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53 Comments
- Brassbud, on 05/01/2009, -0/+13Some news just doesn't cut it on the second day. Buried.
- trucanadian, on 05/01/2009, -0/+9This took too long to get to the front page. It talks about how they Chrysler may file for bankruptcy because negotiations halted. We already know they filed for bankruptcy! (if we read more recent news). This news is too old.
Buried - KimmyGibbler, on 04/30/2009, -1/+9Bankruptcy usually doesn't involve the US Treasury as a creditor, this is an exception. Bankruptcy law is a good thing because it creates liquidity in the economy by allowing insolvent entities to pay what they can an settle their debts, rather than trying to continue operating by taking out loans at higher and higher rates. Sometimes you just need to cash in your chips and call it a day
- garryw, on 04/30/2009, -4/+10I just want to take the time to thank Bush, Obama, and the legislature for sinking 35 billion of OUR money into this Detroit rathole to keep it alive for a couple months past it's due date. MWOPM (morons with other peoples money)
Read the damn tea leaves: Let Detroit Go Bankrupt
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/19/opinion/19romney ... - inactive, on 05/01/2009, -1/+6Of course, we could have just let this happen to begin with back in, oh, January and the restructuring would have probably been over by now.
- zorrosombra, on 05/01/2009, -0/+4These jobs won't be lost. They will find their way to other -effective- industries. It's just labor mobility. Sure it won't be easy for them but in reality, without restructuring the entire process of how they make cars, we -will- lose more in the long run. That is painful economics and the truth.
- inactive, on 05/01/2009, -1/+4trucanadian, everyone knew Chrysler needed to file for bankruptcy.
and lordmike, the bondholders, by law, are supposed to be the first to recoup their investments. The OTHER parties should have taken less. - Darkyuubi, on 05/01/2009, -0/+3But really...
Will we really lose a brand/car we will miss? I mean really? What does Chrysler even make?
Maybe thats the reason why they are filling for chapter 11. Because they can't make anything people want.
Say what you will about the invisible hand, but it still hurt as much as a real one when it slaps you square across the face.... - inactive, on 05/01/2009, -0/+3TJ- you hit on a raw nerve.
If we as consumers are having trouble, we get no mercy from banks or creditors. They don't even wait 30 days to come repossess a car.
Chrysler's debt is YEARS overdue and they haven't turned a profit since Nixon was President.
It is time for them to go and for their fat-ass union mobsters to be forced to look for a real job. - Dan6963, on 05/01/2009, -3/+6I want a "filler" job too, where I can get paid out of pity to do something that is counter-productive, but I can't find one! I guess I'll need the help of a mob.... errr.... union..... to do this.
- Nintendesert, on 05/01/2009, -2/+5What about all the people that were employed by the buggy industry? Times change.
- yeahwhatever58, on 05/01/2009, -0/+2This whole deal is all wrong. It has been carefully crafted and positioned to put the UAW as the majority owner when all is said and done after the BK. This is what happens when the government is allowed to have this kind of power to involve themselves in what should be just plain old free market capitalism. The government gets their mitts into it and it gets all mucked up.
- JQP123, on 05/01/2009, -0/+2The difference between an American car and a Japanese car is obvious from the moment you open the door.
Notice how the doors on an American car are spring loaded to fly open. Ever wonder *why* they do that? It's intentional ... so you'll bang the door of the car you parked beside. A banged up door looks old ... time to buy a new one. Japanese cars don't do this. As Toyota says, it's all about total respect for the customer.
Goodbye Chrysler. You've reaped as you have sown. - LordRedSnake, on 05/01/2009, -0/+2That's the truth. I hate to toot my own horn... but I've been saying this was inevitable all along: http://digg.com/autos/Hyundai_Lost_Your_Job_Return ...
We, the taxpayers, got taken to the cleaners. Our tax dollars are going to prop up companies that make products that most of us don't want. Both administrations acted like we would see our money returned to us, but it's quite clear that we won't, the Treasury has admitted it. They're a junior creditor and will suffer in Chapter 11 proceedings.
Nothing at all was averted by lending money to these two companies; they're going bankrupt anyway. Except now, we paid them money because it would've been a political black eye to both Bush and Obama to let them go bankrupt without at least "trying." It was billions of our tax dollars handed out with the knowledge it wouldn't be repaid just to save face.
Furthermore, you know those bondholders like JP Morgan who are going to be forced to take a loss in bankruptcy? Well guess who is going to give them more bailouts when they announce more losses and writedowns from this? Taxpayers once again. - superkendall, on 05/01/2009, -0/+2No wonder they are calling off talks. In a bankruptcy primary investors get the largest portion of what remains. In the current "negotiations" the government wants the creditors to take 10c on the dollar, while the UAW gets to own 55% of the company and no pay cuts are required for anyone. Gee, what a deal.
- tj_walker, on 05/01/2009, -0/+2Sure, they can get some protection but they did not hesitate when I was 3 weeks late with my payment to come and take my Jeep Liberty. To hell with them. Let'em go under. I will still drive my 1970 AMC Hornet with pride.
= : )K - thealsir, on 05/01/2009, -0/+2This is old. Why isn't there a front page story with 2000 digs about Chrysler declaring bankruptcy?
- davidhasselhoff, on 05/01/2009, -1/+3Question.
Why would Chrysler's creditors deep-six the negotiations like this, knowing that they may well lose everything after a BK?
It seems like the same scenario is playing out for so many companies these days - with financial institutions going to the mat over debts that could conceivably be repaid if they'd just cut their debtors some slack in the short term. - tidu, on 05/01/2009, -0/+2Dude, the factories and jobs don't vanish when the company goes under. Someone else has money, and needs a factory and ready-and-able workers. Tesla, maybe? Honda? Toyota?
- FairDinkumMate, on 05/01/2009, -0/+2Paying more than $600,000 per worker to try & save their jobs isn't good math in anyone's book...
- soonermandan, on 05/01/2009, -0/+2let em go under
- inactive, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1That's not how it works, or how it is supposed to work.
The creditors are supposed to have priority and in a normal bankruptcy procedure, they would be in the best position to negotiate.
The administration is usurping the courts here by setting up a deal before bankruptcy and then taking it a step further by politicizing it and demonizing the creditors who should be at the front of the line instead of the back.
This whole thing STINKS. - Renfamous, on 04/30/2009, -4/+5FTA:
"But bankruptcy doesn't mean the end of the company. The people said plan B is for Chrysler to file for Chapter 11 with funding help from the government. Under the bankruptcy law that Chrysler would file under, a judge would decide how much creditors would get, but is likely to go with any settlement agreed to by the majority of the creditors, the people said."
So either we bail them out now or we bail them out after they go under?
Bankruptcy law in this country is just as effed up as the government buying up failing businesses. - KimmyGibbler, on 04/30/2009, -0/+1Nope. Daewoo Motors is a subsidiary of GM, and as you might've heard, GM hasn't been doing any killing lately
- rdolishny, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1I just clicked a Chrysler ad on the digg page and feel so guilty. Sorry, creditors!
- licnyc, on 05/01/2009, -1/+2"These jobs won't be lost. They will find their way to other -effective- industries"
That's really not true - Darkyuubi, on 05/01/2009, -1/+2Thus, not creating anything people want.
I mean, I'm not saying branding is good. I think its mucking things up. But at the same time, you don't see BMWs asking for a hand out. That being said, they have better built cars, but at the same time. I'm sure if you poped a BMW badge on a plate of sick, people would pay money for it.
Its not about the product, its about the brand. But it seem the post-fordisum giants just never really caught on. - Dumbledorito, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1Oddly enough, as I hear about these brands going kaput, the biggest thing a lot of analysts will point to is a lack of branding. What does "Pontiac" conjure up for the average consumer? Or "Chrysler?"
A lot of people will say they were decently average cars (I still wouldn't buy one), but they didn't appeal to any particular market. It was just sort of "here's your generic vehicle, thank you for blending in." - AlienMushroom, on 05/01/2009, -1/+2When you knew that someone's gonna pay you anyway, why would you slash such foreseeable income?
- mbritten, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1Ok, Mitt's op-ed started out just fine. Unfortunately, all his credibility went out the ***** window when he compared a Ford Taurus to a Toyota Avalon. What color is the sky on your planet, Mitt?
Detroit is losing because they build cars that people don't want to buy. - Dumbledorito, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1*effect.
And it was a true triumph for capitalism when the Big 3 got Japan to agree to purchase a quota of American cars which the auto companies couldn't be bothered with to even put the steering wheel on the correct side of the vehicle for Japanese drivers. - Dumbledorito, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1That's the weird thing about BMW. Almost everyone I've known who owns one (from the top models to the lower tiers) has had loads of problems with them, though mostly with the "fit and finish." A friend of mine has one of their sports cars and the rubber liner just started falling off of the door (I was told to "step over the fine German engineering" when I got in the passenger seat). But yeah, BMW has that cache to fall back on that makes such problems just "little things" you put up with to own a Beemer.
And these American brands that are dying did catch on, back in the day, but then they sort of ran out of ideas after the age of the muscle-car petered out. - redxii, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_CHRYSLER ...
"The ailing auto giant would get a total of 10.5 billion dollars in funding from the US and Canadian governments to support its operations throughout the process."
... - JQP123, on 05/02/2009, -0/+1But the wages of the workers who built it stayed here. And the US Treasury gets a cut of any profits.
- JQP123, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1"2. Buy American Cars and Products to Help the Economy"
The car I drive was made in America ... in a Nissan factory in Tennessee. - superkendall, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1If there are no jobs there, then people will have to move. Or jobs will come there looking for cheap labor. In the end, it all works out if you allow it to instead of propping up something that cannot exist any longer.
- Nintendesert, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1Hey Lordmike, apparently they don't drive GM or Chrysler cars.
- tj_walker, on 05/02/2009, -0/+1Thanks! Good point on the "...since Nixon..."
= : )K - inactive, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1Exactly. We got WORKED.
- tgc1, on 05/01/2009, -1/+2I can't ***** wait until these 3 pieces of ***** companies go under. Not so much Ford however, 'cause they seem to be the one company among the three that aren't neck deep in their own feces. These companies though, are dinosaurs. They need to go under. We have to stop wasting our ***** money on companies that don't get it.
- inactive, on 05/01/2009, -0/+1Ah we have a member of the United Autoworkers Union...
I'm sorry but American cars are crap on a crap cracker. I drive a Toyota bcause my experience with America POS automobiles has been more under the hood than driving the damned things. - lordmike, on 05/01/2009, -3/+3"What about all the people that were employed by the buggy industry? Times change."
People still drive cars... your analogy fails... - lordmike, on 05/01/2009, -1/+1"I don't see why an autoworker is better than any other person who can be laid off. "
'Cos there are no other similar jobs to go to now or ever... How do you retrain thousands of 50 year old guy to work at Wal Mart for a quarter of his old wages and expect the economy to prosper, somehow? - lordmike, on 05/01/2009, -2/+2"These jobs won't be lost. They will find their way to other -effective- industries. It's just labor mobility. "
You have no clue what it's like in the upper midwest... there are no other "effective" industries, and no one invests here... Blue collar manufacturing jobs get replaced with crappy Wal Mart jobs which don't pay enough to pay the bills...
It's time to get out of economics theory, and look at the reality of the situation in this part of the United States... without capital, there will be no job motility, and there isn't any capital coming to the midwest...
It's not this simple "magic" that plots nicely on a 2 point graph... This isn't econ 101... this is real life, and real life contains many more variables and conditions than what is provided for in economic theory... - zorrosombra, on 05/01/2009, -1/+1Well I suppose we wouldn't have this problem if we didn't let the auto companies lobby for tariffs against foreign cars, which by the way are still in affect -decades- past their due date. One more reason why holding their hand didn't work... and still won't.
- Chirp08, on 05/01/2009, -1/+1You are an idiot. Chrysler is in trouble because of Daimler ***** it up. Do some damn research and cut the biased American cars are crap *****. Their marketshare increased dramatically throughout the 90s. Take 2 minutes to look up Lee Iacoca and what he did to Chrysler.
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