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- timewarrior, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5Dual-Booting Windows XP on a Macintel
The Problems
Macintosh uses a different MBR
MacBooks use EFI, XP x86 uses BIOS
The modified Darwin Bootloader is made for EFI w/ EFI supporting operating systems
OK… So step by step.
Where is the BIOS used? For what? How?
The OS sends low-level calls to the BIOS that tell it exactly how to deal with the hardware. Now I don’t have the Windows XP source code at hand.. so all I can tell you for a fact is that NTLDR uses it to access the drive at first to boot Windows, and Windows uses it at *least* once more when it is mounting the drives.
The Required Programs and Stuff
Acronis Disk Director Bootable CD
Acronis True Image
Another computer with a clean install of XP. No programs installed at all.
A MacBook obviously!
A Windows Vista DVD (not for installation purposes!)
Vista boot files
bcdedit.exe
BCDedit restore file
Most of the problems can be theoretically quickly dealt with.
Using the Bootable Acronis Disk Director CD on the MacBook, shrink the Mac partition. Create a new partition of type NTFS/HPFS in the remaining space.
Setup a clean version of XP on a PC.
Extract Boot.7z to the root drive of your XP installation.. So you have C:Boot
Copy bcdedit.exe to the root drive of your XP installation. C:BCDedit.exe
Copy MacBook.bcd to the root drive of your XP installation
Use sysprep to “reseal” your XP install and remove all hardware info from the setup (thanks Kristan for pointing that out!).
Use Acronis TrueImage CD to make an image of your XP install.
Use the bootable Acronis True Image CD to recreate the image on the partition you just made on your MacBook.
Use the Bootable Vista DVD to boot on the MacBook.
Select “Repair Startup” -> Next -> CMD -> Run too.
Browse to drive C:Boot (which is the partition you created on the MacBook and then extracted the Acronis TrueImage file to). (cd C:boot)
Run “fixntfs.exe -lh” without the quotes
Browse back to drive C: (cd )
Run “bcdedit.exe /import MacBook.bcd” without the quotes
Eject the CD and restart.
In Mac now, hack the Darwin Bootloader to add another entry that chainloads Drive(0) Partition(2). With GRUB it would look something like this… I’m not sure if Darwin is the same, but this step is very simple, and has nothing to do with EFI.title Windows XProotnoverify (hd0,1)chainloader +1
Restart
By selecting “Windows XP” on the Darwin Bootloader you should be chainloaded to the Vista bootloader, which should in turn boot the entry “NeoSmart Windows XP”
If everything has gone well, XP will boot!! - MaxDrax, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Can you believe I once thought that dual-booting Windows on a Mac would be a pain in the ass?
- danieleran, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2FATAL FLAW #1:
"Using the Bootable Acronis Disk Director CD on the MacBook, shrink the Mac partition. Create a new partition of type NTFS/HPFS in the remaining space"
Acronis is a DOS disk utility (with an XP look) for imaging and repartitioning images. If we could boot DOS CD or DVD-ROMs on Intel Macs, we wouldn't have a problem.
The Intel Macs ONLY support booting from GPT (a new Intel EFI disk partitioning system that 32-bit Windows does not support) and Apple's own APT. In fact, they can only boot from APT formatted DVDs (not APT drives; you can't format a HD that will currently boot on both PPC and Intel Macs).
PC boot CD/DVDs using a "superfloppy" mechanism that Intel Macs don't support (at least for now).
So this guy's idea is dead in the water before he gets started. There's no way to reformat/repartition a volume using a DOS boot CD (!!) and if there were, the repartitioned drive wouldn't be usable from EFI firmware anyway.
- LaughingMan11, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Clearly this guy hasn't tried any of this on a real Mac...
He's going to get stuck right here :
Using the Bootable Acronis Disk Director CD on the MacBook, shrink the Mac partition. Create a new partition of type NTFS/HPFS in the remaining space.
It's not going to boot from that CD... and it's not going to boot from the Vista CD either.
Nice try though. - Bandito, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This is all getting tiring -
"why would somebody spend all of that money on a mac to put xp on it? u people are morons for doing this"
Yes we're morons.
OR...
just my .02 but:
We're educated IT professionals that recognize the pure genious behind having Apples slick gui on top of the incredibly stable and much more secure BSD backend that combines to make OSX. That being said we'd probably want to run OSX (I'll speak for myself here) and would certainly love a nice Powerbook (who can deny Apple's beautifully designed hardware), but live and work in a Windows world.
Yes Windows pays the bills. So I for one would love to have a single machine that I can bring with me to work during the day to run all my production applications (on XP) and then use OSX for my personal system at home.
And before you say - well just wait for Vista.. That doesn't fly because who knows what the compatibility is going to be like between applications that I need for work that run on Windows XP and what will actually run on Vista. You'd hope it would be a smooth transistion, but lets be honest... this is Microsoft and these apps weren't written with Vista in mind.
I'm all set to buy a Macbook Pro (hate that name though) but will wait for them to actually hit the streets and see the "in use" reviews instead of the speculation.and Apple 'marketing machine' hype.
So can we get back to tech behind "How to get it working" instead of whining about "Why would you want to do that?" - atrain, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Vista supports EFI He uses vista's bootloader, if you had read what you posted...
"By selecting “Windows XP” on the Darwin Bootloader you should be chainloaded to the VISTA BOOTLOADER, which should in turn boot the entry “NeoSmart Windows XP”"
"Use the Bootable Vista DVD to boot on the MacBook.
Select “Repair Startup” -> Next -> CMD -> Run too.
Browse to drive C:Boot (which is the partition you created on the MacBook and then extracted the Acronis TrueImage file to). (cd C:boot)
Run “fixntfs.exe -lh” without the quotes
Browse back to drive C: (cd )
Run “bcdedit.exe /import MacBook.bcd” without the quotes" - geminitojanus, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I won't believe it until we get independent confirmation; you still have to get around ACPI in Windows XP, which is kind of a BIG DEAL. Also, he gives instructions for the MacBook Pro, a product that's not shipping yet, which means he's either an industry insider or someone who's guessing. And from :"In Mac now, hack the Darwin Bootloader to add another entry that chainloads Drive(0) Partition(2). With GRUB it would look something like this… I’m not sure if Darwin is the same, but this step is very simple, and has nothing to do with EFI." you can see which I'm guessing.
- timewarrior, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Is the bootloader the only thing that needs the bios in XP?
- timewarrior, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Other possible ways
1.elilio bootloader
2.hardware hack
3.an EFI setting - timewarrior, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1http://digg.com/apple/How_to_enter_EFI_menu_in_your_Intel_Mac
- elroy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Am I the only one who thinks dual-booting belongs in the 1990's? I want to see Virtual PC turned into a compatability layer (like Classic, but for running windows apps).
- Xuff, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0This is silly. Step 9 reads "Use the Bootable Vista DVD to boot on the MacBook." No one has sucessfully booted from a Vista CD yet (the farthest anyone has gotten is the "Press any key to boot from CD..." message on a Vista CD, and when you press a key nothing happens).
Also, creating an NTFS partition on the Mac's drive isn't nearly as trivial as he makes it out to be. This guy needs to read about the steps other people have tried (and failed) before posting something like this. - aptiva, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1is the macbook even out yet?
If not, wouldn't this just be what he *thinks* is necessary?
So this will most likely not work at all? - gamefoo21, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I thought MS said that XP Pro 64Bit supports EFI?
- damnyooneek, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0macs don't support certain programs that windows do. so if someone can have the ease of a mac and then switch over to windows when needed its a money saver and more convenient. imagine going on a business trip with two laptops.
- PeterNorton, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0why exactly would windows make sense on a macbook?
http://www.tgdaily.com/2006/01/28/toms_hardware_uncovers_power_drain_issue/ - trogdoor, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0^^ If the Apple store were open right now I would find some way to test this without them noticing just to get the prize money. Heh if I got caught one of the "geniuses" might have just try to help.
- kazem, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0No digg. This is lame. Getting XP on a Mac would be a great thing. But, as someone just noted, theorizing or speculating, is a waste of time and a waste of a really good headline.
Half the diggs are from people who just wish it would happen, not people who read the guy's instructions. If you actually read the forums, where the real hackers are discussing this, you'd see that you can't do it using his method. The Mac EFI doesn't see the Windows XP partition table. Simple as that. There's a very good reason that $8,000+ is riding on this: it's proving to be quite difficult to pull off. - superalamar, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"no mac user is dumb enough to want to dual boot their mac, obviously some idiot m$ user's pipe dream. "
Just about everyone in the apple community is looking to see if this can be done. That's why there is 8 grand in donations on the line for it. You are silly or worse. - crosswire, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:hTx_GUwch6oJ:neosmart.net/blog/+&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1
google's cache of the blog - FullMetalMonkey, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Sounds plausible. Someone should try to see if this works!
- TROGDOR42, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"WTF would you want to install Windows on Mac? I understand installing Mac on x86..."
Maybe because you want to run Windows programs on your Mac without paying hundreds for Virtual PC? THINK! - mingistech, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0if this really works the author needs to go here:
http://winxponmac.com/
and claim his 8k in prize money. - nogami, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I'm wondering if this would work:
Repartition the Mac drive to allow space for a Vista (or XP?) install. Take the HD out of the Mac and put it into a PC and use the PC to install Vista/XP onto the HD. Use the PC to install a (linux?) bootloader that allows you to boot the partition you want, then replace the HD in the Mac and see what happens...
If the bootloader works (the only dodgy part), then it would probably start the XP/Vista loader, however since XP or Vista was installed on a different system with different hardware, you'd probably need to boot in safe mode and remove all of the MB drivers that it added during the installation and let it re-detect them the next go-around.
Just a thought - don't know if taking the HD out and modifying it on a secondary system is something people have experimented with much. - kday, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Once I gain enough side money autosurfing, I am gonna get me a MacBook Pro :P. First Mac Notebook that truely appeals to me, even though there are drawbacks (Firewire 400, no s-video, still 1 mouse button) :sigh:. The Powerbooks were nice, just not fast enough. Hopefully I would be able to boot Windows XP someday. Since I am a web designer, this is important to me. I would be able to design in BBEdit in OS X, and boot to XP to preview and debug the design in IE. I will also be able to play games on my Mac!!! Pretty damn good video card too.
A side note: This guys theory won't work since XP doesn't support EFI. - jabba, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0If I could download any of those files, maybe I would believe in this. Plus, how can you believe somebody dual-booting MacBook, when none of them is available.
Unless, somebody from Apple is doing us a favour and showing us how to do it properly without breaking our brand new machines and clogging their support hotlines. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0i will gladly mirror the site, i just dont know how to, so if somebody could tell me how i will do it
- crosswire, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1http://neosmart.net/blog/dual-booting-windows-xp-on-a-macbook/
It's working!!! - darkvad0r, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"About...
The Computer Guru lives deep in CyberSpace, finding his way into the depths of support forums (he absoloutely loves programming and network security!) to save those in need. Some compare him the leprachaun in the shoemaker fable."
As seen on the website...
No comments :p - damnyooneek, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0well everyone has their opinions but don't hate the messenger. maybe someone can try it? Many of you know that here is a contest to dual-boot (www.winxponmac.com) XP on a Mac and the prize money is up to $7861. The rules state," The first person to email complete instructions, including pictures of the boot process to contest@pintmaster.com will be the winner." Since this guy has not tried this yet whoever that's able to get it to work will get the money. It's worth a try.
- ComputerGuru, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0OK, thanks to Jani I got static plug-ins working for WP, so load should be much more bearable now :)
Load off my back :) - lame_duck, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I've read through this and it seems clear that it might be done. EFI has BIOS emulation, so you would just need to figure out how to turn that on or fiddle *yes I said fiddle, sue me* with a ROM image of EFI to get it going. After that just add a second HD and your in business.
Wheres my $6000 bucks? - jpesicka2, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0if i bought a mac i would never think to go back to windows
- devoinregress, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0If you really want dual boot at the moment you can get a PC and load windows and OSX on it. It has already been done and it may not look as pretty as a mac book pro but it seems to be the easiest way to do things now.
http://www.osx86project.org/
This article includes some good information to help loading on an Intel mac. It may not work but I am sure it at least helps.
I digg it, I dugg it. - CatcherInTheWhy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@gamefoo21
The problem is that XP x64 supports EFI, but the MacBook Pro uses a 32 bit architecture. - hookid, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0all we need to do is get our hands on a copy of the gateway modified version of windows xp media center edition, which has EFI. Im on the phone with gateway now seeing if i can buy one.
- hookid, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0ok we just need to get a gateway oem media center cd, which has EFI enabled.....then we should be good to go, i emailed some people on ebay who are selling gateway media center pcs and i asked if could buy the cd off from them
- Guspaz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Sounds great until you see this:
"In Mac now, hack the Darwin Bootloader to add another entry"
Yeah, that is a very descriptive instruction. - SystemError, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0time to visit the apple store
- vinny, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"WTF would you want to install Windows on Mac? I understand installing Mac on x86..."
Mac is a brand name for a computer, you don't install it. You install OS X, which is an operating system. - yeahright, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0i just bought one... and i sure as hell won't try it.
- suppazone, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@hardkoretom
and you are such a moron for asking that question -think think think - I know you can do it - think think think - ComputerGuru, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Fix:
Instead of booting from a Vista CD, you need to Basically run bcdedit.exe and fixntfs.exe from Darwine or within an XP emulator. Sorry, I know it makes it longer and more boring, but what can I do? :( - FrostyFire, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I hope everyone paid for their extra copy of Windows XP while trying this *wink wink nudge nudge* ....yeah right.
- ComputerGuru, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0lol....
Anyway guys, damn host. I'm switching next month, but for now I changed the theme, and am optimizing the DB to try to lessen the load... I'm getting vistors by the tonnes (that's measuring the weight on the server)
:D - ComputerGuru, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Excellent post Bandito.
I'm having hard time accessing the server, but I am trying to add the statictize reloaded plug-in in hopes of lessing the load on the backend.
Anyway, I just want to make it clear that by no means is this article/post dead.
I'm gathering more info, making changes, and learning from my mistakes.. Get ready to see progress, step by step. - samspoon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0THIS WOULD NEVER WORK.
EFI loads legacy operating systems by loading a Compatibility Support Module (CSM) which changes all Bios calls into their EFI equivilents. This is non-existant in the Apple EFI firmware. I really really really really wish people would stop speculating and either get an iMac and try themselves or just shut up because speculation is completely worthless without an environment to show your ideas work. - ComputerGuru, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0????
"copies from other sites"
Where? What? I was not even interested in this until after this post grabbed this much attention on other sites.
Tell me your problem, and I'll address it. No need to start personal attacks. - kday, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"why would somebody spend all of that money on a mac to put xp on it? u people are morons for doing this"
Windows does have it uses... look at my post above ^^^ -
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