What is Digg?59 Comments
- mdelves, on 10/12/2007, -4/+18A well written article expressing emotional and lifestyle reasons over technical. Deserves to be dugg.
- actorboy, on 10/12/2007, -2/+14Sounds like you're speculating and using articles posted Feb 14, 2002 and Jan 25, 2006 to debunk one posted yesterday.
- theone3, on 10/12/2007, -2/+13It sounds to me like he's following his passion. It also sounds like others with the same passion for 'hacking' are using the mac/ruby/FLOSS gear. I can't see anything wrong with doing that. However, as you say, it was pretty poor form to take a shot at Vista, especially given RC1. He also extremely seems arrogant about comparing himself with other developers, perhaps even a little optimistic about the difference between MS and mac/ruby/floss.
- hansamurai, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12If you actually tried the platform, you would understand why it's called that. It's incredibly easy for someone unfamiliar with Ruby to get a web app running in less than 5 minutes with a mysql database.
- jeylux, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9You'll note all the companies i pretty much hate are listed in that blog...
mostly accenture.
If you want to work for a company that could careless about talent, and cares more about profits, look for accenture. They hire programmers who have no skills in the desired aspects of the project, and expect them to simply adapt just because they can program.... Sorry I could rant for hours about how much i hate accenture, and how they ruin real programmers... - happyfappy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7As someone who uses both ASP.NET and Ruby on Rails, I can totally relate to his sentiment.
I started learning ASP.NET 6 months before I ever touched RoR, and (since starting RoR) I have put 5 times as much labor into my ASP.NET project than my RoR project. Even so, my RoR is *ahead* of where my ASP.NET project is.
I like ASP.NET; 2.0 is far better than 1.x, which in turn is heads and shoulders above classic ASP, but, imho, Ruby on Rails is just a much better way to build 2/3-tier web applications. - geriborg, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8This is just nasty, hate-filled homophobia. Are these kinds of folks MS's defenders, these days?
- ditoa, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6whats weird is i have one of this c# books on my desk right now!
- corser, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Why is wearing shorts in the office such a bad thing? Where I work the only expectation is that your work gets done. Everything around that is up to you. You can wear what you want, show up when you want, work from home if you want.
- dacheetah, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5He's certainly got some good points, and I wouldn't mind working for a company where the dress code code is shorts, sandles and a nerf gun, as long as it was summer. There were some points I disagreed on, but to each his own. :)
- laserdisc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Well perhaps people feel imprisoned because of Microsoft's dominance over the market. As far as Macs setting them free, I think it's the reaction of using something different that works just as well or even better than Windows. Some folks feel the same about Linux. Unfortunately all this is speculation on my part since I didn't switch from Windows to Mac. I switched from Amiga to Mac back in the mid 90s.
- laserdisc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4It's a sad state when 95% of the companies out there don't employ tech workers with that type of passion for their profession. In the last 5 years providing desktop support I've only met a handful of people who are really into computers. The rest could careless about the latest in PC technology or shun the existence of non-Windows technologies.
Viva Amiga! - hurfydurfur, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Yeah, I don't see the whiny bits. His term "day coder" really hits something on the head. There is a lack of passion in the industry that makes all these Apple topics diggable. People _want_ to get excited. People _want_ to stay inspired. Are computers a commodity? Can the PC do everything a Mac can do (basically) and vice-versa? So is it just a luxury difference now? Although I applaud him for being romantic, he might just be switching to a different technology stack with the same natural problem.
If I could make it work financially, I'd do the same thing. However we all aren't mature in our careers like he is. The storming out to make a point is kind of a no-no (because the point is never made).
He can think Vista is a pile of crap, but it may still be successful because of the previous "whatever, good enough" mentality of the Windows world. And, it may be right. - msergeant, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5As far as I'm concerned, it sounds like he's going to have fun at his new job. Remind me why this is a bad thing?
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4As long as we have Deitel everything is fine. ;-)
- drjones78, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Lord, the comments on this post are exceptionally inaccurate and just plain ignorant.
Its telling that Rails is a great Web Application Framework (Note: not a web-app), and many of the PHP frameworks have followed suit and attempted to mimic it, to varying levels of success.. symphony, cake, etc
Sure there have been plenty of web app frameworks before rails, but none have had the elegance or completeness that it enjoys. Its very simple to do simple things, and less complicated to do complex things.
The one gotcha with rails seems to be the documentation, but that is getting better. More and more books are coming out on the subject.
"Also, there is a huge lack of standards out there to support RoR to date." Err.. I would respond to this but I have no idea what it means... it doesn't make any sense. When you say "standards" are you referring to best programming practices (of which there are plenty, and documentation to go with it)? - Magadass, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I feel his opinions, work for Avanade and have been happy so far with getting immersed in technology. But man they sure do have a large sum of idiots employed, but you know I dont mind helping amateur programmers out, what I mean by idiots is by the ones who ***** their way through everything pounding their chest the whole way saying "im the best!". They lie, they produce crappy code and its aggrevating and it seems like the Microsoft world is getting worse and worse in this aspect, its not enough for me to ditch Microsoft technologies but it is enough for me to hate working with these people!!
- hurfydurfur, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2If I did desktop support, I'd watch TV (etc) when I got home. There's the pattern, there's the result, there is the habit of exhaustion and lack of enthusiast hobby practice. Viva indeed.
- corser, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I'll agree on your sentiment that Macs are expensive, but, I've had a Mac-crush for the last 6-8 months, and I wouldn't consider myself trendy or a hipster. This is partly because of the pretty UI and machines, but mostly because I've been reading about all the technologies they shoved into OSX and how well they all seem to work together. It appeals to me in a way that Windows and to some extent Linux does not.
As for ***** computers, my sister's iBook has had two problems in the years she has owned it that I've had to help her with. OSX wouldn't boot for some reason, and iTunes got corrupted and she couldn't reinstall it. The first case, I just reinstalled the OS, the second was a quick fix I found on the Apple site. I'd say two problems in something like 2-3 years, for a non-techy shows, how extremely stable and functional the OS is. - jeylux, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Yes i worked for them, otherwise i would have nothing to base my problems on, now would i?
The problems were all over, they had terrible intro level pay scales... and then they would have mid-to high level developers working on the same aspects as the intro guys, but getting paid 4x more, you want to talk about getting fed to the fish? Nothing worse than finding out the guys you work with hate you because you get 4x the pay they do, for doing the same job.
Also they would hire people, and have them doing jobs they weren't even hired for, mostly .net guys doing SQL development and hiring mechanical engineers to be programmers who had ZERO programming experiance...
All in all, the company sucked... but they gave everyone business cards so they would feel better about themselves.... - PhairOh, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2This article scares me, but only because I start work at Avanade tomorrow...
- jsams81, on 06/26/2009, -0/+2I'm a graphic artist, I'd rather work on a pc. "macs are better at graphic software" is an old myth.
Grandmas use pcs too, i really dont understand your point there. Unless you point is that theyre good for non saavy people, which might be true. Thats basically what I was saying, they target n00bies. Most graphic artists arent very tech saavy either.
I use a mac everyday too, so its not like I'm just being biased. There are a couple things about Macs that I like but its not enough to make me want to use them more than a PC. - CircleFusion, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@tehmoth
Placing focus on simplicity does not mean the absence of complexity, when it is needed. For most webapps, complex SQL functionality is not needed. When it is needed, those options are available.
Ruby and Ruby on Rails place a lot of emphasis on convention. This does not mean that alternative methods are out the window. They allow a great deal of flexibility. - Frankie4Fingers, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5One writer won't kill M$.
- CircleFusion, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Yea, but it looks like a "web app" that was written in 5 minutes. Its crap."
It's obviously unfinished.
It's a starting point... a functional starting point to building a full-featured app.
How is that complicated for you? - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'm curious. This isn't directed so much at Mr. Wright but all book authors in general. With all these _BOOK AUTHORS_ jumping ship from Java, C#, VB, Python, etc. Is it because Ruby on Rails is the next best thing technologically or because all the other camps can't generate the endless cash flow that Ruby on Rails seems to enjoy from having yet another rah-rah cheerleader?
Don't misunderstand me, it's an honest question and not a troll. I actually like Ruby itself while not sold on Rails completely for a variety of technical reasons. Just because yet another book author jumps ship isn't really a selling point since book sales can drive bias as to what is hot or not. e.g. Is C++ really dead or is it just the related book market? - phill, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I work in my pajama's all day. Heck, some days I don't even get dressed at all. That reminds me... I need a hair cut.
- lazypeon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Wait, so a guy who made his fortune and fame from Microsoft is now turning around and defecting to other technologies?
That still doesn't change the fact that he made his fortune and fame from Microsoft. The only difference now is that he's gotten enough of a payoff to do what he wants. Good for him, but there is no principle here. He sold out, and then he cashed out. Big deal.
If you want to admire programmers, look at the ones who built their careers on principle and stayed there, not the ones who took the easy road to wealth and then bought their way to virtue. - Gantos, on 10/12/2007, -14/+15As a recent Windows-to-Mac convert myself, Bravo!
- CircleFusion, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2@Frankie4Fingers "How is one of them deciding to write about a Mac anything special? Please inform me."
Is that really all that you derived from his writing?
This man is probably like many MS writers, certainly, but probably unlike most of them. He explained what originally attracted him to Microsoft technology, and how that has changed over time. He described (indepth) what he appreciates about programming environments and teams, and how that is missing at Microsoft, and in many companies that he has worked for.
Then he explains how he has found those attractive qualities within communities surrounding other technology. He named Macintosh, Ubuntu, Python, Perl, Ruby and Ruby on Rails as technology that interests him. It is of no coincidence that what attracts him to those technologies is extremely common. They uphold creativity, innovation, enjoyment of work, appreciation of skill, etc. These are things that make being a developer enjoyable. These are the reasons why many of us are interested in learning to program software. These things have been drowned out by big business mentality in the computer industry, and it is a wonderful thing that there is technology (with the community behind it) that is gaining serious momentum (similar to the momentum Windows experienced back in the v3.0 - v3.1 days).
The issue here is not about quantity of writers who have switched. His message is a shared message...likely shared by many developers who would LOVE to switch to something more enjoyable...but are still working with Microsoft Technology, and are sticking with it is currently the most popular, and because it is what they know, and it pays the bills. For many of those developers, perhaps it is just a matter of time. - DrDabbles, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I have read and still own one of his books on VB5 or VB6. Very good book, and got me writing VB code in a couple days. Later that year I went on to work with an accounting software company to convert from VBA to VB/SQL and wrote a score-keeping application for F.I.R.S.T.. After all that, I wrote a team scouting application for F.I.R.S.T. teams which kept records of team strengths and weaknesses to help choose better partner teams. Either way, the book was great and I'm very thankful that there are people out there like Peter. Maybe I'll learn RoR finally? :-)
- CircleFusion, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0You do know that he has worked with more technology than just VB, right? Someone earlier mentioned that they had a C# book that he wrote.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -6/+6Yea, but it looks like a "web app" that was written in 5 minutes. Its crap.
- Cymrubeats, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0http://digg.com/apple/Microsoft_Technology_Author_defects_to_Mac_and_Ruby_on_Rails
I thought this sounded familiar. - dossy, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3"VB guy switches to RoR."
Boy, that sure is telling about RoR, isn't it? RoR is the VB of Web 2.0. - CircleFusion, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@Frankie4Fingers
You keep missing the point. The point here is not about quantity of writers that have dropped Microsoft Technology.
"If I could make it work financially, I'd do the same thing."
How many Microsoft developers and writers likely feel the same way? - tehmoth, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0comment of the day
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1ARTICLE SUMMARY: (It's a long article, this extract sums it up):
"Microsoft don't innovate, in my opinion. Vista looks like a pile of crap compared to Mac OS X and Ubuntu with GLX. Their software is buggy, overpriced, and stress inducing. Their development tools are staid, designed and developed by committees to solve every problem you could ever conceive of, while being ideally suited to solving none.
The people that write code for a living with Microsoft technologies (by and large -= not all, and if you're reading a blog about coding then you're probably not included in this generalization) are day coders. They code to pick up a pay check – they have no passion, no drive, little talent and create environments filled with tedium and political *****.
Today, I've resigned to leave that world behind forever, and I couldn't be happier."
Truest words I've all year... - CircleFusion, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@Frankie4Fingers... "Because of this, I think we will see if RoR will make headway by how many of these large companies like Accenture get contracts for projects with RoR."
Or...
We'll see how many companies that value innovation, drive, passion and creativity in their development team will surpass companies like Accenture in the marketplace, because they end up providing a better service or making a better product.
Have you read that book "My job went to India and all I got is this lousy book" (I think that is what it is called). It is written by Chad Fowler, a guy who has embraced Ruby on Rails technology and is part of the RubyConf team. He is a developer that went to India to learn about the practice of outsourcing. One of the things that he learned was that Indian workers didn't seem to have much passion for what they were doing (at least the ones that he met). That was a in contrast to many of the programmers that he was used to interacting with (in the RoR community, especially).
Here is the podcast where Chad talks about his experience in India. http://paranode.com/~topfunky/audio/2005/Chad-Fowler.mp3
You're just not going to accomplish as much without drive or passion for what you are doing. This applies to all professions at some level. It is a simple human psychological need to have motivation for what we are doing. Money as a prime motivator doesn't always work as well as passion. Now, add passion plus money... - ltbarcly, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1Macs are overpriced ***** computers. That is why you'll find a few specific kinds of people generally use them:
1. PHD researchers use them,
2. Grandmas use them,
3. Graphic artists use them,
4. and now programmers in agile languages use them.
The reasons are:
1,2: These people aren't tied to specific software to get their work done. PHD researchers are on the cutting edge and there isn't software made yet to do what they are working on, so they can use whatever suits them. Grandmas aren't tied to any software because they have such basic needs (no offense to any foxy grandmas reading this).
3,4:These people use macs because they can. The software for graphic artists to use macs is fully developed and as good or better than PC counterparts (especially photoshop). Agile programmers use macs because they get the same functionality and none of the windows/PC bullcrap. Powerbooks are just plain better for getting work done than PC notebooks. They are lighter, have much nicer trackpads, and two finger scrolling is fantastic. The best part is that when you close the lid it is off, and when you open the lid it is on, and you don't ever have to wait or get pissed off.
There is a unifying theme to the users of macs. If you take the set of computer users, and subtract the people who are forced to use PC's because they need Outlook, or that is what is used at work, or they have to run some niche software that is only available for windows, then you basically have much of the community that is switching. Microsoft was right to try to lock people into windows by making it impossible to use windows side by side with any other OS without great difficulty. (notepad can't even read text files created in linux for christ's sake, and it has been recently updated several times in ways far more complicated, unicode and everything else). The reason they had to do this is that if people aren't locked in to eating turd soup through a straw they will avoid doing so. But stick to your guns and in 15 years when nobody is using windows anymore you'll be able to get a job as a sysadmin at an elementary school. - Frankie4Fingers, on 10/12/2007, -4/+3Sounds like the TECH craze of 5 or 6 years ago. I lived in Austin TX then and it was like that about .NET and Java. People were enticing employees with thoughts of shorts and throwing balls around the office.
Unfortunately, this became non-productive and most companies busted or changed their attitude and became more professional again. This sounds like the beginning of then end for the so-called Web 2.0 if companies start doing this again.
History teaches us so much. Is it just human nature to repeat it? - timalmond, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0The "day coders" thing is a stupid insult. I've worked with a lot of "day coders" who I'd gladly hire again.
Why? Because they were more interested in getting the requirements correct and delivering code than spending their time chasing what the next cool technology was. Some of the geekiest, and most tech-savvy people at that company delivered far less to the business.
Forget tools. The biggest single problem in IT is in requirements definition, specification and communication.
Incidentally, I'm not the biggest fan of Microsoft, but I call ***** on a lot of these .net vs RoR estimates. If you're knocking up simple CRUD apps, I could see that Rails would have benefits, but most applications are more complicated than that. - Frankie4Fingers, on 10/12/2007, -8/+7I could do that with PHP, ASP and .NET so it really isn' t that big of a deal. Also, there is a huge lack of standards out there to support RoR to date. Until it becomes a lot more formally recognized and developed I doubt many large companies will actually dive into it.
- hansamurai, on 10/12/2007, -11/+9How is this news? An author "defects" to Mac and RoR? What's next? A sportswriter defects from football to baseball?
- tehmoth, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1the main problem with RoR is its dediction to the LAMP lifestyle, mainly considering lack of features in mySQL to be a plus, reducing database-driven webapps to the lowest common denominator
- MadMoses, on 10/12/2007, -6/+3Hey, dodgeball is cool!
- JQP123, on 10/12/2007, -5/+0What makes him think that the work environment surrounding the Mac and RoR will be any different?
- hasanahmad, on 10/12/2007, -13/+8He sounds really whiny. im glad microsoft is rid of him. Ironic he left right on the verge of RC1 version of Vista calling Vista (sucky) , while RC1 is now considered a generation leap over vista in terms of security, performance and graphics performance (dx10)
- Frankie4Fingers, on 10/12/2007, -13/+8How is this anything worthy of people caring.
Do you Mac people actually sit with baited breath waiting for someone do actually endorse your technology? There are thousands of big Microsoft writers writing books about VS and other technologies. How is one of them deciding to write about a Mac anything special? Please inform me. - CaughtThinking, on 10/12/2007, -14/+8I think going from football to dodgeball is a more appropriate comparison.
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