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105 Comments
- d2002, on 11/26/2008, -3/+152Google makes its own rules, thank you very much.
- krazykipa, on 11/26/2008, -7/+131Google > Apple
/2¢ - netneutrality, on 11/26/2008, -6/+59Why must Apple stifle innovation?
- FKnight, on 11/26/2008, -2/+55Google vs. Apple
Digg could devolve into Civil War. - Fuel90, on 11/26/2008, -2/+36Google, kickin' ass and takin' names.
- ToastPop, on 04/17/2009, -2/+35Because they want to be the only ones innovating.
- londubh, on 11/26/2008, -10/+36Go, go, Google! ***** Apple and their fascist rules!
- brad016, on 11/26/2008, -2/+24Holy Balls!
- ttamshadbolt, on 11/26/2008, -3/+22I wonder how many apps were rejected for breaking the same rule?
- HookmasterCH47, on 11/26/2008, -2/+18People think that it's Google vs Apple? They're working together.
- roberekson, on 11/26/2008, -4/+19Does this really surprise anybody?
Google obviously has access to the documentation for the internal API used by Apple since the Google Maps app was on the phone from day one. - Shady77, on 11/26/2008, -1/+15Dear Apple: Please don't take my verbal search away. Without it I never would have found those great web pages on "hex positions", "how to meet squirrels", and "flash light".
- TPorter72, on 11/26/2008, -6/+19Apple == Microsoft Both run by douchebags
- inactive, on 11/26/2008, -1/+12Grab them by the balls and squeeze google!
- dagamer34, on 11/26/2008, -0/+11Let's be serious here: Apple had to have known that Google was using undocumented APIs. Only ONE application has ever been able to turn off the screen because the user's head has been lifted to the phone, and that's the Phone app. Either Apple wanted to give special treatment to Google so that they could have this hot app on the iPhone (and it WILL be in a commercial, I have no doubt about that) or someone at Apple's app approvement department needs to be fired.
- feshmania, on 11/26/2008, -1/+11It'd be evil if they charged you for a product that crashed every other time you loaded it up.
they did this to help the masses. - superkendall, on 11/26/2008, -0/+10All developers (well obviously apart from Apple) have access to the same documentation, it's easy to find out what method calls are not listed in the header files.
- cerealjynx, on 11/26/2008, -1/+10A gaggle.
- sterni, on 11/26/2008, -1/+9more like a gogol. :-)
- inactive, on 11/26/2008, -2/+10Google = Turtle because i like both of them.
- byukid, on 11/26/2008, -2/+10I'm pretty sure whoever opposes this will be killed by the GoogleBots in the Great Google Takeover of 2011.
- Bauer22, on 11/26/2008, -3/+11Google==SkyNet
Fixed. - hmunkey, on 11/26/2008, -1/+9Nope, Google aren't douchebags.
- Metaleks, on 11/26/2008, -9/+16I'm not a fan of Apple (I dislike them intensely, actually), but I do think its rather dumb to compare a primarily web-based company to a primarily hardware based company.
- skyshock1, on 11/26/2008, -2/+9So now that the API's have been exposed, why doesn't Apple just release them as part of the SDK? Seems kind of a silly thing to hide. But I'm not a programmer so what do I know.
- superkendall, on 11/26/2008, -0/+7So do other apps.
Apple doesn't care if you use undocumented features of existing API's, they only care if you use deep private frameworks (like the much nicer underlying camera API). - Kazaki, on 11/26/2008, -1/+8I disagree.
I don't know if anyone has noticed, but most Apple fans have simply stopped commenting on threads.
While Digg itself still specially promotes Apple news, the vocal community are mostly Anti-Apple here.
Just read a few comments on this very page. - Meursault, on 11/26/2008, -1/+8In fact Google used Google Voice Search to find the undocumented procedures online. It's all very recursive.
- afruff23, on 11/26/2008, -0/+7It's a conspiracy...maaaaaan.
- Metaleks, on 11/26/2008, -3/+9It's Apple's fault. What with their RIDICULOUS licensing for applications that are on the iPhone, I'm with Google all the way on this one. Not only that, but as this article nicely puts it, Apple is absolutely horrible at handling the flood of new applications.
- r3zonance, on 11/26/2008, -0/+6The way Objective-C (unmanaged code) works, is slightly different from say C# (managed code) in that use of a private function call only generates a compiler WARNING that "the object might not respond to the message...", whereas in C# it just wouldn't compile because of a build error.
Objective-C sends the message (function call) regardless and it will only fail at runtime if the object in question doesn't respond to it at all (i.e. the function doesn't exist). This is the main power of Objective-C. - LastDitchHero, on 11/26/2008, -2/+8Because maybe apple feels they are immature and will break with future updates. Costing not only Apple time and money to rewrite stuff but a lot of Devs who use them. Not defending them but they did say "hey don't use them if you don't want your crap to break and face rejection from the app store".
- haentz, on 11/26/2008, -1/+7Apple hides crucial APIs from their "official" developers, like the UIPreferencesTable or the APIs Google used. I really feel ripped of by Apple, as a developer....
- inactive, on 11/26/2008, -1/+7Shame on apple for stifling innovation.
And shame on everyone else for supporting them. - stoanhart, on 11/26/2008, -2/+7***** Apple.
Didn't Microsoft get a world of ***** for having undisclosed API's only it could use? I hope Google publishes these and wipes the smirk off Jobs' face. - Myztry, on 11/26/2008, -0/+5An EULA is just a wish list without any power.
It's not binding in anyway whatsoever unless a court make an order derived from it.
The court could just throw the term out, opening the way for a countersuit. - surferjoemaui, on 11/26/2008, -1/+6Ever got caught speeding down the highway? Sometimes you get a ticket sometimes you get a warning.
- r3zonance, on 11/26/2008, -0/+5I wrote an app that used the undocumented textField in a UIAlertView and it got through and onto the store. I have since re-written the functionality to use only pubic API calls.
- Myztry, on 11/26/2008, -0/+5Still not binding until the terms have been evaluated. They can't for example send the police around on the basis of an agreement.
Try showing the police a copy of the agreement, and asking them to enforce it. - likwidfuzion, on 11/26/2008, -0/+4Is it even possible to catch?
- Me1000, on 11/26/2008, -0/+4actually Apple had the APIs from Google to write the app Rob. Not the other way around...
- theratster, on 11/26/2008, -0/+4Have u tried it? Hold it up to "thin air" and then move ur hand infront of the sensors on the top by the speaker. Its actually using the proximity sensor!
- r3zonance, on 11/26/2008, -0/+3'Apple hides crucial APIs from their "official" developers, like the UIPreferencesTable or the APIs'
You don't need the UIPreferencesTable, you have Settings bundles and NSUserDefaults, which stops you having to define and fully specifying how to handle ALL of your app settings and types and render your custom UITableView.
Okay there are some times you need to have the odd setting item with custom handlers (for example turning off passwords, with a prompt for the password), but these things are supposed to be the EXCEPTION rather than the rule.
Also, NSUserDefaults offers a standard way to use default settings when the user has specified their own.
The benefits of using NSUserDefaults far outweigh any of the drawbacks, if this isn't the case then you really don't understand the iPhone SDK properly. - Myztry, on 11/26/2008, -0/+3The name on a card isn't (as far as I know) verifiable. I have a business credit card with shows both name/business. I have used all sorts of combinations. name/company - company/name - name only - business only - abbreviated company (left off company structure denotation), and never had a problem.
I have the authority to spend at my own deeming, but not to form agreement as agents for the company. I am not an executive because I merely have a company card.
"NOT allowed to", is quite often a funny thing, as generally there is no way to verify such things, and they will be allowed. I could stick whatever names I wish as pertaining to the the credit card. There would be no need to request information like billing addresses if it could all just be pulled from the card number.
This would breach the agreement, and the most likely American law. But as I'm not an American citizen, my countries law is my only realistic concern. Assuming it was every discovered. Point being, there still has been no verification of identity.
Laws limit what personal information can be exported, especially to foreign countries.
Anyway, enough of this, I think we've both got too chatty :) Cya - Myztry, on 11/26/2008, -0/+3"But can it fill in a 5-pages of forms." - Agreed, if that is the case. The cat was an extreme example of lack of identification. Point is anybody (anything) could be accepting the agreements.
Quite common is minor children who aren't even legally allowed to enter pseudo contracts as used on the Internet. Hell, I don't even use my real name for pseudo contracts. That's what pseudonyms exist for.
So don't pretend the whole Internet contract/agreement isn't full of more holes than swiss cheese.
Oh, and some contracts (or terms of) contracts can indeed be law, where either the term is legally required for that type of contract, or the contract consists of a specified standard form. Which you touched on with "LAWS surrounding" - Nephersir7, on 11/26/2008, -0/+3yeah, Google is trying hard to improve Apple
- Myztry, on 11/26/2008, -0/+3It's more a case of potentially binding. That's why agreements/contracts have clauses relating to unenforceable terms not invalidating the whole agreement.
Catch is, neither party really knows if any of the agreement is enforceable. That's entirely up to contract law, related laws, and the judge who's task it is to vet the agreement.
Gets even more uncertain when Internet based agreements neglect simple contractual requirements like proof of identify, verification of age to enter contract, signatories, witnesses, equal bargaining power, etc.
Try entering a house loan agreement without any of the above... They won't give you the loan, because they can't enforce it!
Even a cat on a keyboard can accept a [NEXT] agreement... Not even the right species to be bound... - mcsenget, on 11/26/2008, -1/+4Go, go Google COPTER!
- Kragnerac, on 11/26/2008, -1/+4...and so it begins...
- r3zonance, on 11/26/2008, -1/+4At the end of the day, if Apple change the API calls, then Google's app will break and require fixing, and that will piss off a lot of people. But it'll be Google's fault entirely.
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