but themselves, no matter how obvious the truth is. - inactive, on 02/19/2008, -1/+4Site seems to be down.
- Mootabolife, on 02/19/2008, -0/+30-60 in 20 seconds
- trogdor282, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3So can I download Portal off it?
- razrielle, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3Are you saying my Geo dosnt get around 42 if i drive it right? damn my math mush be off from dividing miles by gallons
- fudgebrown, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3Honda ftw.
- DrakeGTA, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3Comment abuse: Working Original Source: http://www.greencarcongress.com/2008/02/honda-rese ...
- gi0rgi0s, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3It is a geek site. The dude was joking and you geeks missed it.
- JQP123, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3You generate technical solutions that are economically non-viable?
- siblbombs, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3I believe that there is less environmental impact from running your car off of the grid as opposed to gas. While coal still pollutes, it requires less overall emissions to run the car. Also, energy tends to be cheaper at night because the relative load on the grid is lower than during the day.
- roflbrothel, on 02/19/2008, -0/+3Looks like my next car will be a Honda.
Heh, it was going to be a Honda anyways. -
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