What is Digg?185 Comments
- bxblox, on 11/19/2008, -1/+41Will there still be a chevy in 2011?
- joejonson, on 11/18/2008, -0/+18Doesn't look nearly as nice as the concept car did a few years ago. Sad face.
- PeterNorton, on 11/18/2008, -2/+18This cars is confusing: It is much nicer than most Chevy's on the road today and about twice the price of a Chevy Cobalt. If I am just looking at the money factor (unfortunately, I have to), the $20,000 will buy a lot of gas, even at $10 a gallon. But yes, if I could afford it, I would buy it right away.
- fluidfoundation, on 11/19/2008, -1/+15SCIENCE!
- MarkusX, on 11/19/2008, -1/+15I am assuming, you compare it to an average small gas-driven car, that you can get for about $20,000, resulting in a price difference of another $20,000.
At $10/gallon, $20,000 buys you, well, 2,000 gallons of gas.
If you have a fairly efficient regular gas-driven car (not SUV), you may get 35 mpg. (that's good already).
This translates into 70,000 miles.
So, you have to drive 70,000 miles BEFORE you start saving money with the Chevy Volt.
I guess, whether it pays off for you or not, depends on how much you drive per year - or on how much the environment is worth to you.
Anyway, you are right. It would make sense for most people to buy it for about $30,000 (instead of $40,000). That would cut lower the price difference to $10,000 and the miles-before-you-save to 35,000 miles.
That's much more likely for most people to reach, before they paid off they car and may get a new car.
btw, $10 /gallon isn't unusual for other countries and maybe it won't be for the U.S. some day. But as long as gas costs less than that, you've got to multiply the amount by that difference. So, right now, with gas prices at incredibly low $2.50/gallon, you won't save any money until you've driven 280,000 miles. That's just crazy! The car is most likely dead at that point.
Chevy, lower the price!!! - tawnos, on 11/18/2008, -6/+18nice. cant wait!
- H3avyC, on 11/19/2008, -1/+12If the government wants to bail GM out, it should be solely to subsidize the cost of this specific car. Take the 25 billion dollars they are asking for and give out a 20,000 dollar subsidy on each car sold. That would effectively get the car down to a sub 20,000 dollar sticker value which is affordable to anyone seriously looking at buying a brand new vehicle. You could put a 20,000 dollar subsidy on 1.25 million Volt cars before the cash ran out. It would be a huge infusion of cash to GM, and the massive amounts of sales would bring the economies of scale way, way down by the time the government subsidy ran out.
I'd even take it a step further and offer a large tax deduction on top of the subsidies. If the cost is low enough, people will buy these. - oneredeye, on 11/19/2008, -2/+12$40,000 buys a goddamn Cadillac CTS. A Prius starts at only $22,000. They're going to have to get serious about electric/hybrid cars if they want to sell them.
- Trekhawk, on 11/19/2008, -0/+9This might have been news two months ago.
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/09/08/breaking-2011-c ... - bodegit, on 11/19/2008, -0/+9Yeah... this is gonna be 2 years too late for GM
- dujkan, on 11/18/2008, -2/+10finally a nice Chevy..
i think i might get a pre-order on this one soon :) - MarkusX, on 11/18/2008, -0/+8I think it looks very cool, kinda futuristic, unlike most other Chevy models.
- wezman2, on 11/19/2008, -1/+9GM isnt really making a profit on this car. They don't have any room to lower the price. Besides, people are going to be buying the car not because of the economical value (keep in mind that they will have to pay for the electricity too), they are buying it for the ecological value.
I, for one, salute GM for their efforts here, and encourage them to continue their efforts in fuel cell technology. - BelatedHero, on 11/19/2008, -0/+7It sure looks a lot like an Acura TL.
- FrankTheTank17, on 11/19/2008, -0/+7Not really, the average American drives something like 27 miles per day. The reason why nobody wanted the original EV-1 was because it couldn't go too far without having to charge it for hours at a time. This one combines the best of both worlds so you can get to where you need to go off electricity and if you need the range, the gas motor kicks in. It's a hell of a lot better tan the Prius who's gas motor is on if you want to travel at a reasonable speed. Either way, the fuel economy will still be the best even when the gas motor kicks in!
- silkyd, on 11/19/2008, -0/+6Pefect timing: Because what American can't afford a $40,000 vehicle?
- jpe81, on 11/19/2008, -1/+7American auto manufactures only have themselves to blame for letting the unions get completely out of control.
- vertigo32, on 11/19/2008, -0/+6Turn off the engine in your Prius and see how far it gets you. Run the battery in that Tesla down to zero and see how long it takes you to get enough of a charge to get home.
Besides, try driving the Tesla every day. It's a boutique car that is turning out to be far less than promised. - Taintsmasher, on 11/19/2008, -0/+6I just read a popular science article about the batteries they're developing for the Volt. This article kinda helps put things into perspective.
400-pound battery = 1 gallon of gas
http://www.popsci.com/cars/article/2008-10/inside- ... - hadiz, on 11/19/2008, -0/+6And then they're going to announce that they're bankrupt.
- Number23, on 11/19/2008, -0/+5Of course the Tesla carries two people and has zero luggage capacity. Oh, and the Elise chassis, which is the basis for the Tesla, is exempt from US crash tests.
- oboshoe, on 11/19/2008, -2/+7Thats part of the process of taking a car from concept to production.
1) Remove all the cool styling cues that the public loved. Heck we need those parts anyway for the next general concept car that we are working on.
2) Find all the parts that have a long life span, cheapen them up so that last about 5 years
3) In general, screw up all the things that the public loved about the concept.
4) Go to Congress asking for bailout money, because the public is too slow to buy into our products for some unexplained reason. - terenceyap7, on 11/18/2008, -2/+7Looks promising!
- imronburgundy83, on 11/19/2008, -1/+5Except the Acura won't fall apart in a year. I unfortunately have a GM for a company car, and let me tell you, it's very badly constructed.
- Colecoman1982, on 11/19/2008, -0/+4@MarkusX: I think you forgot to include the cost of electricity from the wall (assuming you, almost, never drive on normal gas). Most of the estimates I've seen put it at ~1/3 the cost of gas per mile in most parts of the country. That's much better than gas cars, but still not free.
@Wezman2:
"Besides, people are going to be buying the car not because of the economical value (keep in mind that they will have to pay for the electricity too), they are buying it for the ecological value."
Allow me to correct that for you.
"Besides, _a_small_number_of_ people people are going to be buying the car not because of the economical value (keep in mind that they will have to pay for the electricity too), they are buying it for the ecological value."
Unfortunately the number of people who care/can afford to make large purchase choices, such as cars, based on the environment is pretty small compared to the amount of sales a car company need to make in order to call a car a success (or even to break even). Something that requires the R&D and production overhead of a car needs to either sell large numbers or be sold at absurd prices (like a Lamborghini, Ferrari, Bugatti, etc.) to make up for the small sale numbers and low production quantities. - blackinthmiddle, on 11/19/2008, -0/+4FTA: "GM still expects pricing of the Volt to come in below $40,000."
Hopefully $20K under. Otherwise, people will simply buy a Prius or one of the new Hybrids that Honda's coming out with next year. - oxphantomxo, on 11/19/2008, -4/+8I guess getting rid of the EV1 want such a good idea after all.
- Anth, on 11/19/2008, -0/+4Uh, wasn't the Volt already unveiled at an event a month or so ago at GM's HQ? AutoBlogGreen and the other car blogs did a good job of covering the rollout there.
- CraigB12, on 11/19/2008, -2/+6People have been saying "can't wait!" for years about this. 5 Years after the announcement, and we still have to wait another 3 years. At this rate, and basing my opinion on Chevy's previous workmanship, I'll buy the Tesla sedan for the same price, and I guarantee it's made far better than this thing.
- pkulak, on 11/19/2008, -0/+4Actually, for three times the price you get a car with half the range (if you count the Volt's electric + gas range), half the seating and no trunk space. I'll take the Volt.
- FeloniusMonkey, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3The Volt was introduced as a concept/prototype, along with many other advanced-fuel-technology cars, when the price of gas started spiraling out of control a few years back.
Despite whatever I hear "officially" for why gas is cheaper now, I firmly believe the recently unprecedented push for better fuel efficiency is the reason gas is cheaper... Basically, people won't buck up for this technology as long as gas is cheap. Technology will stymie, and the oil companies will tighten their stranglehold once again.
Let's just hope this doesn't happen. - lilhelper, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3None ever do.
- inactive, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3Why are you whoring this link on all the comments? I haven't been on digg long, but that seems pretty lame and spammy.
- watcht, on 11/19/2008, -2/+5It's a pretty good looking *hybrid* much better than the Prius. It's most unfortunate though that they must test the waters in such a bad economy, I just can't see this making it with a 40,000 dollar tag, but it's to be expected with R&D, good luck GM, I hope for the best.
- sremick, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3Whether you like Chevy or not (I don't), you have to commend them for breaking some new ground here. This will help push the technology a bit further, making it closer to mainstream (like the Prius).
However, we have to be real here: the Volt, in its current incarnation, is still going to be simply a car for rich people to burn less gas per mile and make a statement, not for the average person to save money. The numbers don't work at the current price. - jbmcb, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3Because a battery that powers a car has to be:
1 - Light
2 - Durable, shock and vibration resistant
3 - Relatively inexpensive
4 - Operable in any environment, from -20F @ 0% humidity in Wisconsin, to 105F @ 100% humidity in Miami.
5 - Deep cycle and fast charging
6 - Safe
7 - Maintenance free
It's VERY difficult finding a battery technology that meets all those requirements. The temperature requirements in particular are killer - most batteries don't work well in either extreme cold or heat, or both.
LFP batteries are promising, but they are new, which means they are expensive, and they'll need to be tested for YEARS before the reliability and durability factors are known for sure in an automotive application. - AlexanderBlue, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3Sorry, but that's BS. The Chevy Volt concept car first appeared in January 2007 at the Detroit Auto Show. That was less than two years ago. Five years after the CONCEPT would be 2012.
The Volt was originally, and is still, slated for release in late 2010 as a 2011 model.
Oh, and Tesla is unfortunately experiencing financial problems, and has closed their Detroit offices and temporarily ceased development of the sedan. - Fratz, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3Comparing TCO is only one aspect of a decision to purchase. I think it will come down to how well the Volt compares against other $40,000 vehicles in terms of safety, cost of ownership, amenities, aesthetics, etc. I can't speak for Chevrolet, but I suspect the Volt isn't aimed at buyers who normally spend $20,000 on a car. If the Volt does well, perhaps the next extended-range electric car will be, though.
- Colecoman1982, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3Not to knock your opinion of GMs track-record, which I tend to agree with, but Tesla is no poster-boy in that department either. They just shipped a substandard gearbox with their cars because they couldn't produce one that could handle the job. Besides, they are a boutique sports car company. Companies like Lamborghini and Ferrari are known for making extremely expensive; extremely beautiful; but extremely temperamental cars. I wouldn't mind having one as a toy, but it won't last long as a daily commuter. It has yet to be seen if they can make the transition between performance vehicles and daily drivers.
- steelersfan7roe, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3You forgot to add the electricity bill going up because of charging the battery...
- brb1031, on 11/19/2008, -0/+3My worry is that's all it is.
They've dragged their feet on developing this technology for decades. I hope they pull this off. Competition in the high efficiency market would be great for everyone (Chevy, Toyota, you & me).
Edit: $40K? Oh, well. Back to Toyota, or (favorite small car). - Supergliding, on 11/20/2008, -0/+2Doing something to improve = building a $40,000 car that few can afford.
Yea, that'll add to the bank account real quick... ROFL - Fratz, on 11/19/2008, -1/+3I haven't found that part of the 12-minute clip yet, but I'm certain that any production version of the Volt will far outperform what you quoted.
- jsams81, on 06/26/2009, -0/+2i hope you don't think gas is going to stay at $2/gallon forever
- mapfelzweig, on 11/19/2008, -0/+2Call me a conspiracy theorist but why has battery technology matured so slowly in these electric/hybrid vehicle offerings from the big automakers? The technology is already here: look at A123 lithium phosphate batteries. They are developing automotive batteries that are capable of fast-charging in 15-20 minutes, hold more charge, have a longer lifetime and are safer than lithium ion batteries in impacts.
I know it takes a while for new technologies to get adopted into vehicles because of all the testing involved but it seems like automakers are creating artificial slowdowns to delay long-distance, fast-charging, economically priced all electric cars.
Of course they would have every reason to. In an all-electric car there is no oil to change, no valve timing, no oxygen sensors or cataytic converters, less complicated transmissions, and a host of other components that just aren't needed for electric power. That means less stuff to maintain, which means less revenue. Dealers make 98% of their income on maintenance. With an all-electric car how is the automaker and the dealer going to keep making money after the initial sale? This is why I don't get the point of hybrids: the car may have better range and fuel economy than a gas-only vehicle but it still costs more than one and still has all the crap to service that a gas vehicle does, plus the parts to accommodate both an electric motor and an IC engine driving the car. It's 2.5 times the complexity! Sounds like a step backwards to me.
I'm looking to Tesla to release a decent, sporty all-electric vehicle in the $25-35k range within the next 8-10 years. At least until then my Corolla will be fine. For now I'll keep dreaming about silently waiting at a stoplight in my electric sports car next to some bass-whoring teens in a rice rocket with "race car" exhaust and all sorts of other useless crap and then speeding away at 60 mph in 3 seconds the second the light turns green. Man that would be awesome. Then I'll get a ticket. - BelatedHero, on 11/19/2008, -1/+3And that right there is exactly why those fools are on capitol hill begging for $25B. They wouldn't be going bankrupt if they would simply make attractive, well-built cars. My '95 Nissan Maxima runs great. I don't think I'd be able to say the same if I had a 13-year old GM/Ford/Chrysler instead.
- CTRaiderThe1st, on 11/19/2008, -0/+2NO! Our power grid can't handle current peak demands. If everyone had one NOW!, it would not be a good thing. It's gonna take an updated grid if people start buying these cars.
- Nerys, on 11/20/2008, -1/+3YES it is. its called a Series Hybrid. this is where the electric motor is the only source of motivational force and the "gas" engine just recharges the batteries.
- Nerys, on 11/20/2008, -0/+2Because the battery that meets ALL our needs was sold to chevron and take a guess on the chances of them letting you make one before that patent expires.
Nuff Said.? Nahh lets add more gas (pun intended) to the fire...
120-150 mile range $4500 replacement cost 250,000 mile expected life span (real world examples on the road right NOW today are at 150,000 miles or more with NO measurable degradation in the battery pack yet) and thats in a RAV4 NOT designed for electric power (IE too heavy) and even it manages to get 80 miles on a charge DOUBLE that of the Volt)
What is it? large format NIMH batteries.
its not difficult to find the battery we need. Its difficult to find ANOTHER battery we can use since the one we already have is ILLEGAL to build since Chevron REFUSES to license it (you think? Duh!) - azhura, on 11/20/2008, -0/+2What is in 2015? Dammit, did I miss something important?
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