What is Digg?72 Comments
- tdmeth, on 10/31/2008, -2/+44Not exactly. When you get hired by a large tech company, especially in a higher up position, you must sign an agreement with the company stating that you will not work for a competitor for a period of time after terminating your employment with that company. These contracts are there so someone cannot take company trade secrets (upcoming products, upcoming patents, etc) to a competitor. In this case, Mark Papermaster signed such an agreement with IBM, and now he is trying to work for apple before that time period is up. Like it or not, he signed the contract and has to abide by its terms.
- lewystud, on 10/31/2008, -8/+34Im a PC and I sell fish
- drifter, on 10/31/2008, -4/+26I seriously hope all the Apple fanboys don't start coming in and bashing IBM. This is common practice to sign agreements. Especially in the tech field and competitive markets.
It would be unfair for him to go to Apple, a competitor, and then give them all the secrets that IBM funded. As I said anyone who tries to say IBM is dumb or anything, obviously has no clue about business.
Keep in mind, with Steve Jobs ***** like character, he would probably bad mouth and ridicule someone who would try this at Apple. - krulz133, on 10/31/2008, -0/+16Oh man, as a headhunter this makes me laugh pretty hard.
Non-compete agreements are about as annoying as Apple's NDA for the Applications Development scene. Nobody likes them, but IBM believes that this guy will take trade secrets to Apple - a legitimate concern.
Why ELSE would they hire him? My god, I can only imagine what kind of compensation package he'll be getting. - mrbad101, on 10/31/2008, -1/+15Papermaster. That's one hell of a cool last name!
- leontes, on 10/31/2008, -4/+17There are laws already to protect intellectual property. They are complaining they own this guys intellectual capabilities? This whole idea of a non-compete clause is just unfair.
- sbusta, on 10/31/2008, -1/+12I'm a PC and I [boobies]
- sockpuppets, on 10/31/2008, -3/+13I dugg you up just for the halibut.
- larryjr88, on 10/31/2008, -0/+9Why does it seem like Apple is constantly suing someone or being sued?
- drifter, on 10/31/2008, -1/+8Really? Ever worked for a corporation or company? Engineers and many others see this all the time. If a company spends billions on a project, they dont want someone to then leave and give all the secrets to a competitor.
- CCB0x45, on 10/31/2008, -1/+7Armani iSuit
- leerayIG88, on 10/31/2008, -1/+7A suit?
- tdmeth, on 11/01/2008, -0/+6@maanwi - Possibly. It will be up to the judge.
@bbear - True. But while California law specifically states that such contracts are void, New York (where IBM is located) does allow such contracts. Since the contract was entered into in New York, and the lawsuit is in New York, they will be able to sue for quite a bit. Further, the Full Faith and Credit Clause of the Constitution (Article IV section 1) could apply and require a California company to override their state law. It would be up to a federal judge to decide that, though. - bbear, on 10/31/2008, -2/+8Signing a contract doesn't overrule the law. For example you can't sign your children into slavery. Depending on the labor law in his state he may not have to abide by its terms at all. There are separate laws that govern trade secrets.
- mustang460, on 10/31/2008, -0/+6They may not have filed for the patent yet, given his position he would have detailed knowledge of upcoming technology
- maanwi, on 10/31/2008, -3/+8I'm pretty sure that the contract with IBM will be found to be unconscionable, as most of these agreements reach too far.
- DigDugDigger, on 11/01/2008, -0/+5Say he does give some "trade secrets" to Apple, is there a standard for proving where they came from? I'd imagine Apple (or any other company, for that manner) would just say they stumbled over it and discovered it the same way the first party did.
- dilpil1, on 10/31/2008, -0/+4Every big company is. Once you get to the top, everyone wants to take you down- especially if it means bringing themselves up.
- inactive, on 11/01/2008, -0/+4If Apple was this important to IBM then they should have done something to keep them as a customer. They had their change. That being said, I'd like to see Apple try and fight another companies NDA (ok, it's a non-compete, so it's close) and see how that goes.
- gimpbully, on 11/01/2008, -0/+4that's pure conjecture. Apple has already made the move to x86, changing their server line while leaving the consumer line on an x86 arch will only serve to fracture their lines. That's always been a major win on the side of Apple -- uniform arch across their pro and consumer lines. Otherwise, they'd have an even harder time garnering developer support. Now, don't get me wrong, I would love nothing more than to see a POWER-esque line coming from Apple, but realistically, I doubt this will amount to anything other than chipset improvements, perhaps bringing design in-house for workstation/server chipset design.
- rzermatt, on 10/31/2008, -2/+5I can seriously see this not going far at all. This is the mans livelihood... his forte. Seriously, you can't stop him from making a living? That being the case I can see him winning, but not for any time soon... this will surely be a while.
- CptnEvilStomper, on 10/31/2008, -1/+4I'm a PC and I [insert random thing that has nothing to do with PCs].
- AlienMushroom, on 10/31/2008, -0/+3Everyone wants to take a bite on it but it's kinda toxic.
- nmanguy, on 10/31/2008, -1/+4But can't they just wait till Apple develops something using the guy's knowledge, and then sue them for patent infringement?
- inactive, on 11/01/2008, -0/+3Socialistic? Do you just throw that word around every time you make an argument?
Because I don't think it means what you think it means. - 1hrSleep, on 11/01/2008, -1/+4@maanwi/bbear
Wha? When I learned contract law, this was a textbook bit. It's only illegal/voids the contract if it's too far reaching/keeps someone from earning money.
Guy working for a company designing chips now working for another company to design chips = not far reaching.
Guy working for a company designing chips now working for another company designing potato chips = far reaching.
At last, that's the case here in BC, Canada. - drifter, on 11/01/2008, -0/+3Are you serious? If you don't agree then don't sign it, plain and simple. Like you said get a lawyer and read it over.
But if you then still sign it, don't expect sympathy. I think it is a good contract helps companies from losing money, which in turn will result in job losses.
Plus in this case, they guy was offered even more cash but still turned it down. Could it be because Apple offered more or maybe IBM pissed him off? Who knows, but fact is he has valuable information that is wrong to give away. And your argument of making a living is ludicrous in this case, since he would have easily made one with IBM.
This will get settled out of court, but please dont say IBM is wrong. What if it was your company? Bet things change fast then. - gritta, on 11/01/2008, -0/+3I can't see any way Apple could win this since he signed a non-competition agreement.
- cledet, on 11/01/2008, -1/+4Apple just wants the best of the best, can't blame them.
- tnoy, on 11/01/2008, -0/+3So wait, Apple is going to try and win a court case that will say he doesn't have to listen to a NDA?
- KibibyteBrain, on 11/01/2008, -0/+2I'm sure many Read Or Die fans just love the reference.
- fluxion, on 10/31/2008, -0/+2didnt metallica make a song about him or something
DUN
DUN DUN DUN! - AlienMushroom, on 10/31/2008, -2/+4Master of paper is also a master of chip.
- jasmus, on 11/01/2008, -0/+2"I seriously hope all the Apple fanboys don't start coming in and bashing IBM."
"Keep in mind, with Steve Jobs ***** like character"
I'm far from an Apple fanboy, but that seems a little unfair. - civikminded, on 11/01/2008, -0/+2OK, everyone is focused on the legal aspect of his employment let me ask this question:
Why the F does Apple want a Power processor guy? Didnt they just ditch them for Intel? Strange things are afoot in Apple-land. - Dante001, on 11/01/2008, -0/+2Afraid not man, the chip gets too hot they just cant pull it off. They would have to have a fan the size of the laptop to keep it cool enough. Although that could give way to the the ihover.....
- DigDugDigger, on 11/01/2008, -0/+2Why would you sue a server?
- Shaggy3, on 10/31/2008, -3/+5I'm a PC and I develop computer chips fo - Oh nevermind. Hi, I'm a Mac.
- BrendanSheehan, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1Apple can always say they hired him for his talent and experience, and not secrets he might have.
- inactive, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1gone are the days that Apple would ask IBM guys if they were virgins
- Giga, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1"keeping someone from a livelyhood just because they are going to a competing firm is the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen EVER!"
IBM wants to keep this guy at IBM and pay him more. How is that trying to keep someone from earning a living? - bipolarruledout, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1You guys are horrible fan boys.... they have said on a number of occasions that they want to develop there own chip sets.
- Giga, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1It would seem so. Let's see how they like it if everyone stops listening to Apple NDAs?
- 7aji, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1I'm a PC and I listen to my ipod
- kachayev, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1Each company has two variants: to want to be the best of the best, or to be a loser.
- digitalpencil, on 11/02/2008, -0/+1IBM aren't dumb but you're being naive if you think they're above this practice.. Headhunters are hired for this explicit purpose, to steal IP from competing firms. It might not be an ethical business practice but it's still a very common one existent in every sector of the industry.
- HHP2K, on 11/02/2008, -0/+1That website is ***** horrible on the eyes. Who makes entire paragraphs of text BLINK? That's supposed to make me read it?
- jasmus, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1then return it.
- mesasone, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1I hope not, but I sort of wonder if Apple isn't going to try to split off from the intel architecture and go to something proprietary to head off companies like Pystar and whoever put out that EFI usb-dongle. I guess we'll have a better idea when that case is settled. If it turns out Apple can' stop them from selling Mac clones, then I think we will have our answer.
And yet, I have to ask if it's really cost effective to develop your own architecture as opposed to removing the artificial limitations on OS X installations and compete head on with Windows. - tashtego67, on 11/01/2008, -0/+1What else can this guy do to earn a good living? He is in a specialized career path and only a handful of companies have opportunities for him. If it is standard practice to make people sign these things then you have to figure he can't earn a living without signing one. His only protection is the law which generally makes these things unenforceable, thankfully. I had to sign one once and I had serious hesitation about it till I found out they were pretty much worthless.
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