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Americans Change Faiths at Rising Rate, Report Finds

nytimes.com — More than a quarter of adult Americans have left the faith of their childhood to join another religion or no religion, a new survey of religious affiliation says.

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  • Craga89, on 02/25/2008, -42/+7Front page with 30 diggs and no comments? The digg algorithm is a mysterious force...
    • holzp, on 02/25/2008, -4/+14I changed my faith to Digg in 2005, He works in mysterious ways.
      • spyrochaete, on 02/25/2008, -1/+11I'm Diggnostic. I'm not sure there is a Digg.
        • Devotia, on 02/25/2008, -1/+5Shun the nonbeliever! Shuuuuuuuuuuuunnnnnnnn!!
    • Aeron, on 02/26/2008, -0/+7thou shalt not question the digg algorithm
  • myranttoyou, on 02/25/2008, -10/+48Not surprising, given the way the all religions act today.
    • skeen07, on 02/25/2008, -8/+17Well yeh, that and that whole truth thing.
    • peestandingup, on 02/25/2008, -2/+20Yeah, they were totally better back in the day. Its not like they crucified people or anything.
      • MasterGrief, on 02/25/2008, -4/+12You're a witch!
        • Terr01, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1Only if you've got a morbidly obese duck on the scales.
    • carpespasm, on 02/25/2008, -1/+14not to mention the effects of finding out more easily with communication tools we have today that there are people who think vastly different things than you who still manage to make it through life without the life-changing power of [insert deity/prophet/supernatural force here].
    • diggduggjoe, on 02/25/2008, -6/+24I can fully understand moving to no religion, but for the life of me I cannot fathom why you would change your faith. Especially, drastically like going from Christian to Jew. You just threw out an entire segment of your life's knowledge due to it being BS, but can uncritically take on a new crop of excrement. Why?
      • kazamx, on 02/25/2008, -2/+17Jews get to wear those little hats. Christians get to wear a crappy cross.

        Hat > Cross.
        • MasterGrief, on 02/26/2008, -1/+3Best part about that little hat thingy is that you can sew it into a visor and get a full fledged ballcap.

          Someone will notice, but to those that don't, that was a George Carlin reference.
      • pintomp3, on 02/25/2008, -2/+4i always wondered how that worked. can you chose to be chosen?
      • csw1342, on 02/26/2008, -2/+4Thats not really that drastic of a change. Jew to Hari Krishna would be more extreme. Abrahamic religons, islam judaism, christianity. all the same "god".
        • diggduggjoe, on 02/27/2008, -0/+1Sorry, but Jesus is the messiah (deity) in one and not the other. That is pretty drastic change. You have to stop believing Christ is god. Your belief system was challenged, yet you did not realize all faiths are BS.
      • johnnyOnline, on 02/26/2008, -4/+7this question has also perplexed me. if someone's religion is so entrenched in their day-to-day, moment-to-moment decision making that they could give it up for an entirely different set of beliefs, then that 1st set of beliefs mustn't have been all that compelling after all. And if that individual was able to step back from their 1st religion and say, "that religion wasn't true at all!" .. how could any other belief provide compelling argument that it's a better choice? it boggles my mind.

        surely if all religions believe their world view to be the true and accurate one, wouldn't it seem plausible to the rational thinker in all of us, that possibly NONE of the religions are true? and upon further investigation any rational thinker would confirm this, steering towards a life removed from false direction? the mere existence of religion makes my poor little atheistic brain hurt :(
        • DrMonkeyLove, on 02/26/2008, -1/+2I assume it's all the poor suckers getting married who do it to appease their spouses. AKA, the RINOs (Religious in Name Only). Around here, there's a lot of "Catholics" who never attend church and don't adhere to a vast majority of the Catholic traditions, but they call themselves Catholics.
        • Genady, on 02/26/2008, -0/+3Dude, Catholic girls are so hot in bed, I'd convert too.
    • killbotX, on 02/26/2008, -2/+3well thats not a generalization at all. How about all the religions that do, oh idk good stuff. feed the poor and such. Dont base your views of religion on the radical people who claim to represent them.
  • jpwhitmore, on 02/25/2008, -1/+10membership in Pentecostal church went up, what's with that
    • BabyWookie, on 02/25/2008, -1/+9Yeah, really. Jesus Camp was not supposed to be a promo video.
    • MixMastaKooz, on 02/26/2008, -0/+3I see it as a more intense branch of Evangelicailism (although its roots predate modern Evangelicalism). As a former evangelical, I went to some Pentecostal churches, and didn't see much difference in terms of approach to their theology. But how they expressed their belief, which was in a charismatic way, seemed like a "next step" if I had wanted to be more hardcore about my beliefs.
    • SheilaNoya, on 02/28/2008, -0/+1Apparently, shaking snakes, speaking in tongues, and jumping around the room like an insane person is really popular in some areas.
  • cledford, on 02/25/2008, -20/+2It's all part of the Digg Conspiracy!
  • diggduggDOOM, on 02/25/2008, -9/+22Better practice them all - hedge your afterlife bet.
    • shreveyboy, on 02/25/2008, -2/+7Except when one says you have no after life when you practice another.
      • diggduggDOOM, on 02/26/2008, -0/+0Sounds like somebody who's going to lose the bet.

        Double down!
    • Versh, on 02/25/2008, -2/+10Ah, Pascal's Super-Deluxe-Mega- Wager... a lesser known topic in teleology/ontology... :]
    • homercles337, on 02/25/2008, -1/+5Actually, its better to not "practice" any religion when there is so much contradiction among all of them. Religion is a manifestation of man's knowledge that death is inevitable.
      • zeabu, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1There's a lot of contradiction in just one faith, still people believe.
  • lukemandese, on 02/25/2008, -17/+2lol, report finds.
  • PabloIV, on 02/25/2008, -16/+55FTA:
    More than 16 percent of American adults say they are not part of any organized faith, which makes the unaffiliated the country’s fourth largest “religious group.

    We should all pat ourselves in the back for our part in this.
    • drmangrum, on 02/25/2008, -4/+9I prefer to think of myself as they largest non-religious group.
      • jaznova, on 02/25/2008, -3/+2right, I'm not so presumptuous as to say I know the nature of the universe.
        And some would like to say that that puts me in a religion
    • wideawakeready, on 02/25/2008, -18/+3You should all be ASHAMED and GUILTY for your part in this.
      • homercles337, on 02/25/2008, -3/+11Sounds like you have been beat about the head and shoulders with the stupid stick. Congrats.
        • Zarokima, on 02/26/2008, -1/+4Judging from his other comments, he fell from the top of the stupid tree and hit his head on every branch.
      • dcronin90, on 02/26/2008, -4/+2Troll.
    • whatthefu, on 02/25/2008, -2/+5That doesn't mean they don't believe in God; I know plenty of people who aren't necessarily religious but do believe in God. It's kind of weird.
      • riggs32, on 02/26/2008, -5/+2most of those people are just afraid to come out and say that they don't believe in god. Its like they don't wanna call themselves atheists just in case theres a hell lol
        • Genady, on 02/26/2008, -1/+2Ummm... either that or they admit that there's an awful lot of ***** in this world that they don't think science can explain and thus the 'God of the gaps' as some scientists put it.
    • signal15, on 02/26/2008, -2/+6This study shows that Americans are at least thinking about religion and not necessarily blindly following it, although I'm sure a lot of that goes on. What if secular America made more noise? Planted the seed that religion is bogus?

      Would a bunch of these people that switched to another religion have switched to atheism? The Freedom from Religion Foundation has been putting up billboards in some major cities. Maybe we need to get some more "clever" advertising out there.
    • pintomp3, on 02/26/2008, -1/+7don't be too quick to celebrate. many mega churches are non-denominational. they aren't any less crazy.
    • zeabu, on 02/26/2008, -1/+1That means AT LEAST 84% is a believer. That's a lot, no?
  • rtarar, on 02/25/2008, -14/+76"Religion is an insult to human dignity. Without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion."
    - Steven Weinberg, Nobel Prize winning physicist.

    I rest my case.
    • elliotys, on 02/25/2008, -8/+8There was a post about a month ago about top 100 atheist/agnostic quotes. This was one of them, and the whole list was awesome.
    • rtarar, on 02/25/2008, -12/+7There are two kinds of people
      1. I think therefore I am. (enlightened/aware)
      2. I cant think. (sheep/ready to be hearded)
    • fantasticjon, on 02/25/2008, -3/+7Good quote. I would add that any any system of beliefs or ideology can lead good people to do bad things when taken too far or too strictly.
      "Let's protect the environment" (good) can turn into "let's torch a bunch of SUVs" (bad) when the followers of an ideal are too zealous.
    • Arramol, on 02/25/2008, -11/+11The quote overgeneralizes. There are also numerous cases of people becoming better as a result of their religion. Heck, I can point to a number of changes in my own life that came as a direct result of Christianity. By nature I'm fairly calloused and selfish, Christianity's been the source of my drive to change that. Say what you will about what that says about me, but religion's on trial here, not me, so there it is.
      • banmaster, on 02/25/2008, -7/+14BULL ***** *****!!
        Any time you are threatened by eternal damnation unless you do good stuff is utterly contemptable!

        Who is the better person? The guy who ONLY does good works because they believe they'll be left out of heaven if they don't, or the guy who does good works simply because its the right hting to do but who doesn't have any sword of damocles hanging over his head forcing him to be good?
        • Arramol, on 02/25/2008, -4/+8Interesting that when I say Christianity, you immediately assume I'm talking about Hell. It was more a thought along the lines of, "This is what I've signed on to be, so this is how I need to act." And again, my point is to debunk the quote, not portray myself as some saint. In fact, the very proposition I'm suggesting is that religion can cause evil people to do good, which would require that confessing some fault in myself.

          In any case, I find your take on goodness interesting. I see the measure of goodness being in how you impact the world around you; you seem to see it as some sort of standard to achieve. In other words, it's not about seeing how many moral goodness points I can earn by finding the most selfless motivations for goodness possible, it's about how much good I can do in the world, regardless of my motivation. In any case, I've never actually felt much fear of Hell anyway; I can't say it's ever been much motivation. I'm not even convinced that the conventional view of it does the Scriptures justice.

          There's no question in my mind that the effort to be more Christ-like has changed me and continues to change me; whether it's making a charitable donation I wouldn't otherwise have made or refraining from flaming someone when I otherwise would have. And yes, it's definitely Christianity and not my own inner goodness that's prompted me to make these changes. When I'm at the point of deciding whether I write that check instead of buying a video game or something, it's invariably Christianity that pushes me over the edge. My point here is that if we're going to analyze all the effects of religion, the picture is incomplete if you ignore its capacity to cause evil people to do good things.
          • jhuebel, on 02/26/2008, -1/+4Excellent comment. I'm "non-denominational", I suppose. I'm not even sure I consider myself to be Christian. However, I grew up in a very strict Christian household. The values that my parents instilled in me were directly influenced by their religious beliefs. They taught me patience, tolerance, avoiding rushing to judge others, etc. I appreciate that upbringing very much.
        • amPar, on 02/25/2008, -5/+5Sorry, that's not Christianity.

          Christianity doesn't threaten eternal damnation unless you do "good works". It straight says the opposite. You can't do enough good works because you're not good enough, Christ's crucifixion is the propitiation for sins and the only good work a Christian needs. Christians are just those who except that as fact and try to live upon it. Good works IS NOT a requirement of Christian salvation. This isn't theology class so if you really care go look it up(though I know you don't), but otherwise, you're totally wrong about the religion.
        • Arramol, on 02/25/2008, -2/+5I should also mention that you've actually sort of hit on a significant part of the basis for Christianity: humans do evil, contemptible things, and part of Christianity's goal is to change that. The Gospels, particularly the one attributed to Matthew, portray one of Jesus' roles as that of a teacher leading people toward a moral transformation away from such evil much like what I've already described.

          Sometimes it takes a "fake it 'till you make it" approach - I've noticed that the harder I try to emulate Christ, the more it becomes part of my nature. Before, I'd restrain my temper out of a sense of duty; now, my temper is slower to rise in the first place. Of course, it only works if it's practiced, it does no good if a person merely pays lip service to it or takes the American approach and uses it as a political rallying cry.
      • spyrochaete, on 02/25/2008, -0/+7You've got this atheist's digg. You're a lucky person to have identified a factor in your life that inspires you to improve yourself, and a go-getter for delving deeper to seek greater inspiration. I personally didn't need religion for that but if others do, that's cool.

        Even if we can't agree on the means we can enjoy the ends together.
    • ZellD, on 02/25/2008, -2/+4I love people who confuse the abrahamic traditions with all religion. It's soooo enlightened.
    • directrix13, on 02/25/2008, -2/+18"People use quotes for the same reason baseball players use steroids. They feel a need to inject something that makes them look like a bigger man."

      -- Directrix13, just now, on digg
    • killbotX, on 02/26/2008, -1/+1Well if your case is that you an idiot, then yes i believe you should rest it. How about the poor insane ***** who say they are doing what is right for there nation or whatever else they choose to get behind. What it takes for good people to do evil things is them being human. Most religions promote nonviolence its the people who join them who ***** things up, and it can easily be done with any thing else.
  • TheGreatZarquon, on 02/25/2008, -11/+37I used to be a Mormon priest, but gave it up after realizing that there is no God.
    • EelfinnTy, on 02/25/2008, -2/+23Aww... you should have held out longer. You and your favorite wife could have started your own planet!
      • TheGreatZarquon, on 02/25/2008, -3/+14lol, there's two Mormon churches: The Mormon Fundamentalists (polygamists) and the plain ol' Mormons. I was just a regular Mormon (with zero wives)!
        • Leomarth, on 02/25/2008, -0/+1I don't think he was talking about polygamy. The Elders that came to my house, after I talked to them three days in a row, finally admitted to me that they believed all men become Gods and all women become Goddesses. This was after they consulted with their Bishop to make sure they had it right.
      • ninsei, on 02/25/2008, -3/+2wow, that was totally unnecessary.
    • skeen07, on 02/25/2008, -1/+4Good reason, really..
    • stillasleep00, on 02/25/2008, -5/+2Not all that exciting- Mormons become priests at age 16. As a minor subjected to his Mormon parents' religious leanings, I can say I'm the only practicing Atheist priest in my area :)
      • JigoroKano, on 02/26/2008, -1/+5How do you practice atheism?
        • DrMonkeyLove, on 02/26/2008, -0/+6I like to walk by churches and not believe. It doesn't seem to do anything though. I also tried praying to a non-existent God, but that's actually a lot harder than it sounds.
  • usrlocalbin, on 02/25/2008, -10/+31I hope someday the headline will say "Americans say '***** you' to organized religion, Report finds."
  • drmangrum, on 02/25/2008, -10/+7I love the bit where someone is quoted as saying that people are looking more for a personal religion and Evangelicals offer that. I don't know if the guy is stupid or just that naive.
    • spyrochaete, on 02/25/2008, -1/+3Yeah, nothing more personal than a religious sect practised by 80 million Americans.
  • Metropolis, on 02/25/2008, -3/+30Thank science!
    • wanderlander, on 02/25/2008, -17/+0Which science? Most of it is just as bogus!
      • brentinkc, on 02/25/2008, -4/+7Boo this man! BOOOO!
        ***** moron.
      • carpespasm, on 02/25/2008, -1/+7There is only one science that I am aware of. Well, there are many fields in science, but there's no argument that I know of as to what is required for something to be scientific, namely repeatable, falsifiable proof and supporting evidence of any claim made.
        • wanderlander, on 05/07/2008, -0/+1The thing is we shouldn't be claiming one thing over another in the name of Science if it's just as fake, i.e. no evidence on either side
    • banmaster, on 02/25/2008, -5/+16Science - Where the questions might never be answered
      Religion - Where the answers MUST never be questioned!
    • brivix, on 02/25/2008, -7/+2Quit being ignorant.. if you're so sure science disproves God, read this book:
      http://www.amazon.com/dp/0310241448?tag=churchcomm ...
      There are many many more like it too.

      Go ahead, digg me down....
      • csw1342, on 02/26/2008, -2/+5Now it is such a bizarrely improbably coincidence that anything so mindbogglingly useful [the Babel fish] could have evolved by chance that some thinkers have chosen to see it as a final and clinching proof of the non-existence of God.
        The argument goes something like this: "I refuse to prove that I exist," says God, "for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing."
        "But," says Man, "the Babel fish is a dead giveaway isn't it? It could not have evolved by chance. It proves you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguments, you don't. QED"
        "Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.
        -- Douglas Adams,

        just felt like throwing out all these books about god and such
  • stillasleep00, on 02/25/2008, -3/+10"Unaffiliated" showed the largest net gain.
    Hell yeah (pun totally intended)
    • brentinkc, on 02/25/2008, -2/+6Hell doesn't exist for the non-believer.
  • elliotys, on 02/25/2008, -8/+19Flying Spaghetti Monster FTW!
    • pintomp3, on 02/26/2008, -0/+3life began in the olive garden.
      • frostieDude, on 02/26/2008, -3/+2Yours did, but that is only because your mom was a slutty waitress working there.
  • sigg14, on 02/25/2008, -6/+25first santa and the easter bunny and now god? we are running out of imaginary characters to lie to our children about.
    • banmaster, on 02/25/2008, -1/+12Don't worry, we can still brainwash them with the delusion that we live in a democracy, and that brown people hate us because of "our freedoms" and not what we've done to them.
    • killbotX, on 02/26/2008, -0/+3wait.. theres no Santa?
  • brainpan, on 02/25/2008, -1/+19I think it's good that people are at least questioning their beliefs- a healthy dose of skepticism is good for society
  • sigmaman2, on 02/25/2008, -1/+3FTA, it looked like it started happening around '93 or '94. What happend???
  • fuckingusername, on 02/25/2008, -5/+3Krom
    he is my god
    ice to see you!
  • demonsnake69, on 02/25/2008, -26/+9Anytime an article about religion is posted on Digg, the atheist fundamentalists come out and start insulting those of us who belong to a religion. Now I personally don't care what anyone believes in whether it be God, Vishnu, Zeus, Odin, Chtulhu, The Flying Spaghetti Monster, or Nothing, but why do you atheist fundamentalists pretend you're better than the rest of us? Yeah, on that graph a lot of people are "unaffiliated," that's nice and all -- but who cares? Do you guys want a cookie or a burrito or something?
    • PaxImperium, on 02/25/2008, -2/+22What exactly is an Atheist Fundamentalist?
      That we fundamentally believe in reality? Please expand on your insulting post.
      • demonsnake69, on 02/25/2008, -15/+3Thank you for your kind words.
        • PaxImperium, on 02/25/2008, -2/+11Nothing relevant to say huh? Why am I not surprised.
      • ZellD, on 02/25/2008, -7/+2An Atheist Fundamentalist is one who so strongly believes in no-religion that they force their beliefs onto others. The sad thing is that they inevitably take on the behavior models of religious fundamentalists.
        • PaxImperium, on 02/26/2008, -0/+7That's nice but that's a completely misuse of the word "fundamentalist". There are no atheist fundamentalist since there is nothing fundamental to follow among all atheist.

          You mean Anti-Theist Fanatics.

          BTW: Please clarify, "force their beliefs onto others" since most strong atheist do not force their beliefs onto others, they refuse to respect religion and criticize it.
        • ZellD, on 02/26/2008, -3/+1By strict definition your absolutely right. However, the colloquial usage of the term now tends to refer to a person who shows strict devotion to any set of beliefs and refuses to acknowledge other viewpoints as valid. A quick search shows websters and wikipedia confirming that.

          As to your other question. In some countries freedom of religion is maintained legally . You can feel free to practice whatever you want or practice non-belief. In others it is outright banned(See China during the Cultural Revolution) and can even be followed by jail or execution. The Atheist Fundamentalist would prefer the latter.
        • PaxImperium, on 02/26/2008, -0/+6Actually no. A fundamentalist has to have some fundamental tenet to follow and a "fundamentalist atheist" only tenet to follow is a lack of belief in any gods. A lack of belief in gods does not automatically lead to the hatred or banning of religion.

          I'm sure a rare few atheist would want the banning of religion but they are extreme minority(I can't even name one well known one), however many atheist just want religion to keep out of our lives, schools and government.
        • ZellD, on 02/26/2008, -1/+0See that's where you misunderstand me. I'm not saying that atheists as a general want that. I'm simply pointing out that there are extreme believers in atheism. As with believers of a religion it is a sliding scale. You have those that wish to leave it as a personal affair, those who wish to criticize and debate, and those who wish to force it upon another. Most atheists fall into the second though I've seen a startling number recently fall into the last category.

          Take Laicism in Turkey. A concept I'd originally agree too but it has morphed into state sponsored non-religion. The idea that you can't wear a headscarf at work even if you want to is tantamount to forcing your religious beliefs or lack there of onto others.
        • PaxImperium, on 02/26/2008, -0/+2ZeIID:
          I agree with you. Extremism of any belief is dangerous.
          Although I believe in secularism in government, Turkey takes it way too far that infringes on the rights of others.
          • zeabu, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1Turkey is were Europe was in the beginning of the 20th century. They're searching a precise balance. From the Ottomans to Atatürk to Erdogan to something in between. Hands of and they'll get there, pressure from Europe or the US, and it can get ***** up.
      • csw1342, on 02/25/2008, -5/+1I think you might have just proved his point, pax.


        • PaxImperium, on 02/26/2008, -0/+7In what way? He makes an insulting post without a shred of justification. My atheism is based on naturalism(reality) and rationality while others are based on completely different factors. So I continue to wait for an answer to what are Atheist Fundamentalist?
          • demonsnake69, on 02/26/2008, -8/+1C'mon Pax, cry some more because your tears make me stronger.
          • PaxImperium, on 02/26/2008, -0/+8...and your continued refusal to justify your claims is nothing more than cowardice which makes you seem more pathetic. ZeIID is a better example of a theist and has more balls than you do.
          • demonsnake69, on 02/26/2008, -3/+1Oh yeah Pax, you give it to me the way I like it.
          • ApokalypseNow, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1@demonsnake69
            ...you like it when you're intellectually outmatched and shown to be both dishonest and outright wrong at every turn?
            Strange fetish.
      • killbotX, on 02/26/2008, -3/+1an Atheist believes that there is no god, its a belief and with all the atheists who are so dogmatic about it I think it should just start being called a religion. I am agnostic which (in my opinion) is the smartest way to go since I highly doubt we will ever know for sure how or why were here.
        • jm4847, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1Sigh
          You give too much credit to a myth by admitting that it might be true...
        • twitchr, on 02/27/2008, -0/+1agnostics are just ***** atheists
    • banmaster, on 02/25/2008, -6/+14Anyone, including you, that has the low inteligence required to believe that an invisible man in the sky made us all so he could persecute all but the 140,000 of us who will fit into heaven is a ***** RETARD!!
      Go preach your unfounded crazy ***** elsewhere! Hey, heres an idea - why don't you move to pakistan and help kill anyone accused of witchcraft with the rest of the brainwashed ***** who think its their right to impose their ***** up religion onto everyone else in the world.

      Oh, and by the way, we ARE better than you! We don't hide our arrogance and utter disdain for ***** under the guise of religion like you ***** do! I'm an arrogont prick and I'm proud of it!
      • demonsnake69, on 02/25/2008, -11/+3Thank you for your kind words.
      • ZellD, on 02/25/2008, -7/+4How insightful banmaster! You have equated some sects of Christianity with religion as a whole. Then by finding faults in those sects you've described how all religion is bad!

        Here's a tip, grow up and explore the world.
      • rlh1, on 02/25/2008, -3/+2Man, you're a real arrogant prick.
    • carpespasm, on 02/25/2008, -1/+9I guess it's the just venting of frustration over people not being willing to listen to what they have to say. Everyone on Digg who talks about skepticism of religion knows that they're mostly preaching to the choir, but I think they feel justified in demeaning people of faith since all major religions require some seriously odd logic to be believed in once you dig into their origins and specifics, whereas people who lack faith tend to see science as mostly supporting their view of the world.
    • Rapter09, on 02/25/2008, -0/+12Hey, if you're giving free cookies or burrito's to Atheists, then color me Godless!
    • PixelMagic, on 02/25/2008, -1/+6I'm not an atheist, but I'll happily accept a burrito.
      • demonsnake69, on 02/25/2008, -7/+2The burrito thing is a reference to something that atheists bring up, but I wonder if the moron atheists on Digg know what I'm referring to.
        • PaxImperium, on 02/25/2008, -0/+5What burrito thing do atheist bring up? I'm not familiar with it.
          I must be a moron for not being familiar with your unjustified claims. Humor me and tell me about it.
        • Genady, on 02/25/2008, -0/+9If God is all powerful can he create a burrito that is so hot that even he can't eat it?
          • demonsnake69, on 02/26/2008, -4/+1That's the only one that I know of, lol.
          • PaxImperium, on 02/26/2008, -2/+6I'm more familiar with the rock paradox, "Can God make a rock so heavy he can't lift it?" Nothing new, it basically highlights how the concept of god is illogical.
          • demonsnake69, on 02/26/2008, -4/+3C'mon Pax, at least provide some scientific proof God doesn't exist -- make this fun for me.
          • PaxImperium, on 02/26/2008, -1/+4I'm not making a claim for the existence or lack thereof of any gods. The burden of proof is on the claimant.
            Theist has not provided any evidence and therefore that claim continues to be unjustified.

            Do you have anything of relevant or even intelligent to say or are you just trolling for fun?
          • Zarokima, on 02/26/2008, -1/+6There is no scientific proof that god exists, just like there is no scientific proof unicorns, magical pixies, or miniature polka-dot whales that fly around when we're asleep to play badminton in our closets don't exist. Do you believe in those, too?

            Believing in something for which there is absolutely no evidence is quite possibly the second most retarded thing a person can do behind believing in something for which there is direct evidence to the contrary (such as the "evolution isn't real" idiots). To explain it to you in simpler terms, we (the more intelligent people) don't exactly think "there is no such thing as god," but "there is no evidence of god, therefore it's stupid to believe in god. Show me proof that god exists and I will believe."
          • demonsnake69, on 02/26/2008, -3/+2There is no scientific proof doesn't God exist either -- so this game becomes even more fun.
          • Genady, on 02/26/2008, -1/+1Show me proof love exists, and I will believe.

            I think the thing I dislike most about the realists is their inability to completely grasp the nature of reality and how when all is said and done, it is belief that this isn't all just a dream that they're really subscribing to.

            Then again... maybe it is all just a dream.
          • zeabu, on 02/26/2008, -1/+2Good example.
            Love is a chemical reaction in your head, just as believing in god is one. I know that, but it gives me some feelgood moment, the same most people keep hooked up to a god, because they feel safe that way.
          • demonsnake69, on 02/26/2008, -1/+1People are wrong on the Internet!...but I think I'd rather goto sleep.

            Goodnight, ya'll.
          • ApokalypseNow, on 02/26/2008, -1/+2As Imperium said, the burden of proof is on the claimant. If you want to claim that a god exists, then you have to show evidence to support your case - otherwise, the idea of the existence of the supernatural isn't so much wrong as it is unworthy of consideration.
          • Mnementh2230, on 02/26/2008, -1/+1There's not scientific proof god doesn't exist, but there's plenty of proof for the bible being wrong on many accounts. Sure, it gets a few things right, but its BOUND to get a few right with all the claims it makes. What I'm getting at here is: With all that is wrong with the bible, why should we believe any of the claims it makes at face value?
    • Darkhacker, on 02/25/2008, -1/+7We care because religion is the cause of a lot of the world's problems. Slavery, abuse toward women, and genocide, just to name a few. I wish I kind find some hard numbers to cite, but I bet that religion is also the cause of most of the worlds wars, and if not, it's probably second behind economics. Hell, the war in Iraq is because of Islamic extremists and Bush on a mission from god. I also care about religion on a personal level because I'm gay. There are still parts of the world today where being homosexual results in the death penalty.
      • Leomarth, on 02/25/2008, -0/+5I'll take it one level higher - bad ideas is the cause of a lot of the worlds problems. Religion is just an instance of an idea.
      • Puisapres, on 02/25/2008, -0/+5While I don't want to repeat the old "religion doesn't cause wars, people do"...it's true. Since the dawn of man, wars have started because of petty reasons like race, tribe and (almost always) land disputes. Religion, too.
        I'm sorry to hear that you've had a bad experience with religion. I know it's tough sometimes, but just try to remember that most people who subscribe to a religion are, in their hearts, good people. I consider myself a Christian, and when I read you were gay I didn't go "OMG OMG TEH GAYS." Many Christians - even the so-called "fundamentalist" ones - really try to practice the important Biblical tenets like "love thy neighbor" and charity towards others.
        • Leomarth, on 02/25/2008, -0/+5You seem to be a reasonable Christian. Could you answer me this?

          Christians seem to cherry pick what they like from the Bible. It can be a source for almost anyone to find justification for what they want. So why do Christians find it acceptable to ignore things like stoning those to death who worship foreign Gods and things like that? I've heard one person justify it saying that it's because there is a new 'covenant' starting at the new testament. But that doesn't stop them from following selected issues from the old testament, such as the ten commandments.
          • eosp, on 02/26/2008, -1/+1Let's see. Some guy asked Jesus what the most important part of the law was. He responded with two commandments: Love the Lord your God with all your heart, and love your neighbor as yourself. And he essentially said this: "If you do these 2 things, you do all of the parts of the law that matter."
            If you love your neighbor as yourself, you won't steal from him, kill him, et cetera.
            That answer your question?
          • Puisapres, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1Leomarth, you ask a good question. The (short) answer is that many Christians view the New Testament as a "revision," in a sense, of the Old Testament. This is because part of Jesus' message was that he was bringing in a "new covenant" for the people, one that improved upon the old. In Jesus' sermons, he sometimes would bring up an example of an "Old Testament law" and amend it. (A good example would be when Jesus says that the "an eye for an eye" rule from the old Scriptures was wrong, and that people should instead adopt a "love thy enemy" stance.)
            That said, the section that we refer to as the "Old Testament" is quoted over 100 times by the writers of the New Testament. Also, the former book is still considered to be the holy word of God. So, obviously, the founders of Christianity held those Scriptures in a positive light.

            I know it's still a bit confusing, so check this out: The following site provides a good summary of where different Christian denominations stand on Old Testament vs. New Testament law. While I hate to post it because it's from Wikipedia, it provides an excellent summary of the different viewpoints and debates. If any Diggers can find other articles like these, please post them:

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Testament#Christi ...
          • Leomarth, on 02/26/2008, -0/+2@Puisapres, correct me if I'm wrong though, but didn't God say that his word never changes? Why wouldn't a 'new covenant' constitute a change in his word?
          • zeabu, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1God is a woman?
          • Puisapres, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1One of the main reasons is because the Old Testament is filled with hundreds of "messianic prophecies." These are prophecies that tell of a "Chosen One," or messiah, who is sent from God and who will rule the Jewish people. Christians believe that these prophesies refer to Jesus, and that therefore Jesus is the Messiah.

            Some of these messianic prophecies (particularly one in the Old Testament Book of Jeremiah) state that the future prophet will bring about a "new covenant," one that is chosen by God himself, and that this prophet's new message will redefine the relationship between God and humans. One of the most well-noted parts of Jesus' "new covenant" is that believers will experience life after death (in other words, go to Heaven.)

            So...in other words, the Old Testament states that a prophet will be sent from God, and that this prophet will not only "lift up" the people, but will also be giving believers a "new covenant" with God that will replace the previous ones. It's not that the word of God necessarily "changes"; rather, it's that God had stated all along that a messiah would eventually come to create a new relationship with the people.
        • wellyuk, on 02/25/2008, -0/+3Although you couldn't possibly approve his "choice" of homosexuality, n'est pas?
      • ZellD, on 02/25/2008, -1/+1Darkhacker, during the Cultural Revolution in China the government had fairly similar beliefs about religion. They blamed it for many of China's problems and ultimately banned it. In addition to persecuting religious practitioners, destroying their relics and temples, they also jailed and executed gay people. The result was a secular China, devoid of meaningful cultural items and still as repressive and inhumane, if not more so.

        I'd love to blame religion for the world's problems but sadly life isn't that easy. The Chinese learned the hard way.
        • PaxImperium, on 02/26/2008, -0/+6China replaced religion with Nationalistic Dogma and Mao Worship. Unfortunately, nothing really change. Instead of worshiping gods, they worshiped the state instead.
        • ZellD, on 02/26/2008, -1/+1You sort of proved my point pax. Religion or not the same fundamental behavior is there.
        • PaxImperium, on 02/26/2008, -0/+4Then we'll agree to oppose dogmatic fanaticism, both religious and non.
    • spyrochaete, on 02/25/2008, -0/+10You can't lump atheists together just like you can't lump all Christians together. There are different varieties of atheists. People choose atheism for their own reasons.

      Personally, I was raised to believe in god but all the good and bad things that have ever happened to me have been the result of the actions of myself or my fellow man, so I have no proof of a god. I also see things like tradition, holidays, and ceremonies to be insulting and a waste of time that could be spent doing something now instead of recognizing something from thousands of years ago.

      Do I consider myself to be better than religious people? Yes. I admit it. I reward logic, deeds, and adventure. I cannot understand faith, tradition, nor anyone's morals but my own. I see no benefit of religion that couldn't be earned "more genuinely" (my personal defintion) elsewhere.

      demonsnake69, many people here wish you would elaborate on your words. Do you believe you are better than atheists? Why or why not?
      • demonsnake69, on 02/26/2008, -4/+1I said "atheist fundamentalists." If you think I was referring to all atheists, then that's your problem.
    • demonsnake69, on 02/26/2008, -3/+1Sweet, digg me down some more and score some e-points!
  • kleptomaniac, on 02/25/2008, -15/+1Calm yourselves, "unaffiliated" includes those who practice wicca, possibly the greatest scourge this planet has ever known.
    • PaxImperium, on 02/25/2008, -0/+10Wicca is the greatest scourge on this planet?
      Why? Be specific.
      • kleptomaniac, on 02/25/2008, -1/+1Im sorry, I assumed that the /sarcasm label wasn't needed.
  • defektiv, on 02/25/2008, -1/+11When the religious right is telling everyone to believe in Jesus or burn in hell after they burn you alive, what do you expect? I was raised Christian and still claim to be, but I'm far from the fundamentalist and illogical Christianity I was brought up conditioned to believe.

    People need to find their own paths more than anything, and I think that's all this is showing.
  • pagalchu, on 02/25/2008, -6/+7I am gonna become Hindu. Freedom of everything. Pray whenever you want. Eat whatever you want. go to temple whenever you want.
    • nirav72, on 02/25/2008, -2/+8you can't eat a COW though. that would suck.
    • wellyuk, on 02/25/2008, -2/+3Do you believe in Devi, Krishna, Ganesh, Hanuman, Vishnu, Ramachandra, Lakshmi etc.? If so, you go for it!
    • pintomp3, on 02/26/2008, -2/+3unless you are an untouchable.
      • zeabu, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1In the states they also exist. People refer to them as "homeless".
  • FaithclubDotNet, on 02/25/2008, -24/+11I know God is real, Jesus is Lord. Of course, my own experiences don't translate into anything for you. It isn't like I'm God telling you that he exists. I'm just a man who knows God exists.
    • wellyuk, on 02/25/2008, -2/+23You're just a man who BELIEVES god exists. You cannot possibly know that god exists.
    • tightscrummy, on 02/25/2008, -0/+12No you don't.
    • BabyWookie, on 02/26/2008, -0/+7You must be very special. LOL
    • pintomp3, on 02/26/2008, -1/+4god told me he doesn't like you.
  • SOS84, on 02/25/2008, -2/+16At least some people get it.

    The way to deal with superstition is not to be polite to it, but to tackle it with all arms, and so rout it, cripple it, and make it forever infamous and ridiculous. Is it, perchance, cherished by persons who should know better? Then their folly should be brought out into the light of day, and exhibited there in all its hideousness until they flee from it, hiding their heads in shame.

    H.L. Menckin
  • Leomarth, on 02/25/2008, -4/+4I have to admit - I'm a convert, my wife is a convert. Our children, well... they'll be raised with it, and perhaps one day they may be converts too.
    • wellyuk, on 02/25/2008, -2/+6A convert to what? Scientology? If so, shame on you.
    • tightscrummy, on 02/25/2008, -2/+9Child abuser.
    • frostieDude, on 02/26/2008, -0/+2FSM?
    • Leomarth, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1Sorry peeps. Wrong on all accounts. (What the heck is FSM anyway?)
      • tightscrummy, on 02/26/2008, -2/+2The Flying Spaghetti Monster...it's the hot new religion, haven't you heard? Indoctrinating your children in a religion is indeed child abuse.
        • Leomarth, on 02/27/2008, -0/+2Given the premise that all religions are false, I can see that.
    • jm4847, on 02/26/2008, -0/+2I feel sorry for your kids.
    • zeabu, on 02/26/2008, -0/+2atheist. All religions put childs from birth on in that believe-system. Only we atheist say "they'll be raised with it, and perhaps one day they may be converts too." That's what we do, we leave people, even our children, a choice.
  • dacjames, on 02/25/2008, -2/+13In related news, more Americans are attending college and internet usage continues to increase steadily.
    Knowledge is power.
  • BigOrangeHippo, on 02/25/2008, -2/+10“Religion is the single most important factor that drives American belief attitudes and behaviors...”

    Read: Manipulation.
    • aethelberga, on 02/26/2008, -0/+2Yeah, I didn't get this comment. I would say it was consumerism slash capitalism.
  • HypocriteDigg, on 02/26/2008, -4/+8Proves that most Americans are not only stupid, but ***** stupid.
  • IAmLegend24, on 02/26/2008, -17/+5Anyone who is not an atheist should be killed.
    • Gerfervonbob, on 02/26/2008, -3/+1/sigh
    • eosp, on 02/26/2008, -1/+2I dugg you up just so people will see your comment and laugh at you.
    • z28com, on 02/26/2008, -5/+3I dug you up because you're almost right. I can't stand religious people. They are all hipocrites and evil, mean people. Everybody I know who is religious has the shortest fuse and gets offended and pissed off at the smallest things. ***** that *****. End religion around the world and watch the wars go away. Religion is nothing more than a ***** cult. Just like joining Amway. STAY AWAY!! Don't be a Jew. Don't be a Christian. Don't be a Buddist. DON'T BE ANYTHING except YOURSELF. You don't need people to tell you what's right or wrong. USE COMMON SENSE!
      • BoMEpsilon, on 02/26/2008, -2/+2Am I evil and mean, z28com? Do you really know me as an evil and mean person?
      • eosp, on 02/26/2008, -1/+1That's funny, the people I know who like Monty Python most are Christians. I've seen people go from violent-tempered jocks to someone who hasn't thrown a punch in almost twenty years.

        Oh, and the Bible actually encourages testing doctrine and seeing it for yourself, rather than mindlessly listening to the guy up front. Acts 17:11: "Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true."
        • zeabu, on 02/26/2008, -1/+1The guy in front does not refer to 17:11, because that would mean an empty church.
          • eosp, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1Mine did. Quote: "If the Bible contradicts what I say, LITERALLY throw me out of this building."
    • jm4847, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1Not killed, pitied.
  • realityparadox, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1I know I'll be doing so as soon as the next patch is released and re-specs are cheaper.
  • DavidGX, on 02/26/2008, -1/+9"I believe in *godhere* and that's the one true god and path and faith! Praise *godhere*!" "Hmm.. a little windy today, faith changing time!"

    Religion is such a joke.
  • Mrdudeperson, on 02/26/2008, -1/+5I'm happy with this story. It shows that people are becoming more and more open minded to other ideas.
  • GREEDOnvrFIRED, on 02/26/2008, -2/+9Step One: Realize YOUR organized religion is bogus.
    Step Two: Realize ALL organized religion is bogus.
  • davbmn68, on 02/26/2008, -3/+4I'm probably what you would call a fundamental Christian, but I'll be the first to tell you that this report doesn't suprise nor alarm me. If people were "joining" an organized religion to become better people their motives were skewed to begin with. The God that that I serve sent His son to make reconciliation between us and Him and take "the rules" out of the equation.

    He chastised religious people for making something that was supposed to be easy, hard and trying to control the people with religious rules, which unfortunately persists today. So I for one, am glad that people are questioning their church leadership, but it is not necessarily a reflection on their belief in God.
  • DeFex, on 02/26/2008, -0/+6ramen to that.
  • popcontest, on 02/26/2008, -4/+4http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/02/ ...
    Thus, in post-Judeo-Christian America, the sports club is the new church. Global warming is the new religion. Vegetarianism is the new sacrament. Hooking up, the new prayer. Talk therapy, the new witnessing. Tattooing and piercing, the new sacred symbols and rituals.

    And apparently, Barack Obama is the new messiah.

    Here's how a 20-year-old woman in Seattle described that Obama feeling: "When he was talking about hope, it actually almost made me cry. Like it really made sense, like, for the first, like, whoa ... "
  • bpwrinn, on 02/26/2008, -1/+3"The Roman Catholic Church has suffered the greatest net losses from changes in affiliation. But their overall membership remains fairly constant..."

    Well duh, they only preach bans on all forms of contraceptives and abortions.
  • triad203, on 02/26/2008, -2/+4I was born and raised agnostic and switched over to atheism later in life... does that count? =)
  • jm4847, on 02/26/2008, -3/+3So sad that many people either switch religions, stay with their father's religion or live on to believe a fairy tale without religious affiliation. Can't they see that atheism is the only RATIONAL path and everything else is a man created myth with no factual basis? Without any evidence, God is the same as a pink unicorn.
    Why are people so stupid?
    • VeganG, on 02/26/2008, -1/+3They always cite their holy book of choice as said evidence. Pretty flimsy, if you ask me. I wouldn't trust historical accounts nor scientific books that are thousands of years old, so why should I trust anything else that old?
  • mhz1000, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1What's really scary is the 84% fanatics!!
  • protodon, on 02/26/2008, -1/+2I think I know that 16% that have "no religious affiliation". They do believe in god, they have pre-marital sex, they give something easy up for lent, they never go to church, they pray when they need money or something and they get their kids baptized so that will go to heaven! WTF?!? It's all or nothing. Pick one! I prefer nothing and yet I still have better grasp on morality than 95% of the people I've ever encountered.
  • dtfinch, on 02/26/2008, -1/+2I was raised Christian, and baptized about 8 years ago. I stopped believing around 5-6 years ago, and became atheistic around 3-4 years ago. I'm more of a militant anti-Christian atheist nowadays, just because I'm still pissed off over the last presidential election.

    Gregorian - Losing My Religion:
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=A7hRnPKdQq4
  • jacekpoplawski, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1Each religion is evil.
  • KCLorelei39, on 02/26/2008, -0/+1not surprising. at all. people don't know how to even think coherently anymore, let alone decide what to believe and where to place their faith.
    • funkywood, on 02/27/2008, -0/+1What? So we as a society used to have the ability to form a coherent mind meld? Just cuz not everyone doesn't come to the same conclusion doesn't mean no-one can.
  • SniperSlap, on 02/26/2008, -0/+4The world needs atheism.
  • nardo510, on 02/29/2008, -0/+1the world would be a better place if everyone embraced atheism. We wouldn't be enforcing our primitive logic on how the universe was created. I personally take the best things from every religion and put them together like in a list and live by that.
  • cheaprugs, on 05/16/2008, -0/+0http://astore.amazon.com/cheap.mattresses-20/
    http://astore.amazon.com/buy.cheap.scrubs-20/
    http://astore.amazon.com/buy.cheap.rugs-20/
  • abajur, on 07/22/2008, -0/+0This person is become more and more open mind to other idea and I think ramen to that.Realize my organize religion is bog.
    Ofcourse it is my opinion.
    Thanks,
    http://www.onlineflashgames.org
    http://www.bid-directory.net
  •  

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