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64 Comments
- diggit83, on 02/02/2009, -0/+55Ours didnt get this far, but Toyota took 3 months to pay off my old car loan, we simply faxed the car paperwork to the bank that was holding the old note, and they went after toyota. We never got another call or letter again, and its not on our credit report.
Some of these people should simply be a little more proactive - presidentraygun, on 02/02/2009, -0/+45A dishonest car dealer???
"In the dictionary under redundant, it says see redundant." - R. Williams - PrincePickle, on 02/02/2009, -2/+37If that happened to me I'd drive the car through the dealerships show room....
- inactive, on 02/02/2009, -0/+28Just hope they haven't gone out of business, because otherwise, that might end up being a pointless gesture.
- BuzzEdition, on 02/02/2009, -1/+21Damn...
- djmccormick, on 02/02/2009, -2/+19Once the title is transferred should this even be possible?
- CoD4, on 02/02/2009, -1/+15few years back, i bought a 1987 deville from this dealer for $800, when signing the title the guy goes "You've made a great decision my friend"
- theworldisflat, on 02/02/2009, -1/+12If you have a bill of sale and a contract showing that they will be satisfying the loan, it is no longer your problem. The lien holder can not pursue the original owner for this, nor can the dealer "sell" the vehicle to another person w/o satisfying the debt. Doing so is called fraud (and anyone taking the title/bill of sale personally or via a bank (lien holder) would instantly see that the previous lien had not been freed).
You may also pursue the dealers bond with the state, which is held in trust for just these sort of "mishaps"...assuming they didn't fold shop overnight and owe like 50 outstanding cars.
Of course... LOL @ folks actually trading cars in while upside down. P.T. was right. - ancalagon73, on 02/02/2009, -0/+10But they went out of business so they have no showroom and you sold them your car so you don't have it anymore.
- mrgarci1, on 02/02/2009, -3/+13A similar situation is occurring between home lenders and renters too - if you rent a house, and the landlord fails to pay the mortgage on it, you will be kicked out with no warning (other than a foreclosure notice on your door) and your belongings can be held by the bank that now owns the house. Renter beware!
- Aadain, on 02/02/2009, -2/+12While I agree with your sentament, I had to dig you down. The solution here is not another law, just common sense. If a dealer is telling you not to sign over the title on your trade in, they are going to stick you with the debt even after they sell it to someone else. Simply make sure that when you do the trade in you fill out all the paper work with the bank, DMV, etc and point any debt collectors towards the dealer. It would no longer be in your name so you can't be held responsible. No new law needed.
- lynchjos, on 02/02/2009, -0/+9This is just one more example of how the "little-guy" gets stuck by the system. We've got to end this era of LOW integrity. Who can be trusted to give you a fair deal any more?
- NegativeDigg, on 02/02/2009, -1/+10She made a great move buying that 94 w124 E320.... It's always better just to own your car instead of financing it.
- dtfinch, on 02/02/2009, -1/+10When you sell or give away a car, the transfer of title is for your own protection much more than for the buyer's. I had a family member who was stuck with a hefty abandonment fine for a car he hadn't owned for years, because he couldn't come up with the paperwork to prove that he had transferred ownership.
The corrupt judge and police officer shares a lot of the fault, for acknowledging they believed it wasn't his car, but fining him anyway because the current owner couldn't be found, maybe to line their own pockets, who knows, but he could have avoided it all if he had the proper paperwork. - AaronCo, on 02/02/2009, -1/+9Yea but that wouldn't really be redundant, it'd be recursive. Redundant would be having the word redundant defined twice.
- cowsgonemadd3, on 02/02/2009, -1/+8Then enjoy the jail time.
- bamatime, on 02/02/2009, -2/+9Has nothing to do with it, but thanks for playing.
- charlie55, on 02/02/2009, -2/+9you shouldnt buy a car when you still owe for the previous one.
- diggitydoc, on 02/02/2009, -0/+7Although it is on a per-state basis in the US, most states follow the ULRTA (Uniform Residential Landlord and Tenant Act). This affords protections against such activities, and every state has a minimum notification period, generally 30 days. It is not like the sheriff comes to your door and you have to leave that second without any of your belongings. Believe it or not tenants have basic property rights as non-freehold estate dwellers that are implied if not expressly stated in the lease. Also leases do not have to be in writing, an oral agreement is all that is needed. My uncle died and there were squatters living in the house (he was in a nursing home for a long time before he finally died). It took us 90 days to give them the boot, and then we had to go to court and get a court order.... then wait for the sheriff to get around to it... then we could finally sell the house.
I offered for them to rent, as I have several friends who live the traveler lifestyle, but they didn't want to pay so I had to give them the boot. - inactive, on 02/02/2009, -0/+6"Well, you can say that again".
- bamatime, on 02/02/2009, -3/+9Wow it only took 3 comments to start blaming the buyer.
- Snarfy, on 02/02/2009, -1/+7Get incorporated. It costs about $200 to have a CPA do it for you. Make sure you do all business under the new corporation. When anything bad happens, default and start a new corporation.
That's what they are doing to us. Fight fire with fire I say. - hairysandwich, on 02/03/2009, -0/+5<Vroom>
PrincePickle: Dieeeeee!!!!!!!
<SMASH!!>
PrincePickle: "Muahahahaha!!! Eat that you *****!"
<PrincePickle looks up at conspicuous red sign>
Sign Reads: Due to cost cutting, we've moved to 123 anystreet, see you there!
PrincePickle: "*****..." - compgeek, on 02/02/2009, -0/+5This is just sad. People are going in to deals with dealers and the dealers advertising that they will pay off the old loan on a car when it's traded in. If they fail to do that and then the original company comes after the new car I'd be suing the dealership or at the very least whoever is in charge of their OOB liquidation and assets. It would simply come down to you advertised this and there is a signed contract to that fact so this is now on your hands.
- inactive, on 02/02/2009, -8/+13Moral of the story: You don't need a new car every 2 years dumbass.
- ExplorerNation, on 02/02/2009, -0/+4No, this is wrong. The bank still has to conduct a formal eviction if the renter refuses to leave. Even as a renter, the bank has no legal right to kick you out without an eviction. Most of the time the banks will pay the renters to leave early, rather than dealing with a long eviction process.
- dreadlocks, on 02/02/2009, -0/+4chanop: thats not the case everywhere, Kansas wont give you a title anymore if there is a lien on it.. They will send it to you once the lien is removed, but until then you wont see the title..
It was not always that way in Kansas, and Colorado printed and handed me my title on the spot when I was getting a new vehicle tagged.. so there is little consistency across the country. - inactive, on 02/02/2009, -0/+4I saved my ass off to pay cash for my most recent car. It's double satisfaction because 1.) I own it and 2.) You can tell the drooling loan brokers, or I mean "Finance Managers", to suck balls.
Now if I paid cash and learned that the previous owners loan wasn't paid by the dealership there'd be some reckoning with the front bumper for the banker and the dealer. - inactive, on 02/02/2009, -2/+6This is a testament to the morals of the banking industry and it's players we've come to love. When the banks go after the new owner of the car instead of the dealership who defaulted it's obvious where their priorities are in this crisis. They are going to get theirs and anyone, I mean anyone, guilty or innocent who gets in the way will feel the wrath of collections.
Bankers suck on ***** for breakfast. That is all. - chanop, on 02/02/2009, -1/+4You have a title with a lien on it
- Barackalypse, on 02/02/2009, -2/+5Does anyone actually read the paperwork they sign? Whenever you buy something or sell something, you really need to understand what assets and liabilities you are getting with it, or getting rid of when you sell it. Why would you sell the car to someone who wasn't also taking on the loan responsibilities?
- blackinthmiddle, on 02/02/2009, -1/+4I dugg you up because you're right, the onus shouldn't be on the buyer...then again
FTA: "It's become more common for a driver to owe money on a trade-in as people stretch their car payments over six or seven years to make them more affordable."
I'm not perfect in terms of how I handle my money, but I beat the living crap out of my last car. Got 180K miles out of it and was upset I only got that. I duct-tapped gaskets that fell down and refused to fix a dent in the hood. The paint was fading badly and finally died on me in the rain one night coming home from the groceries. But guess what? I had a five year stretch of time where I had no car payments. Now if you pay yourself the car payment you would to a dealership, you can then but a slightly used (never new, that's throwing money away) car for cash!
When I finally got my next car (a 2005 Accord Hybrid) my neighbors almost gaped. One said to me, "Wow...you really got your money's worth out of your last car, didn't you?" - Valyn, on 02/02/2009, -0/+3True, the dealers are douchbags and should be hung out to dry. But didn't we already know this? Its not like this is big news that car dealerships are full of greedy asshats.
Just like everything else in life, make sure its in the contract. Then you can prove its somebody else's problem. - inactive, on 02/02/2009, -1/+3Umm, if they are paying off the loan then the seller does not have the title, the bank does.
- dtfinch, on 02/03/2009, -0/+2They found remains of several old cars in one place that someone had stripped for scrap metal. Rather than find who did it, they tracked down the previous (or previous to the previous, etc.) owners, who had nothing to do with the dumping. Even had a bill of sale naming the new owner, but the judge didn't really care to start the process all over. Since they weren't going after the current owners, no, the police/court weren't following the law. They couldn't or were too lazy to catch the criminal, so they went after the victims.
- Rixar13, on 02/02/2009, -1/+3Saw the story and it is distressing. Moral of the story, But a Toyota and keep it for 20 Years.
Also handy to keep a Lawyer by your side at all times. - rowlodge, on 02/02/2009, -0/+2why people have not said anything about how "dubious" they where in the past but let them carry on is why its so bad now.
- DiggityCarl, on 02/02/2009, -0/+2ummm, no most do not. I regularly take cars in trade with the entire envelope of paperwork from the previous dealer in the glove compartment.
- Hayaru, on 02/03/2009, -0/+2Instead of answering "why don't you sell your old P.O.S. and buy a new car?" with "I like my old car," I can reply "RTFA."
- inactive, on 02/03/2009, -1/+3That is true, in fact you should never get a new loan for a car until you owe the same amount as your car is currently worth on the used market. That way if you trade in, it will more or less erase the existing loan, and the new one is only for the new car.
Though, what I think many dont understand about cars is that they depreciate in value very quickly, and in fact is probably the poorest investment you could make as far as new vehicles. If you want a new one think about it hard, does your current ride get you where you are going and function well? Is it really worth the price of another depreciating asset? - charlie55, on 02/02/2009, -0/+2right but they didnt really own the car they sold, then did they.
- jtown, on 02/03/2009, -0/+2That would be stupid. Drive it through his LIVING room.
- ExplorerNation, on 02/02/2009, -0/+2Yes, this applies to renters renting homes as well. The same law that protects apartment renters protects home renters. This is why there is such a problem with squatters (see diggitydoc's comment).
- inactive, on 02/02/2009, -1/+3Agree with above, dealers letting idiots buy an expensive, new, high-margin cars when they are upside is just stupid.
Isn't this exactly what the home lending industry did? I only feel sorry for the new owner who bought used to save.
This is SORT OF similar to why the Big 3 should get nothing from the government. It is all corrupt and fat. That and the fact they don't know how to compete anymore. - darkened, on 02/02/2009, -0/+2That's a good idea but had to implement in real life. For new corporations very rarely will a creditor ever lend anything without affixing your personal identity to it. To protect themselves from this very same idea.
- charlie55, on 02/03/2009, -1/+2right. new cars are a bad deal. poor people make bad decisions regarding purchases. perhaps that is why they are poor.
- southernxfried, on 02/03/2009, -1/+2Why do you think Car dealers are rich? Why do you think people who sell cars make SO much money? Because it is not easy ripping folks off, its hard work separating smart (or dumb) people with money they worked for. Their is a method of wearing you down. Taking off your mental edge so you will sign almost anything. Some of the richest most influential people in my city are car dealers. Why? Corruption in the industry. It is about time these pigs get a little muddy.
- goodvinboy, on 09/07/2009, -0/+1buy what you can afford...that resolves many problems
- MrSwap, on 02/03/2009, -0/+1You don't understand the article. If I sell my neighbor a car for $20,000 but still owe $10,000 then my neighbor would probably want me to take half the $20,000 he paid me and pay off the lein. If I felt like going on a huge bender to vegas instead and gave the bank jack ***** then someone would still owe the bank $10,000. This is what the article says the dealers are doing (benders in vegas) and the person who just bought that $20,000 car is now stuck with an additional $10,000.
- iceperson, on 02/03/2009, -0/+1I admit I didn't RTFA, but just because you have a balance doesn't mean you're upside down.
If you can't think of a reason someone would trade in a car they still owe money on then you're not trying very hard. I know a few people who traded in their SUVs at the hieght of gas prices for something more fuel efficient, and my little sister traded in her sedan for a hybrid crossover when she found out she was having triplets. -
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